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SwingingPick
11 Jul 14 20:51
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Date Joined: 11 Jul 11
| Topic/replies: 5,589 | Blogger: SwingingPick's blog
The first mountain stage of the Tour takes place in the Vosges Mountains region, starting in Tomblaine and finishing 161kms later in Gerardmer La Mauselaine with a deceptively difficult mountaintop finish.

The riders will be going uphill for most of the day, starting at an elevation of 198m and topping-out on the Col de Grosse Pierre at 901m, the penultimate climb of the day and rated as a cat.2 climb.

In fact, the total three climbs are all packed into the final 27kms -- or so -- of the stage, and whilst we might see a few puncheurs like perhaps Sagan and Gerrans hanging about and acting tough on the first cat.2 to the Col de la Croix des Moinats, it is unlikely that they’ll make the selections by the ascent of the final cat.3 climb of the Cote de La Mauselaine. This final climb appears to be much tougher than the cat.3 rating it has been given, and it is therefore more likely than not that it’ll be contested by the pure climbers and therefore become a shoot-out for the GC contenders.

It is quite rare that the GC contenders would form a cabal on the first mountain stage of the Tour by deciding to conserve their energies, and in so doing offering the stage to a long-range mountain breakaway specialist like Rolland or Edet. This would only happen in rare instances where the first mountain stage was really tough such as being held in the Alps or Pyrenees on a screamingly hot day; and since this stage is neither I believe we should see some fireworks between the GC contenders and a likely stage win by one of them. It may start as a pissing contest, but eventually someone will drop the hammer hard enough to signal the free-for-all that excites the principal selection, and we might get to witness the first real evidence of where each GC rider stands at this still early period of the race.

Nibali will enter in his Sunday-best, he has to do nothing but ride confidently and allow his team to control proceedings, a task they will be well-suited to do once the climbing starts, on account of their rich climbing talent and the fact that they haven’t lost any riders like BMC, SKY and TCS have. Nibali’s condition looked good on stage 2 which he won and where he moved into the yellow jersey, but this here will be a much sterner test in all regards: his climbing legs, handling the immense pressure which comes with leading the Tour, and his overall condition going forward. He is therefore unlikely to win the stage, unless he is feeling so good that he decides to bury the opposition here and now. Which doesn’t fit with what is known about his riding style, at this time. Wait to see.

The GC contenders must attack Nibali with the view that they take some time back on him, they must connect with a combination which draws some blood and tests Nibali’s resolve and capabilities in the mountains; and the likely candidates to make an attack stick and achieve their plan are Contador and Valverde.

** Alberto ‘Bertie’ Contador. He had a little dig on the final climb of stage 7 after riding in a forward position for the most part, and whilst he didn’t look at all like his explosive best it says something that he was willing to test himself by priming his legs for this. He hasn’t done much this Tour except for that unsuccessful flex on the Jenkin Road climb in stage 2, and at 2.37mins behind on the GC he has the most to lose with a ride which sees him finish behind or even with Nibali on this stage. Therefore, he must look to commit to a deep attack at an appropriate point, maybe take some chances on the descent into the final climb, and if he can, on the final climb, manage to repeat his marvellous stage 2 ride when answering Froome on multiple occasions in the Criterium Dauphine -- then I believe he can not only ride away from Nibali, but win the stage by catching the likely long-range breakaway. Bertie opened-up as the second favourite at 8/1 with the Books, and I believe that is very good value for a rider of his talent and commitment, who has found himself in a desperate situation for the start of this stage. Should be 7/2 tops. Hard to beat. Best WIN ONLY bet.

Alejandro Valverde. He is in a slightly better position to Bertie on the GC, and he can afford to stick with Nibali’s wheel pretty-much up till the finale where a small attack and a gain of a handful of seconds over him will amount to a successful day. Valverde is less likely to win the stage than Bertie, unless he is feeling particularly strong and that will not be known until he hits the first climb of the day, toward the end of the day. Valverde opened-up with the Books as the clear favourite at 9/2 and he should remain quite solid, but I would see his position exchanged with that of Bertie’s on the betting board. One of the main contenders. Watch closely.

Richie Porte. He wouldn’t have expected to be in this position in this race when he set out from Leeds on the opening stage. It has fallen on him to lead the team, something which he has always wanted to do and it’s something which many saw happening for him in the Giro earlier in the season, but which obviously didn’t happen. Porte can afford to test himself here by following the simple and easy plan of sticking with Nibali’s wheel. Porte is a rider who improves with hard riding and is more likely to come into his own in the final week, so, for now, if he can gain incremental levels of confidence by following this one simple plan, he has some prospects to win this race at nearly 2mins down. But patience is key for him, because 1.) he appears underdone, 2.) he has had an interrupted season, 3.) he is under sudden pressure, and 4.) he is part of a thin team with only Nieve as dependable support in the mountains. He is therefore the least likely to win this stage of the GC contenders since he hasn’t shown signs of the form which would allow him to bury himself for a portion of the entire last climb, for instance. Discount.

Andrew Talansky. He crashed when Gerrans swerved across him in sight of the line, taking his front wheel out, however it has been reported that he is uninjured. He looked quite light and powerful on the final climb prior, and it didn’t look like he needed much more expenditure to ride away with a small gap when attacking the front. 50/1, even 40/1 would be about right if he didn’t crash, but trust is required now since he might stick to sheets throughout the night and have a restless sleep. Consider.

Jurgen Van Den Broeck. It has been reported that he didn’t really go down, but that he put his foot down when the riders in front of him crashed in one of the final corners, and he had nowhere to go. 50/1 when opening with the Books. Take on trust.

Joaquim ‘Purito’ Rodriguez. He has been doing nothing when sitting at the back of the peloton day-after-day, but he gets to prove his pre-race position that he is here for stage wins. Nevertheless, he is very short when opening at 11/1 with the Books, and there are several questions which are still unknown. Little value. Should be somewhere in the 30s. Wait to see.

Michal Kwiatkowski. On paper he might do well on a stage such as this, but I would need convincing that he can actually win the stage. Others have stronger claims. Discount. 9/1 with the Books is insanely short.

Good luck to all,
SP
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Report cedarmaster July 11, 2014 9:33 PM BST
the rider i most like on this stage Is Kwiatowski but at a best price of 12/1 with Joes he is way too short, i am only interested i value,

i anticipate most of the main GC riders to be up there at the finish not necessarily picking up the win. I do expect it to be one by a major name and the one who appeals most is Rui Costa who is available @ 40/1

Good luck every one with your selections and lets hope for a crash free day to ease the unbearable tension in the peleton
Report Irish_Celtic July 11, 2014 11:07 PM BST
Any opinions on how many of the big guns are doping?  Or is it most likely all clean now ?

From what I have seen it would be impossible for a clean rider to beat a doped rider in a mountain stage .
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 12:11 AM BST
I suspect that there is some doping going on. Which is to say cycling is probably considerably cleaner than football, tennis, athletics and most other sports.

As to who is doping and who isn't, that would be nice to know. Your guess is as good as mine.
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 12:17 AM BST
I think this is a climber's/GC stage. No punchers, no breakaway. Contador 15/2 first 5 with Boyles is surely bombproof?

2pts e/w Contador 15/2
.5pts e/w Pinot 50/1
Report Irish_Celtic July 12, 2014 12:27 AM BST
From my limited knowledge I would be worried about the strength of Contadors team . If Roche is his main man he may be struggling for support in the mountains ?
Looks like he is struggling quite a bit. Then again how good is a clean Contador ? Rhetorical question.
Nibali looking insanely strong so far - I would expect that to continue.#

Found this article in the mail quite interesting -Bassons wonders how Sky riders who are built like twigs can turn out so much power ...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-2681145/Chris-Froome-Team-Sky-ethics-questioned-leading-anti-doping-advocate-Christophe-Bassons.html
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 12:28 AM BST

Jul 11, 2014 -- 11:07PM, Irish_Celtic wrote:


Any opinions on how many of the big guns are doping?  Or is it most likely all clean now ?From what I have seen it would be impossible for a clean rider to beat a doped rider in a mountain stage .


It's definitely not clean, but in general the peloton is getting cleaner year by year IMO. That said there are some that are blatant and the sooner they are out of it then things will at least look better to the casual fan even if the problem hasn't gone away.

Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 12:28 AM BST
*ahem* Horner
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 12:33 AM BST
Agree with MC, you'd be a mug not to take that 15/2 on Contador. I can't see a break staying away and as he lost so much time on the cobbles he's bound to attack to try and make a few seconds. The only problem I can see is if the final selection sit up and ride in together, and then I'm not sure there will be more than five left.
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 12:35 AM BST
I think there will be a real selection tomorrow, final climb is nearly 2k and averages 10%+
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 12:40 AM BST

Jul 12, 2014 -- 12:27AM, Irish_Celtic wrote:


From my limited knowledge I would be worried about the strength of Contadors team . If Roche is his main man he may be struggling for support in the mountains ?Looks like he is struggling quite a bit. Then again how good is a clean Contador ? Rhetorical question. Nibali looking insanely strong so far - I would expect that to continue.#Found this article in the mail quite interesting -Bassons wonders how Sky riders who are built like twigs can turn out so much power ...http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-2681145/Chris-Froome-Team-Sky-ethics-questioned-leading-anti-doping-advocate-Christophe-Bassons.html


The thing is Contador doesn't need a team so it doesn't really matter.

Have a look at this from Tirreno - Adriatica

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEmPvLR1hyg

Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 12:43 AM BST

Jul 12, 2014 -- 12:35AM, marychain1 wrote:


I think there will be a real selection tomorrow, final climb is nearly 2k and averages 10%+


I can't see Contador not winning it in the form he's in. Potential for him to take 20-30 seconds here at least and 8's for that looks excellent.

Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 1:30 AM BST
I don't think he'll take 20-30 seconds from Nibali, Nibali is too good and too savvy but Contador will be right there. 15/2 5 places is good I reckon, unlikely to be anything other than a GC finish tomorrow imo
Report Happybacker July 12, 2014 2:05 AM BST
AS above sure to be a gc finish tomorrow, think it will be a very select group in the finale.
Contador does look the most obvious winner, as he is the strongest climber and he needs to gain time more than most, so he is sure to be going on the attack. However I'm not totally convinced he is in the superb form he was earlier in the year. He has tried a couple of little digs already and the real explosiveness we know wasn't there, though he may have just been stretching his legs ahead of the big attack tomorrow? He also look very tired at the end of stage 6, more tired than anyone else, almost forlorn, he had been with the Talansky/ Valverde/ Porte group but dropped off the back in the last 2km, which is most un-Bertie like. It could be all nothing and he may well ride away from everyone tomorrow , I wouldn't be surprised to see him do that at all.

Should be another great stage to watch, but looks really hard to call, as this will be the first real climbing theyve done so we will know a lot more after tomorrow. So just a couple of small ew plays for interest for me, on the 2 riders I backed pre-race for the GC, Teejay Van Garderen and Rui  Costa.

Van Garderen 80/1 ew - Hopefully will have no ill efffects from todays unfortunate stage, if not then he is certain to be desperate to want to regain some of that lost time straight away. Thought he was looking in really good shape up until today, looked like he glided up Jenkin road easier than anyone on stage 2.

Costa 33/1 ew - Have been really impressed with him the last month, from Tour de Suisse through the first week here. He is in great form, looks so calm, confident and in control. Again looked strong on stage 2, was the only rider who gave chase to Nibali but gave up when no one wanted to help him. If as expected this blows up tomorrow, then i expect Costa to be right there in the mix at the finish. I have also backed him again at 50/1 for the GC, as with Froome out, my doubts with Contador, and a feeling Nibali might have put too much in to the first week, I'm getting more and more inclined to think we are going to see a real shock winner this year.

Gl all.
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 3:14 AM BST
Michal Kwiatkowski   
Joaquim Rodriguez   
Bauke Mollema       
Michael Albasini   
Rui Costa


Rodriguez biggest winner

wont be trading in running ,thought valverde short enough tbh Plain
Report SwingingPick July 12, 2014 7:13 AM BST
I am really interested to see Rui Costa's performance on this stage, which is a much easier stage than the final stage 9 of the Tour of Switzerland which he dominated so well. The only thing I didn't like about his chances for stage honours here and why I didn't include him in the preview, is that he might require a good initial hit-out in the mountains to prime himself. He rarely just shows up to dictate terms, but rather rides patiently and in a low-key manner to keep contact and improve for his next start.

The thing I'd like to add about Bertie's explosiveness being found wanting so far, is that the excuse might be that those two climbs in the Tour from stage 2 and stage 7 were quite sharp, where is here they will stretch out a bit, especially the first cat.2 (half the distance of the Col du Beal and less steep: stage 2 Crit Dauphine), and he may be more comfortable to build-up some better rolling speed. A 20+km solo is too much of an ask though, I think. If he gets into that habit of going to the front to only look behind and allow the others to bunch back around him, then it'll be clear he won't have what's required to win the stage from long-range, but may still win from the select group if there's not too much chaos up ahead. Bertie is best when he commits and pours it on with little thought to how he'll feel tomorrow, and I'm hopeful that that's the Bertie which will arrive for today's stage.

Should be a cracking stage, can't wait.

Cheers,
SP
Report RAPS July 12, 2014 7:23 AM BST
Albasini.

40 gone overnight but still value.
Report SwingingPick July 12, 2014 7:25 AM BST
Laugh
Report ClayDavis July 12, 2014 10:58 AM BST
I'm very keen on Rui Costa today. I expect a big performance from him.
Have also bet Alessandro di Marchi at 100+ Win and place
Report GoBallistic July 12, 2014 11:15 AM BST
Valverde will be hard to beat if it comes back together
Report dead pop stars July 12, 2014 11:34 AM BST
Morning chaps
3 for breakaway win
Spilak
Riblon
Clarke

No PCM predictions this year, too busy
Gl all
Report dead pop stars July 12, 2014 11:34 AM BST
Morning chaps
3 for breakaway win
Spilak
Riblon
Clarke

No PCM predictions this year, too busy
Gl all
Report ExpertBoy July 12, 2014 1:50 PM BST
first winning breakway today.

My bets are:

Kadri
Bakelants
B. Feillu

Good luck all
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 2:23 PM BST
Got this so wrong. Break wins so Yates should probably be favourite.
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 2:38 PM BST
do they stay away looks like rest of field have a leisure day so far ..
Report buddeliea July 12, 2014 2:40 PM BST
Nearly 11 minutes,and increasing with peleton in no hurry.
The break have it,take ya pick.
Mines Chavanal.
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 2:56 PM BST
Further to the clean racing stuff above, Menchov has just been given a 2 year ban. That'll be no surprise to anyone.
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 3:09 PM BST
Raining again. Looking like we might have more carnage.
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 3:13 PM BST
Anyone else see Valverde say he is stronger now than before his Fuentes-assisted doping ban? Shocked

Love to see Yates win this but I've laid him at 2.6.
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 3:22 PM BST
All the Spanish riders do that and the fans lap it up. I don't understand it, it's a different world.

Layed Terpstra and Petit so far. Not sure Chava will have it on the 15% ramps and I'm not sure about Kadri. Yates by far the favourite for me, but laying rather than backing especially with a wet descent.
Report Autocue July 12, 2014 3:40 PM BST
I've payed all 5 in break. This will be caught.
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 3:40 PM BST
LOOKS LIKE THEY GET CAUGHT ?
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 3:43 PM BST
10k downhill so think they'll stay away.
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 3:48 PM BST
Saxo pulling. Looks like we are going to get some vintage dirty Bertie after all.

All bets off on the break if Bertie goes into Chicken mode.
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 3:58 PM BST
This is weird. Saxo-led peloton clearly moving miles faster than Kadri but gap going up Confused
Report NonShy.. July 12, 2014 3:59 PM BST
marychain - gap came down quickly then increased and levelled off now
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 3:59 PM BST
Game over for Kwiatowski
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 4:00 PM BST
Bardet or Pinot to be in white tomorrow
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 4:02 PM BST
ExpertBoy 12 Jul 14 13:50
first winning breakway today.

My bets are:

Kadri
Bakelants
B. Feillu

Good luck all


A second three-figure priced winner in consecutive days? GrinGrinGrin
Report NonShy.. July 12, 2014 4:31 PM BST
what position did contador finish??
Report the swede July 12, 2014 4:31 PM BST
2nd
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 4:32 PM BST
2nd
Report NonShy.. July 12, 2014 4:33 PM BST
thanks!! Happy
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 4:33 PM BST
What a performance By Bel  Shocked the other 4 got caught 10 mins was not enough for them ,great days action ..
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 4:34 PM BST
Great win for Kadri always like to see a popular winner.

Some big scalps in the GC. Podium could well be the three that arrived first today.
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 4:35 PM BST
well done MC i was down brains but laid Yates and Chavenal short Kadri won me 60 p Laugh
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 4:38 PM BST
Brilliant offer by Spoilsports this. Had Gerrans yesterday 20/1 finished 5th and was a winner. Today I had Contador and Pinot 50/1 finished 5th and paid out the each way Laugh
Report the swede July 12, 2014 4:38 PM BST
great call mc.
was lucky to take him at 3,70 when he left chavanel
for the GC big green on Nibali and Contador and big concern about many outsiders, feels much better now.
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 4:38 PM BST
Also ended up green on here by laying Yates Happy
Report marychain1 July 12, 2014 4:40 PM BST
Even better call by ExpertBoy.

He had Trentin at 100/1 yesterday and Kadri today, must have been 200/1+ on here.

Chapeau!
Report the swede July 12, 2014 4:41 PM BST
great standard from all of you on this forum  Grin
Report casemoney July 12, 2014 5:17 PM BST
YES ,very informative for Luntatic tour bettors like myself Laugh
Report tashkent terror July 12, 2014 6:01 PM BST
The 999/1 layers out in force today owe Kadri a huge drink....

Some serious amounts matched on Contador, Valverde, Rodriguez, Nibali etc at the maximum price when lead group 10+ minutes....some of the favs matched at less than 20/1 when the gap dropped to 4 mins just before the climbs started.

All got swept up bar Kadri...they certainly earned their lay money today!
Report CJ70 July 12, 2014 6:16 PM BST
Not sure why anyone would lay at 1000 in a race like todays. Certainly not going to profit long term by it.
Report SwingingPick July 12, 2014 7:33 PM BST
Obviously got this one wrong, but only because the peloton allowed AST to dictate terms for the purposes of giving Nibali an easy ride. Once KAT and BEL realized their ploy, sending riders to the front to dethrone their control and drive the pace hard as the heavens opened with rain, it was looking like the break had sailed. Nibali got the easy ride he wanted, and he looked very comfortable on Bertie's wheel, while TCS looked imposing with their uphill train. Good to see Kadri keeping the French tradition of the long-range mountain breakaway rider alive. He went quite hard after attacking Chavanel, and I thought Chavanel might come back on terms with him on the descent soon after, but the Frenchman sustained his rhythm very well. Congratulations to all who backed Bertie E/W, I wish I did in retrospect. SP
Report ExpertBoy July 13, 2014 1:11 AM BST
marychain1
Date Joined:     05 Apr 05
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12 Jul 14 16:02 Joined: 05 Apr 05 | Topic/replies: 23,372 | Blogger: marychain1's blog
ExpertBoy 12 Jul 14 13:50
first winning breakway today.

My bets are:

Kadri
Bakelants
B. Feillu

Good luck all

A second three-figure priced winner in consecutive days? GrinGrinGrin

Very nice indeed :)
Report geoff m July 13, 2014 10:12 AM BST
cracking calls Expert well done.
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