official finians rainbow wins the arkle doing handstands thread.

Excellent point about Tidal Bay. I was far from impressed at Warwick and I think people's judgement was clouded just cos they had backed him, but one bad round doesnt mean you cant win.
My only concern would be he hasnt had to really get going in a race yet, also I think he was going really well in the Neptune but I thought he got unbalanced coming down the hill. That would be my concern I would like to of seen him back at the track, cant wait

Lets hope the Henderson vets have been kept away from him!

Medermit 0-5 at Cheltanham

However he was 2nd in a Supreme flying home to just fail behind Go Native. In that race he finished in front of Somersby who is a leading fancy for the Champion Chase.

He then ran 3rd in the Greatwood Hurdle off top weight beaten just 3L by Kyber Kim giving him 3lbs.

He then finished 3rd in the International again behind Kyber Kim and Celestial Halo.

Next race at Cheltenham was the Champion Hurdle where he was well beaten.

Then he ran a fine race in the Dipper over fences when he travelled like the winner and was probably just outstayed by the winner Hells Bay where they finished a mile clear of the 3rd.


He may not be a good price in your opinion but i wouldn't use the 0-5 at the course against him as he has ran in top class hurdle races at the course and ran with credit and on his only chase start around there the trip was probably too far and the drop back is certainly in his favour.

no relation at all to tidal bay if you ask me....that horse had jumped poorly in all his races prior to the festival, finians hasn't....anyway i was a big fan of the perospect of finians this year and got some big prices back in october, but medermit is impossible to oppose for me now...as for the "bounce" not sure where that's come from tbh......medermit jumps travels is the best hurdler in the field and will jump back in trip as he wasn't novicey before the step up in trip because he had to travel faster than he wanted too...he was just novicey....this horse can operate in a champion hurdle itself.....can't see anything living with medermit turning in.

finians got out-stayed in the ballymore, just before the turn in he was running all over them.....finians is really classy but medermit for me has simply got too many guns.

'the bounce factor comes into play'

dont think you have a full understanding of this kido,

Tidal Bay had also performed well at the festival before.

Signing in as a Finian's fan right here. Have been saying for a while how he does remind me of Tidal Bay in his Arkle - very worried about him getting round beforehand but also knew in my heart he was by far and away the classiest horse in the race.

That is exactly how I feel again about this one. Jumping does worry me but he will be my only bet of the entire week who has that question mark over him, so I'll not feel too gutted if he fails for that reason. I think his speed and class are above anything else in the line-up by some way so think he is well worth the risk.

If he jumps well I think he'll win quite easily.

Loooked dodgy both in jumping and stamina at Warwick so if your on at fancy prices you have to lay off, to at least cover your stake - madness not to.

Back it on the day with faller's insurance. I think its a big player if it gets a clear round but Medermit is my main fancy.

By: TheFormMan
Date Joined: 05 Dec 10
Blogger: TheFormMan's blog Add contact When: 13 Mar 11 14:32 'the bounce factor comes into play'

dont think you have a full understanding of this kido,

not just me who's saying it. from the nick mordin website-

MEDERMIT PROBABLY WON'T RECOVER IN TIME FOR CHELTENAM

MEDERMIT (41) clocked a seriously fast time to win the Grade 1 Scilly Isles Novices Chase at Sandown. He actually ran 1.5 seconds quicker over the last two miles than they did in a very strongly run 0-145 handicap for more experienced chasers over the shorter distance later on the card.

Clearly Medermit is a smart horse. He jumped fast and well and came from behind a fast pace to lead three out and prevail when the runner up mounted a sustained challenge which reduced his lead form three lengths to half a length at the line.

Medermit had a hard race last time out too. He engaged in a lengthy duel with the runner up at the end of a very strongly run high class race. So I'm dubious about him recovering from this additional big effort in the 38 days remaining to the Arkle.

The Scilly Isles tends to be a strongly run affair that takes a big effort to win. So it's not surprising that just one of the eighteen winners that's gone on to run at the Cheltenham Festival has scored. This was Young Hustler, a horse that seemed able to take any amount of racing. He won the RSA Chase at the big meeting.


beware the bouncy horses at cheltenham!

Medermit is a stayer. Will stay on. If Finian's jumps well he wins from the front.

mythical prince

all the above may be so.....but that isn't anything to do with the bounce factor....that's just a horse having a hard race and not recovering from it.....the bounce factor is to do with a horse coming back from a long break and being so revved up himself for that first run...that he takes it all out of himself and is left flat for his next run.

medermit isn't a stayer in this world....in fact his 2 runs over further have shown him to be quite the opposite.

Mdermit may just decide he dont fancy it ...... and refuse again !!!

Ok so you know the girl who looks after him do you? And you know why they put him up to 2 and a half? And you know why they're going for the Arkle now?

Nicky was seen 20 minutes ago with a white coat and a toy stethoscope checking all his horses because he doesn't trust anyone else. He says Finian's rainbow is fine so don't worry he will runand of course win.

Medermit is rock solid and will run yet another good race and you can rely on him 100% not to win.

That Ghizao jumps like a gazelle and is very scary, but this is much tougher than taking on Captain Chris when he was till wondering why the hurdles looked bigger than they did last year.

Get on the Finian's he's a good thing.

just remember Finian's backers,it just takes one bad jump going at this pace and he will not be able to recover to win this race,both Medermit and Ghizao have been just about foot perfect at there fences,i wish you all the best of luck,you will need it

i suggest you watch Medermits jumping in his 2m chases Formman.

Was he foot perfect when he refused!?

he was pretty nimble at that fence,very nifty footwork 

Good Luck trying to get him beat guys

2/5, 2/5 and 1/7 in his chases against trees and he's 7/2 to win an Arkle.

It's a layers paradise!

one of those trees he beat,sorry thrashed,beat medermit

no mention of the 2 times grade1 winner whos form has been franked several times and who can be backed at almost  3 times the price as the fav

Poor race but have to agree that Realt Dubh has form in the book against proven horses.

his jumping wont be an issue,but his ability will,or lack of it,and thats why he will not win,
not good enough

there goes any chance of a sensible discussion.
how on earth do we KNOW he aint good enough??

how do you know he is not good enough evra is there a form line we can compare the english form with the irish or is it just your opinion .if you have a look at his form 2 grade chase wins with winners behind bostons angel 24 lenths behind,  saludos winning again next time out it does not look bad to me ,he may not win but at the prices he looks a bit of value to me .

His best form may yet turn out to be his run behind Jessie's Dream and, as you say, we don't know yet but that's really the point of these races over and above any other spring festival. All horses here should arrive at their peak whereas in a few weeks at Aintree and Punchestown that's not always the case.

its not just about having form lines between horses boys,if you cant tell through visual impression that Medermit and Ghizao are better than RD then quite frankly you should not be betting,i have yet to rad a single post that tells me that you have the first idea about racing budd

one of those trees he beat,sorry thrashed,beat medermit 

Yes, over 2m 5f. The Arkle isn't run over that distance. And he received weight off Hell's Bay. If you think beating Hell's Bay receiving weight is the hallmark of an Arkle winner then that's your business.

fair point,but what distance is Medermits best form at?

i dont think that is Arkle winning form,just pointing out he has beaten a horse that beat Medermit.To be honest i aint sure i have seen Arkle winning form anywhere,not concrete anyway,but FR has been running over 2m all season,and think he will prove to be a class act over fences.Just hope it starts tomorrow!!

formman,i aint at all bothered what you think about my posts.For you to bother having a go at someone on here cos they disagree with you shows you up to be a tad stupid to be honest.

True enough, there's no real high-class 2m chasing form in Medermit's book. But if you like the stats then he meets all the main criteria and has mixed it at the highest level as a hurdler and a decent level at chasing. He's also jumped exceptionally (last time out) which isn't something Finian's Rainbow has done.

Anyway, good luck.

come on guys, be nice, its christmas tommorow!

yeh his hurdling is good level,i agree.i also think that FR jumped pretty well in his first couple of races when allowed to run more prominent.I do think as well that Medermit jumping was a lot better in his last run but was that cos it was longer,and he had a bit more time at his fencing??,or is he now just a lot better jumper full stop.
Not sure myself,and certainly not confident enough to back him at the price.

there was only one reason why medermit ran at plumpton imo and that was to give him the experience of jumping downhill at pace so it has to be of some concern that he made one of his most serious jumping errors at the 9th at plumpton (one of the downhill fences) in a 2m chase - to this extent bud has a point and i think its rose coloured spectacles if this is ignored completely

Happy christmas Myth,and good luck to you too Baracouda.

bla bla bla medermit stats medermit bla bla bla. his best form over 2 miles is scraping home a few lengths in front of rackham lerouge. im sorry but that horse ain't in the same country as finians rainbow. there are two horses that have solid 2 mile form ghizao and finians rainbow.

very brave man coming on attacking Medermit just a few hours before he bolts up in the arkle

Medermit backers = Lemmings. The cliff is fast approaching

TheFormMan you are clueless; I remember fondly your Zaidpour is bombproof nonsense a couple of months back!

Now you fancy Realt Dubh do ya!? No f**king chance my friend, unless everything in the race falls like in the other Grade 1 (actually Grade 3) races he won!

If Finians Rainbow stays on his feet he wins by a street, Realt Dubh won't even get in the race you clown!

can you please tell me where i have said that RD wins the arkle please?

Is Finian's ready to set a strong steady pace for Captain Chris before he picks him up going up the hill.

do you think Fr can get in front of Dan Breen??

If he's to have a chance yes.

TheFormMan I apologise; although you clearly fancy Medermit, so I don't take it all back!

Captain Chris couldn't pick up your Mum, Eric!

I wouldn't want to be Barry trying to stop him Budd!!

Finians doesn't need to make it. He just needs to run similar to how diamond harry did in the hennessey.

he will be ok as long as he is allowed to run at the pace he is comfortable jumping at.If dan Breen goes off a bit too quick for BG,s liking he can settle him in just off the pace,that should be ok i would think.
Medermits the one that might not like it,cos his jumping at speed over 2m has not been great.
One thing for sure no horse can afford more than one mistake,and being novices they are all capable of making mistakes.
Ghizao looks the safest jumper from what i have seen,but i personally dont think he is classy enough.

He has only been comfortable while making the pace if something else does then he wont be going at his own pace.

great thread and a very interesting read

for what its worth im on merdermit asits simply the best horse in a disappointing arkle

good luck whatever you go for!!!

yes i know,but i still think BG can settle him in behind Dan Breen if he goes off quick.Their is a danger though of the 2 cutting their own throats which wont be good as i have backed them both from ages ago.

ran a fantastic race, jumped like a stag just found one too good up the hill

really wish hobbs had kept captain chris in the jewson

Ran better than I thought it would I must admit. Medermit never travelling.

Have to console myself with Al Ferof and Sizing Australia instead.

went from cruising to nothing in a few strides,
as i thought,not good enough

deary me evra... dunno what you are taking mate.. take out captain chris and he would have been an easy winner

Dickie was adamant the Arkle was CC's race. Finian's ran a belter just one too good.

Don't think there's a future 2m Champion there though tbh, this race was poor imv

Told you months ago on this chaps, the ground a massive difference to Chris and a strong run race. I even told you just above he would pick Finians up going up the hill. You dont even have to pay for my advice it is free arent you lucky.

Also pointed out ages ago Medermit should have been going Jewson as he didnt have to pace for 2m or jump as well at pace. Should have picked up quite a few more stalkers with this thread.

the evidence was clear re medermit,but i rather think people got blinded by his hurdle form,and it appears a lot thought he had improved his jumping,he may have over 2 and half,but back over 2m he proved today that he cant jump well enough at speed.FR proved as i thought that he can jump well at speed,and Captain Chris out stayed him.Was a great performance from both horses,and had FR not puleed early on its possible it would have been a different result.
Taking nothing away from CC though,and i say well done to you Eric,and i think you owe the jockey a drink.Werent for him it seems he would not have even been in the race.

Captain Chris won because of the ground ... he needs stepping up now. Festival ground will always be up his street. As stated Johnson read the forum and took my advice that he needed a positive ride which would improve his jumping and it did. Well done for taking my advice Dickie you owe me a drink.

eric_morris
When: 15 Mar 11 20:46
Captain Chris won because of the ground ... he needs stepping up now. Festival ground will always be up his street. As stated Johnson read the forum and took my advice that he needed a positive ride which would improve his jumping and it did. Well done for taking my advice Dickie you owe me a drink.

Watched this race a couple of times now, and I think Barry got a little bit cocky. When he looked round and saw them all hard at work, he must have thought he had it in the bag.

He should have kicked on, instead he let them catch up. Not saying he would have won if he did this but it certainly would have been closer.

good point there actually mac

pleased with the way he jumped though

GI MAC my thoughts exactly. He rode Finians absolutely brilliantly until he looked in behind. He should have kicked on but he let them get back to him and put Finians under pressure. He then needed to jump the last 2 well but just got over ok and there was only one winner who was going to find the most up the hill. Flat track they would never have caught him anyway but it was a terrible decision not to kick on again.

Hmmm! can't agree with you guys at all.ld.

If Barry had kicked on at the point you say, which is one helluva way out, what would have happened? He already went so fast the likes of Medermit is off his feet



To expend any more enegry than the horse was already doing would have perhaps gained him a length or 2 before falling in a heap before the last.

Horses aren't machines lads you don't just press the button and get what you want. Everything a jockey does uses up energy and the less you have by the last the less chance you have of winning.

I'm a huge fan of Fininians but plain and simple he was stuffed well and truly by one very good horse.

Geraghty rode a brilliant race and got him jumping, simply beaten by a better horse on the day/ground.

Hey nothing I say is fact it's just an opinion. I thought it was a great ride but he did all of the hard work. He had them all at it and ok he might have been caught anyway up the hill but I just think he gave away the gap he had between finians and the others rather to easily.

He was being very intelligent imo. The horse when stepped up has never found a lot over hurdles so Geraghty knowing this was giving him a breather ready to last the hill. Really intelligent riding by Geraghty imo.

Atleast we have now learnt that there is not a noivice chaser around that will be able to live with Finians in the 2m novice chase at Aintrees flat speed track,should be a hands and heels job,lets just hope he turns up along with a few other decent types to assure a nice price and all you Finians backers can get your money back along with all us Medermit backers

ahem ... you have learnt