Do you think Sprinter Sacre will comeback to what he was?

By the way I sell Knitting Yarn

Having read in this thread that SS had bled during the race while giving a routine p!$$ sample i am inclined to think the SS of old has resided to the history books i am afraid. I so wanted him to be back to his best today, well my heart did, my pocket was thinking other things but thats another story!

Ok vet says that he only bled as much as a lot of horses would do during a race and wasn't much at all and quite normal etc etc, but, he wasnt given a hard time at all.

I fully expect this seasons QMCC to be between Champagne fever, Dodging Bullets and Al Ferof. But lets see what SDG does next weekend, but again, am not expecting fireworks as he is another back from a bad injury

I realise by saying above i am in the minority. Probably the only person in the country saying it

Just trying to be as realistic as possible however

For my eyes, DB got away from SS today from 2 out to the last, BG wasn't hard on SS and any other race and he would have been called into the stewards room for the non triers rule but its that bled thing. Happy with my 7/2 SS 12/1 DB though at mo

12/1 Looks a cracking bet now STS.Wish i had some of that.I can let this race pass with no bet but a short price on the day about SS could tempt me to lay him
DB looked strong today,got to give him credit he is a much improved horse
I

wellchief

Just to put another perspective on this and hypothetically speaking.  If Dodging Bullets who is definitely improving had not been in this race and the result was 1st Sprinter Sacre 5 lengths in front of Twinlight (G1 winner last time) and a further 7 lengths back to Somersby (btn 2 Lengths behind DB in G1 last time).  Would there have been any gloom as there appears to be now.

Having digested the race, a race fit at the top of his game Dodging Bullets has beaten a tenderly ridden Sprinter. They had to get a run into him and had no intention of giving him a hard race no matter what the outcome.  Bring on the QMCC.

My view exactly shocks. A hard driven, ridden all the way to the line Tingle Creek winner beats a tentatively ridden Sprinter by 3 lengths in his come back run after 14 months off.

Yet some big up Dodging Bullets and write off Sprinter? So anyone who has got to within 2 lengths of DB has a chance in the QM, but anyone beaten 3 lengths or more might as well not turn up?

totally agree

love the way he travelled, shame he lost but great effort after so long and what he's been through

DB might beat SS by more in the QM

One thing that does put me off is DB does not like Cheltenham. The couple times hes ran there hes looked likely winner at top of hill but for some reason as soon as he hits the climb theres nothing there. Though he is improving.

That has to be a worry for anyone backing him now at the shorter price.

Wellchief....fire into Twitter my son go to @thecollectorpro...just the 4 winners out of 8 today at 11/2 11/4 14/1 and 4/1.how did you get on today??

By the way you missed out Douvan 6s Supreme Shaneshill 10s Neptune Tell Us More 20s Neptune C Fever NRNB 10/1 C Chase

As ive said for a month or so anyone who backed Sacre at 9/4 for C Chae is simply stupid

Here well chief you forgot Black Hercules 10/1 Albert Bartlett but while we are in the choose what we feel to do mode how are these getting on -


Simonsig - Any Race - 7/1
Irving - Champion Hurdle - 33/1
Vaniteux - Champion Hurdle - 33/1
Morning Assessmbly - Gold Cup - 50/1
Ma Feuille - Gold Cup - 33/1
Diakali - World Hurdle - 45/1

sounds like the bookies love both of you....

How can the bookies love someone that bangs in winners at 14/1 11/4 4/1 11/2 from 8 bets??

Judge the ante post after the event please.Youre the man that's gung ho on Al Ferof for Champ Chase.we will come back to that March 11th....

jeeesus I was just jesting



and im not gung ho on AF, its not a race I get heavily involved in tbh, only had a small bet as AF is my cliff horse and very profitable he has been

The thing is though Collector, I don't come on here insulting people for putting up an opinion, and then blowing smoke up my own ass when I have a winner.

I freely admitted I put them on and have written them off, but you can't come on here with a holyer than thou attitude like your sh!t don't stink.

If you read that thread you'd see the last three in the list were all less than a fiver each.  The 6 horses you mention account for around 10% of my entire book.

The ones I've mentioned in yours account are for £360, plus you've got Allez Colombieres (£150), Shaneshill for the Albert Bartlett (£50) and Vautour Arkle (£180), Tell Us More for the Albert Bartlett (£50).  So you've potentially got £790 of non runner money already there, so unless you've got £8k on for Cheltenham, you've got a bigger chunk of money down the drain than me.

Then you mention you've got Black Hercules at 10/1 - same price as now, Shaneshill at 10/1 - same price as now, and Champagne Fever at 10/1 - only 2 points shorter now.  But actually because you've got Douvan at 6's, all is forgiven.

bally I mean the collector, I have  £4 captain chris GC bet down the drain if it makes you feel better

So you have written off 790 quid already yes?the only ones def written off are Allez Supreme Tell AB and Shanes AB....as you may also have read...a month ago or do I said on that thread I can't be bothered putting on any more ante post bets cos who listens who cares (and quite rightly so) and who believes..listen well chief best of luck with your selections its neither here nor there to me who does well or not. Just stated my point over S Sacre and I believe been proved right at this point in time.this horse is not what he was and the fact that D Bullets has beaten it-who was well behind C Fever in Arkle- well who knows what could happen.....

By the way on the 14/1 11/4 11/2 and 4/1 winners today i only had a pound on each

Alleged I'll get yer 4 quid back....just follow me oh and on Al Ferof id erm rather **** in my hands and clap than back this for the C Chase

Good inni? how much you got on Al Ferof?

Here Alleged whatever it is treble that and put it on Douvan in the Supreme

no thanks

No bother son best of luck

Dear oh dear!!!

No other result could have left us with so many unanswered questions. But let's look on the positive side - providing the 'bleed' is nothing to worry about and he gets to Cheltenham in good shape, I still believe. Come on Sprinter.

He's one with a chance,probably more chance than most,but it's open now,and good I say.
It's become a race we can have a good look at now without a real short priced fav,can only be a good thing imo.

Yeah, wide open race and plenty with chances. Sprinter is now the same price he was before the season started, and that was on the basis of a fully fit Sire de Grugy, so I do think he is a bit of value.

We've seen he's well in himself and last years winner hasn't been seen and the Arkle winner is injured.

Dodging Bullets does deserve respect though, he seems a different horse this year.

bring the house down if he won at cheltenham.

I was one of the doom merchants this morning,but I thought the horse travelled like a dream,did jump slightly left,but over a furlong less on good ground he could still win,dodging bullets won't get within 3 length of champagne fever so sprinter will have to improve,the only downside,there was an awful lot of money on him today so I suspect they thought they had him spot on,but if he turns up he has a good a chance as owt else !

The money said he was expected today and failed. One look at Hendo in winners enclosure said plenty

agree with chief I had Bullets down as a bit of a rouge but kings horse interests me for this race and has all season.

the one which is worth 150 points at scrabble.

Looked really fit,jumped nowhere near as good as he has in the past and found little under pressure. He has to improve a lot to win in March imo,he may of course,but gut feeling is he won't,he just simply don't look anywhere near the same horse.

its interesting bud lots of differing opinions . One thing to hold on to Denman's first run back was a shocker and month or so later ran brilliantly in Gold Cup.

Yeh I like him Howdi,have to ignore his last run,and I am!

Uxizandre I mean!!

Gave Bullets a right good hiding .

Yeh Denman ran well,but not as good as he did when he won the gold cup mate.

i AM ABOUT TO PLACE MY FIRST BET ON FOR CHELTENHAM AND ITS ONE I DONT WANT TO.....................SIRE DU GRUGY.

Possibly Budd although he was beaten by an all time great.

Problem Uxizandre will have is other front runners,be much better if he was allowed to dictate.

wonder if sprinter finished 3rd/4th in champion chase they would retire him?

I do worry a bit about the form / quality of last year's JLT though.

TDS hasn't been the same this year (Martin Broughton did suggest something amiss with his bloods though), Uxizandre won 1 race out of novice company,  Double Ross yet to win this season, Felix Yonger and Wonderful Charm have only won once, and I think all the rest haven't won a single race between them.

That said, if you ignore his last run, Uxizandre could outrun his price, but need to back NRNB because of the Ryanair issue.

good point

Im no fan of the JLT

Gonna be a good race this year my friend

GOD I LOVE THIS SPORT AT THIS TIME OF YEAR

Also, for those clinging on to Champagne Fever's festival form and ignoring all the rest, then you have to do that with Al Ferof too.

Both ran a great race in the Champion Bumper, and their Supreme's were probably equal in quality.  OK, Champagne Fever's produced a Champion Hurlde winner and runner up, but Alf's produced a multiple QMCC winner, a Ryanair winner and Spirit Son is one of the unluckiest horses ever.

Alf has also won a Paddy Power off 159.

CF went a lot closer in an Arkle, but when you compare the two Arkles, you couldn't get two that are more different in terms of quality.  Alf hit a fence, so although there's no way he would have won, the finishing margin between him and the winner is not realistic.

Last year Alf was returning from injury, and was found to be a sick horse yet wasn't disgraced in the Ryanair.  This year, he looks bang on form again.  He's actually rated 6 pounds higher than Champagne Fever as well.

For the record, I was considering backing CF recently, but never did, and glad I never did after today; but if you back one based on the Festival/Cheltenham record, you have to consider the other too.

Where are all the Sacre fans who took 9/4 by the way??

WHO WAS THE MULTIPLE QMCC WINNER?

There's me thinking Sprinter had won it twice!  Foot in mouth time

I love a aman who can hold his hands up

I think the point is both supremes were high quality, it then depends how much you want to pick the bones out of them.....

i think we know the point alleged

Not a history question lol who took 9/4 for the 2015 C Chase?hands up all

not guilty

I took 4/1 (antepost rules) with Paddy Power and 11/4 NRNB Betfair Sportsbook.

Still pretty happy with my position.

You can get a bet on with Betfair Sportsbook and paddy power?**** me man....harder to beat The Cube

*than The Cube

Just watched it back and I'm certain SS will beat DB next time out - he travelled all over him up until the turn got home when he probably blew up.

Whether beating DB will be enough to win the CC or not is another question though I do find the love for Champagne Fever to be quite strange - horse has won over 2.4m this year, came 4th in the King George and tipped up last time. Doesn't scream CC winner and I'm pretty sure the record of backing last time fallers at the fest would leave you very poor.

I'm sure most of us have read the Timeform article this week about horses coming back from a layoff and this is the section I'm taking the most from:

"Interestingly, with the Clarence House Chase on Saturday in mind, the first-time-out record (following a significant lay-off) of elite horses is the worst of any band judged on RTF percentages, yet they have the biggest share (18.5%) of full-scale recoveries once back on track. One example of high relevance is the mighty Denman, who, like Sprinter Sacre, was diagnosed with a heart condition which prompted a lengthy recess, 330 days in his case. His comeback at Kempton, when beaten at odds-on, was flat to say the least, but only a month later he roared back to finish second to Kauto Star in the Gold Cup, and his pinnacle was still to come, winning the Hennessy under top-weight on his reappearance the following season."

Denman never won at the festival again after his problem

true but little harsh he ran some blinders

Amazing horse deserved to win more than one Gold Cup.

he won that brutal hennessy...off a mere 174...

i was there that day brought the house down #legend the tank

#the tank

Loved the tank me.was there when he won his 2nd Hennessey.loved him.proper trainer an'all.no fannyin around with Mr Nicholls

Hand up here for 3/1 at start of season, 9/4 nrnb and a bit of arbing on here.

Overall position is still ok, would have preferred a victory cruise though!

Henderson and Geraghty interviews http://www.racinguk.com/news/article/32578/henderson-it-was-a-great-performance

I would be going 3/1 each of three, SDG, SS and DB. 16/1 bar. I don't believe that Sprinter was far short of fitness yesterday as they have been saying he was nearly ready for a while and he did have a racecourse gallop. I think that DB is at least 12lb better than last year while SS has probably gone back 12lb-hence the result yesterday. SDG was half way between them on last years form and would need to be right back to his best to beat either of the other 2.

No doubt Dodging Bullets has improved. A lot of Champagne Fever backers are assuming because he had DB behind in the Arkle he will have him behind in the Queen Mum.

I wouldn't be so sure. Someone mentioned Finians/Captain Chris and that's a really good example.

Sprinter Sacre was found to be have suffered a small bleed after the race, but after consultation with vets at the racecourse, Henderson was left feeling more relaxed and some 18 hours after the race, he declared himself satisfied with the condition of his star two-miler.

"Most importantly he's fine this morning. He's been out and looked very perky. He was great, he trotted up, was very bouncy and full of it. I think it's safe to say he enjoyed himself," the Seven Barrows handler told At The Races.

"He's sound and his legs are good. He ate up and did all the right things. No damage done which is always a relief.

"It was great to see him out and everyone was pleased with what he did."

Asked about the post-race bleeding, Henderson admitted: "We'd have preferred it not to have happened. There was a show of blood in his nostrils when he was being routine tested and we scoped him after that.

"We don't want to see it. It's not ideal, but on the scope there, the significance of the score didn't seem to be too dramatic. It was probably acceptable.

"There was no mucus which was important - there was quite a bit of Ascot racecourse [ie mud in the scope], which there always will be with kickback and mud flying.

"They are bound to have a little bit, all sorts of things get breathed in as you can imagine, and there was a bit of blood there.

"I think we can accept that. It didn't affect him or his performance.

"We did weigh him and it depends how far you go back with his weight, but he was comparative to where he has been in the past. He was more than 80% fit - you can't come into a Grade One less fit than that - but there is bound to be improvement.

"He didn't blow up as such, but what he did do was get tired. The legs are going to get tired.

"They set a searching gallop yesterday and went out to test his fitness. That is perfectly fair game. AP went a good gallop there [on Somersby]. I'm not a great stopwatch man but the time was respectable - I'm not surprised, they went a good gallop and they are good horses.

"There is more to come and there is improvement. We weren't pretending he was back to his very best.

"In the autumn we knew he wasn't, but gradually it's been coming.

"You've got to let a horse find his best form. It's a work in progress, if you like. He's been pleasing us. He's gradually progressed, progressed, progressed.

"Newbury (where he worked last month) was a huge step forward and yesterday was another one."

While Sprinter Sacre will not run again before the Betway Queen Mother Champion Chase on March 11, Henderson has not ruled out giving him a racecourse gallop.

"There is no other race he can run in between now and the Festival except for Newbury (the Game Spirit Chase)," he said.

"We're hardly going to go to Newbury in three weeks' time. That would be suicide.

"You could go to a racecourse. I don't think he particularly needs to, but we could take quite a lot of the Cheltenham horses that are not going to run again before the Festival. There would be quite a few to go to the racecourse.

"I wouldn't rule it out, but I wouldn't rule it in at the moment.

"What we are definitely going to do is have a quiet week to 10 days and then we will start the build-up. That is why the timing of yesterday was perfect for us.

"He's had a fairly intense build-up which is why he was more than 80% fit. He was probably nearer 90%.

"He just got tired yesterday and we feel that's perfectly acceptable, going that gallop in that ground in his first race really since Punchestown the year before last as he only went for a mile at Kempton (in December 2013).

"Realistically I was very satisfied and pleased to see him back.

"There was that moment turning in when you just thought a miracle was going to happen. It would have been fantastic.

"I think it's realistic for him to regain his crown at Cheltenham. We have lots to do.

"Dodging Bullets won the Tingle Creek and has now put up two cracking performance. We've got to find a couple of lengths. You'd like to think we've got that in our pocket somewhere.

"Now you've got Sire De Grugy to come as well and then the final piece of the jigsaw [would be] for us all to meet together in March.

"It could be one of the great races. That day we've got to be 100% or even more. I think we're on track.

"It would be great if they all meet and it would be one of the spectacles of the Festival."

Nicky Henderson believes Sprinter Sacre has flourished since his comeback run last month and is now ready to regain his crown at Cheltenham next month.
Notably bullish, despite continued setbacks to other key players in his Lambourn yard, Henderson said yesterday: "I know it could have gone either way but he has definitely come in for the run. Physically, he looks quite different.
"He had a good schooling session on Friday and then worked very well the following morning.

Were did you read this?

It was on the Times web site.

Just had a look and couldn't find it. If that's what he said then I'm sure he'll be able to find 3 lengths on Dodging Bullets especially on Good ground.

I am hopeful of this to Giggysy, my impression was that on decent ground back at Cheltenham his jumping would bring all the others out of there comfort zones, he had dodging bullets on the stretch at Ascot before getting tired late on. Think it will need a performance of 175 - 178 to win the CC this year and this seems perfectly plausible that SS could come on to get to that figure. This will be Henderson's main shot at a Championship win and I am sure they will throw everything at making sure SS is spot on.

He won't get his ideal conditions until Cheltenham. Going down the betting the only danger I see right now is Dodging Bullets and for the reasons stated above I think Sprinter cand get his revenge.

Henderson seemed very happy with Sprinter when asked at the Grand National weights launch!

The more times I watch the replay of the Clarence House race the more and more convinced I am that SS will reverse the form with DB.
I just can't see how he doesn't improve 10+ lbs on that form. It had been over 600 days since SS last won and the only race he'd had since then he was pulled up half way round.
To be cruising coming to the 2nd last and empty, after that long off the track, is no shame. To my mind the only danger I see is CF but he can be quite inconsistent.
The 11/4 on offer at the moment could look very large on SS.

I agree NOSTAW. The better ground alone I feel will allow him to reverse the form never mind the fitness and match practice that will improve his performance. There was a wee glint in Hendos eye when Matt Chapman asked him "In your gut do you think he's back to the old Sprinter Sacre"? Hendo said "Well he looked jolly close to it last Saturday (schooling)! It's the race I'm looking forward to most of the whole festival!

Looks like the ground is coming right for him. Will be declared good/soft at start of first day then changed to good on 2nd day. This will obviously not suit the staying types like Hidden Cyclone (drifting on here and shortening for the Ryanair) and Champagne Fever. Connections of SDGS and Dodging Bullets have also clearly stated that soft ground would be preferable. Ok SDGS won last years Champion on pretty quick ground but the field last year was poor at best. Feeling more and more confident about Sprinter every day and I think there'll be a lot of red faces on the doubters if he wins.

A lot of hype about SS with Henderson talking him up constantly. Just feel that a bit like Kauto Star and Istabraq hoping for one final hurrah from their horse that SS is taking his place more in hope than expectation. Wouldn't be at all surprised to see him pulled up and I'll be laying him to place as I don't think they will want to give him a gruelling race. The race will be run at breakneck speed to test the 2 principals SDG and SS and if SS is not firing or bang in contention at the bottom of the hill I think Geraghty may ease off on him. All things considered I think its a better bet to lay the place than the win.

Geraghty on SprinterSacre: "he’s as well now as he was going into the race two years ago.”


All aboard the Sprinter Express to Winnerland

first of my threads that has got over 30 posts cheers

Time to bring this back to the top again

Better than last year according to NH will he?

Have to say took a little 25/1 last night for QMCC and 9/4 this morning, heart ruling head

I do now

Sorry Howdie had to bring it back

Have to be impressed with that....he got tired late and was getting weight but really none of that matters....the telling part is that he appeared to power through the race similar to the old days...that was the most interesting part.....deffo hope there.

Big player in the Champion Chase now. Fantastic to see him back.

Well done Sprinter Sacre

Theres really only UDS to beat in the Champion so 6/1 did look very big post race - now 5/1 best price.

25/1 pre race with baldy bet, ptl'd me last night for £20 each way but let me have it! Looking forwards to March now just hope to god he gets there safe and well

With Vibrato Valtat still in contention turning for home, despite UDS crashing out, I think he is still very much the one to beat in the QMCC.  Laddies went 2's straight after his fall, but brought him back into 7/4 after the Desert Orchid.

Whilst it was great to see SDG and SS battling it out, I don't think they'd have the toe these days to live with UDS, but then it all depends on UDS staying on his feet!!  I couldn't go in big on UDS though because it can't do the blood pressure any good!

Have to say that Special Tiara looks a great ew bet now at 16's, when the Tingle Creek puts him bang there with Sprinter and he is widely 7/2-4/1.

well he's not back to what he was,think that is pretty clear.
Good to see him back of course,and SDG,but they ain't as good now.
I suspect UDS will be too quick and will have them both under pressure a lot earlier than they would like.
Race needs Dodging Bullets back,he would add interest,or Vautour,otherwise I fear a rout.
That's of course if UDS jumps round!!!

Good to see Sprinter digging deep at Kempton and emerging OK but unless it was the track that didn't suit him or he'd been given an easier time beforehand it looked to me like he took a step back from his Cheltenham form. The run looked 20lb short of his best when he would have cooked the likes of Vibrato Valtat and for me he'll never get back to the high eighties. I wouldn't bet on him ante-post but I'll look forward to seeing him in the paddock on March 16th. I did think he looked better in the paddock at Cheltenham than at Kempton.