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The Leopard
15 Jun 18 08:09
Joined:
Date Joined: 05 Apr 06
| Topic/replies: 25,113 | Blogger: The Leopard's blog
What about the daily mail taking photos of that naked bike day ?
.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2018/jun/15/upskirting-to-become-a-criminal-offence-punishable-by-two-years-in-jail

Upskirting – the taking of surreptitious, sexually intrusive photographs – is to become a specific criminal offence punishable by up to two years in prison.

The justice minister Lucy Frazer confirmed on Friday that the government would back a private member’s bill introduced by the Liberal Democrat MP Wera Hobhouse outlawing the practice.

In the most serious cases, those convicted of secretly photographing underneath someone’s clothing without their consent in England and Wales will be placed on the sex offender register.

Such invasive behaviour is currently prosecuted under either the offence of outraging public decency or as a crime of voyeurism under the Sexual Offences Act.

Not all instances of upskirting, however, are covered by existing criminal law. One woman, Gina Martin, started an online campaign for the practice to be criminalised after police declined to prosecute a man whom she accused of snapping pictures of her on his phone at a music festival in Hyde Park in London last summer. She had been wearing underwear and the photograph was therefore not deemed to be illegal.

Frazer said: “This behaviour is a hideous invasion of privacy which leaves victims feeling degraded and distressed.

“By making upskirting a specific offence, we are sending a clear message that this behaviour will not be tolerated, and that perpetrators will be properly punished.

“I’d like to thank Wera Hobhouse, Gina Martin, and all other campaigners for their tireless work, and look forward to seeing the bill progress through parliament.”

Hobhouse’s bill will receive its second reading in the Commons on Friday. The MP said: “I got involved in politics to change things that my constituents and I care about. I am incredibly grateful to Gina Martin for starting this campaign, and for giving me the opportunity – in my first year in parliament – to do exactly that.

“The fact that the government have listened to our calls is testament to the widespread consensus that there was a gap in the law that needed to be addressed.”

Martin said: “Almost a year ago, I started my campaign to make upskirting a sexual offence after I was targeted … And now, the result of all that hard work is that women and girls who needed this law changed are now being heard by those in power.”

There have been a number of convictions recently, including that of Andrew Macrae, who was vice-president of ticketing company Live Nation. He was found to have amassed 50,000 images of strangers for his sexual gratification.

He was caught by an off-duty police officer who noticed a pen-shaped camera in a laptop bag that Macrae had placed between a woman’s legs at Clapham Junction station.

Katie Ghose, chief executive of Women’s Aid, said: “We welcome the government taking decisive action to make upskirting a criminal offence. This form of abuse is painful and humiliating for victims and often has a devastating impact on all aspects of their lives.

“By condemning this form of abuse, we can send out the powerful message that upskirting is unacceptable and perpetrators of this crime will be held to account.”

Professor Clare McGlynn of Durham University, an expert on the law on sexual offences, said: “The criminalisation of upskirting … is a welcome first step towards a more comprehensive law protecting victims of all forms of image-based sexual abuse, which also includes so-called ‘revenge porn’. We hope to work with the government to strengthen what is proposed in order to provide a truly effective deterrent, looking at intent, anonymity for all victims, and at threats.”
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Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 11:42 AM BST
There is a law in place, now if that law should be changed then they are going to have to say why
And the person and people wanting to change the law will be best not to tell lies

As in the op
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 11:44 AM BST
because when I read that sort of nonsense in the op it makes me suspicious

I don't know why
Report Just Checking June 15, 2018 11:59 AM BST
I hope this applies to "upkilting" for when Aka and Trilby go on their annual holiday to Blackpool! Wink
Report trilby22 June 15, 2018 11:59 AM BST
Cool
Report posy June 15, 2018 12:25 PM BST
You'd think parliament would have better things to do than waste time on this issue which is to all intent and purposes already covered by legislation. Looks like the silly season has started earlier than normal this year.
Report SontaranStratagem June 15, 2018 12:39 PM BST
Will tv presenters stop wearing low cut dresses? Steph McGovern (BBC) is always sitting front camera with a low cut dress to show a lot of thigh. BBC presenters are probably the worst for it imo.
Report trilby22 June 15, 2018 1:19 PM BST
Had to look her up see who she was.  What an oogly looking woman.  Need something to divert from her boat, imo.
Report Torquemada June 15, 2018 1:22 PM BST
A low cut dress that show a bit of thigh? Woah, that really is low! What channel did you say she was on again? Laugh
Report Crisp77 June 15, 2018 1:54 PM BST
I know a women who was traumatised by upskirting. She had to grow a beard so she wouldn't be recognised.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 2:05 PM BST
Pre-op tranny ?
Report Gin June 15, 2018 2:21 PM BST
Report alun2005 June 15, 2018 2:34 PM BST
How are the tabloid newspapers going to manage now without their daily front page photo of some Z-List bimbette getting out of a taxi, thighs strategically opened (completely accidentally of course) revealing her knickers?
Report Arklearkle June 15, 2018 3:11 PM BST
In short its a private members bill making it illegal to take photographs of private members
Report GLASGOWCALLING June 15, 2018 3:29 PM BST
lone tory objects to upskirting law change.!!!! LaughLaughCry


    Christopher Chope has blocked the upskirting laws at the last minute. An unquestionable act of misogyny. How could anyone hate women so much that they would want it to be legal to take pictures of her genitals without her consent?


.. courtesy of twitter.
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 3:32 PM BST
It might be something in the specifics he objects to. Doesn't necessarily mean he hates women.
Report bigmo June 15, 2018 3:42 PM BST
Almost as sad and embarrassing as pantie sniffing. Some right weirdo's about.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 3:44 PM BST
Why can't women just wear shorts and trousers ......job done !
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 3:44 PM BST
lfc1971 15 Jun 18 10:30

now cooperman if someone is wanting to change the law can’t be bothered to tell the truth
And people like you are stupid enough to listen to her
That’s not good , it’s dangerous when people are as stupid as that


cooperman 15 Jun 18 11:05

You really don't read, or absorb what you read. Her name is Gina Martin, not Gina Millar[sic] and she isn't an M.P., merely a victim who was prepared to campaign for a change in the law. Stupid? Take a look in the mirror
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 3:45 PM BST
Oh lfc,

you need to get upon your donkey and get back to your village, they need you!
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 3:52 PM BST
The leopard, some ladies look very nice in a dress/skirt, and why shouldn't they wear them if that's what they like to wear. People shouldn't try to photograph them without consent, it's very bad manners.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 4:01 PM BST
What about mini-skirts.....what should be the minimum length ?
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 4:01 PM BST
I don't think they should go to jail for 2 years though. I think all they need is a good telling off.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 4:01 PM BST

Jun 15, 2018 -- 4:01PM, The Leopard wrote:


What about mini-skirts.....what should be the minimum length ?


^^^

Report themightymac June 15, 2018 4:02 PM BST
The pervs should be castrated.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 4:03 PM BST
No....because what if they were fitted up by a bent cop ?
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 4:05 PM BST
Mini skirts are very nice on the right lady. I think it was the late 60's early 70's when it was more fashionable. I don't really care how short they wear them. But still they shouldn't be photographed without consent, that is the point.
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 4:06 PM BST
That's just barbaric
Report Get me a drink June 15, 2018 4:09 PM BST
...Castrated I mean
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 4:15 PM BST
mini skirts are not great in Medway. As stated many times before they are very nice on certain young ladies but an affront to public decency on some. Thigs that should have been put away years ago and bellies protruding over the skirt is nost troubling! Get them on and maybe use the Burqa! We need to bring the fashion Police back.

I do think upskirting is disgusting though and should be policed with vigilante style justice meted out.
Report woundedknee June 15, 2018 4:23 PM BST
medway is a khazi inbred paradise and that isle of grain is a shocking gaff
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 4:25 PM BST
for once wounded knee we are in agreementWhoops!
Report woundedknee June 15, 2018 4:27 PM BST
that was.nt the answer i wanted mr death
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 4:27 PM BST
Haha it’s been thrown out ! Well done Sir Christopher  Scrope

Can you imagine 2 years in jail for this , complete madness
Report Crisp77 June 15, 2018 4:29 PM BST
So they were busy beavering away for nothing.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 4:31 PM BST
Beavers gnawing at wood ?
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 4:32 PM BST
: )
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 4:32 PM BST
Laugh
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 5:06 PM BST
Some of you are unbelieveable!

Do you think it is alright for a person to try and take a photo up a skirt? Seriously?
Report Injera June 15, 2018 5:15 PM BST
To even have this debate is beyond belief. Anyone who treats women like this deserves a slap.

Of course it should be a criminal offence!!!

As for the media's double standards on taking pics of girls' bits and pieces, well that's for the Old Bill. Let's see them act.
Report Torquemada June 15, 2018 5:21 PM BST
Perhaps we should all 'take a knee' in protest? Oh, no, hang on, maybe not!
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 5:27 PM BST
No it's not alright to take photos up women's skirts but it has to be kept in proportion.

200 hrs community service ...max.

There have been 75 murders this year so far in UK ....that's 75 families  and their friends grieving, that should be a Govt. priority.

( Make all drugs legal so gangs have no motivation to deal the rubbish; result : no one gets killed )

My son could be killed as an innocent bystander.

75 more at least to come this year !

Govt. is lily livered  and thick !
Report Torquemada June 15, 2018 5:32 PM BST
What's that got to do with upskirts?
Report SontaranStratagem June 15, 2018 5:40 PM BST
I would never take a photo of a womans bits anyway, anyone over 18 doing is either still a virgin or sad and perverted

16 year old lads can get away with it to a degree, but grown men over 30? CryCry
Report SontaranStratagem June 15, 2018 5:43 PM BST
Its up to the other men to sort the pervert out imo, why we should rely on the state to intervene is baffling

Women should knee the little mugs in the balls as well. if the woman enjoys that sort of stuff though then who are we to stop them?
Report posy June 15, 2018 5:49 PM BST
The outcry reminds me of the dangerous dogs act...knee jerk reaction with poorly crafted legislation.
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 6:10 PM BST
Dangerous dogs should be banned.....drug dealers are using them for protection.
Report themightymac June 15, 2018 7:40 PM BST
Stupid old ****. He should resign. He is finished now.
Report Zsa_Zsa_Gabors_Leg June 15, 2018 7:53 PM BST
I dont see it as a serious problem, surely its just for the craic!
Report Crisp77 June 15, 2018 7:59 PM BST
Huge problem at shopping centres where complaints have been escalating.
Report Injera June 15, 2018 8:03 PM BST
Laugh
Report Whisperingdeath June 15, 2018 8:52 PM BST
Don't start, I am now starting to feel bad about looking up escalators!
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 9:06 PM BST
That's what the feminist extremists want !
Report Torquemada June 15, 2018 9:10 PM BST
Will looking be banned as well, or just taking photos?
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:13 PM BST
such a fuss, leave the peepers alone
Report Torquemada June 15, 2018 9:21 PM BST
How about looking at their breasts, will that be banned?
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:24 PM BST
perfectly normal
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:25 PM BST
its almost like a hobby for some , not me
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:30 PM BST
can you imagine if you were caught doing it!Laugh
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 9:38 PM BST
.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7367805/Television-producer-who-filmed-himself-having-sex-with-women-jailed.html
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:42 PM BST
I feel sorry for the mp who blocked it, they are going to make his life hell

but I admire him
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:51 PM BST
We might have to get to a situation were everything is recorded , everything we do in life 24 hrs a day
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 9:52 PM BST
no one need see it, but it would be there recorded, everything we say and do
Report The Leopard June 15, 2018 9:58 PM BST
Chope married Christine Mary Hutchinson in April 1987 in Wimborne Minster and they have a daughter, Antonia, born in February 1990 and a son, Philip, born in August 1992.[citation needed]
Report lfc1971 June 15, 2018 10:00 PM BST
that doesn't look good at first glance
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 7:16 AM BST
Corbynistas are much worse
Report lovegod June 16, 2018 7:50 AM BST
I heard about this on the news yesterday morning.

Later I was on an escalator and just ahead of me was a guy wearing a kilt.

I remembered the two year sentence and though better of it!!!!!
Report STUDYFORM June 16, 2018 8:07 AM BST

Jun 16, 2018 -- 7:16AM, lfc1971 wrote:


Corbynistas are much worse


See, lfc, this is the stuff that's so unnecessary.
"Corbyn(istas)" is in no way relevant or pertinent to any part of the topic or discussion.

The idiot Chope. Whose constituents (Chopeistas?) almost certainly don't even realise he's the person they're voting for, together with a bill brought forward by a Lib Dem and supported by the government and all the women who've had their gussets photographed are the people involved...

Yet you still manage to pop a little Corbyn into the thread.

Report STUDYFORM June 16, 2018 8:08 AM BST
btw... lovegod Laugh
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 8:14 AM BST
study I was merely commentating on the giggilos post before mine

whats wrong with that?
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 8:18 AM BST
I hope his constituents reelect him
Report aaronh June 16, 2018 8:30 AM BST
He will be, he has one of the largest majorities on the country. (nearly got 70% last time)

I expect this will eventually get through anyway and all it has achieved is embarrassing the Tories for a few days when May already looks weak.

I also expect there will be eventual reforms to the system and not in a way he likes. Most people don't care about the HoC anyway but may well be engaged by a story by this and be put off later.

Btw, he also did the same on a bill with regards to attacking police dogs, horses etc. And has previous for doing so, even on bills the government is supporting
Report STUDYFORM June 16, 2018 8:46 AM BST
Well, lfc, each to their own I suppose, but I cannot understand why you think what this MP does is ok. Or why you'd hope he got reelected. He will, he's in a safe seat, but
to block a bill outlawing upskirting? What's good about that?
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 9:07 AM BST
Its already illegal, and there are much more important things to be doing than wasting time on this

The fool of an mp who is bringing this through parliament should be de selected for wasting everyones time
Report lybertyne June 16, 2018 9:17 AM BST
The MP who objected didn't do so because he thinks upskirting is good.  He did it to prevent a law being passed, which carries a prison sentence, by a practically empty House of Commons.  He argues that something so important should have a proper discussion.  Otherwise you can end up with all sorts of new laws with stiff penalties being made at the whim of just a few people.  You either thoroughly discuss and approve a new law, no matter how noble people may think it, or you let a handful of MPs turn whatever they want into a criminal offence.
Report Torquemada June 16, 2018 9:34 AM BST
That's a very good post Lybertyne.
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 9:47 AM BST
Has he done this for other laws when Parliament has been half empty or is this a first?
Report xmoneyx June 16, 2018 9:50 AM BST
an the law being passed

make up skirting a criminal offence
Report lovegod June 16, 2018 9:53 AM BST
Does it also cover down blousing?
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 9:56 AM BST
I gusset depends on how you're trying to sneak a peak.
Report xmoneyx June 16, 2018 10:05 AM BST
what about chum trousers
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 10:15 AM BST
Two points

1. These people are weird. No one should take a picture of anyone without their consent regardless of what the picture is of.

2. Is this something the police should be spending their time on when 2 in 5 girls and 1 in 5 boys are suffering abuse, rape gangs operate throughout the country and most regular crimes go unsolved?
Report xmoneyx June 16, 2018 10:20 AM BST
bill won't be ready till july


feel free with your smartphones
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 10:25 AM BST
IT - in answer to your second question, I'd imagine if this happened to you or if you had daughters and it had happened to them your answer would be yes. The reason resources are spread thin is nothing to do with investigating "less worthy" crimes.
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 10:36 AM BST
It does actually. If resources are used on things like scanning for comments on Twitter there is less resources for following up CSA cases.
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 10:46 AM BST
Not really. It's not just a pool system where every copper follows up on every crime. There are teams and budgets etc etc.
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 11:26 AM BST
would it be possible for women to wear shorts under their skirts ?
I don’t know
Report cooperman June 16, 2018 11:53 AM BST
lfc getting quite excited, never seen so many posts BlushBlushBlush
Report lfc1971 June 16, 2018 12:07 PM BST
: ) I don’t know the whole thing just seems so comical
let the peepers have their fun
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 12:16 PM BST
This is the kind of thing the MPs should be making strong laws to stop and the police should be acting on.

Instead they choose to pick off easy targets.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-5850281/ROBERT-HARDMAN-did-police-stop-travellers-destroying-historic-brewery.html
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 12:17 PM BST
In a statement to the Mail, a spokesman says: ‘We didn’t stand by and let things happen. We took decisions based on the resources we had available at the time during an extremely busy weekend of unprecedented demand, along with consideration for our officer safety due to numbers of travellers and their potential hostility, not to go to the site. Officer safety is and has to be integral to any operational decision.’
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 12:23 PM BST
Isn't breaking and entering, or stealing, or vandalism already on the statute books?



Are you saying our MPs should be deliberating already existing laws rather than new ones aimed at protecting young women from pervs?
Report mini me June 16, 2018 12:26 PM BST



Ah, that's better!
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 12:31 PM BST
PorcupineorPineapple
16 Jun 18 12:23
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 5,052 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
Isn't breaking and entering, or stealing, or vandalism already on the statute books?



Are you saying our MPs should be deliberating already existing laws rather than new ones aimed at protecting young women from pervs?

^

Of course it should be illegal but is it a top priority for the police to enforce when they refuse to enforce the basic laws we have on certain minorities?

You make all the laws you like and collect all the data on people you like but if nothing is enforced you are wasting everyones time.
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 12:43 PM BST
That's a completely separate issue IT.


Happens plenty of times that police (or ambulance or fire crews for that matter) will stay back if there's a serious risk of of them or civilians being hurt or killed by them barging in.



As for it being a top priority, not one person has said that. It is just a law that's finally being drawn up to stop some people being utter nuisances, pervs, or bully boys. The simple act of making it illegal will act as a significant deterrent in itself so is worthwhile.
Report InsiderTrader June 16, 2018 1:22 PM BST
Of course these people should be stopped.

My fear is things like this and monitoring Twitter etc are just diversions from the bigger issues. The fact this gets more coverage than Telford is mad.
Report PorcupineorPineapple June 16, 2018 1:28 PM BST
Again, you're confusing media coverage of something with the thing itself. The thing itself is very important. But then lots of things are also very important. Media will always pick up on what they want. Compare the coverage when a young, pretty woman is attacked to when someone else is. Lots of pictures, full page coverage etc etc. "Such a waste" etc. Sadly, just the way the media works.
Report The Leopard June 16, 2018 1:40 PM BST

Jun 16, 2018 -- 12:26PM, mini me wrote:


Ah, that's better!


Mini me....did your Au Pair realise you were taking a photo.....or were you using the hidden button camera ?

Report Pleasegivemeanailedontip June 17, 2018 10:47 AM BST
Surprised by TMay and her 'disappointed' statement. I wouldn't have thought polical correctness over scrutiny on a feminist issue is a good thing for a conservative female PM.
Report trilby22 June 17, 2018 10:54 AM BST
Thing is, imo, there were less than 30 people in the House (from what I've seen) when the vote took place.  Do we really want new laws (as right and correct as they may be) being voted through by circa 5% of the House?

No thank you very much!
Report Knight Commander June 17, 2018 5:41 PM BST
If they plan to imprison everybody who inadvertently catches a glimpse of knicker gusset they'd better start building more jails a bit sharpish
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