No Place to Call Home. BBC2 Now.

This is what happens when you flood a Country with immigrants !

No houses for the born n bred but plenty for the immigrants.
Should be like the old times. Sorry no room at the inn.

The young, and folk of circumstance have a lot to worry about now and in the future,  the street will be a blaze with anger and death, this country as a housing CANCER problem That will kill it .

As the woman working in the housing office said.
It's not caused by immigration, immigrants are homeless too. It's the cost of bloody rent!

1/2 the housing stock has been sold, loads demolished, none replaced.

The Government and press have shifted from blaming the feckless scroungers to blaming the "immigrants".
Has this ever happened before?

They might not to be blamed for the problem SF but they are certainly going to make it worse in the areas they go to.

As the woman working in the housing office said.
It's not caused by immigration, immigrants are homeless too. It's the cost of bloody rent!



Too many people vying for too few properties is what keeps rents high, so I would think  immigration plays a part.

I'm not saying the larger population doesn't exacerbate the problem and that immigration isn't a part of the problem.
But, as with all popular scaremongering, divide and rule systems and deflection... it's only a tiny part.

If all immigrants left the UK tomorrow, housing would still be in crisis, the NHS would still be fecked and education would still be wrecked.

Rents as a proportion of income are almost entirely to blame for the housing crisis. I wonder how many MPs and other decision makers rent properties out as a means of extra income?
I wonder how many empty properties there are in the country?

Rob Dylan absolutely correct btw, another form of privatisation which, when added to all the other forms have completely, imo, slaughtered this country.

A million extra bodies in the last 3 years would need around 300k houses at a guess, not really tiny is it.

Plus SF you said the government were blaming immigrants for the problem.
I don't see any proof of this. Do you have a link?

A million?  There are 3 to 4 million working here. Then there are the huge number of claimants who aren't. Then there are 1 to 2 million illegals(they don't actually know.  Then there are the asylum seekers.   No pressure at all from incomers.

how do immigrants gets homes here if there are no homes ?

has any politican,think tank asked and answered the elephant in the room question,with rents only going one way and £2,000 a month plus normal in london and the south east,WTF is going to finance    these rents when people are retired,if there struggling to pay rents now they obviously wont be accruing any savings or pensions which will come any where close to meeting their housing costs in retirement,rearrange grass,kick,long,bit of room in the long grass when heathrow pops out

They must move North or suffer.

We need more immigrants to finance future rent benefits imo.

I have seen the future.

The advent of on line shopping has mean a massive increase in warehouse jobs...many of which are being done by migrants

The number of old people is greatly increasing  requiring more Care workers...many of whom are migrants.

The future will see warehouses for old people where they are kept alive like battery hens ....by migrants.

To pay for their care the pensioners will sell off their houses ...which will then be rented out to the migrants who provide their care.

Wot about when the migrants are old and need care?

....yeah  thankfully I won't be around then

and neither will be the people making the decisions today!

Akabula, I like to think that I (and other intelligent people) can read between the lines of the way government plays the population.

Much of it is quite obvious - anything to keep themselves in power and feeding from the trough - although it wouldn't be sensible for anything as overt as "Immigrants are to blame for everything", so the media assists and nothing much is said or done to put any opposing view.

The exception would be the Brexit vote which it seems is being denied by so many liars who voted leave based on the desire to rid us of immigrants, even though loads of them think Syria is in the EU.

For example the tale of the Sikh doctor who on June 24th had to see an old lady for her appointment and who greeted him with,
"Why am I seeing you? I voted to have you kicked out yesterday."

Unless the Nazis actually gain power and we're not so far away from that, which would make lots of current forum users happy, finding actual links would be a bit tricky.

Incidentally this applies in both the UK and the US where so much of the population is intrinsically xenophobic and tribal (as is human nature) and it is very easy to score points from this and, in my view, naïve to think they don't.

American but valid:
http://theconversation.com/why-were-wrong-to-blame-immigrants-for-our-sputtering-economies-56324

From a few years ago:
http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-are-immigrants-to-blame-for-the-ae-crisis/13648

For all you who think I'm wrong, you're in good company:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3355750/Benefits-couple-claim-t-work-immigrants-pickings-jobs.html

But the mainstream tv news programmes do not play  blame the  immigrants - they all have the opposite agenda. Newspapers of course, are more varied.

old folk still buy newspapers , still prattle on about what they are fed with their breakfast

likes of bbc are trying to build a global brand so spin a different story

Studyform, I'm having some difficulty interpreting your post at 20:40.

Do you really believe that people think Syria is in the EU? (I credit you with recognising the Sikh doctor story as nonsense.)

Your accusation that a Nazi government "would make lots of current forum users happy" is beyond crass. You used to attack the argument, not its proponent. What's happened?

If you're drunk then I apologise.

Ok then, as we're being pedantic..... Some of the Nazi ideology, in principle if not in practice would seem to lie comfortably with much of what I read on this forum, gallivanter.

The Sikh doctor story is not nonsense, I'll endeavour to find it tomorrow, though it may be tricky.

Yes I absolutely believe many people have no idea about Geography nor do they understand what hell life is for the vast majority of Syrian refugees who are enduring stuff we can only have nightmares about, only to become displaced then to have their numbers infiltrated by terrorists, thus making their lives even more intolerable. I honestly believe people think Brexit means getting rid of immigrants (Asians and Africans included) and that its the SOLE reason they voted leave.
They'll say they want control back, but they don't know what control and what over, and who will actually have it.

Then we have immigration from all over the world which has been really a feature of the UK since the mid 1950's and which has been slightly offset by some of the emigration over the same period (a fact never mentioned).

Mostly fed by the press (Mail, Express, Sun, Telegraph possibly worst) who at best are writing what will sell and at worst are under orders as to what gets
published, personally, I think it's somewhere in the middle, there is an almost mass hysteria about "immigrants"; ruining the NHS (not cuts to services, beds, hospitals, or massive centralisation and over management), filling all the jobs (not that there are not many jobs about and pay is supressed and manufacturing is shot and global firms have most employees), taking all the houses (see earlier in the thread), being responsible for nearly all crime (patently crap).

As with the non-stop scrounger news and stories of a couple of years ago, it's deflection, it is stuff which draws attention away from the massive ineptitude of government.

I hope this clears things up a tad for you, gallivanter. I'm not drunk but I'll do you the courtesy of accepting your apology anyway.

We need to build and sell loads of large houses that will barely last 10 years ,change our laws to prevent suing of bad build houses
and then use the money to rebuild our economy and evict all foreigners from this once pleasant land.

Studyform, even if it turns out that some old lady failed to understand the meaning of Brexit, even if it's true that there are people who don't know where Europe ends and Asia and Africa begin, does that mean that Brexit is somehow misguided? Are there no ignorant people who voted Remain? Those who believe that holidays in Spain will stop, for example?

The Remain faction seems to believe one or both of the concepts that Britain cannot function economically without the EU and that Britain has no right to absolute sovereignty, including total control of immigration from anywhere in the world. Do you deny that?

To assert your right to govern your own country as you see fit does not make you a National Socialist. The Remainers had no complaint about the referendum when they were odds on to win it but now they want to overturn the will of the people. Stories of a few, possibly fictional, fools are bandied about as some kind of proof that Brexiters are either deluded or Nazis. Remainers, on the other hand, are happy to boast of their cowardice and greed. They seem to think that Britain and the British can be bought and sold.

Perhaps the only thing we can agree on is the ineptitude of British governments although, comparing them to others, we might be fortunate.

i wonder how many uk citizens could point to syria on a map, regardless of their
vote to remain or leave

not really the point i know, but if an iq test and or general knowledge became
a requirement to vote there would be a fair few miss out

Not many Britons know if Edinburgh is east or west of Bristol but that wasn't the question on the referendum paper.

The ineptitude of all governments is definitely something I agree about.

Given this, "To assert your right to govern your own country as you see fit" is unlikely to ever occur properly as the government is inept.

Therefore there is nothing to be gained by leaving Europe. Not this this was what the thread's about.
Also, of course there were ignorant people voting in both directions, but the mass coverage and ongoing hysteria (which is what is occurring) about immigration held by a very long distance, the biggest sway.
I would suggest that more people voted leave based on nationalism/immigration fear/xenophobia than on all the other reasons to leave added together.
As for,
"Not many Britons know if Edinburgh is east or west of Bristol but that wasn't the question on the referendum paper."
It might as well have been.

I think it was mainly immigration also, not so much from existing Europeans but people know there will be a couple if not several million Muslims getting EU passports in a couple of years. Without doubt there are terrorists among them and people don't want them coming here, I can't see why anyone would.

Another programme that assumes London represents the whole of the country.

asides those that voted to stop mass imigration and regain our soverignity ,huge numbers decided to give cameron and the elite a kicking knowing that if project fear came to pass their lives couldnt get much worse and those with the means would be hit hard as well

Merkel did it for us. Showed us what kind of migrant we had coming in a few years, and made Cameron look a fool for making a perfectly reasonable request about migrant benefits, job done.

UK Population 1980 56m
UK Population 2015 65m

Houses should under right to buy 1.5m.

Discuss.

UK Population 1980 56m
UK Population 2015 65m

___________________________




what was the UK population in 1955 ?

doesn't building council houses mean that it adds to a population problem rather than solve it ?  -  families living in social housing areas  traditionally have larger  families .

Eventually our friends, many already here, will change the demographic in the cities and the rest will have no choice.  It is very simple to achieve hegemony with a minority.  Check out pre WWII  Germany for one example.

Oct 21, 2016 -- 10:06PM, mobo wrote:

Eventually our friends, many already here, will change the demographic in the cities and the rest will have no choice.

That didn't post as I'd intended..... trying again.....

mobo  • October 21, 2016 10:06 PM BST 


Eventually our friends, many already here, will change the demographic in the cities and the rest will have no choice.  It is very simple to achieve hegemony with a minority.  Check out pre WWII  Germany for one example.

AND THERE WE HAVE IT!

yes mobo makes a good point. history shows that all great countries commit suicide.
that is what we are doing in Europe.

in Germany we had the fanatical and mindless belief in a new religion.
very dangerous and Europe survived it,but only because of countries outside Europe.
it was almost the end but the US and Britain and Russia(although Russia`s contribution must be qualified because they went on to enslave eastern Europe) managed to prevail.

Just watched it, emotional stuff alright. If you are low paid with no kids you are toast.

In the late 1960's Enoch Powell said in 15 years the blacks would have the whip hand he was just reflecting the fears of the
people but listening to the population can be a grave mistake Democracy isn't the be all and end all for a cohesive society.

Neither is unlimited migration, someone is making property very scarce.

Conservative policy ,if there were no immigrants they would stop building houses altogether they want to get rich.

Blair opened the gates and built nowt, Conservatives indeed. 

Countries the world over, the United Kingdom most certainly included, need to implement measures which will drastically reduce their respective populations.  To allow these figures to keep rising unchecked is a gross dereliction of duty in my view, and one in which the World Health Organisation is also complicit.

But we need more people to pay our pensions according to some. Sounds a bit Ponzi imo.

If we look at both housing association homes and council houses, Labour built more affordable properties in 2009 than the Conservatives did in each year between 1987 and 1990.

Between 1997 and 2010, some 350,000 housing association dwellings were built.

1990 pretty irrelevant, they started coming in numbers in 2004. At least we both agree there are too many people here for housing to go round. Best we stop people coming until we build them some homes, sounds sensible to me.

Really it was the Vikings who started it off followed by the Romans ,the Danes,the Saxons from Germany that made us into Anglo Saxons
the Normans Nigel Farages descendants....
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2726735/REVEALED-Penniless-German-immigrant-great-great-grandfather-Nigel-Farage-He-famously-no-nonsense-stance-migrants-Ukip-chief-no-idea-ancestor.html

Breedingmad    25 Oct 16 00:48 
Between 1997 and 2010, some 350,000 housing association dwellings were built.



13 year build and those will have housed around 100, 000 people. We are getting a million extra every three years, your history is clearly stronger than your maths.

0 missing^

There's nothing that can be done to remedy the situation - you can't get the toothpaste back in the tube.

Thee are too many people in the country for what the infrastructure and public services can cope with.

They're packed like sardines. And as far as the general public are concerned, they don't like us and we don't like them.

God help us if we have to go into care in old age and be looked after by some of these types we are importing.

We're turned the best country in the world into a potential battlefield through immigration.

The Tory government has always tried to deflect blame away from itself for it's own decisions. Failure to invest in social housing, a creaking NHS, under-funded pension pots etc etc. Ultimately they themselves get to make these decisions and as pointed out the housing problem has existed since Thatcher's disgraceful decision to sell off social housing without replacing any. At the same time we're cutting corporation tax for big businesses, we're able to pull a couple of billion from the back of the couch for trident or for any made up invasion that the yanks want us to back them up on so the money's there.

What you also have though are other politicians who use this as an opportunity. They know people are unhappy about all of the above and twist it to fit their own agenda and lust for power. Twas ever thus. Should I pin the blame on the tories, and the bankers and big businesses who are screwing them and us over?  Could do but what would that gain me? However, I could blame it all on the foreigners. Even if the facts and figures fly in the face of the story I'm trying to sell I know a certain section of the press will happily run with it, that a lot of right wingers in Parliament will also run with it as it deflects blame from themselves and those lining their pockets and I know a significant proportion of the population will ultimately believe whatever they read in the Sun, the Express or the Mail.


We will exit the EU, immigration from Eastern Europe will almost certainly slow down, and we will undoubtedly and disgracefully isolate ourselves in setting quotas and limiting the number of refugees trying to escape horrors that we've helped create. This will all almost certainly happen. But does anyone seriously think on the back of that we'll see a surge in building new social housing, £350M for the NHS, £35M, £3.5M, will the pension crisis be solved? Particularly when so many of the jobs employed in the NHS, in nurseries, in retirement homes are done by foreigners on minimum wage, jobs that British people are frankly just unwilling to do. Good luck investing in the infrastructure when you have to raise the minimum wage by 30% to get the staff.

What's the alternative to ending this madness of immigration - to go further down the road we are going down until civil disorder is rampant?

We were doing okay before Labour won in 1997. The country was in a much better state.
Where were the housing shortages then?
Where was the NHS crisis?
Where was the problem with education and the numbers of unemployed?

You only have to look what is was like then compared with how it is now, to see what a total disaster mass immigration has been for the UK and the rest of Europe if it comes to that.

What people don't realize is wages will rise and with higher wage costs investment will
pull out jobs will be lost and we will be worse off with no future. Is this what the
masses voted for a protectionist immigrant hating little Britain that harks back to the
British Empire.

Oh and the big one - where was the debt?

Nearly twenty years on and the country has gone from economic stability to staggering debt.

In those days couple could buy their own houses to live in - now they're lucky if they can even afford to pay for an expensive flat. 

Don't you just love immigration?

marvelous thing the British Empire, the world would be a much better place if we still had it, who would disagree with that?

I wish the multiculturalist would simply put the country back in to the sate it was in before they threw a spanner in the works. And flooded the country with immigrants and cheap labour.

Let's just return to the good old days.

almost every single person in England was not a foreigner when we had the British Empire, that seemed to work very well at the time.

I suppose we are more civilized now, I read it somewhere.

they were in England because they were English, plus a few Scots.

I would not like to see China overtaken by English people, certainly not.

we didn`t do that even at the very height of the empire, we civilized them and traded opium.

and tea, or was that India? we stopped them murdering each other in vast numbers also.

it is better in the main not to make friends with other countries, or to invite them to live in your country.
its better for everyone that way. countries should not go running around after new friends.

how many Chinese people were murdered after the fall of the British Empire, 20 million or more? that's not a very good record.

that was the communists, the British leftists loved them as well.

Does anyone reckon if a couple or so million Brits went and lived in China we could take over their country
convert them all to C of E or Protestants and in a few decades put fear and loathing of us into the Chinese mindset?

well quite

A couple of million in China is one in seven thousand people, muslim population here is already one in twenty people. Don't let your dreadful maths get in the way of a ridiculous analogy though.