EgyptAir Jet Disapears over the Meditarrean Sea

It's a complete mess Ron, Charles de Gaulle airport employs many Muslim immigrants from the Parisian suburbs.
More than 60 in recent years have been terminated through fears of radicalisation, many more will slip through the net.

You'd have to pay me £££££s to fly into anywhere in that totally ****ed up region these days.

Don't worry though, for those that don't like to travel to a bloodbath, we've surely thousands of nutcases waiting for the word in Europe now, and the left demanding we take more.

They're demanding Britain takes in orphaned children

Who grow up; usually very quickly when the local imam get's his pawa on them..

INFILTRATION has always been the magic word. I've been saying it for decades.

The entire area is awash with weapons including missiles. The border with Turkey is totally porous, and they're trying to make the EU border with turkey porous and once in the area is free travel. If that doesn't worry you, there's something wrong with you. The people at the top of the EU must hate their own people.

The people at the top of the EU must hate their own people.

That's certainly how it feels JC isn't it.

I agree with Canaletto.

Being in the EU is safer folks.
OUR leader tells us so.

This one?

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Yes Zen.

Call me Dave has said..


has described the disappearance of EgyptAir Flight MS804 as a "dreadful event", and said he feels for the families of those aboard.

He added: “I think it’s too early to speculate about what the cause was.

“We simply don’t know but all the experts are talking to each other and trying to work out what has happened and when we know more, we’ll be able to say more.”

WAC this gutless man is - an absolute traitor - if your not prepared to stand up
to these muslim **** get out the job - in all fairness to (DC) i probably know we're too
far broke, which is why i support Sir Donald - the USA have a chance - we don't imo.

They don't know yet, if it was a terrorist attack.It could be, but a plane carrying only 60-odd people, many of them muslim by the sounds of it, does not seem an obvious target for terrorists.

You'll soon be in trouble Des Pond; Introducing conjecture on here.  The cause is obvious, they've all agreed.

Good point Des.

It would be unusual for Islamic State to kill other Muslims.
They have been careful in the past, not to do so.

All very strange these flights disappearing, add to that wrong info coming out and changing it when they feel like is all rather disturbing...

pilot suicidal?

What's strange guinness, is a low volume inbound (to Egypt) flight being targetted, if indeed that is the case.

Probably a Liverpool supporter..

If i was a betting person id place a small single on it being a muslim bomber

Ron - to slightly misquote Mandy, you would say that wouldn't you

Muslim
Muslim
Muslim

Yes Muslim - this is the supposed religion that bombs people - it's nothing to do with
anyone else - this is a Muslim issue Call me Dave

It would be unusual for Islamic State to kill other Muslims.
They have been careful in the past, not to do so

A fair point, but I was thinking that they would be more likely to target a plane with as many passengers as possible (I assume that there are thousands of flights every day that would carry several hundred passengers). Although, I accept that the terrorists just try to strike where they can. And this was possibly the only opportunity they had (assuming they were terrorists). i don't know enough about the subject to make an informed judgement, vis-a-vis how frequently the opportunities occur.

Comment on Dave and Obama above ...
Joan Rivers Murdered For Exposing Michelle Obama As Tranny.....

blackbarn, i normally sit on the fence on these kind of delicate matters

..Id just like to know we're being looked after! it's not much to ask for is it, rather
than just fast track someone in a job to make it look like this person represents the
majority from their culture

Is it still technologically impossible, or impractical. to have live CCTV installed on all commercial flights, that can be monitored at security centres, or at least be able to play the tapes back when something like this happens?

They've got them on buses ffs.

Ron-"i normally sit on the fence on these kind of delicate matters".......

I think that is a very sound approach. When do you intend to start?

Man on the moon in 69' had live footage i believe.

Yep the new show.

BOMBERS ON THE BUSES.

So when did white people want to stop driving London Buses?

all companies like Royal Mail, BT, London Transport etc etc can't get enough of them,
can't employ them quick enough to make themselves look good,

someone in the fire brigade said to me unless your black or g@y you've got such a slim
chance of getting a job - don't matter how perfect you are for the job!!

Is it still technologically impossible, or impractical. to have live CCTV installed on all commercial flights, that can be monitored at security centres, or at least be able to play the tapes back when something like this happens?

It does seem odd to me that in this age of extremely advanced communication technology, that they don't have better ways of monitoring activity on flights. I mean, Black boxes? How many decades have they been on the go? Maybe black boxes are the only indestructible recording device? i'm not sure. but why can't they stream live pics and record them at Airports or wherever?

Britain needs to be taking in these orphaned children, there's more chance of them becoming radicalised without any responsible adult in their lives wondering the streets of Europe, than there ever would be here, nobody has to convince about any religion, I couldn't care for it, what I do know is however this forum is full of scaremongerers who as it seems have never met a single muslim, because everyone here would have everyone believe they're all scum, all evil, and all planning on terrorist acts and taking over the world.

I've never met on single Muslim who has either threatened me or anyone I know, there is too much Daily Mail and Donald Trump hysteria going on that you've all been swept away with.

You should forget about their religion and look at them as people, fellow human beings, defenceless kids and genuine refugee's who need help, sanctuary, food, medical care and safety.

when I saw that hungarian reporter last summer tripping up a man carrying his child whist running for a better life and then filming them, I imagine some people on here cheered, that's what its got to,and there's probably apart of some people on here are secretly happy to hear of the latest mass drownings in the Turkey-Greece crossings in the Aegan sea because that is the mentality of far right lunatics who's live is so consumed with immigration.

Listen they are like sheep (fact)

They are not allowed to speak out that's their cult.

When the radical muslims throw the g@y of the top of the buildings the moderate
muslims watch below - as i said their like sheep - certainly not the sort of
people you can integrate are they?

or have you got any success stories you'd like to share with us?

"Yep the new show. BOMBERS ON THE BUSES.

Well someone has to

"So when did white people want to stop driving London Buses?"
I don't know!, when did they and why do you think that might be?

"all companies like Royal Mail, BT, London Transport etc etc can't get enough of them,
can't employ them quick enough to make themselves look good",
Is "them" muslims or all non whites?

"someone in the fire brigade said to me unless your black or g@y you've got such a slim
chance of getting a job - don't matter how perfect you are for the job!! CrazyCrazy"
Always good to throw in the old unattributable, unverifiable "I know someone who told me" quote. Never fails does it.

My post was after......."Listen they are like sheep (fact)"

So this is your view of all, or the majority of muslims is it?

I Know someone = someone in the fire brigade! can't get his fit as a fiddle
mate a job, absolutely perfect as i know him for a fireman, after the 2nd go just said unless
your black or g@y it's a struggle to get in.

The majority are sheep! (fact)

They'd dare speak out against an extremist, as they full well know the
back lash that would come their way (fact)

Perhaps they would have reservations about employing firemen that would only save white people

Elvis actually used to be a part time fire engine driver, but the media covered it up.
I worked it out though, after I listened to "Love me Tender".

It is the silent majority that makes it easy for evil to run amok.

Ron - what is your mate in the Fire Services's view of Muslims. Will they get in if they are not gay and/or not very black?  You should get him on here, he sounds like he could add first-hand value to the debate.

Ha Ha Des - with the smoke & fumes everyone would look black?

be just my luck - when there's a fire a g@y turns up

Would you refuse to be rescued in case the mincing fireman felt you up?

blackbarn - everyone knows the by far majority of muslims won't integrate.

Is there anything else to say on the matter?

Id be the first to say it's an absolute crying shame for the ones that want to!
but then we come back to the have to follow like sheep issue don't we.

I dare say theres a slim majority thats adjusted to our ways - but what would you say
that slim majority is blackbarn in 2016?

10%
20%

What would you guessdimate the muslims that have integrated into our way of life blackbarn?

LOL Des

Have you been to Luton blackbarn?

They haven't integrated - instead they've created their own no go zone area.

Best thing to do when this failed experiment has happened is welcome even more in
don't you think blackbarn?

All i want to know is who's driving the train?  it's pretty obvious they have no
idea where it's heading - ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE TO THE USA I SAY

Trump won`t let the British into America, quite right can`t trust them.

i agree lfc.

we'll have to prove we haven't been brainwashed, which is quite right.

Ron - I don't know the percentage, but more importantly YOU (who considers it hugely important) don't know either. What do you consider to be integration? Language? Behaviour? Work Ethic? Morals? There are probably dozens, you chose the word so you define it.

I consider myself to be integrated into my local community (for several reasons) but I dont consider myself to be particularly integrated into society in general, given that I am an aging, fat(ish) hunting shooting fishing country boy, with heavily carniverous and alcohol induced tendencies.

How a country is viewed can change surprisingly quickly, Britain was once a great and powerful country, and its people were respected.

There's stories of American people saving up all their life's to come to visit
England - London & when they get here they can't believe what they see.

a proper multicultural sh1t hole that you wouldn't wish you worst enemy to live
amongst - no wonder the good people ****** off to the suburbs

Integration is not democratic, it is a belief in certain principles, european and yes democratic but a form of cultural imperialism.

lfc - you should start a thread with that subject - it would be a good debate on when your scenario changed

Ron, the same thing happens when Japanese people visit Paris. They expect to see a beautiful city with beautiful people...some have to be hospitalised with shock and stress when they see the reality

I don`t have a scenario Blackburn. Its immaterial to me.

Ron - here you go again - Another unverifiable unattributable anecdotal statement; this time relating to Americans visiting the UK. You cant keep pulling up this stuff and expect to get away with it. Post something fact-based ffs

I`ve lived and worked in America, there is no doubt that they are beginning to see the true nature of a lot of British people.

A lot of things such as the Iraq war are not as people think.

lfc - I am a slow typist and my post was related to your previous post. Your hypothesis was "Britain was once a great and powerful country and its people were respected"  My post was saying that would be a good debate about how and whether it had changed, and if it had why?

lfc - despite my countryboy post, I too spent a lot of time in America - and worked for a major American Corp for over 30 years and I think you are right (but I doubt we will agree!!!) To quote Churchill, you can alway rely on the Americans to do the right thing........................eventually.

Blackburn if we look at the very basics of why Britain was great, it was first and foremost because of its people.
Their mentality was like their homes, simple and prosperous. Other countries citizens were like house pets, for English people freedom and pride were inborn.

We were not subject to anyone but our own judgement and good character.

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I would go as far as to say England was the greatest county in history, with the possible exception of America.

America also may be the greatest.

Perhaps even greater than England, but then what the US achieved in the 19th and 20th centuries was a miracle.

lfc - good posts. I am off to bed in a mo, so post a simple post for tomorrow morning. What would be a decade (or two) that epitomises your view of when Britain was "great".  No trick, not going to come back with a simple negative response list of "what about this or that". Cheers.

Thanks blackburn, goodnight. Well i have a favourite year, not decade and its France not Britain...1874 in Paris and the first impressionist exhibition.
Its been all downhill since then

In England the first half of the 19th century, and Charles Darwin the ideal work and place in time.

Blackbarn is a typical Liberal,hates his own history,hates his own culture but has this love of the strange with the obligatory soft spot for the religion of peace.

May 20, 2016 -- 12:26AM, blackbarn wrote:

lfc - good posts. I am off to bed in a mo, so post a simple post for tomorrow morning. What would be a decade (or two) that epitomises your view of when Britain was "great".

^ The decade starting from  30 January 1649 (the execution of Charles 1st)....would be a good contender.

When the radical muslims throw the g@y of the top of the buildings the moderate
muslims watch below - as i said their like sheep - certainly not the sort of
people you can integrate are they?

too true ron, the extremist muslim wants to chop off your head, the moderate muslim wants to watch him chop off your head.

Depressingly perhaps not too far from the truth.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3598699/When-tough-smart-vigilant-Donald-Trump-responds-EgyptAir-crash-calling-incident-terrorist-attack.html

This guy talks so much sense

The Cow Clinton same as Cameron can't even say that it's an Islamic problem!
What future will the USA have with her in the driving seat?

Will we get the truth on this plane crash?

Hmmm - beginning to look like it's nothing to do with terrorism. I did have my suspicions when the story first came out. This time the terrorist organisations have kept stuum about the whole thing which is unlike them as the perpetrators usually admit to their actions soon after the incident first happens.

Also, the latest news is that there was a fire (electric it seems) minutes (not seconds) before the aircraft plummeted. If the electrical wiring burnt through, then that could cause a loss of communication from the outside world (radio would go dead). If the main control wiring was destroyed (melted) then it's likely the pilots would have little or no control over the aircraft's handling after that.

I was wondering if these new Lithium batteries are playing up again. They can, on rare occasions, have a propensity to suddenly without warning burst into flames.

Even with all this aircraft's back up systems in place, if critical wiring is destroyed, these fly by wire control systems become ineffectual and there's nowt anything the pilots can do about it.

This might explain the uncontrolled turning descent that this aircraft seemed to experience.

FRANCE IN NEW TERROR THREAT AS EXTREMISM LINKS AT PARIS AIRPORT PROBED OVER EGYPTAIR CRASH

Aviation experts probing the disappearance of the EgyptAir crash into the Mediterranean are focusing on the Paris airport over fears radicalised workers may have planted a bomb on board.

The stricken Airbus A320, which left Paris’ Charles de Gaulle Airport for Cairo on Wednesday evening, went missing with 56 passengers and 10 staff onboard, including a British national, two babies and a child.

I not buying the fire thing. A fire wouldn't cause all that catastrophic events so quickly on a plane. A bomb of cause causes smoke fire so all this stuff happening close together is just signals from a plane that has just exploded and sending bits of data falling from the sky.

00:26Z 3044 ANTI ICE R WINDOW
00:26Z 561200 R SLIDING WINDOW SENSOR
00:26Z 2600 SMOKE LAVATORY SMOKE
00:27Z 2600 AVIONICS SMOKE
00:28Z 561100 R FIXED WINDOW SENSOR
00:29Z 2200 AUTO FLT FCU 2 FAULT
00:29Z 2700 F/CTL SEC 3 FAULT
no further ACARS messages were received.

The sharp turn to the left was probably a deliberate move by the pilots. Its a procedure in an emergency situation if you want to drop altitude quickly........turn 90 degrees left and then you can exit the traffic corridor ready to descend. The 360 loop right is indicative of a quick way of loosing a lot of altitude purposely. These moves to me suggest the pilots handled whatever happened very well and were trying to get their aircraft down quickly. What they know so far indicates i would guess either a rapid spreading fire in or around the cockpit or maybe a small explosion, either way, it eventually it seems, robbed the pilots of control. RIP to all those poor people.

Strange reporting by the bbc on this event, keep ruling out terrorists and they are even promoting fires on planes as a story.

Its looking more and more likely that it was a fire though Sonko and probably not as a result of terrorism, although yes, they ought to atleast keep it open.

Maybe, still a strange place for a fire to start.

very, the CVR and FDR will hopefully reveal all so future flights can be made safer.

Don't have much luck Egyptair do they? Hijackings - strikes - terrorists on the shop floor and front desk.

And in a week when they offered 50% discount on internal and international flights, lo and behold they have a fire in or around the cockpit.. Maybe one of their 'brethren' sneaked on a hookah and gave the Captain a good blow?

Fire my arse..

rom the NY Times
¨ First, there was a problem with the autoflight control computer. The jet would have been flying near its maximum speed and elevation at that time. That is the most efficient way for jetliners to fly, and it is safe, but pilots prefer to rely on autopilot systems in those conditions because if they were to ever lose control of the plane, it could be hard to regain, Mr. Mann said. The last message had to do with the spoiler elevator controller, which essentially controls the flaps responsible for pitch and roll control. The computer controlling these failed as well.

“It looks to me like you have a progressive flight control system failure,” Mr. Mann said. It is over the course of two minutes, which might have seemed like an eternity on that plane, but is relatively fast.This is also the moment that the plane left Greek airspace, and at 2:29:40 a.m., Greek controllers lost the aircraft’s trace, just inside Egyptian airspace, about halfway between Crete and Egypt.

Around this time, the plane made a 90-degree turn to the left and then a full circle to the right, dropping precipitously to 15,000 feet from 37,000 and then plunging again to 9,000 feet before it disappeared from radar.


The crew never gave any indication of a technical problem or other difficulties on board, even during the final, fatal minutes when the plane itself was transmitting data indicating a catastrophic failure.

One former crash investigator said that radar evidence pointing to a series of sharp maneuvers in the moments before radar contact was lost suggested that the plane was almost certainly not under the control of the pilots. Whatever upset the Airbus was so sudden and violent that it could not be compensated for by the plane’s automated safety systems.

“In my mind, this basically opens two axes of possibility: either a sudden technical problem or some kind of illicit or terrorist act,” said the expert, Alain Bouillard, a former chief investigator for the French Bureau of Investigations and Analyses.¨

The only thing on fire was a bomb or a person.


But sadly we wont ever hear the truth, it was a wiring fault i predict.

Kids & matches ay!

IM not ruling out mile highers at this point ron.

The sharp turn to the left was probably a deliberate move by the pilots. Its a procedure in an emergency situation if you want to drop altitude quickly.

You read that rubbish on the BBC didn't you? They didn't issue a mayday, they most likely weren't in control when these sharp turns happened, it's just the plane out of control and falling from the sky.

As above I believe we are pointing to a device in the cargo exploding causing a hole/fire.

A fire on it's own is a possibility, but everything happened so quickly I find it unlikely.

No Hamsterdam, i didn't read that on the BBC. I have a bit of an interest in aviation and have heard this before. From the pieces i have read, the plane made 2 what look like quite deliberate moves, a 90 degree left and a full 360 dropping altitude.......both of these moves mirror manouvres that you might expect to see, if in the situations that are being banded about as possible scenario's, they dont necesarilly indicate that the plane was out of control at this point.

that rubbish that was posted was nearly as bad as your attempt Hamsterdam

People that know sfa about aircraft or remotely understand the systems their fault codes and what they could mean should not say anything ,a lot of stuff being reported about wiring causing fires and the like is so insulting to the people that design ,maintain and repair aircraft .
Of course most of it comes from pilots that themselves dont really understand the finer detail or  used to fly a long time ago and should not be saying diddly squat .

Jimmy no mayday call debunks that 'story'. I firmly believe the plane was out of control due to catastrophic incident/bomb.

'no mayday' call doesn't debunk that theory Hamsterdam. In an incident the pilots priority is to fly the plane NOT communicate. Granted, you would expect a mayday call but the lack of one doesn't eliminate the theory. What if the a fire had disabled the radio ect. I still think initially after whatever occurred, that the pilots had some level of control and maybe those turns were deliberate. Depending on the size of any 'bomb', they normally result in the plane explosivelly decompressing and breaking apart almost instantly......this doesn't appear to have happened here.

There was a bomb on a plane last year wasn't they that blew a hole in the plane and just killed 1 person IIRC...a bomb can certainly go off without the plane completely breaking up.

That was a Somalian plane as i remember and the person killed was the bomber. That bomb was detonated at 10,000ft which is why a single hole in the fuselage was the outcome. At 37,000ft, the result of that bomb would, almost certainly, have been the death of everyone onboard.

Planes don't need to turn 360' to lose altitude, there's no reason to, to lose altitude you lose altitude, cut power, nose down, maybe add flaps. I've never heard of turning 360, and why would you do this over the sea in an emergency situation, it makes no sense.

Lithium batteries scare me anyway before this. Just look at last christmas with these "hover boards" or e-cigarette charging fires.

Perhaps all batery powered devices should be put in a special fireproof luggage container. It would make a lot of sense.

They dont NEED to to turn left to descend.......what i said was that it was, i believe, a sometimes known practice to get out of a traffic corridor, prior to an emergency descent......i.e, if you have planes at altitudes below you in the traffic corridor, it might not be a great idea to suddenly start plunging downwards.

From what i read, the plane made a precise 90 degree left turn followed later by a full 360.......to me, this indicates they had a level of control for some time after whatever incident started. The CVR and FDR will tell the story hopefully but for me, the bomb scenario at the minute is no more likely than an onboard fire.

they had  3mins and a max of nearly 5

heat in c/pit right window ,smoke in avionics bay and toilet , might lead some to think there was a c/pit fire ,right c/pit window is first officers seat

Lack of decompression warnings or other major codes  suggests plane was intact imo ,best guess is a rapidly spreading c/pit fire being fed by oxygen or something else

The ACARS reports suggest nothing that explains the subsequent rapid loss of the flight or the manoeuvers or that main systems failed
and thats from Airbus

Once boxes are recovered and data examined more will be revealed ,so far no wreckage shows signs of fire but c/pit/forward parts  will be very revealing if ever recovered .

8-12 months for a interim and 2 years for a full report

wont stop speculation and not saying it should but chances are this accidents causes  will be known and  explained in due course and the relevent lessons learned .

So boxes recovered ,one slightly damaged (cvr) but other is about to reveal the  parameters/variables shortly .

Apparently there is reports of smoke and heat damage to the front of the aircraft ,bodies are being recovered and hopefully as many as possible are returned to their loved ones .

Was going to return to this thread a  while back as the conflicting info being put out was shocking ,although when i read the stuff about north african naval exercises and then meteor shower warnings followed by ufo's a thought it maybe better to wait a bit .

Hopefully getting closer to the truth emerging now ,although dont hold your breath .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EgyptAir_Flight_804