Chit Chat
Welcome to Live View – Take the tour to learn more
Start Tour
There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
SENT:12-Nov-2009 11:55COMMENT:All we'll get is people with Nursing Studies "degrees", sold by "universities" at the bottom of the league table, the result being people who are unable, in the words of a quaified nurse of long standing, to put a plaster on a cut knee. However, they'll be able at the drop of a hat to spout jargon about the bio-medical model of disease while around them patients die of starvation, dehydration,infection or plain old-fashioned neglect.
THIS IS SO TRUE THAT I FELT COMPELLED TO POST THIS HERE.
THIS IS SO TRUE THAT I FELT COMPELLED TO POST THIS HERE.
Show More
I don't think that's true. I'm sure the degree will involve lots of practical work.
all that's happening is that a new role is being created and what used to be done by nurses, i.e. actually tending and caring for sick people will be devolved to people with a different job title
Im not sure if this is entirely true. My dad left school when he was 15, never had any qualifications,worked in the police till his mid 40's, then took up nursing when he turned 48.
He completed a diploma in nursing which involved in depth coursework and many work placements for weeks at a time on different wards. Even stood in on operations to observe procedures before, during and after operations. He left with sound educational knowledge and plenty of practical experience that he was able to walk straight onto a ward and perform various duties to a professional standard.
I suppose what I'm trying to say is that there are some training procedures out there that are producing good nurses. Although there clearly are parts of the country where the system is failing.
My dad has ended up leaving NHS to work abroad for a private hospital. Got fed up with under staffed wards and poor conditions in the hospitals, but thats another story.
He completed a diploma in nursing which involved in depth coursework and many work placements for weeks at a time on different wards. Even stood in on operations to observe procedures before, during and after operations. He left with sound educational knowledge and plenty of practical experience that he was able to walk straight onto a ward and perform various duties to a professional standard.
I suppose what I'm trying to say is that there are some training procedures out there that are producing good nurses. Although there clearly are parts of the country where the system is failing.
My dad has ended up leaving NHS to work abroad for a private hospital. Got fed up with under staffed wards and poor conditions in the hospitals, but thats another story.
Nurses leaders want nurses to be as respected and as renumerated as doctors.
Won't happen coz they are generally dense.
Won't happen coz they are generally dense.
My guess is that this is a move to bring fees/grants etc in line with regular students and is for that reason flawed.
Personally I'd say you should be able to do nursing with on the job NVQ training, and more senior posts require further education, which is supported by the employer, as like apprenticeships.
Most of us will have seen the situation whereby a graduate gets a job in industry and turns out to be either uninterested in working life or not cut out for the environment that they are now in despite being a very good academic. Would you want this type of person caring for you/your family?
On the upside it would go a long way to breaking the NHS public service culture which is the root of a lot of problems imo.
Personally I'd say you should be able to do nursing with on the job NVQ training, and more senior posts require further education, which is supported by the employer, as like apprenticeships.
Most of us will have seen the situation whereby a graduate gets a job in industry and turns out to be either uninterested in working life or not cut out for the environment that they are now in despite being a very good academic. Would you want this type of person caring for you/your family?
On the upside it would go a long way to breaking the NHS public service culture which is the root of a lot of problems imo.
On the upside it would go a long way to breaking the NHS public service culture which is the root of a lot of problems imo.
How do you mean jim?
How do you mean jim?
TIG - The NHS's biggest problem today is the historic culture that it has. Many staff consider it a right to be there, many staff are too busy looking out for themselves rather than providing a service. Many staff do not see the patient as a customer, and see them as a burden. I know it is not all, but is is widespread enough to be a big issue.
MY WIFE WAS A NHS SISTER - RECENTLY RETIRED EARLY - THROUGH CHOICE I MIGHT ADD AS SHE JOINED ME IN THIS FULL TIME ROLE :) - IN THE PAST 5 YEARS SHE SAW AN INCREASE IN DANGEROUS DEGREE QUALIFIED NURSES
- PARTICULARLY DEGREE QUALIFIED NURSES.
I AM NOT TRYING TO BE PROVOCATIVE HERE- JUST REPORTING THAT ITS BEEN HER EXPERIENCE AND THAT OF HER COLLEAGUES THAT A NURSING DEGREE IS A WASTE OF TIME FOR EXISTING NURSES AND TENDS TO BE A DISTINCT DANGER FOR THE YOUNGER , INEXPERIENCED NURSES.
AS OTHERS WERE GETTING DEGREES , SHE TOOK A DIPLOMA - THIS BEING THE FIRST HALF OF A DEGREE IN HER PARTICULAR FIELD - THIS AT THE AGE OF 45 - AND GOT A FIRST - SHE IS ADAMENT THAT THE DIPLOMA IS A LOAD OF C R AP - SO FAR REMOVED FROM THE NEEDS OF A NURSE THAT SHE REFUSED TO CONTINUE AND COMPLETE THE DEGREE. THE SECOND HALF OF THE DEGREE WOULD FOLLOW THE FIRST - I.E. LARGELY CENTRED ON A STUDY OF SOME DRY AND IRRELEVENT STUDY WHICH WOULD NEVER IMPACT ON HER ROLE OF BEING A NURSE OR RUNNING A BUSY COUPLE OF WARDS.
NURSES TODAY NEED TO BE NUMERATE AND LITERATE - FOR DRUGS - UNDERSTAND THE ROLE OF DRUGS BEING PRESCRIBED- CARING AND ATTENTIVE TO PATIENTS AND WILLING TO GET HANDS DIRTY AS REQUIRED. THEY DO NOT NEED A DEGREE- THEY DO NOT NEED TO HAVE A BELIEF THAT BEDPANS ARE BENEATH THEM (PUN NOTED)- THEY NEED MORE WARD- SERVED TIME - WITH ENCOURAGEMENT - AND ONE MORE THING:
WHEN A NURSE IS UNSUITABLE FOR A JOB - THEY NEED TO ACCEPT THE SITUATION- AS DO THE MANAGERS WHO MUST NOT SHY AWAY FROM REMOVING THEM- UNFORTUNATELY THE LATTER IS A BIG PROBLEM , SELDOM ADDRESSED- WITH ALL TOO OFTEN , DISASTEROUS CONSEQUENCES.
I'LL CLIMB OFF THE SOAPBOX NOW......
p.s. ongoing nurse training is too often lightweight , overdone and inapropriate: e.g. how about a 2 day massage training course- great for me and my back - s od all to do with her work - unless she was getting close to a doctor
- PARTICULARLY DEGREE QUALIFIED NURSES.
I AM NOT TRYING TO BE PROVOCATIVE HERE- JUST REPORTING THAT ITS BEEN HER EXPERIENCE AND THAT OF HER COLLEAGUES THAT A NURSING DEGREE IS A WASTE OF TIME FOR EXISTING NURSES AND TENDS TO BE A DISTINCT DANGER FOR THE YOUNGER , INEXPERIENCED NURSES.
AS OTHERS WERE GETTING DEGREES , SHE TOOK A DIPLOMA - THIS BEING THE FIRST HALF OF A DEGREE IN HER PARTICULAR FIELD - THIS AT THE AGE OF 45 - AND GOT A FIRST - SHE IS ADAMENT THAT THE DIPLOMA IS A LOAD OF C R AP - SO FAR REMOVED FROM THE NEEDS OF A NURSE THAT SHE REFUSED TO CONTINUE AND COMPLETE THE DEGREE. THE SECOND HALF OF THE DEGREE WOULD FOLLOW THE FIRST - I.E. LARGELY CENTRED ON A STUDY OF SOME DRY AND IRRELEVENT STUDY WHICH WOULD NEVER IMPACT ON HER ROLE OF BEING A NURSE OR RUNNING A BUSY COUPLE OF WARDS.
NURSES TODAY NEED TO BE NUMERATE AND LITERATE - FOR DRUGS - UNDERSTAND THE ROLE OF DRUGS BEING PRESCRIBED- CARING AND ATTENTIVE TO PATIENTS AND WILLING TO GET HANDS DIRTY AS REQUIRED. THEY DO NOT NEED A DEGREE- THEY DO NOT NEED TO HAVE A BELIEF THAT BEDPANS ARE BENEATH THEM (PUN NOTED)- THEY NEED MORE WARD- SERVED TIME - WITH ENCOURAGEMENT - AND ONE MORE THING:
WHEN A NURSE IS UNSUITABLE FOR A JOB - THEY NEED TO ACCEPT THE SITUATION- AS DO THE MANAGERS WHO MUST NOT SHY AWAY FROM REMOVING THEM- UNFORTUNATELY THE LATTER IS A BIG PROBLEM , SELDOM ADDRESSED- WITH ALL TOO OFTEN , DISASTEROUS CONSEQUENCES.
I'LL CLIMB OFF THE SOAPBOX NOW......
p.s. ongoing nurse training is too often lightweight , overdone and inapropriate: e.g. how about a 2 day massage training course- great for me and my back - s od all to do with her work - unless she was getting close to a doctor
I bet they can use caps lock though?
I gave up reading that tbh, but I think it alludes to what I was saying above. The answer is degree sponsored nurses studying part time alongside working practice, and grades of nurses open to degree and non degree.
I gave up reading that tbh, but I think it alludes to what I was saying above. The answer is degree sponsored nurses studying part time alongside working practice, and grades of nurses open to degree and non degree.
My son's G/F is doing a degree in nursing,a large part of which involves being on placement in different wards,so far she has been in surgical,medical & heart wards each for 6 week stints working the same hours as a nurse and she is only in her 2nd year.I have spent quite a lot of time in hospital in recent years and I haven't noticed much difference in the care from ones with degrees and ones without degrees but surely as in any profession the better qualified you are,the better you will get on,it might not make you a better nurse in many aspects of the job but I think it should help.
Post Your Reply
Please login to post a reply.
Wonder
Instance ID: 13539