Trump right to end WHO funding?

I doubt they would pull funds immediately dave?
If I paid a lot of money for something which nearly burned my house down I would not buy it again.

he has suspending funding, if that means something other than suspending funding, I am happy to be corrected.

I repeat, how does it help getting back to normal?

When you see who pays in per head of population

Trump reckons there is a chink in the W.H.O'S armour. He may well be proved correct.

Sorry, I don't do news lately, I wasn't aware. Still, if they have conspired with the Chinese and damaged the health of the world's populations they are not fit for purpose and need replacing quite quickly.

Does the WHO save lives?           YES!
Will defunding WHO cost Lives?     YES!
Does WHO need reforming?           YES!

^^Could you please link to the evidence that "they have conspired with the Chinese and damaged the health of the world's populations"

and what will he do with the chinese,halt the trade deal ? i think both need looking

Another example of grievance politics. The lies from China will eventually emerge but the lies from Trump, downplaying the seriousness of the pandemic, the preparedness of the testing, the lack of supply of PPE and ventilators and the lack of a national response plan are staggering in comparison.

I don't have any dave. I'm tempted to believe that the country who bankroll the corrupt outfit do have some, and we will eventually see what occurred when the WHO invstigated Wuhan.

I don't know if the WHO are to blame for the pandemic or whether they colluded with China in any way. What I do know is that this is an election year in the USA, Trump is under huge pressure as he is behind in the polls and he is happy to blame anyone apart from himself for the apparent lack of action when the pandemic was on it's way.

^^the WHO investigators were being blocked from China when trump tweeted this

China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!
9:18 PM · Jan 24, 2020

Perhaps you are looking in the wrong place for conspirators.

Why do WHO block Taiwan from being a member?

Taiwan were asking questions in late December and WHO was still saying no evidence Covid could go human to human in mid-Jan? If WHO had come out of advised stopping all travel out of China early this could have been contained.

Also it is very strange that Gates is involved in their funding.

the who dont block taiwan from being members, the members decide who is allowed to join and that means that both the usa and the uk are prepared to go along with china's refusal to let taiwan join.

Bill Gates
@BillGates
·
3h
Halting funding for the World Health Organization during a world health crisis is as dangerous as it sounds. Their work is slowing the spread of COVID-19 and if that work is stopped no other organization can replace them. The world needs @WHO
now more than ever.

No sure about their continued praise for China's handling of it.

The world should fund it then, expecting the US to do so while plssing on their shoes seems unrealistic.

they have made many c0ck ups and need to be reformed or defunded and something else put in their place but it is just politics from trump, shifting the blame to an organisation whose advice he continues to ignore. the who recommend the  standard practice in an epidemic to test, isolate and trace something that south korea, taiwan, hong kong and singapore all did yet something the usa and uk didnt do and continue not to do.

If he hadn't challenged them there would be no reform. Now there will be investigations, whatever happens in the US elections.

Surely there would have been investigations anyway? Withdrawing funding at this stage isn't going to help anyone.

@InsiderTrader • April 15, 2020 9:29 AM BS

I believe that you have to be a member of the UN to be a member of the WHO.  Taiwan aren't a member of the UN

They said there was no evidence because they had none. "Taiwan were asking questions in late December" - what questions and what was the WHO meant to do?

InsiderTrader • April 15, 2020 9:36 AM BST
No sure about their continued praise for China's handling of it.

Their handling of it internally is infinitely better than trump's and also see my 9.22 post

It is becoming clearer day by day that trump's dysfunctional administration is the sole author of his country's misfortune and his desperate attempts to shift the blame equally obvious.

Dave you are in danger of reversing the debate here.

Lets not talk about Trump's failures or Boris' failures or Macron's failures. Non of them are the subject of funding cutting. I am interested in is the assertion that WHO messed up fair?

trader did the uk government mess up?

politicspunter. The fact that the African WHO boss installed a murderous dictator as a Goodwill Ambassador tells me all I need to know about this gravy train. Where was the international outrage about that? I was actually unaware of it until recently.

Well, if it was such a corrupt organisation, why have other countries not withheld funding before now?

dave, did their infinitely better handling not involve nailing apartment doors closed to keep people in? I gather they also build walls on mountain roads to contain flu ridden villagers now and again. Not sure how this would go down in the West.

pp, because most of em pay little or bugger all.

Apr 15, 2020 -- 9:57AM, InsiderTrader wrote:

Dave you are in danger of reversing the debate here.Lets not talk about Trump's failures or Boris' failures or Macron's failures. Non of them are the subject of funding cutting. I am interested in is the assertion that WHO messed up fair?

The post is about trump ending funding mot macron or johnson.

I still await your responses to my points above

trump was praising china while they were blocking WHO investigators

what did taiwan say and what were the WHO meant to do about it?

Get rid of NATO and UN too
Anybody in support of any of these organisations should be lobotomised

Apr 15, 2020 -- 10:06AM, dave1357 wrote:

Apr 15, 2020 --  8:57AM, InsiderTrader wrote:Dave you are in danger of reversing the debate here.Lets not talk about Trump's failures or Boris' failures or Macron's failures. Non of them are the subject of funding cutting. I am interested in is the assertion that WHO messed up fair?The post is about trump ending funding mot macron or johnson.I still await your responses to my points abovetrump was praising china while they were blocking WHO investigatorswhat did taiwan say and what were the WHO meant to do about it?

Lol, Insider trader started this thread titled "TRUMP RIGHT TO END WHO FUNDING?" and now he doesn't wish Trump to be mentioned?

https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2020/03/25/2003733321

Virus Outbreak: Taiwan warned WHO, China on virus last year

Taiwan warned the WHO and China about possible human-to-human transmission of the new coronavirus at the end of last year, but the global health body did not make it public, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said yesterday.

Department of International Organizations Director-General Bob Chen (陳龍錦) made the remark at a news briefing in Taipei, when asked about statements made by US Department of State spokeswoman Morgan Ortagus.

“Dec. 31— that’s the same day Taiwan first tried to warn WHO of human-human transmission. Chinese authorities meanwhile silenced doctors and refused to admit human-human transmission until Jan. 20, with catastrophic consequences,” Ortagus wrote on Twitter yesterday.

https://www.business-standard.com/article/news-ani/taiwan-warned-who-ignored-and-covid-19-became-pandemic-120040601496_1.html

The coronavirus, which originated in China, could have been stopped from turning into a pandemic if the World Health Organisation paid heed to Taiwan's early warnings regarding the human to human transmission of the virus.

However, the WHO chose to ignore the warnings by Taiwan at China's behest and now the whole world is paying the price of it. Emerging from China's infamous wet market, the virus has so far infected at least 1.216 million people around the world. The global death toll from the deadly virus stands at 65,652.

New York-based writer Wilfred Chan wrote for The Nation that despite early warnings from Taiwanese officials, the organization kept the island cut off from its global information networks. Now, it may be the rest of the world that's paying the price.

Scientists from Taiwan informed the WHO as early as December 31 about the human to human transmission of the Chinese Virus from Wuhan but not only did WHO suppress this information, it continued peddling the lie that it doesn't spread from human to human, Chan stated in the article.

that is bad trader but what difference would it have made to uk government policy if the who has made the correct call? i would suggest absolutely none. on 23/1 the who held a press conference where they said it was transmitting person to person, was more contagious than the flu and far deadlier. on 24/1 following a cobra meeting the medical director of public health england said it was likely to come to the uk. matt hancock said the risk to the uk public remained low. so the day after the who got the right message our secretary of state for health got it wrong.

^^What did you expect the WHO to do as their inspectors were being blocked from China and trump was tweeting "The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency."?

We won't get fooled again.

I think if we had had full information from the start it would have helped.

My thoughts are we have learnt a lot more from what happened in Italy than China or WHO over this. The fact that it was Italy ICU stay length numbers rather than China ones from one or two months before that caused a change in government policy tells its own story.

flushgordon1 15 Apr 20 09:33 
We won't get fooled again.



  indeed not.

of course we will get fooled again,it just comes down to money,china has a massive economy and countries didnt want to lose the trade and the usa/china trade deal hadnt been signed long,so money was put before the health of the people

These organisations waste billions every year ,if they were a manufacturing facility they would go bust due to inefficiency , that is even before you look at the structuring/ wages paid.
The charity sector is also very disorganised with a management structure which would not be tolerated in manufacturing/ private sector.

Just another gravy train, someone compared em to FIFA and the Olympics commitee on here, probably not far off.

InsiderTrader • April 15, 2020 10:34 AM BST
I think if we had had full information from the start it would have helped

well that is mainly down to china not the WHO

I wonder if the Taiwanese said "Screw you guys, goin' home!" after the WHO dismissed them or if they also called their western friends (who also dismissed them).

Why has the WHO faced criticism?

It is not the first time the WHO's response to the outbreak has come under scrutiny.

On 14 January, the organisation tweeted that preliminary Chinese investigations had found "no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission" of the new virus.

Mr Trump and others have used the tweet to attack the WHO for simply
believing China, despite evidence to the contrary. But about a week
after that tweet, on 22 January, the agency released a public statement saying that human-to-human transmission did appear to be taking place in Wuhan.

At the end of January, on the same day it declared a public health
emergency, the WHO said that travel restrictions were not needed to stop
the spread of Covid-19 - advice that was eventually ignored by most countries, including by the Trump administration the next day.

In March, the UN agency was also accused of being unduly influenced by China after a senior official refused to discuss Taiwan's response to the outbreak.

Meanwhile, some health experts also say that the WHO's guidance on face masks has led to public confusion.

Other frequently-made criticisms of the WHO more generally are that it is
constrained by politics and a sprawling bureaucracy. It came under
particular fire for its response to the 2014-2016 Ebola outbreak in West
Africa and how long it took to declare a public health emergency, leading the organisation to announce reforms in response.

You don't see a conflict of interests with China buying half of Africa and the appointment of a highly questionable non medical WHO chief, steered into the job by other African countries dave?

The WHO probably does have problems and needs reforms (or a new organisation to replace it), but at this point in time it stinks of a move to not take responsibility for own failings.

PP's post from 9.21 is pretty much the only thing of note from this news.

^^^all these global organisations tend towards political appointments and nepotism in the wider sense, that doesn't mean that they don't do some good and doesn't justify trump's attempt to destabilize the organisation during a pandemic.

Jan 30 - WHO declare COVID-019 as a public health emergency of international concern

Feb 24 - Trump tweeted that "The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!"

As per usual, Trump the bully does what bully's always do, he abuses his position to issue threats to make himself look strong.
He has form in manufacturing conflicts, allowing him to control the narrative until he later rides in on his white horse to resolve it.

What good has the WHO done during the Covid-19 outbreak?

What bad has it done?

You say it was late in calling it a pandemic? Did Trump or Johnson declare it so earlier? Just wondering how you qualify "late".

^^They quickly created a test that worked, trump refused to use it and created one that didn't work

Angoose on the 24th Feb there was only a total of 221 cases and 7 deaths in Italy. USA had like 50 cases and no deaths.

China claimed 76k cases and 2663 deaths.

So at that point it was not a problem outside China. Trump had blocked flights from China against WHO advice back in Jan.

If China and WHO had given us more information about its 2663 deaths, how long people were in ICU and so on many deaths could have been avoided. The Southampton study suggests 95% of deaths in China could have been avoided let alone the rest of the world. WHO should have listened to Taiwan.

Why did he state that "CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart."
Did he lie ?

PorcupineorPineapple
15 Apr 20 10:10
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 9,330 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
What bad has it done?

^
To ask what 'bad' a multibillion dollar operation that is supposed to protect world health has done is a bit strange. Surely it is there to do good.

1. Appointed someone who denied chlorea outbreaks to be it boss.
2. Confusion over human to human transmission.
3. Confusion over face masks.
4. Confusion over flights.
5. Not listening to Taiwan.
6. Not compiling data.

The list goes on.

Angoose
15 Apr 20 10:17
Joined: 18 Jul 02
| Topic/replies: 14,532 | Blogger: Angoose's blog
Why did he state that "CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart."
Did he lie ?

^

It was an opinion at the time. I am not sure you can call on opinion a lie.

Things have come to light later (such as the Taiwan warning) that suggest the WHO has not been brilliant or smart in my opinion. They may have worked hard. I do not know.

What do you think Angoose. Has the WHO been smart?

Why are the paddies contributing so much per head

WHO should have listened to Taiwan.

Why do you keep saying that?  There are obvious political tensions between taiwan and china so anything that taiwan says about china has to be considered in that light.  As I have to keep repeating, the WHO can only act on the evidence they have and that came from China until WHO investigators were allowed in.

Why did it take WHO til 12th March to actually declare it a Pandmemic.
there claim it would lead to people taking their eye off the ball is staggering to say the least.

Trumps an idiot but people deflecting criticism away from China or WHO is just as bad imo.

He hasn't ended it, just suspended it pending a review. I don't agree with the timing but they definitely need to be investigated. Not recommending travel being cut off, from China especially, was grossly negligent at best and criminal at worst. The head guy is a politician and quite a dodgy one too with a long standing relationship with China from his days as an Ethiopian politician.

Not a big Trump fan but as a non-US citizen/resident the most important thing for me is US foreign policy and he is the first non-warmonger President in my iifetime, which is good for the world.

He also needs to start a war of some sort to win the election and I'd rather see him do it this way than start or prolong a real one, which numerous Presidents have done when in trouble or looking to get re-elected. No President at war who has stood for re-election has failed to get re-elected. I'm surprised he hasn't looked to attack China and the WHO sooner than now. He initially focused on blaming China but then went quiet on it. And there is a very good chance that China and WHO were complicit in suppressing human to human transmission until after the trade deal with China was signed on 15 Jan. They confirmed it 5 days later even though Taiwan had warned of it 3 weeks earlier. The timing of that looks very dodgy and needs to be looked at.

Apr 15, 2020 -- 11:23AM, InsiderTrader wrote:

Angoose15 Apr 20 10:17Joined: 18 Jul 02| Topic/replies: 14,532 | Blogger: Angoose's blogWhy did he state that "CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart."Did he lie ?^It was an opinion at the time. I am not sure you can call on opinion a lie.Things have come to light later (such as the Taiwan warning) that suggest the WHO has not been brilliant or smart in my opinion. They may have worked hard. I do not know.What do you think Angoose. Has the WHO been smart?

It is possible that Trump's current "opinion" is also wrong ?

N-east Correspondent • April 15, 2020 11:26 AM BST
Why did it take WHO til 12th March to actually declare it a Pandmemic.

Pandemic is simply a technical term based on the spread between countries.  So can't see how that is relevant to anything.

Apr 15, 2020 -- 11:25AM, G Hall wrote:

Why are the paddies contributing so much per head

Because unlike Blighty they are one of the richest countries on earth.

I see you swerved my direct question..

One day after thumping his chest and screaming that he has "total authority" over ending the US coronavirus lockdown, he sheepishly has to admit that he hasn't, the President is not above the law.

So what does he do to deflect the attention, picks a fight with the WHO.

Apr 15, 2020 -- 11:10AM, PorcupineorPineapple wrote:

What bad has it done?You say it was late in calling it a pandemic? Did Trump or Johnson declare it so earlier? Just wondering how you qualify "late".

Do you think it is the job of the leader of one country to declare a virus/disease a pandemic? It isn't

all this topic proves is that IT can round up cattle; & that dave has found the bold symbol

is this not all about removing Tedros Adhanom from the helm?

Angoose
15 Apr 20 10:27
Joined: 18 Jul 02
| Topic/replies: 14,535 | Blogger: Angoose's blog

    Apr 15, 2020 -- 10:23AM, InsiderTrader wrote:


    Angoose15 Apr 20 10:17Joined: 18 Jul 02| Topic/replies: 14,532 | Blogger: Angoose's blogWhy did he state that "CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart."Did he lie ?^It was an opinion at the time. I am not sure you can call on opinion a lie.Things have come to light later (such as the Taiwan warning) that suggest the WHO has not been brilliant or smart in my opinion. They may have worked hard. I do not know.What do you think Angoose. Has the WHO been smart?


It is possible that Trump's current "opinion" is also wrong ?

^

He has taken an action based on his opinion - yes it could be wrong.

Angoose, Do you think the WHO has been smart over this outbreak?

Baphornet • April 15, 2020 11:40 AM BST
all this topic proves is that IT can round up cattle; & that dave has found the bold symbol

Would you prefer italics when I quote your drivel?

dave1357 15 Apr 20 10:31 

Pandemic is simply a technical term based on the spread between countries.  So can't see how that is relevant to anything.




dave, every time the news was on they mentioned that the WHO had 'not yet declared it a pandemic'. Clearly a term which, when announced, would trigger upgraded action, unless I was mistaken.

maybe if trump had bothered doing some testing it would have resulted in an earlier declaration?

To determine whether or not the WHO has been "smart" in regard to its handling of the COVID-19 outbreak, you first require to understand what the role of the WHO is and measure its performance against that role.

WHO works worldwide to promote health, keep the world safe, and serve the vulnerable.

Our goal is to ensure that a billion more people have universal health coverage, to protect a billion more people from health emergencies, and provide a further billion people with better health and well-being.

For universal health coverage, we: 
- focus on primary health care to improve access to quality essential services
- work towards sustainable financing and financial protection
- improve access to essential medicines and health products
- train the health workforce and advise on labour policies
- support people's participation in national health policies
- improve monitoring, data and information.

For health emergencies, we:
- prepare for emergencies by identifying, mitigating and managing risks
- prevent emergencies and support development of tools necessary during outbreaks
- detect and respond to acute health emergencies
- support delivery of essential health services in fragile settings.

For health and well-being we:
- address social determinants
- promote intersectoral approaches for health
- prioritize health in all policies and healthy settings.

Through our work, we address:
- human capital across the life-course
- noncommunicable diseases prevention
- mental health promotion
- climate change in small island developing states
- antimicrobial resistance
- elimination and eradication of high-impact communicable diseases.

Having never read that high level overview description of the WHO before today, I am in no position to arrive at an informed opinion as to whether or not they have been "smart".

I suspect that this will be the case for every other contributor to this thread.

I can, however, offer an opinion on whether Trump has chosen to use the WHO as a domestic distraction.
There is ample evidence of similar behaviours that allow a reasonable opinion to be formed.

Stretching it a bit to blame Trump for the WHO inaction dave tbh 

https://time.com/5791661/who-coronavirus-pandemic-declaration/

During multiple prior press briefings, WHO officials maintained that COVID-19 had “pandemic potential,” but stopped short of declaring it one. The agency did, in January, call it a public health emergency of international concern, a slightly different label that refers to an “extraordinary event” that “constitute[s] a public health risk to other States through the international spread of disease.”

Angoose,

Do you really want to talk about Trump rather than WHO/China failings?

trump is the one attempting to damage the organisation

btw you still haven't answered afaik

And how does neutering the WHO at the height of a pandemic help getting the world back to normal?

Apr 15, 2020 -- 12:05PM, InsiderTrader wrote:

Angoose,Do you really want to talk about Trump rather than WHO/China failings?

Look at your thread title

From the bbc...

International rejection of Trump's WHO decision grows
China and Germany have added to international condemnation of the decision by President Trump to US halt funding for the World Health Organization (WHO).

A foreign ministry spokesman said China was "seriously concerned" about the decision, which he said came during a "critical moment" in the pandemic.

Germany's Foreign Minister Heiko Maas said "blaming doesn't help".


He added that one of the best ways to work to stop the spread of the virus was to strengthen the UN and the WHO in the development and distribution of tests and vaccines.

The EU foreign policy chief, Josep Borrell, said he "deeply regretted" the move, adding: "There is no reason justifying this move at a moment when their efforts are needed more than ever to help contain [and] mitigate the coronavirus pandemic."

As much as I despise Trump and all that he stands for I would never put myself on the side of China either, that cruel tyranny needs to be taken down a peg or 2000

It makes no positive difference at the moment Dave. In fact it has hindered things by being slow and giving confusing advise.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cmWxH1S5A8

Context:-

If you look at the WHO website, they are behind on funding all the time and loads of countries owe them money and are late in providing payment, including China and Germany. The US are the largest contributor and owe €99bn but the WHO has had funding problems for years. In total it was owed €253bn by countries all over the world as of 31 March and I'd imagine this pandemic will mean it's funding will take an even bigger hit.

https://www.who.int/about/finances-accountability/funding/AC_Status_Report_2...

Just some context about Trump hampering them during a pandemic. There are a lot more countries who are doing this. And the reality is that a pandemic is hampering them even more because they are not going to be top of the pile for payments in the middle (start!) of an economic crisis.

And Trump wouldn't have been paying them any time soon anyway, whether he made this announcement or not.

WHO also green lighted reopening of the Wuhan wet markets.

Good idea?

International condemnation ?

As with most things, where Trumps concerned, first they condemn then they follow, as they did with closing the borders.

Apr 15, 2020 -- 12:41PM, InsiderTrader wrote:

WHO also green lighted reopening of the Wuhan wet markets.Good idea?

Could you please link the WHO statement?

lets not forget Dr Tedros thought appointing Robert Mugabe as a WHO goodwill ambassador was a good idea.

Amazing leadership by Trump to end funding.

BTW the WHO are a talking shop. They have always allowed affected countries to lead the effort rather than controlling themselves.
They were horrendous at the start of the Ebola outbreak in 2014

take that money of WHO and buy 40,000 ventilators with the same money for the incredible people of America who are doing a tremendous job,"now that's how you run an economy"the American public will love it.
Votes for Donald

Just another gravy train, someone compared em to FIFA and the Olympics commitee on here, probably not far off.


Nail on the head. The vast majority of these "Charities" are filth shops where failed politicians end up as a "retirement" gig. Look at Milliband.
In Ireland, vast swathes of them have ex politicians as CEOs.

The only charity I respect is MSF. A phenomenal open organisation which does amazing work on the ground

Huge wet market reopens in Wuhan after WHO backs controversial move

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/huge-wet-market-reopens-wuhan-21867777

WHO is ‘lamely following China’s line’ on wet markets

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71V08D1cvuQ

those wet markets are horrendous, absolute cruelty in its worst form
terrified animals packed in crates to be slaughtered by god knows what method
even if they found out it wasn't the direct source of covid19 they should be banned NOW

for WHO to back the reopening with the only directive that certain animals should not be allowed
is indefensible imo

Apr 15, 2020 -- 1:29PM, InsiderTrader wrote:

WHO is ‘lamely following China’s line’ on wet marketshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71V08D1cvuQ

I said a link to WHO statement - do you have that?

One where they "green lighted reopening"

Its the Americans money they can do what they like with it if some people do not like Trumps decision then do feel free to make up the difference

Bill Gates
✔
@BillGates

Halting funding for the World Health Organization during a world health crisis is as dangerous as it sounds. Their work is slowing the spread of COVID-19 and if that work is stopped no other organization can replace them. The world needs @WHO now more than ever.

Speaking on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme, Dr Nabarro said while WHO is not able to tell governments what to do, their advice is to close wet markets.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/
coronavirus-china-cases-deaths-who-wet-market-wuhan-a9462286.html

Looks more like a red light than a green light.
Interesting to learn that IT relies on The Mirror for his information though.

WHO said in a statement that wet markets should not be allowed to sell illegal wildlife for food
and authorities should enforce food safety and hygiene regulations. But it said “wet markets
and other food markets do not need to be closed down.”

to me its not about WHO directives or not - they are horrendous killing factories
would you like to go to your local market and pick an animal to be slaughtered?

Looks like one part of the WHO team changed its mind after Scott Morrison (Australian PM) had a go at them for the green lighting.

Australia are keeping the WHO funding in place for the moment but no doubt push for change of leadership and and reform.

trump is in full election mode


he couldnt give a t0sss about anything bar the election