Chit Chat
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21 Feb 16
10:17
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Date Joined:
06 Mar 03
..... workers' rights, conditions, pay, sick benefits, job security will be decimated if we come out of Europe. All the slogans and bannerlines from the Sun and Daily Mail about taking control of our own country mean nothing for ordinary wrokers, it will just give our employers carte blanche to treat us with more contempt and disdain in the workplace. Why? Because ultimately in a capitalist country like ours, decisions in the workplace are predicated on profit, balance sheet, appeasing shareholders etc, and workers are simply tools to ensure profitability, and if it suits them to get rid of us they will do so in an instant. The EC is based on sound socialist principles and we need to be in to ensure our protection. A few years ago Royal Mail had a £10 billion deficit in its pension pot due to bad management, and it was only due to European Directives that the Government was forced to make good this deficit, otherwise all posties would be in a situation where theyre paying into their pension in good faith facing a retirement of uncertainty and worry.
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All that will go from leaving the EU is the working time directive which nobody wanted anyway.
Actually workers rights conditions and wages will be given a boost if the oversupply of labour is removed with us leaving Europe. The worst thing that's happened to the working man regarding jobs and wages is being in the EU. Wages and conditions have been decimated due to too many workers coming here from Europe. |
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quite correct Dr.
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"The EC is based on sound socialist principles"
That's the reason I want out! |
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 Room 0182. |
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The EU is a capitalist club. It's in all the treaties and has been from the first which is why,historically,it was the left in this country which was against joining.
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That's right salmon.
The Royal Mail btw may have been privatised by the Tories, but it was the EU that began the process by enforcing the liberalisation of the natural monopoly of postal services. Corbyn fancies renationalising the railways. That means he'll have to overcome European commission rail directive 91/440/EEC, & potentially the proposed Fourth Railway Package too. TTIP is another thing all together. There are plenty on the left who can see all this. Here's the left's poster boy Owen Jones on the subject - The left must put Britain's EU withdrawal on the agenda . http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/14/left-reject-eu-greece-eurosceptic?CMP=twt_gu a Guardian article - Open borders or fair wages: the left needs to make up its mind . http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/24/open-borders-fair-wages-left-mass-immigration-britain-economy and Kate Hoey's take - Why leaving the EU is a left-wing move . http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/labour-mp-kate-hoey-why-leaving-the-eu-is-a-left-wing-move-a6687936.html |
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Nail on head from Room 0182.
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The sound of great Labour men and British radicals from the past turning in their graves is deafening at the senseless din this toilet snake oil salesmen is making. Free born British people people took what was theirs through solidarity. They didn't need our continental friends to make it happen. How are the workers rights doing in places like Spain and Portugal? Not so good. Unemployment is rampant.
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To pick up on Dr C's over supply of labour comment:
Controlling immigration should lead to better contracts, higher pay and more favourable conditions. We need an employee-led economy. At present with such an oversupply of largely low skilled labour, employers dictate the terms. It's a race to the bottom. Mimimum wage, zero hour contracts etc. If the worker doesn't fancy it, there's 200 foreigners standing behind him. The best thing for people in low paid work is for the supply of labour to be drastically reduced. ONLY by leaving the EU will this be achieved. |
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Eeeeternal Optimist - if there was any chance of voting in a genuine Socialist-leaning non-tory or substitute-for-tory Government in the next 20 years, i'd be inclined to agree with your every word. But guess what, there isnt. Saying we should achieve what's right through solidarity is a great soundbite but in todays Britain of declining - or even already-decimated in some cases - manufacturing economy and inherently weaker unions, its merely lip service, it aint gonna happen. Whats good for company and industrial owners, in a system where maximizing profit is the be-all and end-all and few restrictions and restraints are applied - must (almost by definition) be bad for workers' pay pension, security etc. On the Sunday Politics today, Chris Grayling was quite open in admitting he gives very little significance to workers health and safety issues in the workplace. Leaving immigration aside, the 'OUT' side's chief argument is all to do with supporting British business, not British workers.
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Injera is correct. The argument posited by the original poster is flawed.
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The only socialists supporting the In campaign are the Islington set who dream of international socilaism and open borders but are just as inclined to sell the british working class down the river.They have supported mass immigration that has massacred the union's negotiating powers to enhance lower paid workers.
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Keep the red flag flying,more power to the unions, that'll create jobs and keep the UK/EU competitive in a globalised economy. The whole EU should get Syriza in to run it, that's been a roaring success!
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So you'd give your country away because you don't like Tories toilet. Fair enough but don't try and sell us all that waffle.
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E.U. Employers have Never said U.K. Employee`s would lose out if we leave the E.U.
In fact, not a lot will change for 2 years, Anybody who has never seen the the bbc Programme about the Cayman Islands, should Download it now onto i-player, A Tax Free haven with 20,000 Businesses in one building  ££1.5 Trillion GBP in the Cayman banks (The UK`s Debt) New Hospitals and Schools but No finances to accommodate the local Natives  Items in the shops that cost £1 in the UK, but £4-5 in Cayman shops, A population of 10,000 but a Township really called "Hell" where the natives live, and a Warning that this is how the UK Will end up. |
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It's kind of ironic to read of the EU being the great defender of the working class when there is all the evidence and the simple logic that if you bring in lots of low or semi skilled workers prepared to work for less money, then it'll obviously depress the wages of the workers already here, or keep them out of the workplace altogether. To then say we need the EU to somehow fix this sort of thing via legislation is surreal.
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I agree with just checking.
I am socialist, I want a better life for those at the bottom of our society, but mass immigration will work against this it will make them still poorer. I have always opposed mass immigration, a little does us good, a lot harms us. |
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bit like ur posts ebu
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the eu know that capitalism is a mugs game, as any old hard working new money rable can work their way up into the upper echelons.
what's needed is the the socialist model, 99 percent slave/workers entirely dependant on the state with a 1 percent ruling class making sure everything is fair. |
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Don't Most countries already have;
93 per cent Workers (Slave) entirely dependant on a 7 per cent ruling class making sure everything is fair. |
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your grammar is all over the place, obviously 93 percent are not workers, however non contributing welfare beneficiaries are still considered slaves as they are required to vote fpr the party that provides their dole. also you missed the required question mark.
you may be impertinent enough to suggest that my office mis-spelled "rabble". i can assure you that a slave upon whom i have projected the weaknesses of my ofice has been beaten mercilessly and may not survive, this suffering of ours (we look upon suffering communally) shall be considered a just end to this matter. you subordination and crimes against language are yet to be resolved, expect a visit  |
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Given the number of grammatical mistakes in the last post it must be some kind of wind-up. If you are going to do a wind-up post you really should put more effort in.
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you completely missed the literary device, and the obvious reference to the eu, but not a complete failure as you spotted some typos, so well done.
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..... workers' rights, conditions, pay, sick benefits, job security will be decimated if we come out of Europe
What is the point of having workers rights pay etc. if you can't get a job because it has been taken by a migrant |
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Capt__F • February 21, 2016 11:32 PM GMT
bit like ur posts ebu Cool  |
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Thanks
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Mick,the logical response,which we will hear repeatedly,is that most british members of the workng class are so lazy we have to encourage mass immigarion because we have so many workshy............ ad infinitum, by the Labour party politicians usually.
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