Many Clouds

Because he is lightly raced and improving.

I can see many clouds skipping Cheltenham and waiting for Aintree if im honest, he has no chance in this years rsa after the moriarty, why give him a hard race in a race he has no chance of winning....

black thunder and corrin wood are ahead of him from what ive seen,and that's without the irish!!

still never know in this game I guess.

sorry alleged but that is just stupid. His OR is 145 for starters so he only needs to improve about 7lb to place and he has not even ran over 3 miles yet, which he is crying out for.

If people think Black Thunder is ahead then I suggest re-watching the Haydock and put it into context.

Out of the thorough stayers he'd be the one of interest from the bigger prices if it's soft ground all the better soft ground all the better, the sire has got a few extreme stayers, including cloudy lane.

I'm just coming round to the notion that a few bets with the emphasis on stamina might not be a bad idea...I know that one day of dry weather and it will be good to firm etc etc...but this weather is starting to take the piss now....never thought I'd ever say it but at this rate I'm even considering backing Melodic Rendezvous at 30's.

So it appears you are keeping all the reasons for reversing that Haydock form to yourself?

As for the idea that he is a thorough stayer, his two efforts over longer trips are the above Haydock run where he was hardly charging home and a pulled up over hurdles on quicker ground which could be another cause for concern if the ground ever dries up. Not what I would call cast-iron evidence. Half brother not exactly crying out for three miles. Given his JLT entry the trainer doesn't appear to be totally convinced either.

sint in 3 races he has beat 7 horses of not great quality and got beat when he faced a half decent one, just my opinion mate

why would he be charging home over 3 miles if he's an extreme stayer though.? over the extra trip and on bad ground he's a player...on normal ground I personally don't see him being classy enough....but this might be a year for the sloggers all round.

Ok Sint, I shall watch again my friend.

They went a slow pace on a flat track, Differentdrum. You can see that in the race and he also had mild interference during the race. At the end of the race you can see MC is closing the gap the closer they get to the line. It's hardly difficult to imagine a turnaround in the form when the distance was only 2.5 lengths especially when their is more emphasis on stamina.

The form of each one of his novice chases has been boosted nicely by the horses in behind, too! Shotgun Paddy, Indian Castle.

As for the double entry, you will find very novices over both hurdles and fences that don't have more than one entry. Trainers will be trainers!

* very few

Like i sed earlier since when was Sherwood had winners at the festival, it ain't happening

Outstanding input denman85. New account for you soon, I suspect!

Don't worry Denman many agree with you...old Sint gets very touchy when you don't agree with him...I'm sure he'll reply to this with steam comin off the keyboard as usual....probably mention our Conor for the 81st time. Never been wrong has Sint but don't worry we know he's on Many Clouds n Jezki so we look forward to their performances and see how great he is

all this tit for tat is getting boring now, sometimes we get it right sometimes it goes horribly wrong, more often that not is goes wrong espesh when your backing a horse 4 months before the event, but when it goes right, those antepost post vouchers look incredibly big, good luck all

Not sure why you think i've backed Jezki, Ballyskint. Only horse i've backed for the CH is TNO, i've just taken a balanced view on Jezki rather than offer up disparaging remarks all the time, like you do. Good luck with all your freebies, pro!

Ok, so we got

Many Clouds RSA
The New One Champion Hurdle.

Always keen to learn from those that call strangers "skint"...anything else you have backed so we can all pile in or will you inform us at 6pm on the 14th March?

Says the bloke who continually aftertimes and has been placed on the aftertiming thread numerous times, iirc.

Now now children,can we plz take every1s view on board when coming to our assumptions, ( obviously disregarding sints view)1

Aftertiming? Ok here we go...already been posted :

Supreme Novices

West Wizard 8/1 and 16/1


Arkle

Felix Yonger 10-1 NRFB
Mozoltov ew 25-1 NRFB
Caid Du Berlais 25-1 NRFB



Champion Hurdle

The New One 7-1 NRFB
My Tent Or Yours ew 7-1 NRFB
Bayern Munich to beat Arsenal at Emirates and Hurricane Fly NRNB 13-2

Neptune

The Tullow Tank ew 14-1 ew 11-1 both NRFB
Apache Stronghold ew 16-1 NRFB
Faugheen 11.5



RSA Chase

Shutthefrontdoor 25/1 and 16/1
Ballycasey 10/1 NRFB
Morning Assembly 16/1
Bright New Dawn ew 33/1 NRFB

JLT

Taquin Du Seuil 8-1 NRFB
Felix Yonger 9-1 NRFB


Ryanair

Hidden Cyclone 33-1
Al Ferof 7-1 NRNB
Beneficient 8-1 NRFB
Baily Green 20-1 ew NRNB
Marito 10-1 ew NRNB



World Hurdle

Salubrious ew 25-1
Annie Power 6-1 NRFB



Triumph Hurdle

Pearl Castle ew 20-1 NRFB
Plinth ew 12-1 NRFB



Albert Bartlett

Faugheen 8-1 NRFB
Oscar Rock ew 25-1 NRFB



Gold Cup

First Lieutenant 20-1 and e/w 12-1 NRNB
Harry Topper ew 33-1 NRFB
Lord Windermere ew 25-1 NRFB
Silviniaco Conti 40-1 for the KG/GC...treble stake laid off at 4-1 on here
Bobs Worth 7-2
Rocky Creek ew 50-1 NRFB
Al Ferof ew 14-1 NRNB

Denman...said it all in my reply on the RSA thread about the legend that is Sintonian. He is a guesser and when stuck for a response it's name calling. Honestly...how old are you Sintonian by the way?

gl Sint with Many Clouds, looks a decent horse but think the best the English are playing for is 4th or 5th in all honesty. Don't rate any of the English stayers this season. No formline to go on between either side of the sea so could be completely wrong of course. Just it's a race we generally dominate in recent years unless there is a quality English Nov hurdler ala Bobs Worth or Denman.

CVB pretty well sums up my view too. I like the horse but he hasn't been campaigned like one destined to lift one of the novice chase championship crowns. The Reynoldstown might tell us more but for someone who learnt from a master, Sherwood has largely underperformed in his training career and his stable jockey is no better than adequate.

Ok Sint, I shall watch again my friend

Have just done that,and I have no doubt the best horse on the day won the race. BT was last off the bridle,and travelling better coming to the last. After the last BT started going away from MC,and last 100 yards MC came back at him to narrow the gap from about 4 lengths to 2 and a half.
Thought overall BT jumped slightly better,and MC did hit the top of the 2nd last.
After watching that, my feeling is BT might just be a better horse, but having said that, Its not cut and dried at all who would fare better in the RSA imo.
Corrin wood I was most impressed with and to me he looks better than the pair of them.
He could jump a lot into the ground in the RSA.
Not Ballycasey though

seagull likes him for the rsa !

plenty of people seem to have issues with either the horse or sintonian. regarding the horse, all his chase form looks top notch so far. haydock was a funny race for me with previous posts having expressed/included them. i'm expecting a min 10 length victory today then bring on the rsa.

graham rodway just tipped himm on racing post tv,flush those dockets down the toilet

I like the horse but, for today, think Rebecca Curtis's horse has been a bit overlooked - stable out of form and horse scoped badly after it's last run, should surely perform much better today based on hurdles form and overall profile.

FOYLESWAR 15 Feb 14 08:59 Joined: 09 Jan 11 | Topic/replies: 6,562 | Blogger: FOYLESWAR's blog
seagull likes him for the rsa !


No he doesn't, he said he didn't fancy him for RSA, he did fancy him to win today. From the morning line

sorry lads got that rse about face !

Once Graham Rodway,James Pyman,Dave Or or ed quigley get involved,stay away.Some of the biggest dopes not on social welfare

bit dissapointing that tbh, was he 100%? would still like him to go to the rsa, as he was closing at the finish.

Very good jumper, I'd be interested in him in a handicap chase at the festival. He jumps so well he could keep his position in a big field, which is a huge asset.

Lets see what mark he gets.

cv was going to say it might not win today to get a decent mark,do you think the 3 miler on the 1st day !

145 going into today

wont go up for that will it !

he'd be close to top weight in the jlt

Top weight is usually around 155 in that race. Trainer said on morning line that today would tell them if they go h/c or RSA. I'd say he'll stay around his mark and go for the h/c on the first day. The old Billy Hill. Such a lovely jumper I'd have him on my shortlist alright.

hope highland lodge doesnt win at ascot next,he is deffo on my list !

highland lodge ran far too freely to win hopefully here !

think he might go up a couple, him and gevrey were at it the whole way round and that killed the majority of the field but MC survived it and still stayed on to the line...you've got a solid 137 horse in baby shine, 40 lengths back.

According to the racing correspondant for the Mail, Marcus Townend, Many Clouds definitely goes to the RSA - the following put up on Twitter post-race today: "Both Reynoldstown first and second O'faolains Boy and Many Clouds will go for Rsa Chase at the Cheltenham Festival" @captheath

Got to laugh at the "experts" who thought that was a non staying performance. He missed work and obv had a blow then ran on again at the end, obv getting a second wind. Amazed the prices have drifted.

MC laughed at indian castle to the tune of a 16 length hammering who in turn won well at cheltenham next time and is now 140...a mere 5 lbs below MC...reckon the handicapper will want a bit more daylight between them and today gives him the chance IMO

Fairly clear he needed it when Sherwood didnt even include it in his bets on ML, when the horse is his fav.

The comments about handicaps are just a case of paying it lip service. Earlier in the season Sherwood said ''I am not interested in his handicap mark''. He is a graded chases.

I must be ploughing a lone furrow here but I thought that was an excellent run today. I am all for riding horses positively, especially when they jump as well as Many Clouds does, but to get into a battle a long way from home on testing ground like that today was very taxing. Given the fact the trainer has said he still goes for the RSA I think that tells you he has left something to work on fitness wise and ofcourse he won't be conceding the weight there.  The handicapper is going to put him up a few lbs for sure so handicaps wont' and never have been the plan.

You obviously dont read comments just above yours! Im with you all the way. I expected 12-1 tops after that performance. Loaded up again. GL us

gl Bigadz.

As I said earlier on this thread, I love the horse and have backed him.

I still have the nagging feeling that he's not quite good enough to win the race, and although there were plenty of positives today, there are also negatives if you want to be entirely objective. Promising though it was, I can't help but feel the price is about right, and have always had this nagging worry about his never having been to Cheltenham before. It's all well and good leaving something to work on, but a slog in heavy ground less than a month before the RSA with an undercooked horse is not my idea of the best prep. Obviously hope I'm wrong and I do like Sherwood so have to trust he knows his onions with this one.

sintonian 15 Feb 14 16:49 Joined: 21 Sep 04 | Topic/replies: 22,980 | Blogger: sintonian's blog
The comments about handicaps are just a case of paying it lip service. Earlier in the season Sherwood said ''I am not interested in his handicap mark''.

You're getting a bit too defensive sint. Trainer said this morning on the Morning Line that today would decide if they go down h/c route or go for the RSA. So for me to suggest he may go down the h/c route now is hardly wide of the mark opinion. He got beat today in a race that looked low on quality already. I'd imagine his mark will remain unchanged and the handicap route is certainly a possibility.

Trainer also said he could get beat today as he had left plenty to work on, so I would think connections will be very pleased with that and the RSA is still likely to be their main target imo.

Winner of todays race might prove to be a very good horse,so i think it was a decent performance by MC

Big fan of this horse and think it jumps tremendously but starting to think it might be a bit tripless

or just a handicapper which is just below top class !

Curtis horses seem to be picking up a bit after an awful season so far. I suspect the form of the race is ordinary as far as the RSA is concerned. If MC had been ridden with more restraint, he might well have won today.

gutted cos i backed it last time out when it came to win and just tired,dont think the irish will be losing much sleep regarding rsa though !

ReaseHeath
15 Feb 14 11:01
Joined:
15 May 04
| Topic/replies: 10,435 | Blogger: ReaseHeath's blog
I like the horse but, for today, think Rebecca Curtis's horse has been a bit overlooked - stable out of form and horse scoped badly after it's last run, should surely perform much better today based on hurdles form and overall profile.

didnt think her horses were back yet tbh,afc ran well at chelt but has she had that many winners since then,dont know tbh !

MC is a very nice horse but not top class. Will fall someway short in the RSA

When AFC ran at Cheltenham, her RTF was 20%, now it's 55%

Pipe similar, been running at about 30% for best part of the season, now up at 76% - really noticeable how many horses he had running today off really long breaks.

I fear he may have peaked too early...

Apologies I digress, need to watch the race to assess Many Clouds performance, the Curtis horse will have appreciated the ground and the 4lb weight advantage.

i should do a bit more homework really,there some strike rates !

I cannot believe this horse is 30 on here for the rsa, Was expecting 14's, already backed sam winner but i just have back MC at its current price.

The Curtis horse won't be in amongst it in the RSA so I can't see Many Clouds bein up to it either to be honest.best off in a handicap

just to be clear, they're not strike rates - they're % of horses running to within 5 lb of their RPR over last 14 days.

the only positive I can think of is beaten horses in the reynoldstown do fair better in the rsa.

Never been a fan of if a horse wins/loses target a then target b is possible etc. Too many variables for me to work that out.

Fitness, jumping on the day, trainer form. Doesnt work for me but clearly their are a few stats worth following.

your right Ibrahima of course, just trying to find a posiive for the MC fans....

Personally, for me the rsa is not usually won by the best horse.

You need a galloper that jumps and is not bothered by other horses, finds under pressure and can handle being taken out of its stride.

Hard to find, but you can eliminate a few that have had soft races.

Trainer said he goes for RSA in RP, so you'll defo get a run now sint. Good luck

Feltham winner under rated in the betting for me.

Annacotty is maybe a tad underestimated but how many times would you fancy a 6yr old in the RSA who has had 7 chase runs since October and won a grand total of 2 of them?

Personally, in a year without a standout novice, people are maybe clutching at straws a little

CV, when I said the comments about handicaps are just paying the notion lip service I am referring to the trainer. Connections have no interest in going handicapping with him and never have. I think the ATR stable tour is still up on their site from the beginning of the season. His comments about handicaps are on there.

"He's in at Haydock over two mile seven on November 22 and is much more mature this season so has come out of Carlisle well. Buzzing at the moment, and goes well on heavy ground. I'd like to think we won't be too worried about handicap marks and he can be upped in trip. He'd be fine at Haydock."

He said he has improvement to come from his run yesterday, also I rate O'Faolains Boy a good horse. So he's entitled to take his chance in the RSA.

Race has a bit more shape to it now with plenty of confirmed runners. Still can have any English horse for this. Though that's just my opinion as there is no form lines to back it up.

Basically, if they want to take a big handicap they wouldn't of run yesterday. First prize was only £18k whilst a big handicap is £30k +. The RSA has been the target.

very surprised aspell decided to take gevrey chambertin on yesterday...a more conservative ride might of paid dividends imo

the horse himself looks more a grand national type for the future and even then he will have to prove himself on better ground plus after his runs this season will have plenty of weight

he could become hard to place in the future but in the meantime i would think he would take his chance in the rsa although he does seem quite one paced so it won't be easy for him

Overall level of his form indicates that he's not quite good enough for a championship race. Wonder if the 4 miler is on the horizon.....might get a better ride off an amateur!

He's not entered in the 4 miler, though I agree about the jockey. It will be interesting to see what happens if one of the tops jocks is available. Does McCoy have an RSA ride? Will Geraghty keep the ride on O'Falains Boy given Hendo doesn't have anything..

I've no bet in the RSA yet.

Having reflected on Saturday's race, I just wonder whether the ultimate proximity of Third Intention holds the form down a little bit, he was giving weight to both the first two.

I'd also probably see the winner as the one to take out of the race, a sick horse less than a month ago so Sat probably plenty soon enough and produced a fine effort in the Albert Bartlett last season.

Not writing off Many Clouds though - the way Gevrey Chambertin stopped so quickly does suggest that the pair of them going hammer and tongs up front did not help his chances.

I'd save him for the 3m novice chase at Aintree if he were mine.

I'd have stuck him in the 4 miler myself....although if it was a slog in the RSA he'd have a chance.

It is a huge jump from 3 miles to 4. Last thing I would do tbh when he is yet to win at 3m.

yeh, but he's an out and out stayer...to stay at it with gevrey for all that time and still come back again at the end...he'll keep going for ever more...just wouldn't be able to do it in a good ground 3 miler against a host of decent horses IMO

He is a stayer in the making, not quite there yet. Being trained perfectly for the staying contests further down the line, no need to whack him up to 4 miles, hence no entry.

I'd save him for the 3m novice chase at Aintree if he were mine.

You might be right up - especially as his owner is very keen on Aintree winners. Horse must have had a hard race on Saturday.

The article has disappeared now but trainer today said he has ''come out of the race bouncing. Not a bother on him'' fwiw.

just watched the race again and although i was dissapointed on sat i'm now feeling optimistic again. the fact aspell got into a duel for the last mile with gevrey was that he knew he was on a stayer. the dissapointment comes from the closeness of third intention who got to within a length after the last, which is when mant clouds staying power came into play to pull 4 lenghtes away from him. tbh it was a good ride from geraghty. as for aintree i just wont have it, the tight turns wont play to his strengths. bring on cheltenham, he'll gallop up that hill if not closing then pulling away.

Taken out of the handicap.

The Trevor Hemmings-owned novice has recorded two wins and two seconds from his four runs this season, most recently finishing runner-up to O'Faolains Boy in Ascot's Reynoldstown Novices' Chase.

Sherwood has always held the seven-year-old in high regard, and did have options for the Cloudings gelding, as he explained.

He said: "If I had it my way we'd have probably gone for the three-mile handicap (on Tuesday), but Mr Hemmings already has another horse in the race (Vintage Star) and he's entitled to run in this.


"I think it's a very open RSA this year and you can make a case for half a dozen horses, if not more.

"In his last run at Ascot some people have said that he and Gevrey Chambertin might have cut each other's throats a bit up front, but we certainly won't be running him that forcefully at the Festival.

"The one thing I've been really pleased with this season, especially in his last two runs, has been his jumping. It was exemplary at Ascot.

"I think he's going there with a good chance and if he finishes in the first five I'll be very pleased."

Stablemate Deputy Dan is entered in both the Neptune and Albert Bartlett, but Sherwood has said that his novice is more likely to run in Friday's race over three miles.

After twice finishing runner-up in his first two starts over hurdles, he then went on to record back-to-back wins in impressive style at Chepstow and Warwick on heavy ground, despite suffering a nasty cut on a hind leg in the latter.

Sherwood said: "He'll almost certainly run in the Albert Bartlett and he's in great form. He'll have no problems with the extra trip as he has plenty of stamina in the pedigree.

"It was public knowledge that he had a nasty cut when he won at Warwick, and he had to stand in his box for 10 days, but he's back to full work now and I've been very happy with his progress.

"I'm very lucky to have a horse that is capable of going there with a live each-way chance."

Sherwood has been forced to miss the OLBG Mares' Hurdle with Mischievous Milly after she suffered a setback, but does hope to run the lightly-raced Drum Valley is he gets into the Pertemps Final on Thursday.

He said: "It's going to be nip and tuck whether he gets in or not. He's a better horse on better ground, and he could be anything."

more good form today. beat holywell over 9 lengths 1st time out, & shotgun paddy 14 lengths when closing on black thunder. hope the ground will be ok.

Yep, ground is the concern. IF he handles it I don't see why he cannot finish in the first 3. Good luck.

Very excited about this contest. Have Many Clouds at 25/1 and Le Bec at 16/1 and wouldn't swap them for anything

On soft ground I would be very confident of a massive run but the surface has dried out significantly so it adds a bit of doubt. There is some hope on breeding as his sire Cloudings was a Flat horse who won on good ground and his progeny have a 10% strike rate on gd/fm. Many Clouds was also second to Gevrey Chambertin in a good ground Aintree maiden where he quickened nicely and stayed on so all is not lost.

Good luck to all of us

The ground is a real concern for me, after watching how he ran at aintree i am worried.

On the plus side i have Sam Winner who loves it good on my side.

terrible luck

Donkey Cossack cannot jump and took us out. Hope the horses are OK.

was also hampered by the fall of Black Thunder

given his form with the winner he could surely have been competitive

That was just meant to be tears!

Both MC and Ofailans jocked up for the 3m1f race this week.