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WTF! 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-38757650
A man has admitted killing a 17-year-old woman by not helping her when she fell into the sea.
Becky Morgan fell in the water at the Port Of Ramsgate on 1 May after a party. Her body was recovered from the sea at Broadstairs about two hours later.
Michael Bowditch, 21 of Prestedge Avenue, Ramsgate, denied murder but admitted manslaughter.
Maidstone Crown Court was told Bowditch went clubbing after watching her die.
They had been at a birthday party before going to the Harbour Arm in Ramsgate, Simon Taylor for the prosecution told the hearing.
He said: "Mr Bowditch accepts that although he cannot say exactly how Becky Morgan came to fall into the sea, once she fell in he failed to take any steps to try to assist her.
"It is the failure to take any steps to prevent Miss Morgan's death after she fell into the sea which forms the basis of his culpability for manslaughter."
Bowditch had been due to stand trial this week after denying murdering the college student, but an admission of manslaughter was accepted by Judge Jeremy Carey.
'Seen someone die'
The court heard when the pair went to the harbour, Bowditch was drunk and had taken cocaine and cannabis. Miss Morgan was not drunk, toxicology reports showed.
Bowditch told police they had been "mucking about" and he believed she ended up in the water sometime between about 02:05 and 02:40 BST.
The court heard Miss Morgan had asked for help and told Bowditch she could not swim. He said he was unable to help.
The prosecution lawyer said: "He did not just walk away and leave Miss Morgan to perish but remained and watched her drown."
Bowditch was later seen dancing in Rokka Bar.
He called police at 05:01 and said: "I've seen someone die tonight."
In a statement to the court, Miss Morgan's mother, Lee-Ann Bevan, said: "She was smart, mature, independent and funny. I feel like something bright has died in my life.
"I'll spend my whole life not knowing what happened. All I can think about is her being alone in the dark and cold and frightened.
"I can only think she would have been asking for me."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-38757650
A man has admitted killing a 17-year-old woman by not helping her when she fell into the sea.
Becky Morgan fell in the water at the Port Of Ramsgate on 1 May after a party. Her body was recovered from the sea at Broadstairs about two hours later.
Michael Bowditch, 21 of Prestedge Avenue, Ramsgate, denied murder but admitted manslaughter.
Maidstone Crown Court was told Bowditch went clubbing after watching her die.
They had been at a birthday party before going to the Harbour Arm in Ramsgate, Simon Taylor for the prosecution told the hearing.
He said: "Mr Bowditch accepts that although he cannot say exactly how Becky Morgan came to fall into the sea, once she fell in he failed to take any steps to try to assist her.
"It is the failure to take any steps to prevent Miss Morgan's death after she fell into the sea which forms the basis of his culpability for manslaughter."
Bowditch had been due to stand trial this week after denying murdering the college student, but an admission of manslaughter was accepted by Judge Jeremy Carey.
'Seen someone die'
The court heard when the pair went to the harbour, Bowditch was drunk and had taken cocaine and cannabis. Miss Morgan was not drunk, toxicology reports showed.
Bowditch told police they had been "mucking about" and he believed she ended up in the water sometime between about 02:05 and 02:40 BST.
The court heard Miss Morgan had asked for help and told Bowditch she could not swim. He said he was unable to help.
The prosecution lawyer said: "He did not just walk away and leave Miss Morgan to perish but remained and watched her drown."
Bowditch was later seen dancing in Rokka Bar.
He called police at 05:01 and said: "I've seen someone die tonight."
In a statement to the court, Miss Morgan's mother, Lee-Ann Bevan, said: "She was smart, mature, independent and funny. I feel like something bright has died in my life.
"I'll spend my whole life not knowing what happened. All I can think about is her being alone in the dark and cold and frightened.
"I can only think she would have been asking for me."
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He wasn't in any state to help. At the end of the day get yourself a sober boyfriend.
Failing to help is unpalatable.
But how is inaction deemed an action?
But how is inaction deemed an action?
I considered that too geoff.
But if the suspicion were that then he would have been prosecuted on the evidence.
To bring a case of murder seems very odd to me.
He clearly did her, nor himself any favours through inaction.
But was he legally or morally responsible for a fellow human?
Id say he was guilty of being immoral.
Ofc, there must be something written in law that says humans are legally required to assist then if this ended in conviction.
But then what about all those that make gains that result in suicide, like banks foreclosing for profits and humans killing themselves.
Where does that stand?
But if the suspicion were that then he would have been prosecuted on the evidence.
To bring a case of murder seems very odd to me.
He clearly did her, nor himself any favours through inaction.
But was he legally or morally responsible for a fellow human?
Id say he was guilty of being immoral.
Ofc, there must be something written in law that says humans are legally required to assist then if this ended in conviction.
But then what about all those that make gains that result in suicide, like banks foreclosing for profits and humans killing themselves.
Where does that stand?
Maybe he didn't want to save her because she would say she was pushed. Don't go near the sea/cliffs with just one person around !
Thats sort of why lighthouses were manned by 3 people in the past.
If one murdered the other then there was more likely a witness.
If one murdered the other then there was more likely a witness.
He admitted watching her drown then went clubbing. What a loathsome creature.
Terrible stuff, but I seem to remember cases of police officers not helping drowning people, without them being tried for murder, if anything at all.
I can't remember any cases saddo other than in rough seas when it would have been unsafe for them.
The problem here is that this guy never tried to get her help. He couldn't swim so fair enough but he could have sought help.
The problem here is that this guy never tried to get her help. He couldn't swim so fair enough but he could have sought help.
He caused her to fall in and then panicked because of his drug intake, he made a cowardly decision to escape the scene. Then went clubbing as to attempt some kind of alibi but when he started coming down of the cocaine etc his conscience took over.
What an awful decision he made.
What an awful decision he made.
He wasn't in any state to help. At the end of the day get yourself a sober boyfriend.
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not so drunk that the **** managed to find his way to a night club .
should be held very accountable . Poor lass
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not so drunk that the **** managed to find his way to a night club .
should be held very accountable . Poor lass
What action could he have taken that would amount to 'taking steps to save her'?
If he'd raised the alarm immediately I guess.
If he'd raised the alarm immediately I guess.
Seems the police thought he'd pushed her, otherwise why go after a murder charge?
Surely you cant assume somebody pushed her without some sort of evidence?
Either there was some or the courts say you are legally obliged to assist.
His inaction was unconscionable, but manslaughter/murder?????
Either there was some or the courts say you are legally obliged to assist.
His inaction was unconscionable, but manslaughter/murder?????
Its an odd one because Ive thought about the quandry perviously.
Based on if somebody turned up and happened on somebody they hate having a heart attack and walked past and didnt help.
Would the fact they admitted to hating the individual mean they were culpable?
Based on if somebody turned up and happened on somebody they hate having a heart attack and walked past and didnt help.
Would the fact they admitted to hating the individual mean they were culpable?
The fact it never went to trial and he took the manslaughter verdict suggests a little more..
Surely you cant assume somebody pushed her without some sort of evidence?
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no, but how does one just fall into the sea when sober ? and if it was deliberate it would make a lot more sense then that the culprit wouldn't help .
If she somehow accidentally fell then there is something seriously evil with anyone who just watched.
dustybin - however much you loathed someone i don't think you would just watch them die would you ? unless there were exceptional circs
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no, but how does one just fall into the sea when sober ? and if it was deliberate it would make a lot more sense then that the culprit wouldn't help .
If she somehow accidentally fell then there is something seriously evil with anyone who just watched.
dustybin - however much you loathed someone i don't think you would just watch them die would you ? unless there were exceptional circs
He was due to stand trial for murder. His brief must have advised him to take the manslaughter charge (for fear of being found guilty of murder). He did and got 5 years, out in 2 1/2.
Reckon he drowned her.
Reckon he drowned her.
akabula 26 Jan 17 14:44
I can't remember any cases saddo other than in rough seas when it would have been unsafe for them.
The problem here is that this guy never tried to get her help. He couldn't swim so fair enough but he could have sought help.
She couldn't swim. Where does it say he couldn't ?
I can't remember any cases saddo other than in rough seas when it would have been unsafe for them.
The problem here is that this guy never tried to get her help. He couldn't swim so fair enough but he could have sought help.
She couldn't swim. Where does it say he couldn't ?
coach
I dont know how she ended up in the water, but tis circumstantial just to assume she was pushed....but as injera possibly correctly outlines, his guilt could well have been in what he accepted as punishment.
To stand and watch them die would make them evil yes, but that alone wouldnt be a prisonable offence I wouldnt think, especially if it mean being evil was the result of doing nothing.
It would make him some f cuked up individual either way
I dont know how she ended up in the water, but tis circumstantial just to assume she was pushed....but as injera possibly correctly outlines, his guilt could well have been in what he accepted as punishment.
To stand and watch them die would make them evil yes, but that alone wouldnt be a prisonable offence I wouldnt think, especially if it mean being evil was the result of doing nothing.
It would make him some f cuked up individual either way
Why did he ring the police ? Could he have been linked to her death, if he hadn't ?
'but admitted manslaughter by gross negligence. '
that sounds fair enough to me - i'll take that one dusty .
that sounds fair enough to me - i'll take that one dusty .
Facts - i assume akabula meant he couldn't swim owing to drink
akabula, here is one, there is at least one other.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jack-susianta-police-refused-enter-6164625
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jack-susianta-police-refused-enter-6164625
He was very drunk/stoned. Later he sobered up and called the police.
Hard to tell his level of guilt in her death. He may not even know.
Just wish women (she was 17!!!!!) would be more careful. Why stay out so late with a stranger who's drugged up?
Hard to tell his level of guilt in her death. He may not even know.
Just wish women (she was 17!!!!!) would be more careful. Why stay out so late with a stranger who's drugged up?
Why did he ring the police ? Could he have been linked to her death, if he hadn't ?
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good point facts - he had obviousluy been going through a few scenarious in his mind trying to get away scott free and came up with that one
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good point facts - he had obviousluy been going through a few scenarious in his mind trying to get away scott free and came up with that one
No compulsion for police officers to their own lifes at risk saddo.
The difference here was that they through rings to them but he refused to take them.
Not sure why you think this in any way resembles the death of this young lady.
The difference here was that they through rings to them but he refused to take them.
Not sure why you think this in any way resembles the death of this young lady.
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Bowditch would have afterwards walked past at least one lifebuoy on his way to the Rokka Bar nearby, close to the coastguard station.
CCTV showed a large number of revellers in the area and none was asked for assistance.
While in the bar Bowditch was reported to be drunk and happy. He was dancing and tried to chat up a girl.
He was ejected after a row. He then met up with a friend and went to his house for drinks.
___________
Bowditch would have afterwards walked past at least one lifebuoy on his way to the Rokka Bar nearby, close to the coastguard station.
CCTV showed a large number of revellers in the area and none was asked for assistance.
While in the bar Bowditch was reported to be drunk and happy. He was dancing and tried to chat up a girl.
He was ejected after a row. He then met up with a friend and went to his house for drinks.
___________
AFAIK there is no duty of care to assist someone unless you caused the situation or were responsible for them. Otherwise, for example, if you happened to see someone struggling in a really rough sea and had no means of helping them other than jumping in and putting yourself in danger you have no legal duty to do so.
This guy has admitted they were together and "mucking about" when she went in and would, therefore, be deemed to have assumed responsibility for her. He had a mobile phone and could have gone into the bar to raise the alert and did neither so he is bang to rights imo.
This guy has admitted they were together and "mucking about" when she went in and would, therefore, be deemed to have assumed responsibility for her. He had a mobile phone and could have gone into the bar to raise the alert and did neither so he is bang to rights imo.
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