Young people with Maths / English / law etc degrees working in Call Centre

That's what happens if you go to a poly

ofcourse it is. a degree lasts for a lifetime and many employers will only choose graduates.

a degree proves that you have the incentive and focus to do something with your life. as you see these people are working in low paid jobs during hard times, instead of playing computer games on the dole. When the job market improves, they will stand a much better chance than someone without a degree or any work experience

my daughters in the same boat ,just about to do degree in performing arts, :(

but it will be a grat experience for her and will hopefully equip her for life in many waays. secret is make sure they are multi skilled i have got my daughtet to do I.T and make up to give hervmore than one string to her bowp

seems a waste
too many go to uni in my opinion on "media studies" etc

70% of kids going to university are wasting there time and money.

but they do know when to use "their" ;)

As a lecturer I'd put it at nearer 95%. They arrive in such bad shape there's very little that can be done with them.

Fck me, Zaubs. That's a mistake I've never made before. Trust you to spot it.

Rob_S 27 May 17:33
That's what happens if you go to a poly

what snobbish bu11shyte. My best mate went to brum to do chemical engineering but got nicked selling pills so dropped out. Then went to derby uni (bottom 10 of all uni's) to do sound engineering and now works in zurich as a computer programmer for an audio engineering firm on 100k swiss francs.

My point is, a degree is only a tool to get in to an interview, once there its all about who you are and what skills you possess. Admittedly some jobs are out of reach for poly students like investment banking but on the whole it means nothing.

Inevitable consequence of making it easier to get into what passes for uni these days. Basic economics that the less scarce something is, in this case degrees, the less valuable it is.

nestor 27 May 17:40
70% of kids going to university are wasting there time and money.

on what basis have you chosen 70%? Having a degree means, on average, an income fo 10k above national average. That's worth 30k, imo.

no, all it means is that while in the past you would consider someone with a 2,2, nowdays you only consider a 2,1 and above

when I graduated, only 5% of the population were finishing Uni. Even so the job market was damn tough in 1993, that most jobs were seeking people with a degree or at least 5 years experience

evski 27 May 17:44
Rob_S 27 May 17:33
That's what happens if you go to a poly

what snobbish bu11shyte. My best mate went to brum to do chemical engineering but got nicked selling pills so dropped out. Then went to derby uni (bottom 10 of all uni's) to do sound engineering and now works in zurich as a computer programmer for an audio engineering firm on 100k swiss francs.

My point is, a degree is only a tool to get in to an interview, once there its all about who you are and what skills you possess. Admittedly some jobs are out of reach for poly students like investment banking but on the whole it means nothing.


That made me laugh for someone arguing a point

Is something now only worth doing if it pays for itself financially? Isn't learning an end in itself?

I think it is more of a case of proving that you can apply yourself, rather than learning

5f sprinter, I suppose it was an unnecessary piece of info. I don't see how it detracts from my point, though?

Many more people are choosing to go than in previous years, so yes it is a bit less 'special' than in previous years, but few top jobs will consider someone without a degree, and the life experience and opportunities are unrivalled. You live more in three years at uni than many do in a a lifetime.

They should be pointed in the direction of a 'Betfair Education' if they possess the required intelligence .

People 'choosing' to go is the problem. It shouldn't be a matter of choice but rather an achievement in itself reaching the required standards to gain a place.

What university are they going to?
I'm starting at Manc Met in Sept :)

Sure it's a generalisation - but won't employers be making generalisations too when they do the first sift of the several hundred CVs that land on their desk? Or do you expect them to actually judge each person individually when they have so many applications for a few jobs - oh and besides all that have a business to run

True, and the qualification fiddling to enable pretty much anyone to get in has created some truly rubbish degrees.

I mean, a BA in Social Work? How much training is required to not notice child abuse?

pervert

that was to watson

Dr

Problem is graduates starting jobs these days are fecking useless, I'd employ someone without a degree over someone with one every time.

Rob_S 27 May 17:56
Sure it's a generalisation - but won't employers be making generalisations too when they do the first sift of the several hundred CVs that land on their desk? Or do you expect them to actually judge each person individually when they have so many applications for a few jobs - oh and besides all that have a business to run
I know some firms simply throw applicants from poly students away, but even of those that do there is still opportunity for gifted students to get in. My bird did biomedical science at notts trent and her best mate is now working for astra zeneca after doing a PhD at Leicester. Just becasue some employers don't look at poly students doesn't make the degree worthless. Especially in subjects that require certain skill-sets.

For the record I go to Uni of Nottingham. I'm also a snob. ;)

Not very nice thing to say zaubs imo :(

evski I wasnt havin a pop or anything just made me chuckle when reading it

Seasider. 27 May 17:59
Problem is graduates starting jobs these days are fecking useless, I'd employ someone without a degree over someone with one every time.

Yeah, academic types aren't cut out to be window cleaners. :p

People with the right skills will always do ok. Skills is a broad brush

I've worked with someone who went to Cambridge. She had an awesome memory but didn't seem able to think anything through. Just a rote learner.

Me? I can't remember things from one day to the next but sit me down with something and I'll calculate it/solve it for you no probs. But I also hate working with people. So there's pros and cons! :)

Seasider.

the point is that they have gone through at least 15 years of schooling, proving that they can be told what to do, plus have shown the ambition to complete a course.
which in my eyes means that they are trainable

surely most of them work part time there when getting the degrees anyway.

Magic Flea is correct ...has nothing to do with intelligence .


Who wants a bright workshy lay about ?

if you think the ones who have gone to uni are thick, you should see the ones that are on new deal the majority imo seem virtual unemployable

look at the loons that make it to PM
cant be that hard to succeed

i don't think you learn much "life skills" at uni personally. when i went, i just got p.issed all the time, never went to lectures, just got the notes and crammed it all in in the few days before exams. Alright so i learnt how to cook and wash my own clothes and pay electricity bills and that. big deal.

What did I learn about life? fk all tbh. Learnt much more from working than I did as a student. You don't meet a particularly varied type of person at uni, because students, are all much of a muchness tbh. when you go to work you meet all sorts.

robdylan speaks the truth - but I still look back on my uni years a cherished times.
Made a lot of friends for life, which when you start a career and move from job to job doesn't seem to happen in the same way.

It is a weight of numbers thing.
At uni you are surrounded by thousands of people who, on the whole, have a lot of energy and spare time. Thus, whatever you are interested in doing, there is a fair chance there are others you can explore doing it with.
Yes, you can go on the lash all the time, but you can could also join the chess club, get into politics, go canoeing, anything. There will be people there who also want to do that, and you have the university's facilities at hand.
And these activities need organising.
I am not an outgoing person at all, and did spend a lot of time sinking pints. But I also gained experience by such things as organising a ball at a halls of residence, driving a minibus for the racegoers' club, setting up and running a football side on Sunday mornings. These sort of possibilities help you learn stuff you would not in the narrow confines of work.

obdylan 28 May 09:56
i don't think you learn much "life skills" at uni personally. when i went, i just got p.issed all the time, never went to lectures, just got the notes and crammed it all in in the few days before exams. Alright so i learnt how to cook and wash my own clothes and pay electricity bills and that. big deal.

What did I learn about life? fk all tbh. Learnt much more from working than I did as a student. You don't meet a particularly varied type of person at uni, because students, are all much of a muchness tbh. when you go to work you meet all sorts.

I can't believe that anyone that would write something like this went to uni, mostly because it's cliched bo11ox, but also because the grammar is so bad "and that".

Uni doesn't end learning in life, it just starts it.

just because something is a cliche doesn't mean it is untrue.

f.uk grammar.

they must have little or no ambition.

Bloody hell, most graduates these days can't string a sentence together verbally never mind write with correct grammar !

because students, are all much of a muchness tbh. when you go to work you meet all sorts.

--------------

thinly veiled, despite my degree, i work in a licorice factory fred, im haho

Maybe you are one of the people that shouldn't have gone to uni. Sounds like you didn't soak up the experience and just let it pass you by. I pity you.

ingfisher 23 28 May 10:27
they must have little or no ambition.

who?

most students are up their own ar** and detest working class people i have little or no time for them.

When I went we were paid a grant and all fees were paid. You could live comfortably on a grant and if you did go overdrawn you could work it off during the summer. My degree was fairly vocational. I had a great time, wouldn't have missed it for the world, made some great friends and it helped me get a job.

Times have changed. Now it is the expected thing to go to 'university'. But the institutions and courses are rubbish. I dont really mind that but the problem is the kids are sold a dream and it isnt a true one. They get in loads of debt, often despite working part time. I am not even sure they are having as good a time as we did.

Of course, the government are to blame, as are the hundreds of thousands making a good living out of the further education system. It is just a big con. A way the government have found to keep lecturers and ancilliary staff in jobs and keeping the students off the dole.

kingfisher 23 28 May 10:30
most students are up their own ar** and detest working class people i have little or no time for them.

on what do you base this? Loads of my peers are working class. Sounds more like you have an inferiority complex.

I could spew when you hear them'Daddy said this, Daddy said that.

it all depends what you put in.

if you put in a decent effort to your studies and having fun, then a degree is well worth it. if you just sit in your halls, skip classes and sit around playing xbox and watching dvd's all day, then it isn't.

if you're going to university, you have to get a 2:1 minimum or it isn't worth it in terms of getting a better job than you would have done without going. if you get a 2:2 or a third and have some amazing experiences on the social side, and i don't just mean getting drunk and stealing roadsigns, then again, it might have been worth it, but that's subjective.

as with all things, the more people that do them, the less special they become. more graduates going for less graduate jobs means you have to do even more to stand out from the crowd, but a 2:1 degree from a decent university, combined with a few other things on your cv, would see you get a decent enough job after finishing university.

after you've got your first job in your proper career, the degree won't matter as much as prospective employers will focus more on what your last job was and how you performed in it, rather than your qualifications (unless specialised).

the point is, going to university and doing it properly, actually putting effort in (assuming you are intelligent in the first place, not someone who just got in to an old polytechnic through clearing with a D in business studies and a D in general studies), will give you a huge advantage over most of the field when starting a career.

it's also very worthwhile considering a year out in business after your second year as the university will help find you a company to work for and if you perform well enough for them, they have a habbit of taking you back on after you've graduated as they know you can perform well in the role and it's safer than taking a 'new' person on.

what is the big thing you "learn" evski? Who are all these fascinating characters? There is a much bigger variety of people in the average work place than at uni. Uni is largely middle class and white, especially if you do English or History or something. (yes, or something). I did engineering so there were quite a lot of Hong Kong, Chinese and Malaysian types who had paid a fortune to come here, so I guess there was variety in that sense, but very little "mixing" tbh.

I made some real good friends at uni, did all the usual b.ollox like drinking and playing rugby and staying up late talking about politics, but no real life experiences imo.

kingfisher 23 28 May 10:31
I could spew when you hear them'Daddy said this, Daddy said that.

well I go to a very good uni and I have never once heard anyone use the word "daddy", loads of public school boys/girls. You're just making it up.

90% of students in Durham are ignorant, excluding a German woman i know VERY well :)

I doubt your very good uni is in the same breath as Durham.

Kingy, Durham is one of the Unis that has been accused of positive discrimination against the privileged classes.

I studied Inglish at Plymoth Politechnic.

Did so well Im know lecturing their.

I turned Durham down :)

A bunch of degens on a gambling forum arguing that you need a degree for 'top jobs' ... you couldn't make it up!

University is something to do until you can be arsed to get a job. Degrees mean less and less for the majority of employers in the real world.

Nestor the greman woman was great and I still see her now and again :)

obdylan 28 May 10:33
what is the big thing you "learn" evski? Who are all these fascinating characters? There is a much bigger variety of people in the average work place than at uni. Uni is largely middle class and white, especially if you do English or History or something.

Abviously it was totally wasted on you. Had you gone in to work straight away as i did, then you would realise that as someone without qualifications you don't get to meet the interesting people. YOu share offices with idiots that couldn't be arsed to go to uni, and if they did they got a 2:2 from sheffield Hallam. There is no variety in these crappy jobs, everyone is a boring pretentious fool that spends most of their paltry 20k on clothes and their car whilst still living with mum.

The uni experience isn't learning one thing that is the same for everyone, but the vast majority of people think it the time of their lives. It's a shame you missed out on that.

Rob if Carlsberg done uni decisions they would have done the same.

kingfisher 23 28 May 10:35
I doubt your very good uni is in the same breath as Durham.

I had to get 3 a's to get in. In my subject it is ranked higher, but in most you are right, it is slightly lower. But not much.

kingfisher 23 28 May 10:41
Nestor the greman woman was great

I have to say I'm surprised by this

is the german woman clarky9's wife? :0

Shes still there Highstack if you want her number ;)

Is this a test evski? Am I supposed to point out your spelling mistakes?

I still don't know what you learn apart from your subject. You learn to look after yourself - washing clothes, paying rent, etc. But you'd learn that anyway.

You have a point re: getting a better job meeting more varied people. But I used to work in factories and on building sites and met loads of genuine and fascinating people. More so than at uni. University really doesn't have a massive variety of people imo.

Not surprised she was great KF just surprised that nestor is a German woman

lol ah i see, didnt notice that :D

?

I got expelled from School at 15 for running a book on the 74 Derby :-(

At least it was a skinner :-)