You can't prove there isn't one. 'Just because you can't see something, it doesn't mean it's not there.'

I agree Make my hay you can still see it's beautiful.

Do you really reckon we all came out of nothing 13 billion years ago though?

Everything in the world HAS a creator. We are all mini Gods.

cardifffc   
02 Jan 15 22:26 
religon will always survive because people are afraid of death......

the pope believes in god

the pope believes in heaven

he believes that when he dies god will let him in to the wonderful place that is heaven

so why does he ride around in a bulletproof car?

I understand that may well be the case but what about the Big Bang? What caused that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfWN5EW5eo4

if the universe did not come from nothing, is the next question not whence did its creating agent arise.

it's a never ending question, and with each iteration the explanation becomes more unlikely.

i've not read all of this thread: a deist's view of non intervening power is not entirely at odds with what we all observe, nor does said power necessarily have to have been the creative force; monotheistic religions are clearly absolute horseshit.

Emden 02 Jan 15 22:46 
amazing how many none-believing, hard core atheists suddenly want to embrace religion when they are on deaths door. Seen it many a time.


it's called bargaining, and we learn it as a very young child when faced with an unpleasant situation we can't control and call on our parents to remove us from it.

it's got nothing to do with religion.

LOL just had a thought. If the infinite multiverse theorum is correct, is it not possible there is a god only in some universes?

As I get older and the physics gets more impenetrable and speculative, I’m willing to entertain the idea that it is not only possible that god exists but that we don’t.

"I thought I was good.

She didn't."

Fixed that for you

asbff. "Scientists believe in eternal energy right? That could be what God is? "

I was going to type a log response but can't be @rsed, so here's a Starter for 10, an interssting take on the above. from the Seth material.

"He is not human in your terms, though he passed through human stages; and here the Buddhist myth comes closest to approximating reality. He is not one individual, but an energy gestalt.*

* Gestalt = a pattern of individual parts so unified as a whole that it cannot be described merely
   as a sum of its parts

This absolute, ever-expanding, instantaneous psychic gestalt, which you call God if you prefer, is so secure in its existence that it can constantly break itself down and rebuild itself.

Its energy is so unbelievable, that it does indeed form all universes; and because its energy is within and behind all universes, systems and fields, it is indeed aware of each sparrow that falls, for it is each sparrow that falls.

Now - and this will seem like a contradiction in terms - there is nonbeing. It is a state of, not of nothingness, but a state in which probabilities and possibilities are known and anticipated but blocked from expression.

Dimly, through what you would call history, hardly remembered, there was such a state. It was a state of agony in which the powers of creativity and existence were known, but the ways to produce them were not known.

This is the lesson that All That Is had to learn, and that could not be taught. This is the agony from which creativity originally was drawn, and its reflection is still seen.

Some of this discussion is bound to be distorted, because I must explain it to you in terms of time as you understand it. So I will speak for your benefit, of some indescribably distant past in which these events occurred.

All That Is retains memory of that state, and it serves as a constant impetus - in your terms - toward renewed creativity. Each self (you), as a part of All That Is therefore also retains memory of that state. It is for this reason that each minute consciousness is endowed with the impetus toward survival, change, development, and creativity. It is not enough that All That Is as a primary energy gestalt, desires further being, but each portion of It (you) also carries this determination.

Yet the agony itself was used as the means, and the agony itself served as the impetus, strong enough so that All That Is initiated within Itself the means to be.

If - and this is impossible - all portions but the most minute last 'unit' of All That Is were destroyed, All That Is would continue, for within the smallest portion is the innate knowledge of the whole. All That Is protects Itself, therefore, and all that It has and is and will create.

When I speak of All That Is, you must understand my position within It. All That Is knows no other. This does not mean that there may not be more to know. It does not know whether or not other psychic gestalts like It exist. It is not aware of them if they do exist. It is constantly searching. It knows that something else existed before Its own primary dilemma when it could not express itself.

It is conceivable then, that It has evolved, in your terms, so long ago It has forgotten Its origin, that It has developed from still another Primary which has - again, in your terms - long since gone Its way. So there are answers that I cannot give you, for they are not known anywhere in the system in which we have our existence. We do know that within this system of our All That Is, creation continues and developments are never still.

The first state of agonized search for existence may have represented the birth throes of All That Is as we know it.

In other words, All That Is existed in a state of being, but without the means to find expression for Its being. This was the state of agony of which I spoke.

The agony and the desire to create represented Its proof of Its own reality. The feelings, in other words, were adequate proof to All That Is that It was.

At first, in your terms, all of probable reality existed as nebulous dreams within the consciousness of All That Is. Later, the unspecific nature of these 'dreams' grew more particular and vivid. The dreams became recognizable one from the other until they drew the conscious notice of All That Is. And with curiosity and yearning, All That Is paid more attention to Its own dreams.

It then purposely gave them more and more detail, and yearned toward this diversity and grew to love that which was not yet separate from Itself. It gave consciousness and imagination to personalities (us) while they were still within Its dreams. They also yearned to be actual.

Potential individuals, in your terms, had consciousness before the beginning or any beginning as you know it, then. They (you) clamored to be released into actuality, and All That Is, in unspeakable sympathy, sought within Itself for the means.

His was in your terms a primary cosmic dilemma, and one with which It wrestled until All That Is was completely involved and enveloped within that cosmic problem.

Had It not solved it, All That Is would have faced insanity, and there would have been, literally, a reality without reason and a universe run wild.

The pressure came from two sources: from the conscious but still probable individual selves who found themselves alive in God's dream, and from the God who yearned to release them.

This, then, is the dilemma of any primary pyramid gestalt: It creates reality. It also recognized within each consciousness (you) the massive potential that existed. The means, then, came to It. It must release the creatures and probabilities from Its dream.

To do so would give them actuality. However, it also meant 'losing' a portion of Its own consciousness, for it was within that portion that they were held in bondage. All That Is had to let go.

With love and longing It let go that portion of Itself, and they (souls) were free. The psychic energy exploded in a flash of creation (big bang).

All That Is, therefore, 'lost' a portion of Itself in that creative endeavor. All That Is loves all that is has created down to the least, for It realizes the dearness and uniqueness of each consciousness which has been wrest from such a state and at such a price.

It, of Itself and from this state, has given life to infinities of possibilities. From Its agony, It found the way to burst forth in freedom, through expression, and in so doing gave existence to individualized consciousnesses. Therefore It is rightfully jubilant.

Yet all individuals remember their source, and now dream of All That Is as All That Is once dreamed of them. And they yearn toward that immense source... and yearn to set It free and give It actuality through their own creations.

These connections between you and All That Is can never be severed, and Its awareness is so delicate and focused that Its attention is indeed directed with a prime creator's love to each consciousness."

At the end of this session with Jane Roberts, Seth said that his words should be read many times, "for there are implications that are not obvious."

Seth also said...

"Even this overall pyramid gestalt (God) is not static. Most of your God concepts deal with a static God, and here is one of your main theological difficulties. The awareness and experience of this gestalt changes and grows. There is no static God. When you say 'This is God,' then God is already something else."

"All portions of All That Is are constantly changing, enfolding and unfolding. All That Is, seeking to know Itself, constantly creates new versions of Itself. For this seeking Itself is a creative activity and is the core of all action."

Is this Seth from Emmerdale?

Converts carry less weight.  Like being fooled twice, so not learning from your mistakes.

I WANTED TO BELIEVE IN THE GOD AND JESUS THAT I LEARNT ABOUT AT SCHOOL AND SUNDAY SCHOOL ,BUT WHO AM I TO SAY THAT THE MUSLIMS OR THE OTHER RELIGEONS ARE WRONG,I DO BELIEVE THERE IS SOMETHING THAT LOOKS AFTER ME AND MAKES PEOPLE WHO DO WRONG GET THEIR COMEUPENCE  LIKE ME ,I DO WISH THEIR WAS A GOD LIKE THE ONE I LEARNT ABOUT AT SCHOOL ,I WISH HE WOULD DO A WORLD TOUR EVERY NOW AND THEN SO I COULD SAY YES ,IM FOLLOWING HIM BECAUSE THATS THE RIGHT THING TO DO ,AND I MEAN THAT ,

Heretic! Burn him!

Avoidance of suffering? What about masochists?

Yet your still here to tell your story. Defies Science.

aasbff   
03 Jan 15 01:26 
Yet your still here to tell your story. Defies Science.

You're 25, you don't do humour

And ready if it comes up: 

NOBODY comes back from the dead.

If you can 'die' for 5 minutes and come to life on an operating table,  you weren't dead.

George Carlin, for me, explains religion precisely and eloquently.
Use 10 minutes of your life and he will clarify;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RT6rL2UroE