Douvan

Very impressive horse. Would take care of L'Ami Serge to name but one no problem imo.

9/4 is truly sickening after beating these horses...yes impressive but didn't see the reason for a full scale price cut myself for beating these particular horses

Supreme seems obvious. I wonder whether they might go down the neptune route. It's has been the preferred path for future champion hurdle types like peddlers cross, the new one and obviously faugheen.  He's only 5, so they have time. Wherever they go, he looks real smart. Couldn't have done it any better.

Only had it on in the background (and not watched the replay yet) but on first viewing he jumped really well. Obviously won in good style but I was pretty taken with his hurdling. Can understand why he's 3/1, struggle to see what beats him at this stage.

Not that I'm backing him antepost.

Jumped and travelled well but not sure what the form is worth. 2nd was behind Black Hercules in a bog at Cork last time over 3 miles. Still, you can only beat what's in front of you.

mullins has also got Alvisio Ville owned by jp so wouldnt be shocked to see him go for the neptune

In a substandard looking Supreme at this stage, I thought 4/1 after the race was a big price and took some. His hurdling was electric and he was very good all round. Would have concerns that he may go to the Neptune but given he's trod the same path as Vautour, I think today's performance will have confirmed to them that the Supreme is the race.

PP 10/1 for the Neptune is stonking insurance though.

agree,if you back him for the supreme its got to worth a saver on the neptune

Out of interest, genuine question....if this horse was trained by say, Donald McCain what price do you think he would be for the Supreme?

I would say 10s

That's impossible to have an opinion on really isn't it...

One thing I did notice today (and it could well be completely meaningless) was Mullins saying he was suited to going right handed...

Howdi the horse has raced twice and won we'll both starts over in Ireland with ease form of the first win is looking good at min in my eyes and this lot he beat today might not be up to much but was the manner he done it if u think he should be double or treble the price of lami id be happy to play if u stick the lay up at 10s

We all know if he was with a diff trainer he might be a bit bigger price but that's stupid talk as he's with one of the best trainers around for horses that's why the blokes got sheds of horses with him I wouldn't give mc Cain my puppy to train

Puppy lol but you are right,Douvan is a short price but apart from Henderson beast not too much to beat at moment.

Reckon he maybe PP money back special on 1st day?

supreme a horrible betting race atm. douvan looks good. very short now tho, my tent or yours was a similar price after winning betfair off 149

slash. • January 10, 2015 7:09 PM GMT
Howdi the horse has raced twice and won we'll both starts over in Ireland with ease form of the first win is looking good at min in my eyes and this lot he beat today might not be up to much but was the manner he done it if u think he should be double or treble the price of lami id be happy to play if u stick the lay up at 10s

^^^ WHY DO PEOPLE ALWAYS TWIST WHAT YOU ASK

Benjy • January 10, 2015 7:02 PM GMT
That's impossible to have an opinion on really isn't it...

One thing I did notice today (and it could well be completely meaningless) was Mullins saying he was suited to going right handed...,,IS IT?

Yea, how many of McCains are (expensive) imports from France that win Irish grade 2s on the bridle... It's not a comparison you can make tbh, it's a throw away statement. Being trained by one of the best trainers around at the moment, who has won the race the last two years (for the same owner) and has made no secret that they rate this beast is of course factored into his price and quite rightly so.

If he had different connections and ran in different races what price he would be is anyone's guess..

Stupid question howdi simple as that im on at nice price and happy he won with ease today and don't think it would reflect much on his price who ever trained it how's that a better answer for you

^^^ Thanks for that ill thought out response slash.

my point benjy he cant be a 3-1 on what we have seen to the naked eye, although well done if you are on at good prices. but to come on and say 'stupid question simple as that' smacks of someone who perhaps isn't the brightest

I'm not on at any price lad.

I do think it's an impossible question to answer though... maybe you'd have been better picking an Irish trainer rather than McCain.

maybe it is pal but it was brought up in debate today on twitter today and i thought it worthy of debate. Mullins horses are generally too short but when you see his strike rate I can see why bookies keep him onside. But I feel we are now looking out for mullins horses and to be fair Douvan wasn't as heavily touted as some at the start of the season. He has run beautifully in his races to date but on the basis of what he has beaten 3-1 looks mighty short to my eye. Hoever, I take a previous point on board that there may not be a dirge of depth to the race.

who do we think is certain to run in supreme?

i noticed he'd shortened for the other race he's fav for neptune on here, or was earlier ! although market suggests supreme

He's achieved exactly the same as Vautour same time last year and he was about 8/1 - 10/1 now. The horse he beat today lost to black Hercules over 3m last time by 2.5l.

The issue with have this year is a) lack of depth to the race and b) bookies / layers being incredibly wary of mullins.

It's a strange situation. I don't think for a million years that he deserves to be a general 5/2 shot but I wouldn't want to be laying him either.

I haven't backed him (backed Allez Colombieres @ 16/1 RIP) but do have Alvisio Ville @ 25/1 so that may well be my only live runner come the day.

It's been a difficult one to back Douvan at very tasty prices due to the shadow of AC earlier in the season despite all the signs being there and mullins calling him a machine after his debut

Aye, the lack of any sort of opposition is the reason he is so short.

Although he's not beaten much today, he's actually won a grade 2 novice (won by last seasons Supreme winner) in ridiculously comfortable fashion (which again goes to show the lack of opposition).

I can fully understand why he is 3/1 here. If the race was today and the top 15 in the market on here turned up. I'd be smashing the 3s

i like hendo's horse but the way hendo's are going he should be 4s to get to the race

I think that's a very valid point - if he's 3's on the day id smash right into it. I guess the issue here is that here's zero value in the price in terms of him turning up on the day

he reminded me of dunguig today

dunguib (way he traveled)

Certainly jumps better than Dunguib.

Surprised Mullins said that he will go straight to the festival now.

stevo1
Reckon he maybe PP money back special on 1st day?

I was thinking the same. But they could do Faugheen or Un Des Sceaux instead.

Walsh said: "He did it very well. He traveled well, he jumped super. They were probably stayers he beat but they're decent enough horses, it was a good performance. He has the size and scope to be a beautiful horse next year - when he fills into his frame, he'll be some horse.


"He was very professional with his jumping and travelled beautifully, settled lovely, quickened up the little bit when he had to - it was hard to knock it. He's a very good horse, I'd say you could go any trip with him, two, two and a half - I doubt you'd have to go the Albert Bartlett but either of the other two (Supreme and Neptune) wouldn't bother me."

^ I read that today, interesting.

Everyone seems to think he's heading for the Supreme, I'm not sold on that yet.

Jan 11, 2015 -- 9:06AM, CVByrne wrote:

stevo1Reckon he maybe PP money back special on 1st day?I was thinking the same. But they could do Faugheen or Un Des Sceaux instead.

Hope they do Faugheen.

While keeping your options open is sensible I don't like that Mullins hasn't nominated a target. If he's going straight to the festival then why wouldn't it be the Supreme?

I agree gi mac, essentialy he,s beat stayers over the minimum trip, like he,s supposed to...

His races thus far all at 2m,if hes going straight there it all smacks of the Supreme.
Stiil jockey says he will be fine over further, so not done and dusted yet.....may depend on their others chances,like AV and TUM.

nobody likes it Benjy, i'ts a pain, but that's him.

The question I ask myself is "Why would it be the Supreme?"

He has got a few bullets to fire at that race, and the only two "likely" sorts for the Neptune are Shaneshill & Tell Us More, and both of those have fluffed their lines, and he's since talked about dropping TUM back in trip.

Cos all his forms at 2m,is a fair answer Mac.

But like I say and you have said as well,others in the yard may well determine what race.

Gonna run and run for a while me thinks.

indeed, we won't know until declaration time.

I haven't watched the mullins interview on ATR yet - is that where he says Douvan isn't having another run and going straight to chelt?

Said they are thinking about going straight there now,but did mention the possibility of running in the Deloitte.

Who knows??

While he beat stayers yesterday, it's worth remembering he beat a grade 1 winning 2 miler just as easy the time before.

Gi Mac, I think you could be right with the other bullets. I guess if one of them suitably impresses beforehand they could target the Neptune with Douvan. I think they'd want to see something really impressive from one of the others though to not go Supreme with Douvan.

I read it in The Irishfield.

Cheers both

Gi Mac, and he's since talked about dropping TUM back in trip.

I read it differently, I read it that he was NOT going to drop TUM back in trip


What other bullets has Mullins got for the supreme please?

CVByrne 09 Jan 15 20:25 Joined: 14 Mar 06 | Topic/replies: 4,365 | Blogger: CVByrne's blog
Mullins basically said he won't go back in Trip in his RP column. His run was good and maybe he and Free Expression slit eachothers throat a bit and Mckinley who had improved at home got them


Apologies to cv for copying this from the TUM thread but it the bold says to me hes not dropping back in trip! It's the wording that is used here, if it had 'He wont go back UP in trip' it would mean to me he may well run over 2 miles again but it doesn't use the up word at all, just, wont go BACK in trip so from 2.5 miles back to 2 miles

I honestly believe mullins and Walsh enjoy all this he could go up in trip,he might drop back Shiite,they would make good politicians,they will no barring injury where the horses are going,they just don't want us peasants to know !

STS
Mullins has Alvisio Ville and Nicholls Canyon that figure in the betting,AV 3rd fav I believe.

Yes cuf, and they seem to enjoy it.

Douvan - Ricci

Alvisio Ville - J.P

Nichols Canyon - Graham Wylie

Tell us More - Gigginstown

All one trainer but i think the key thing here is all different owners unlike in other years. I am confident it will be the supreme for Douvan and Ruby will ride as Mccoy could be on AV who knows who GW could use lol brain freeze

heres where I read the quote about going back in trip Seathestars RE TUM

http://www.racingpost.com/horses/horse_home.sd?horse_id=850451#topHorseTabs=horse_stories&bottomHorseTabs=horse_form

GI MAC - Mullins column from Saturday is more recent where he said TUM basically staying at two and a half.

I think the decision still has to be made re Shaneshill & Douvan in Supreme / Neptune.

OK, thanks.

Lydia Hislop has both Douvan and L'Ami Serge at 12/1 for the Supreme in her portfolio on the SportingLife website - class girl she is.

If he goes there without another run he'll be a cracking lay.

I noticed that Unclupuncle good little weekly read that.

He visibly looks very good indeed, but if you're not already on then he's too short now. Looks a hell of a chasing prospect though.

Joined:
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| Topic/replies: 3,228 | Blogger: unclepuncle's blog
Lydia Hislop has both Douvan and L'Ami Serge at 12/1 for the Supreme in her portfolio on the SportingLife website - class girl she is.Love

Fat girl she is....obviously like her tucker!

Bookies are running scared of another Ricci horse popping out in front and making all yet again.....could well happen but Christ he's short enough at this stage

I'd personally doubt whether some of these hot pots like Douvan, Silvy and Peace And Co will be any shorter on the day and would imagine there's every chance you may get slightly bigger. Why give yourself ulcers for the next couple of months checking The Racing Post to see whether he's stood on a stone, been struck by lightening, may go for another race or indeed gets beaten and have your dreams turn to ash in your mouth?

Ante post has become one big rake which gets bigger the closer you get but whilt they have to put prices up above every race nobody needs to get involved unless it suits.

People should hold off backing the real shorties at this stage especially with two months to go.

Presumably the reason he is so short
is that Ruby says he has more gears than Vautour

Still very short price

Ruby was very complimentary which is a bit worrying because they usually play their cards close to their chest.

FFS, the ricci crew are becoming the ballydoyle of the NH seen. Vautour was supposed to be the second coming now Douvan apprently has more gears.

*scene

Haha, good shout that Sint

Add to that ^ before he sadly lost his life, Allez Colombieres was the next best big thing, no mention of Douvan before then.

jockeys and trainers say things like this all the time when forced to compare with previous horses they've ridden. douvans got an awful lot to do and is a horrendous price.

Dont think we need 2 threads on same horse?

Add Douvan comments on this thread,few -ickheads on other one!

Mullins said today that Douvan is very similar to Mikael D'hagueneut and Five for three.

“I would’ve said Douvan has similar qualities to Mikael D’Haguenet and Fiveforthree, so he could be one for the Neptune,” says Mullins, slowly, pondering his battle plan.

“We will see. Tell Us More is possibly a Neptune horse or maybe an Albert Bartlett horse. A lot will depend on what they do over Christmas and just after. We’ll enter them in every race and nearer the day we’ll sort them out.

Few days after pinnochio said that, supreme bets were struck on douvan.

Mr E - that quotation comes from 17th Dec

Oh sorry.

No worries. Someone is trying to create rumours on Twitter. I was taken in too.

We're them comments before allez columbieres died,maybe an afterthought this horse going for supreme !

According to Mullins today re Supreme in R-Post,Douvan all well Supreme remains the plan.
Well have other runners but ive no idea yet who they'll be.
Nichols Canyon looked a Neptune horse when he won yesterday,but im not ruling out the shorter race for him.
Shaneshill might have another run before we finalise plans for him.
Alvisio Ville lack of experience plus racing quite keenly didn't help him yesterday.
He was fine this morning and well wait and see what his festival target might be.
All as clear as mud.

Is Douvan best priced at present 2/1 in place, the worst ante-post fav at moment?

Looks like Douvan,Shaneshill and Alvisio Ville for Supreme at moment for Mullins.
Tell Us More vibes not good,looks like wont make it over?

Free bet Paddys in Supreme up to £50 if Douvan wins.
Get on Lami Serge, Henderson due change of luck in race,
had loads of placed horses last few seasons.

Not long now for the opener,is Douvan a back or lay at current prices is a lay.
Have built a good back against him,with fallback of having Douvan in doubles in case.
Who is going to beat this so called good thing? Never won left handed and only on soft ground
against stayers.

No-one good horse,Lami Serge had poor run thru race,can be rated much higher.
Would have been 2nd but for all the interference he suffered.

Goes chasing? Think he could win Champion Hurdle, thoughts?

I was a big Faugheen fan, although thought he was pretty ordinary at Cheltenham in a race where his main rivals ran below par.

Think if Douvan stayed over hurdles, he'd be even better than Faugheen. He just looks a monster. Incredibly high cruising speed, superb turn of foot, jumps foot perfect.

Willie Mullins knows how good he is too - if he takes to fences, he could be a freak.

These 'freaks' seem to be coming along fairly regularly for WPM nowadays, perhaps we should stop calling them freaks? Mullins like Pipe before him is obviously working some kind of oracle.

Thunder most of Faugheen's rivals in all his races have run below par - a bit of a coincidence if you get my drift. And if they ran this years CH 10 times he probably would win the other 9 even more easily.

its easy to forget the machine who's a 3 mile point to pointer with a turbo turn of foot installed by mother nature. Douvan barely could get away from Shaneshill at Cheltenham going to the last. Compare that with how Faugheen separated himself in this year CH from the best 2 milers of the last years and the `suberb turn of foot` has a new meaning. He's been unbeaten despite his jumping frailties, not thanks to them. Who's the real freak I wonder...

interesting looking at timeform's rating they only have 3 pounds between them!

They also have Arctic Fire 3 lbs short(168) of Faugheen(171)... think that they're a bit off but who cares.. Looks to me that Peace and Co(161) is a far more dangerous opponent next season than Douvan could ever be. That if Faugheen remains over hurdles.. never say never maybe RR/Mullins will want to do racing a huge favour and test him over fences who knows..

Going by recent years, I think it's safe to assume Ricci will be more than happy for Faugheen to defend his Champion Hurdle crown. They've always spoke about Vautour being a stayer and Ruby has always said he is a Gold Cup horse. If he doesn't stay, there's always the Ryanair or Champion Chase. Djakadam will have learned plenty from his superb Gold Cup run this year and I imagine he will be back for another crack at it next year. In my opinion and assuming they all get there in one piece ...

Arkle - Douvan (many feel he could be a Champion Hurdle contender, I wouldnt disagree with this, however they've already said they'll go chasing with him next year. The only reason Vautour ran in this years JLT and not the Arkle was to sidestep Un De Sceaux. There's nothing of Un De Sceaux's ability getting in the way and I can't see them not going the Arkle route with this horse)

Champion Hurdle - Faugheen (as much as people want to see him jump a fence it won't happen, not any time soon anyway. He will be back to defend his crown and rightly so)

Champion Chase - Un De Sceaux (won't be backing him, nor will I be taking him on but he's all but certain to take advantage of a race lacking in depth)

Gold Cup - Vautour, Djakadam and Don Poli

Annie Power - she's received her last penny from me after "that fall" done me out of a small fortune. Chances are she's Mares Hurdle bound again (boring), however with More Of That likely to be campaigned over fences on his return, the staying hurdler division also looks lacking in depth and they could be tempted).

Just reading back last year's comments - lot of doubts about the Mullins team rating Douvan so highly - before the festival. Good calls from Paterson92 re race targets. Hope you got on all these then, mate,

Douvan is what's known as a 'CSFAS' in The Arkle.

'CSFAS' = Could Stop For A Sh*t'.