A King, D Pipe, P Hobbs, C Tizzard et al gone missing at Cheltenham (again)

Hobbs have been running ok, King not had many but his nags in decent form in general.
Tizzard not so much

Well done Philip Hobbs. About time to.

The might of Closutton is only slightly better despite their firepower and resources.

It's been said on here for a while but David Pipe doesn't half have his share of absolute dogs. Ears back from the start, headgear, you know the type.

He gets financial backing from his main owners and yet still v few horses of note. His dad must've been a genius.

Tizzard: "A few had dirty noses at home..."

I still think if the likes of Hendo, Nicholls,King and Hobbs had a horse good enough,they would not stop it from realising its potential.
If an experienced trainer has a good one they would know what to do.
Take Gary Moore,he don't get many top ones,but when he gets one they tend to do well.
He certainly got the best out of SDG a few years back,and Goshen was hacking up the other day,and will be a Champion Hurdle main contender.

Mullins and Elliott are ahead though...…...no doubt.

basically mullins elliott and hendo are better trainers ,i would add nicholls and  bromhead  to that list , and they are the 5 who if i was considering backing one ante post these 5 wouldnt give me the slightest concern of having one 100% ready and able on the day at the festival ,and any of these 5 would be a positive .

Foyles .....cant agree on that one. Especially after the queen mother. Generally i dont think any of them can allow for a racehorse getting cast in his box the nightbefore, treading on a stone getting out the horsebox at Cheltenham or not getting their ground on the day. Factoring those variables into the odds should give you more than a slight concern.

can see where you are coming from irishone ,with my approach i will get more than my share of non runners etc especially with the jumpers but i only need 1 or 2 to come in and i am well in profit.

same again

At least an early finish will have prevented horses that might have had a virus on them from running at Aintree or Punchestown and a summer outdoors should put them right for the autumn.

None of the 4 trainers mentioned in your opening post have really got going yet in the new season. King 0-9, Hobbs 2 from 12 but many running poorly, Tizzard 2-11 ditto and Pipe 2-20. It might be because they didn't really prepare many for the July/August period. I always follow Hobbs in September as he seems to get his better quality horses ready a bit earlier than most.

I would not agree with that sweeping statement but there must be a big problem in the yard at the moment. You only have to watch the horses to see that. They are running well until coming under pressure and then they stop to nothing. Classic sign of a virus infection. Tizzards are running OK but he is not running any young horses yet. Alan King is also making a very slow start.

Philip knows more about the game than the vast majority of trainers, as did Bruce,  if you dont get the ammo you dont get the recognition , joseph and donnacha know feck all compared to him but they get the ammo. Philip can do better with a poor horse than them, they get rid of them out the door.Aiden doesnt bother with them either. At least Philip has a go.I

which of course guaranteed that he would win the next race!

I normally wait until the Wednesday or Thursday of the Festival to resurrect this thread but have decided on a break with tradition.

I'm expecting Skelton to vie with Henderson as top British trainer in 2021.  Having taken the decision to pursue quality and big money owners Skelton appears to have been rewarded with an exceptionally strong team to go to war with at the 2021 Festival. Roksana, Allmankind, Nube Negra and Third Time Lucki represent their best chances but the likes of Alnadum, Cabot Cliffs, Elle Est Belle, Not That Fuisse and Spiritofthegames shouldn't be discounted.

Nicholls also has a stronger team than he's fielded in recent years with Bravemansgame the flag bearer. Houx Gris, Hell Red, Next Destination, Southfield Harvest, Storm Arising, Shantou Flyer, Barbados Bucks and Threeunderthrufive will all have their supporters.

Hobbs, Pipe, Jonjo, Tizzard and King will do well to have one winner between them which would be in line with recent Festival trends.

Pipe's horses are in good form and it would be great to see Remastered, Brinkley, Umbrigado, Adagio and Leoncavallo run well for the Pipe team next week.

King has the Triumph favourite (Tritonic) and The Glancing Queen (Mares Novice Hurdle) but that's about it although I hope Sceau Royal and Her Indoors run better than their odds suggest they will.

Tizzard's horses have disappointed for the last 12 months and Hobbs doesn't seem to have any ammunition to fire at the Festival - now that Thyme Hill is a non starter - other than Sporting John in the RSA.

Harry Fry's form is as bad as Tizzard's but I hope Metier runs well in the Supreme. I also hope that we see some breakthrough Festival performances from the likes of Fergal O'Brien (Imperial Alcazar and Alaphilippe) and Kerry Lee (Storm Control, Happy Diva and Ballybegg).

I think the Brits will do better than current Prestbury Cup odds suggest they will (9/2) but Mullins should be top trainer by a comfortable margin with Henry De Bromhead and Elliott/Sleepy/Dopey/Sneezy trailing in his wake.

I should add that Kim Bailey is fielding a small but select team and I expect him to secure as many winners as the combined total  of Pipe, Tizzard, Jonjo and Hobbs.

I find it interesting thread mostly because all the top horses are in 3 barns in Ireland, so using comparable data on how good trainers are just isn’t feasible and hasn’t been for a number of years so is an unfair comparison, also when the Irish horses have 10 lbs in hand from the handicapper in handicaps and these trainers are buying all the top lots at the sales to send to these 3 trainers leaves little for other trainers and inferior stock for them to train

Look at cheveley park stud they have bought all the top lots as have robcour and gigginstown in recent times and these horses only go to these 3 trainers so obviously if these trainers have all the top buys, they are obviously the far better trainers and will win the big races, it’s just the way it is, so your argument cash is flawed in many ways when trying to beat these trainers with a stick.

Also if these 3 trainers have a barn full of the top horses it makes it easy for them to handicap there lesser horses...I find this season interesting considering how many of Mullins batllion he has actually broken, similar to Joseph O’Brien the up and coming trainer who was given a load from gigginstown and McManus last season, that we haven’t seen this season, so all injured and broken

They are fancied because they have good recent form harry! Who would have mentioned Kim Bailey without the improved form of many of his horses such as Feel Free? In contrast, this time last year. Olly Murphy and Colin Tizzard had a a lot of well fancied runners. Most of those horses are still there but clearly running at a stone worse than then. That is almost certainly due to the relative health of the yards. I think it can be a regional and climatic thing. Somerset and Dorset was the place to be for a few years but many of those yards are under a cloud. Now the area north of Cheltenham is back in the big time with Bailey, J. O'Neill, V Williams, Fergal, Skelton all having a very good run. I'm sure many will say it is coincidence but I am not so sure. The sad fact is that there will probably be zero winners from north of Manchester in GB. Too cold to train jumpers?