how did god impregnate mary?

CB - Do you reckon the Child Support Agency are still trying to track God down for back payments?

if Mary and Joseph had been in Bethlehem today . . . .

http://www.sfbayview.com/wp-content/uploads/bethlehem-cartoon-mary-joseph-is...

Joseph goes back into the Inn.

"No. I asked to see the manager"

Mary was beamed up to his spaceship where she was artificially inseminated.

It's all there in the bible.

Momm, so thats where you met the Cruises ;)

canaryboy 17 Dec 15:42

at the end of the day, wasn't god just another absent father

----------------------------

He wasn't absent, he's omnipresent remember? Bit like Wilson Palacios.

yeah but he wasn't there to give guidance or help with homework was he

I feel sorry for those who have posted here ... to quote from the bible , 'Father forgive them ,for they know not what they do'.

Feel free to jeer,it is your souls that are at risk.

canaryboy 17 Dec 15:42


at the end of the day, wasn't god just another absent father

Was god west Indian ?

your smugness fails to answer the question...

ask the guy above you

Get ready to dodge the bolts of lightning canary

you can just picture the scene..".how come your pregnant mary..weve never done it ..whos the bstard father"

"honest joseph ive never done it with anybody i dont understand it"

"yeah sure mary i suppose it was the fairies or god or something"

"yeah joseph that must be it..it must be god"


mary perspiring slightly thinks...phew .i think i got away with that

that's the best explanation i've ever heard tbh

Mary may only have been 14, does this make God a child molester?

would explain the catholic church then...

KEEP IT UP BOYS. You are doing yourself proud. I am sure the enemies of Christianity are gloating as you post. If this thread was about another religion it would have (rightly) pulled as soon as it began.

Allah allows his messengers to fiddle with 9 year olds so its not just christianity that allows a bit of incest.

why would a thread about religion be pulled?

i genuinely want to know how mary got impregnated if baby jesus was the son of god

surely there's an explanation

canaryboy 17 Dec 15:42


at the end of the day, wasn't god just another absent father



Is God West Indian?

Hmmm.....

To those taking offence to this thread. If you are genuinely offended, I would apologise. I'd suspect though you just enjoy adopting a holier than thou position - literally.

The man I've respected the most in life was my best friends dad. He was a methodist minister for over 20 years, but his favourite film was Life Of Brian. He had his faith, apart from his family it was the most important thing in his life - but he never force fed it to others. He also hated the stuffy, humourless stereotypical image of some aspects of the church and church goers, and the division of acceptance between different religions. Sadly, his faith couldn't save him from dying of stomach cancer before his 44th birthday.

HRH The Lager Khan

The whole point for people of faith,is that there is a spiritual existence that transcends this one.

The material world that we inhabit is considered a precurser to an eternal life free of sin and pain.

boxing the fox...all organised religions are equally wrong...corrupt...hypocritical and arrogant...we are not just picking on you...

on an individual basis im sure some form of deluded belief can help you get through life and if it works for you thats fine...live and let live

mary was raped by a roman soldier, producing what's technically known as a b@stard (jesus)

how many atheists find themselves praying/ calling out for god when in a life threatening position ?

that apart - didnt the Angel Gabriel turn up and shaft Mary on behalf of his Nibs?

jimk 17 Dec 18:41


mary was raped by a roman soldier, producing what's technically known as a b@stard (jesus)


No- that was Brian

wrong film

jimk 17 Dec 18:41
mary was raped by a roman soldier, producing what's technically known as a b@stard (jesus)


Were you aware that this was the tale told by Nazi Germans during WW2 ?

im sure all the christians in uganda are having a smashing time killing the gays...and the moslems in wherever stoning women to death for allowing themselves to get raped

god and his followers are good ..i dont think so

so - how did god impregnate mary?

There is a world of difference between those who act as Christians and those who call themselves Christian but act in a manner that is obviously anything but Christian.

who got mary up the duff?

lmfao 17 Dec 18:45
so - how did god impregnate mary?

The super natural transcends the physical world of 'matter' , some call them miracles.

how convenient...

canaryboy 17 Dec 18:49
how convenient...

..as is your ignorance.

so ..i cant stand..in your opinion...a "bad" christian who believes in god will still go to heaven

and yet a person who does good all his life but is a militant ateheist wont

something wrong surely

only one holier than thou attitude i can see on here

others call them bulls hit

plainlazy 17 Dec 18:50
so ..i cant stand..in your opinion...a "bad" christian who believes in god will still go to heaven

and yet a person who does good all his life but is a militant ateheist wont

something wrong surely

Who is to say who enters heaven ?

so i'm ignorant to the supernatural mumbo jumbo?

LOL

brendanuk1 17 Dec 18:50
only one holier than thou attitude i can see on here

My attitude is one of respect for those of faith and those of none.

What I do draw the line at is having a cheap and petty swipe at those who have a different world view from you.

what about the female christian god which was thrown out along with the Gnostic books from which the council of nicea chose to 'make' the bible? Whats become of her then???

ICANTSTANDTHISFORUM 17 Dec 18:54


brendanuk1 17 Dec 18:50
only one holier than thou attitude i can see on here

My attitude is one of respect for those of faith and those of none.

What I do draw the line at is having a cheap and petty swipe at those who have a different world view from you


Oh - go on- you'll love it - its very liberating :)

In the second century, the polemicist Celsus (recorded in Origen's Contra Celsum 1.28-32) claimed that Mary had sex with a Roman soldier and then married Joseph who protected her from the harsh Jewish laws of the time which otherwise would have sentenced her to death by stoning for such an act.[26]

Some scholars of the historical Jesus do not believe in the Virgin Birth, regarding the nativity of Jesus to be an early Christian story created to liken Jesus to Moses (the Massacre of the Innocents) and to show him fulfilling prophecy (the return from Egypt, etc.), or speculate that the father could have been "Joseph or some unknown male who either seduced or raped the young Mary".



i'd risk my life for £1 to bet that god isn't real. jesus was real, but he was either crazy or extremely gullable or a conman, who was the result of his mother having sex.

canaryboy 17 Dec 18:52
so i'm ignorant to the supernatural mumbo jumbo?

LOL

I am afraid that your shallow persona represents a rather limited appreciation of the eternal questions in life.

jimk you have conveniently over looked two millenia of Mariology.

crazy or extremely gullable also applies to modern day religion followers. it's rather scary when 90% of the earth's population belongs to a religion.

next people will be believing that global warming is man made.

The story of Jesus' birth is like the rest of the stories in the bible were written many years after the man's death and should be taken with a pinch of salt.

There is little in the bible about his birth and childhood yet all Christian's take the story at face value without question.

I always come back to David Icke as he is a current "messiah". I'm sure you Christians think the guy is a nutter as he speaks to god regularly yet you take the word of men 2,000 years old who write about stories 30 or 40 years previous.

Try questioning your own beliefs, you may find that truth hurts.

i like the Icke example, Ovalman.

Ovalman 17 Dec 19:00
The story of Jesus' birth is like the rest of the stories in the bible were written many years after the man's death and should be taken with a pinch of salt.

There is little in the bible about his birth and childhood yet all Christian's take the story at face value without question.

I always come back to David Icke as he is a current "messiah". I'm sure you Christians think the guy is a nutter as he speaks to god regularly yet you take the word of men 2,000 years old who write about stories 30 or 40 years previous.

Try questioning your own beliefs, you may find that truth hurts.


Ovalman try and study some theology before you expose your ignorance, Bultman would be a good place to start.

ICANTSTANDTHISFORUM i wasnt talking about you ;)

lmfao 17 Dec 18:54
what about the female christian god which was thrown out along with the Gnostic books from which the council of nicea chose to 'make' the bible? Whats become of her then???

I think you are making a reference to 'sophia' a personification of wisdom, rather than an actual individual.

i cant stand.....right im going to give you what my philoophy is..it may be a bit long ..and its harder to convey in print than speech but i will do my best..
the first thing to deal with is time..the universe has been in existence for approx 14 BILLION years..the earth has been in existence for 4.6 BILLION years
And yet man has only existed from his primitive form for 100,000 years.....this is a tiny tiny fraction of the time the universe has existed...and yet people who believe say that god made the universe for man...an arrogance that makes you wince..all we are is a passing species that will be in all probability gone within another 50000 years
this is the first of my ideas..im going for a bath ..and then i will give you the second (and final reason )why its not concievable that there is a god looking solely after man

plainlazy,a divine plan/order for the cosmos can exist out side of the rational of men.

plainlazy 17 Dec 18:39
boxing the fox...all organised religions are equally wrong...corrupt...hypocritical and arrogant...we are not just picking on you...

on an individual basis im sure some form of deluded belief can help you get through life and if it works for you thats fine...live and let live

Wow all those assumptions, and all of them way off target. you could read my post again, on second thoughts.............

Ovalman try and study some theology before you expose your ignorance,

Tis true, I haven't read any of the bible since it was rammed down my throat as a kid, I may read up on that era through independent means - I love history but I won't take in just one book as verbatim (like you do.)

Bultman would be a good place to start.


Can't you make up your own mind?

Your god is a very benign god, just like the rest of them.

Ovalman 17 Dec 19:26
Ovalman try and study some theology before you expose your ignorance,

Tis true, I haven't read any of the bible since it was rammed down my throat as a kid, I may read up on that era through independent means - I love history but I won't take in just one book as verbatim (like you do.)

Bultman would be a good place to start.


Can't you make up your own mind?

Your god is a very benign god, just like the rest of them.

I have an academic knowledge of religion [PhD Manchester] and I would like to believe that I have enough modicum of intellect to decipher the truth in the convoluted tome that is the bible.

didn't you say mary was impregnated via the supernatural :|

If there is a God, He is infinitely incomprehensible, since, having neither parts nor limits, He has no affinity to us. We are then incapable of knowing either what He is or if He is....

..."God is, or He is not." But to which side shall we incline? Reason can decide nothing here. There is an infinite chaos which separated us. A game is being played at the extremity of this infinite distance where heads or tails will turn up. What will you wager? According to reason, you can do neither the one thing nor the other; according to reason, you can defend neither of the propositions.

Do not, then, reprove for error those who have made a choice; for you know nothing about it. "No, but I blame them for having made, not this choice, but a choice; for again both he who chooses heads and he who chooses tails are equally at fault, they are both in the wrong. The true course is not to wager at all."

Yes; but you must wager. It is not optional. You are embarked. Which will you choose then? Let us see. Since you must choose, let us see which interests you least. You have two things to lose, the true and the good; and two things to stake, your reason and your will, your knowledge and your happiness; and your nature has two things to shun, error and misery. Your reason is no more shocked in choosing one rather than the other, since you must of necessity choose. This is one point settled. But your happiness? Let us weigh the gain and the loss in wagering that God is. Let us estimate these two chances. If you gain, you gain all; if you lose, you lose nothing. Wager, then, without hesitation that He is.

"That is very fine. Yes, I must wager; but I may perhaps wager too much." Let us see. Since there is an equal risk of gain and of loss, if you had only to gain two lives, instead of one, you might still wager. But if there were three lives to gain, you would have to play (since you are under the necessity of playing), and you would be imprudent, when you are forced to play, not to chance your life to gain three at a game where there is an equal risk of loss and gain. But there is an eternity of life and happiness. And this being so, if there were an infinity of chances, of which one only would be for you, you would still be right in wagering one to win two, and you would act stupidly, being obliged to play, by refusing to stake one life against three at a game in which out of an infinity of chances there is one for you, if there were an infinity of an infinitely happy life to gain. But there is here an infinity of an infinitely happy life to gain, a chance of gain against a finite number of chances of loss, and what you stake is finite.

Pascal's wager.

preferred his triangle myself

Pascal then asks the reader to analyze their position. If reason is truly corrupt and cannot be relied upon to decide the matter of God's existence, only a coin toss remains. In Pascal's assessment, placing a wager is unavoidable, and anyone who is incapable of trusting any evidence either for or against God's existence, must at least face the prospect that infinite happiness is at risk. The "infinite" expected value of believing is always greater than the expected value of not believing.

Analysis with decision theory

The possibilities defined by Pascal's Wager can be thought of as a decision under uncertainty with the values of the following decision matrix. (Pascal did not mention hell, nor did he address what the outcome would be of "God exists + Living as if God does not exist," the prospect of infinite gain being sufficient to make his point. Pascal also assumed that the combination of B and ~G would simply be -N, though many people dispute that.) Note that it is necessary to assume that the probability of G is both positive and finite in this situation.
God exists (G) God does not exist (~G)
Living as if God exists (B) +∞ (heaven) -N (none)
Living as if God does not exist (~B) ?? not specified
perhaps -N (limbo/purgatory/spiritual death)
or −∞ (hell) +N (none)

Given these values, the option of living as if God exists (B) dominates the option of living as if God does not exist (~B). In other words, the expected value gained by choosing B is always greater than or equal to that of choosing ~B, regardless of the likelihood that God exists.

In fact, according to decision theory, the only value that matters in the above matrix is the +∞. Any matrix of the following type (where f1, f2, and f3 are all finite positive or negative numbers) results in (B) as being the only rational decision.
God exists (G) God does not exist (~G)
Living as if God exists (B) +∞ f1
Living as if God does not exist (~B) f2 f3
[edit] Criticisms

I trust that the profound minds to be found on this forum can grapple with this hypothesis.

very quick bath..right premise number 2
SIZE...as we have established man has only been on this planet for a fraction of its existence and the organized religions in existence for an even tinier fraction
so ..as far size goes..this planet is a tiny sphere in our solar system..which is a tiny part of our huge galaxy...this galaxy is a tiny part of thousands of galaxies...basically the earth is a pin** on a pin** to the power of 1000s.
and we have existed only a very tiny fraction in the existence of this pin**........and yet man believes the whole thing is for just us..how such an arrogant and absurd idea ever happened is mind boggling.
i realise that im talking to closed minds and that you wont even give this thought but its worth a try

plainlazy,as I said before,a divine plan/order for the cosmos can exist out side of the rational of men.

spot on

man thinks everything is about him and can't cope with the bigger picture

i was always under the impression that pascal was just covering his bets...you might as well believe because if he does exist you are on a winner...if he doesnt it doesnt matter anyway

i cant stand...thats a very easy opt out catch all answer that means absolutely nothing

plainlazy 17 Dec 19:48
i was always under the impression that pascal was just covering his bets...you might as well believe because if he does exist you are on a winner...if he doesnt it doesnt matter anyway

Either way ,we will both know the truth within 60 years !

The calculation by Pasacal only has two options when there are, in fact, at least four alternatives: The christian God and afterlife, some other god and afterlife, atheism with afterlife, and atheism without afterlife.

ICANTSTANDTHISFORUM

You surely didn't expect to find too many like minded folk amidst a forum of degenerate gamblers did you?!??! I suspect the only time they ever ask for devine help is in a photo finish at Chepstow. You are obviously far more erudite than I, but purely out of interest; During the course of your PHD, did your attitude to your own faith and that of others, or their lack of it alter much?

fwiw, i'm not a degenerate gambler

I don't think you can make up your own mind, ICAN'T, you seem to need others to do it for you. You've also took the easy option of Pascal's wager.

Is the bible verbatim? If so which bible? If its not verbatim as your mate Bultmann (whom I've never heard of) says then which bits do we keep in an which bits leave out? If some of the bible is exaggerated/ untrue then why not all of it? If 90% of the planet believe in some sort of higher being then which one is correct? Surely blieving the wrong version of god will send you to hell, hell must be brimming.

Try reading a bit of science instead of believing a 2,000 year old book of hearsay.

HRH The Lager Khan 17 Dec 19:56
ICANTSTANDTHISFORUM

You surely didn't expect to find too many like minded folk amidst a forum of degenerate gamblers did you?!??! I suspect the only time they ever ask for devine help is in a photo finish at Chepstow. You are obviously far more erudite than I, but purely out of interest; During the course of your PHD, did your attitude to your own faith and that of others, or their lack of it alter much?


Most of the people that I know in academic circles have an ambivalent attitude to God.Personally I am as wary of 'bible bashers' as the next man,and I agree with Gandhi's sentiment that Christianity has very few true followers ,but there are outstanding exceptions [such as St Francis and Maximillian Kolbe].Personally I would like to disbelieve the existence of God ,but I feel that we may stop believing in God,but he never stops believing in us.

Pascal was wrong in one respect at least, no such thing as limbo

Ovalman,each to his own.Are you aware that some of the leadiing scientists are the most spiritual of thinkers ?

Quantum physics transcends the physical and touches on the metaphysical.

if there is a God do you think he is worthy of worship? Or indeed would such a being need to be worshipped or believed in??

Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. It was He who created all that we see and all that we feel. We feel strongly that the overwhelming scientific evidence pointing towards evolutionary processes is nothing but a coincidence, put in place by Him.

The more I read into science and religion, the more I am convinced there is no higher being. Much as I'd love an afterlife I'm afraid it just doesn't exist. If it gives you comfort having an imaginary friend then by all means.

Until I see some proof I won't be sitting on any fence.

Worship of God is an expression of love.God does not 'need' the act,it is performed because God is considered by some to be the originator of life and praise thanks him for this gift.

Ovalman 17 Dec 20:19
The more I read into science and religion, the more I am convinced there is no higher being. Much as I'd love an afterlife I'm afraid it just doesn't exist. If it gives you comfort having an imaginary friend then by all means.

Until I see some proof I won't be sitting on any fence.


St Thomas asked the same question.

Dear oh dear......Thank God im an athiest!...........

jimk, do you think moses and the nonsense associated with him contains any facts?

I used to go on Yahoo Messenger when it was still about, and go on christian chat

and then I would send private messages to the chat users and say "I am God"

they would then just laugh at me, what about the "real" God? he doesn't stand much chance of communicating with his followers on Yahoo Messenger

tevez is God according to at least one on here

so that's why God "doesn't" have a face? cos he's so ugly?

gone quiet

gone boring

zzzzz

doing a gubbed canaryboy search were you curious-cat? he will feel honoured

I aim to please.

looks like you are doing a real bunny boiler job on him

looooooooooooooooooooooool

Immaculately.

Of course you do realise that if this thread had been about Allah and his dubious activities,this thread would have been pulled long ago

What dubious activities please?

What dubious activities please?

Have you been in a coma for the last 20yrs??

I think you already know Ivor and i couldn't possible mention them on here,i don't want to be the one responsible for having this thread pulled

Mohammed was the kiddy fiddler and not allah. Allah doesn't exist.

Did Allah impregnate any virgins?

oh fvck me i have opened up a hornets nest now