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Chit Chat
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10 May 17
09:35
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Date Joined:
08 Jan 02
Following on from some thread about lager! - which morphed into a home brew discussion, I bottled my Mosaic IPA kit from the demijohn into swing top bottles and made 7 pints from batch one.
I added small amount of dissolved sugar into each bottle and left it in my fermentation room (toilet!) for 2 days. Now moved to cooler room and need to wait 2 weeks. I did get a little taste of the stuff in syphoning and 1. It tasted of beer 2. It tasted of hops. So this is encouraging. The beer looks a nice orange colour and is hazy.
Batch 2 will be bottled on Friday.
I added small amount of dissolved sugar into each bottle and left it in my fermentation room (toilet!) for 2 days. Now moved to cooler room and need to wait 2 weeks. I did get a little taste of the stuff in syphoning and 1. It tasted of beer 2. It tasted of hops. So this is encouraging. The beer looks a nice orange colour and is hazy.
Batch 2 will be bottled on Friday.
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Replies: 63
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Sounds great.Hope your endeavours are rewarded in two weeks time.
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Thanks. I know there are a few that expressed an interest in home brewing on here, as well as Ovalman who is more experienced.
It has been a very satisfying experience so far and I will post and update when the beer is sampled. |
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Funnily Jack I mentioned on that thread that my boiler packed in (not burst!) and I hadn't brewed much. I've done 2 kits in that time (only sampling now) but no all grain. I may be a bit more experienced but it's not rocket science and something anyone can do. It also shouldn't be expensive, a starter kit costs £50 (ish) but that gets 40 pints of drinkable beer and you can reuse the equipment for your next brew.
On Monday I bought a new boiler and brewed my first all grain this year. It was just a mish-mash of ingredients I had lying about, I have it brewing atm, it's still bubbling away. This Saturday I plan a Czech style lager, I have the grains but not the hops or yeast, luckily I have a local home brew shop close. All Grain isn't that much more difficult, it just requires more time (an hour V's 4 or 5 hours.) The difference is huge however and all grain has so more versatility. Taste wise it also knocks socks off a can kit, I've never had the home brew twang off an AG but have had on several cheap kits. It works out slightly cheaper but you have to factor in equipment costs so you need to brew a lot to recoup the initial cost. Give it 2 weeks in the fridge if you can hold off after it's been conditioning. Of course you can sample one but you'll find your best pint will be your last. The fridge should take most if not all of that haze away, it will also help compact the yeast into the bottle. It will be worth the extra wait. The Mosaic kit (I haven't tried it) gets good reviews so it should be a good first experience. In the meantime get a supply on, now your FV is free, sterilise it and get another batch on. |
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Ha Ovalman. Thanks for the encouragement and advice. Just finished bottling batch two. Had a quick mouthful of beer while syphoning and can say, that although warm, it did at this early stage resemble beer and will very likely be an
award-winning classic.  Still in a bit of a quandry about the next move, but no excuse not to do another 7 pint batch - other than the time vs pints of beer produced. Still thinking about going halves on a grainfather with my mate. My step-son made a can kit of 'Bitter' and it was drinkable but no more and reminded me of drinking rubbish home brew in my youth. I think I know what you mean by twang. My favourite beer at the moment in Purity UBU (available from all supermarkets - maybe not N. Ire). The bottle says it has Maris Otter, Crystal, Black and Wheat Malts and Pilgrim and Cascade hops. I may try and get some advice on relative quantities etc from a home brew forum. Probably way too ambitious at the moment - but what an achievement that would be to produce something near. The brewery is not that far away from me and I hope to do a tour one Saturday. |
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I probably mentioned on that other thread but the reason I got into brewing was because I had an amazing black lager in a pub (http://en.ufleku.cz/) in Prague. I started with a kit like you and have added bits and bobs when needed. If you consider the cost of a pint and the 30p for a Home Brewed one then the costs pay for themselves. When my boiler packed in I bought a similar boiler but with digital controls.
http://www.pecoservices.co.uk/digital-mashingboiling-bin---eb1d-30-p.asp It will do a similar job to the Grainfather but without the bells and whistles. You don't need a Grainfather to produce quality beer but it helps simplify things and shaves some time off the overall brewing process. I'd love one as well but a Brew Pub/ Shed is my next move, it may take a while but I'll build one eventually. I've never heard of that beer but I'm heading to Tesco's later so will check if it's there. Getting the proportions correct is difficult without an exact recipe but that's part of the fun. When you go to the brewery just ask them for the recipe, they can only say no. I'm a member of http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/ and also a few Facebook groups. The forum is a great place to ask with many more knowledgeable than me. That's where I got most of my info. I picked up the Saaz hops earlier but no true Czech lager yeast. I had to opt for a Saflager S23 yeast instead, we'll see how it goes. Some kits are better than others. I bought the Coopers Starter kit that came with a lager brew. It was horrible, almost putting me off brewing, my 2nd batch was a Bock Beer, OK but nothing special. When I moved to all grain it was a total new ball game. If I had to do it over again I'd still buy the kit (but the Bitter version), move to AG asap and then buy a cheap larder fridge off Gumtree for temperature control. I done things a bit different than this ie buying Corny Kegs and Co2 gas before a fridge (that only cost me £25.) |
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That looks a good option, Ovalman. Very, very tempted by that Peco. Would you do BIAB with that? What process would you follow between mashing and boiling. i.e. how would you sparge?
Purity have 3 main beers, UBU, Gold and Mad Goose. In English Tesco's, Sainsbury's, Asda, Morrisons, Waitrose, M & S. I have signed up for that forum. Thanks. I am not against a decent lager, I have been to Prague and had a phase of drinking Czech lagers around that time. Don't know if I can get black lager here but will have a look in the supermarkets. I will try some beers first and see how it goes. |
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I seen the Mad Goose last night but not the other 2 but it was around 7pm and the shelves were emptying so I may find it. I bought a Guinness Milk Stout which was OK and a St Peter's Gluten Free Lager which I enjoyed. I'm not a (Celiac) sufferer but wanted to try the beer type as I was curious. I was expecting alcohol free taste, you know something that resembles a beer but is odd but I was pleasantly surprised at the hoppiness and flavour.
I'm gonna start my brew after I get lunch. Last Monday I done a no sparge, instead I constantly recirculated the wort with a large jug. As the boiler is temperature controlled it held the wort at a constant 67°. Today I will sparge, I've a large pot I'll heat some water and sparge with that. Yes I'm using BIAB but I've other filters in place that help make a clearer beer. I'll maybe take some photo's. You can DIY a boiler for |
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?Don't know how I lost half a message?
You can DIY a boiler from a large container, 2 Tesco Kettles and a £3 tap but Peco Boilers start from under £50, that's what I had before. For a mashtun you can convert a Cool Box and do the no chill method. http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=51779 That's how I got started, you should have everything at home except maybe a £4 thermometer and the ingredients. Ask any questions no matter how stupid or simple they seem. We all had to start somewhere and that forum is really friendly. I'm gonna have to brew outside, my missus hates the smell and TBF it does stink the house out! |
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keep the brew inside - stick the wife outside. simples ...
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The best tasting beer I ever brewed was using a dirt cheap kit and yeast from a local brewery.
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I brew my own tea ..just off to make one now.
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I think freshness of ingredients matter Dr Crippen and that's why all grain is far superior. The fresh yeast probably made the difference.
Started at 2.30 and just finishing now. As usual I got my numbers wrong, I forgot about changing my boil off numbers so I'll end up with a stronger brew than I want. Things went well otherwise, final gravity was 1.056 so I think my final beer will end up about 5.5%. I could dilute but I'll just leave it as is. I've finished with about 35 pints for 6 weeks time  Costs iirc, 4kg Irish Lager Malt £4, Saaz hops £4.95, Lager Yeast £2.30, Beer finings £1.30, teaspoon Irish Moss 10p roughly. £12.70. I'll upload some pics and post them when mods pass them. |
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Will pick up a St Peter's. With my DIY skills and mixing water and electricity, the home made boiler option is a no-no!
If I get a Peco and take to brewing, and eventually go the Grainfather route, I can use that for sparge water heating! Sorted! |
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I think once you start, your always aspiring for new shiny's. I'd love a Grainfather but it's a big purchase, maybe someday I'll do as your thinking.
2 things I noticed yesterday, the mash went up to 74° at times so I think recirculating the wort from time to time is a must. And I'll have to calculate the actual boil off properly. On Monday it was boiling off 2L/h but yesterday it was 4L/h. I didn't plug any numbers into my app and it used the default of 0.5L/h. It meant my numbers were skewed badly and I ended up with 17L instead of 21. My expected starting gravity was 1.044, instead I got 1.056. No real damage done, just a stronger beer. I could dilute as I say but I'll just leave it as is. [ This image is no longer available. ] New boiler, it has 3 filters. http://www.geterbrewed.com/stainless-steel-false-bottom-for-peco-boiler/ There's a copper hop strainer below this (can't find a link), but I also have this covered in a 400 micron fine wire mesh. If you do buy the Peco then do everything in the bag as the hop strainer doesn't work very well and it clogs up. BTW a bag should cost around £10 but you can DIY with a washed pillowcase, that will work just as well. [ This image is no longer available. ] BIAB inside a wastepaper bin on top of my toaster rack for sparging  [ This image is no longer available. ] That's actually our "main" fridge. A few months ago I bought a larder fridge off Gumtree for £25 but then our main American Fridge Freezer packed in so my larder fridge was acquisitioned to keep our food fresh. The fridge still works but it won't go much colder than 8°. Perfect for brewing a lager! My next purchase will be a hop spider. The false bottom works well but every step taken helps for a clearer beer. If you do buy a boiler just do things in steps. Use the no chill route and let your wort cool overnight. Just buy small things like the false bottom/ wort chiller, hop strainer ect in stages. Once you the boiler then 20L batches are easy. It takes just as long doing a 20L batch as it does a 5L one as you're doing atm. Brew often though and get that chain going, you don't want to run dry and you want the boiler to pay for itself  |
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Brilliant info Ovalman and thanks for the photos.
I might be a sucker for new shiny stuff, but think I will have to prove myself first with cheaper kit. Might the ambient temp have affected the mash temp? Looking at this... http://www.geterbrewed.com/simple-biab-starter-kit/ What do you think? Would I be right in saying that the main differences between this peco and your new one is the thermostatic control and the filtering? And, is there no tap on the biab starter kit? |
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That would be the boiler I first had and yes it will have a tap. You can buy the filters separate so that is a good price for everything. The only difference between that boiler and mine is the temperature control but what I done before was get the water up to strike temperature, added the grains and then switched the power off and wrapped the boiler up in towels to insulate. The mash temperature held very well only dropping a few degrees.
With my current boiler I don't have to worry about mash temperature but I will have to recirculate the wort over the grains from time to time (Grainfather does this automatically.) This should lead to far better efficiency. Grains are so cheap anyway and efficiency doesn't really matter so much. That boiler will do you well. Someone done the calculation of a Grainfather brew V's a Pub and Shop costs http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=63155 So that boiler will pay for itself in no time |
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There is a 5% Geterbrewed code that will save you a further few pounds
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=64575 If it doesn't work try changing the 2016 to 2017 |
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Cheers. Should be making a purchasing decision soon!
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Ovalman, I did try and contact Geterbrewed with a couple of queries, but no reply to email and no answering of the phone. Meantime, mate and I decided to go for the Grainfather!!
Will report back. |
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Hmmm, slightly jealous
Geterbrewed are usually good for response so I'm surprised they didn't reply. I'm on a Facebook Grainfather group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/grainfather/ simply because one day I'll own one. Have a read around before your first brew as there's a few niggles people have (nothing to put you off, just observations to improve.) I will get one but it's not top of my list. If you haven't already keep an eye out on Gumtree for a larder fridge. I picked one up for £25 but if you want to do lagers you'll need one as lagers need cooler temperatures.Glad you jumped straight into all grain. It's so much more versatile, the beer is much better and you'll soon recoup the cost of the Grainfather Vs shop or pub bought beer. I bought a Vacuum Sealer yesterday out of Lidl to help store hops. I've hops from 2 years ago that need thrown out that I could have sealed and frozen. You'll find hops probably the biggest expense as you only need a small amount for certain recipes. I also plan on Sous Vide cooking in my boiler (which your Grainfather is ideal.) Have a Google if you don't know what it is. If you check the garden thread, I also grow some veg so it will be useful to store my produce. Bought ingredients for a Stout earlier. It's my house Stout as all the sizes can be bought in the shop so no measuring: 3kg Maris Otter (there was no Irish Stout Malt) 1kg Flaked Barley 500g Black Barley 100g Acid Malt any suitable hop like East Kent Goldings (EKG) to bring IBU up to 20-30 It's going onto the trub of my experimental beer with the Neales ale yeast I done 2 weeks ago which I'll bottle tomorrow. The acid malt makes a difference, it gives the beer a twang just like Guinness. Ingredients cost £11 so about 25p a pint. |
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Thanks for the advice. I should probably try and get some lager going - just in case we have a summer.
Hadn't thought about sous vide cooking but happy to give it a go. I found a seller on eBay which offers the exact amount of hops give or take 5 or 10 grams which looked useful from the waste point of view. Might well make a small batch of stout as my step son likes it and I like one occasionally. I have ordered a recipe kit American Pale Ale nand also having a go at a Purity UBU - probably a bit ambitious at this stage though. 25p a pint - wow. As Stan Ogden said about happy hour at the rovers return 'the more you drink the more you save'! |
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Just had a first taste of batch number one. Mosaic IPA done on the stovetop. Very good. Had much worse beer and paid £3.50 for the pleasure. Very little head though.
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Geterbrewed are good also for customised kits and exact hops but my local HBS only sells hops in 50g and 100g sizes. Although Geterbrewed is 30 miles from me, all the good stuff is in a warehouse at the back of their farm shop. It's not a walk in and order type of place and the knowledgeable staff don't work in the shop front. I do use them but tend to order when my LHBS doesn't have what I need.
More ingredients don't necessarily mean more complicated beers, your only steeping grains after all. I haven't brewed since Christmas so I'm building my stocks up again. I actually had to buy some beer a few weeks ago  I've now 100 or so pints brewing or just ready to drink I'll bottle my experimental beer tomorrow or Sunday. I'm unsure of the taste but it's pretty clear which I'm really pleased with. It's cold crashing now. |
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There is a thread on the forum about Purity and a couple of guessy recipes but not much consensus. On the basis of that I could have a stab at quantities of malt and hop amounts and timings.
Have been drinking a few Grolshs for the bottles recently. From Wilko the swing top bottles cost £8 for 6 = £1.33 each. Grolsh cost £5 for 3 (£1.66) - filled with beer! Now I am doing bigger batches I need to get some a capper and standard bottles. Wish I'd have known I was going to get into home brew...I must have thrown thousands away over the years. The reviews of the cappers seem mixed at the bottom of the price range. Have you got a good capper? |
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I've a cheap capper but it's much simpler and easier using 500ml and 2L Cola Bottles so I rarely use it. It's only if I'm giving beer away would I use it. I have 2 corny kegs and a gas bottle (plus mini kegs and swing tops) but I've only one fridge atm and you can't really use it for brewing and serving. If I do a large brew then it goes in the corny, otherwise everything else goes into Cola bottles. I have plans for a man pub but no money to build it. Guess I'll have to brew and drink more beer to save more money as you say
 Sterilising is a big pain so the less you have to do the better. Get some Star San (or cheap knock offs.) It may seem expensive compared to VWP but the no rinse really makes a big difference to both time and work. Also get yourself some brewing software. I use the Wort App for Android, it's free but I liked it so much I paid for the pro version which has no benefits other than giving the author some money. The author is very helpful and responds to your needs, I felt it only right to send him a few $$$ for his work. It gives you beer styles and you can create a recipe according to the style, really handy. You'll only be £1,000 down atm after the Grainfather plus bits and bobs purchased. Get brewing and drinking now to claw that money back |
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Cheers. I got some Star San delivered with my Grandfather yesterday!
Was going through the cost benefit analysis with Mrs H last night. I quoted your 25p a pint compared with about £1.50 to £2 a bottle from the supermarket. I haven't convinced her yet! She even dissed my offer to brew her some lager. Have been banned from brewing until we get back from holiday (a week on Friday) - just in case there is a major explosion in fermentation while we are away.  |
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Grainfather! - flipping predictive text.
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Might try to get her into sous-vide cooking.
Some chance! |
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It is a big expense but it will be worth it. I'd brew however when she is out of the house as the smell is what my missus hates most (and why I brew outside.)
My reason to brew was not to save money but to brew that U Fleku beer. While initial costs have mounted up it has easily recouped itself. Instead of heading to the pub on a Saturday I'd much rather put a brew on and drink my hard work. She may never be convinced but it's a new hobby you can justify in just a few months time. The only problem is you'll end up like me wanting a man shed with a bar, TV, pool table etc. Keep building that supply chain! |
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I have learned this...
Brew while she is out Clear up immaculately Put and keep all kit as far away from her as possible We have a second toilet (room) which is perfect for fermentation. It has a little electric heater and I got it set up to 20 degrees centigrade. Put the demijohns on the toilet seat. Working out how I can get 5 gallon FV on top of it! Got a bid in on eBay for a fridge too! |
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I kept checking Gumtree/ Freecycle for months looking for a larder fridge. I just waited until I seen something under £30 and most of he time I was too late but eventually I found one for £25. Until our normal fridge packed in I was using an Inkbird to control it.
If you don't win the Ebay bid, don't be going spending mega cash, just bide your time and something will turn up. |
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I'm doing Sous Vide Steak atm but months ago I bought a small 12v Aquarium Pump from China for £4. I just used it for the first and recirculated the water in my boiler at 55°. I've a bit of simple wiring up to do but I'll be visiting Maplin's tomorrow before my brew.
It means I can now constantly recirculate my wort during a brew for a very efficient mash and brew. I'm also going to buy some porridge oats thanks to this thread: http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=71245 I've done an Oaty Stout ages ago and it was great so I'll be revisiting it tomorrow. |
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Inspired by threads on this forum, the desire to save a few shekels and alcoholic tendencies I have invested in the basic gear (big plastic bucket with a lid and a grommeted hole to stick the wiggly thing in, a stirrer, a metre and a half of pipe and a tub of steriliser that should last a life-time.
All this and a kit for 40 pints of High Gravity Victorian Bitter (add sugar and water) came to 40 notes. I have absolutely no relation to the place as it was the first ever time I have been there today but it was from a cracking little shop called Chester Homebrew just on the way into Chester from Saltney. Really helpful staff who said to call them anytime for any advice and no question too stupid. Thanks to Ovalman and JH and will let you know how I get on. :) |
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Yay, we got one on the slippery slope!
As kits go, the Woodforde Wherry seems to be the best rated kit. It's a bit more expensive than the usual kit at £23 but from what I've read (I haven't tried it) it knocks socks off everything. Some kits are better than others and you can improve a kit by using Dark Malt Extract, Light Malt Extract or Brewing Sugar (normal sugar mixed with ?dextrine?). Hope it turns out great Clouseau but you've now all the basics and your next kit will be a doddle. Ditch the timescale in those instructions though. Give it 2 weeks in your fermenting vessel, 2 weeks in bottles in the warm and 2 weeks in the fridge. Good beer takes time although there's nothing wrong with sampling along the way. You'll find your best beer is always your last. Get that production line going, buy a kit to get going again for 2 weeks time. Great you have a local home brew supplier. Mine is great as well and while you may pay a little more, the knowledge gleaned is worth supporting them. |
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A Hydrometer is useful, it measures the sugar before the yeast start eating it and then after. This tells you the rough % of alcohol in it. It was probably included in the kit but if not, consider purchasing one. It's not essential though as kits usually turn out as expected. Another less important bit of kit is a thermometer, they cost around £3 (same as hydrometer) so not a big expense. For kits this can be handy for pitching your yeast but for all grain it's essential (we'll have you doing all grain in a few weeks
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Glad to see the CCHC (chit chat home-brew club) has boosted its membership by 50%.
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cant add to the tread as I know sweet f a about homebrew - and only started reading as Ovalman is a good egg on the garden thread
but keep up the good work and reckon you should all try this http://gbhomebrew.co.uk/ |
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Thanks chaps.... got the first task done last night; i.e. draining a load of Grolsch bottles down my neck so I can re-use them later for the home-brew. Tough job but someone has to do it!
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Excellent work Clouseau.
Preparatory work like that should never be underestimated. |