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19 Aug 11
20:05
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Date Joined:
17 Mar 10
Having tried and been too late/unfashionable to get an Exceed and Excel nomination for the last couple of years I take some comfort in his latest run as some vindication of my judgement.
As a stallion with Darley whose ability to launch a stallion is regarded on here as anywhere between average and incompetent, presumably his results make him equivalent to Danehill himself had he been in Tipperary!
Any comments on his REAL merit or more particularly perceived problems, before I consider trying again for 2012!
Mind you, fee could be problematical!
As a stallion with Darley whose ability to launch a stallion is regarded on here as anywhere between average and incompetent, presumably his results make him equivalent to Danehill himself had he been in Tipperary!
Any comments on his REAL merit or more particularly perceived problems, before I consider trying again for 2012!
Mind you, fee could be problematical!
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PotM
I think he is one of the best value sires available. i saw him at Darley when i was getting a mare covered in May and he is a great looking horse.
I imagine his price will increase a fair bit next year and from what i was told he is not the best worker so numbers will be limited i would have thought.
I wish i had a mare good enoygh for him.
I think he is one of the best value sires available. i saw him at Darley when i was getting a mare covered in May and he is a great looking horse.
I imagine his price will increase a fair bit next year and from what i was told he is not the best worker so numbers will be limited i would have thought.
I wish i had a mare good enoygh for him.
Well truehoncho I've only got one mare good enough I'd imagine, so if I have a go there'll be tears before bedtime if I get turned down again.
I've been told that his book stays modest(ish) because they work him harder down under as that is seen as his proper home. I bet your story is the true one!
I've been told that his book stays modest(ish) because they work him harder down under as that is seen as his proper home. I bet your story is the true one!
PotM
i watched him cover a mare along with his groom (i assumed), who was relieved when the job was completed and told me he was not as keen as he could be.
He nearly fell asleep on the mare after he finished (we've all been there!!!!!), but don't let it put you off, the staff at Darley are excellent and will get the job done.
i watched him cover a mare along with his groom (i assumed), who was relieved when the job was completed and told me he was not as keen as he could be.
He nearly fell asleep on the mare after he finished (we've all been there!!!!!), but don't let it put you off, the staff at Darley are excellent and will get the job done.
It's falling asleep before the job's done that's truly dire!!
PotM
according to the next thread E&E may be 20k next year. i'd be suprised if his book is full already. good luck
its a shame excelabration is going to end up in ireland, he may have come into my price range. its really hard over here to find exciting types at senible money.
according to the next thread E&E may be 20k next year. i'd be suprised if his book is full already. good luck
its a shame excelabration is going to end up in ireland, he may have come into my price range. its really hard over here to find exciting types at senible money.
They won't decide on E and E's book or fee just yet, but they won't be short of interest that's for sure.
potm i like him a lot but also fear he will be in for a rise and im sure darley will take a good few for them selves so not that manny places left imho, i have a share in a nice colt foal out of a young winning mare 2nd foal 1st one not run yet would be intersted what everyone thought if i should sell as a foal or not, will he have a better book comming throu for next season? thanks
Sell sell sell.
Sorry if that makes me seem like I'm sitting on the fence j.r. !
Whatever you decide remember Tatts closes at the end of the month - not sure about Goffs.
To gamble on a red hot sire becoming white hot by next yearling sales is some gamble in my eyes.
Ofcourse you have to take into account your thoughts on double dip recessions and the like.
You are right about the Darley factor. The brothers are aware of the need for speed - perhaps not as much as they should be some might say - but the real problem is all the Rabbah offshoots, E and E is right up their street and it does make it difficult for us, the Great Unwashed.
Sorry if that makes me seem like I'm sitting on the fence j.r. !
Whatever you decide remember Tatts closes at the end of the month - not sure about Goffs.
To gamble on a red hot sire becoming white hot by next yearling sales is some gamble in my eyes.
Ofcourse you have to take into account your thoughts on double dip recessions and the like.
You are right about the Darley factor. The brothers are aware of the need for speed - perhaps not as much as they should be some might say - but the real problem is all the Rabbah offshoots, E and E is right up their street and it does make it difficult for us, the Great Unwashed.
thanks pm im sure you are right must now convince my partners
He's doing so well atm so I'm sure they will be tempted to put up his fee and cash in on his increasing popularity but perhaps they may also take the view that at 12k sterling he offers real value giving breeders a chance to make money,those breeders may then be inclined to use him again.Putting his fee up to say 15/20ish may just make us all think again as at that price we all need to make sure our mares are good enough to warrant that sort of spending,Pricing stallions is tricky people who used Iffraaj this year may now just wonder if it was such a good idea as he for the moment has fizzled out to almost nothing,another sire who had a hike in fee last year is Pastoral Pursuits and frankly now looks a bit top heavy for breeders to stand a chance of getting a worthwhile return.
I do however think a price rise will be on the cards as like us all Darley need the money,after all they are operating within a commercial industry.Have to say I think Coolmore buying Excelebration is a good move and I'm not surprised to hear that news really,another E and E colt who if he goes on the right way could make a welcome edition to the sire ranks is Fulbright a stakes winning half brother to Baltic King and Domingues who was a GR winning 2 y'old,Fulbright holds some classy entries one to keep your eye on perhaps.
I do however think a price rise will be on the cards as like us all Darley need the money,after all they are operating within a commercial industry.Have to say I think Coolmore buying Excelebration is a good move and I'm not surprised to hear that news really,another E and E colt who if he goes on the right way could make a welcome edition to the sire ranks is Fulbright a stakes winning half brother to Baltic King and Domingues who was a GR winning 2 y'old,Fulbright holds some classy entries one to keep your eye on perhaps.
Nice to hear from you Prima. I imagine you in Deauville right now, and I imagine how if I were, I wouldn't be spending much time on here either!
Fulbright is a sharp commercial prospect isn't he. His lack of recent form is a worry, but I suppose Johnston runs out of sort horses and it doesn't necessarily prevent them from bouncing back.
When you think of over inflated stud fees over the years due to a good start - Bertolini, Fasliyev, Kheleyf, Medicean, Acclamation (but perhaps by not much!), Iffraaj, Pastoral Pursuits, Royal Applause, Tiger Hill, the list goes on and on.
I think that Iffraaj wasn't a massive increase - demand would have stomached more I guess - and as it's gone awry perhaps E & E will be workable. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath though!
I thought they had a slightly tricky reputation as a bit too hot to handle for some. Am I misguided in that, anyone?
Fulbright is a sharp commercial prospect isn't he. His lack of recent form is a worry, but I suppose Johnston runs out of sort horses and it doesn't necessarily prevent them from bouncing back.
When you think of over inflated stud fees over the years due to a good start - Bertolini, Fasliyev, Kheleyf, Medicean, Acclamation (but perhaps by not much!), Iffraaj, Pastoral Pursuits, Royal Applause, Tiger Hill, the list goes on and on.
I think that Iffraaj wasn't a massive increase - demand would have stomached more I guess - and as it's gone awry perhaps E & E will be workable. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath though!
I thought they had a slightly tricky reputation as a bit too hot to handle for some. Am I misguided in that, anyone?
Pot M,yes I also think Fulbright looks commercial but he does need to go on and that's a point about his recent form,perhaps Darley will have in their minds stallions like Iffraaj and the great Tiger Hill along with Bertolini if and when they set E and E fee for next term.
Slick is in France right now I myself will be very soon,had a few days over at York this week as that's one of my fav' meetings,took a look at Hoof it he's a nice looking horse reckon he wants 6f mind and not 5!
Slick is in France right now I myself will be very soon,had a few days over at York this week as that's one of my fav' meetings,took a look at Hoof it he's a nice looking horse reckon he wants 6f mind and not 5!
Sired the winner of the Group 1 Caulfield Guineas, this afternoon. The Darley owned colt, Helmet set a cracking pace over the mile, to just hold on in the fastest Guineas ever.
Helmet, could next head to the Cox Plate in a fortnight.
He will most likely join Godolphin in Europe next season.
Helmet, could next head to the Cox Plate in a fortnight.
He will most likely join Godolphin in Europe next season.
Helmet to go to Europe?
Have you heard this as a possibility or are you guessing?
Have you heard this as a possibility or are you guessing?
For you Wily
[i]Darley Colts Headed Ultimately for Europe
Tara Madgwick - Monday, 18 July 2011
Racenet have reported dual Group I winner Helmet is likely to join his Golden Slipper winning stablemate Sepoy and eventually head to Europe to join the Godolphin racing operation, which is yet to achieve any success with horses sent from Australia.
Trainer Peter Snowden, who recently visited the Newmarket training facility, told the Daily Telegraph that the trip helped him identify what horses would be suited to European racing.
"It is not just about the good ones going over, it is finding the right horses that will fit in the to system well," Snowden said.
"With Sepoy and Helmet, their ratings will be high and (they) have to compete at the elite level. Because they are southern hemisphere (bred) horses, they will be six months behind and probably won't be competitive at their rating until probably June or July next year, that's when they will be able to show their best.
"We are not quite sure when they will take them, we will know more after the spring carnival."
Helmet (pictured www.stevehart.com.au) will kick off his spring campaign off in the Group III Run To The Rose (1300m) at Rosehill on August 27, while Sepoy, who is due to trial in three weeks, will resume at Caulfield on August 13.
Darley have sent a number of top class Australian horses to the Northern Hemisphere in recent years and have yet to achieve any real success from the exercise.
Last year’s Group I Golden Rose winner Denman was sent to the UK, but did not race, his anticipated campaign in top class events aborted in favour of a stud career back in Australia.
Others to make trip to the Northern Hemisphere include Group I SAJC Derby winner Kidnapped, Group I AJC Spring Champion Stakes winner Sousa, Group II QTC Sires Produce Stakes winner Fravashi, Group II VRC Gilgai Stakes winner El Cambio, Group II MVRC AAMI Vase winner Marching, Group II MRC Sandown Guineas winner Caymans, Group III VRC Danehill Stakes winner Aichi, Group III STC Run to the Rose winner Desuetude, stakes-winner Time Thief and stakes-placed Imvula.
Interestingly not one of these horses has been able to win a race after leaving Australia.
[i]Darley Colts Headed Ultimately for Europe
Tara Madgwick - Monday, 18 July 2011
Racenet have reported dual Group I winner Helmet is likely to join his Golden Slipper winning stablemate Sepoy and eventually head to Europe to join the Godolphin racing operation, which is yet to achieve any success with horses sent from Australia.
Trainer Peter Snowden, who recently visited the Newmarket training facility, told the Daily Telegraph that the trip helped him identify what horses would be suited to European racing.
"It is not just about the good ones going over, it is finding the right horses that will fit in the to system well," Snowden said.
"With Sepoy and Helmet, their ratings will be high and (they) have to compete at the elite level. Because they are southern hemisphere (bred) horses, they will be six months behind and probably won't be competitive at their rating until probably June or July next year, that's when they will be able to show their best.
"We are not quite sure when they will take them, we will know more after the spring carnival."
Helmet (pictured www.stevehart.com.au) will kick off his spring campaign off in the Group III Run To The Rose (1300m) at Rosehill on August 27, while Sepoy, who is due to trial in three weeks, will resume at Caulfield on August 13.
Darley have sent a number of top class Australian horses to the Northern Hemisphere in recent years and have yet to achieve any real success from the exercise.
Last year’s Group I Golden Rose winner Denman was sent to the UK, but did not race, his anticipated campaign in top class events aborted in favour of a stud career back in Australia.
Others to make trip to the Northern Hemisphere include Group I SAJC Derby winner Kidnapped, Group I AJC Spring Champion Stakes winner Sousa, Group II QTC Sires Produce Stakes winner Fravashi, Group II VRC Gilgai Stakes winner El Cambio, Group II MVRC AAMI Vase winner Marching, Group II MRC Sandown Guineas winner Caymans, Group III VRC Danehill Stakes winner Aichi, Group III STC Run to the Rose winner Desuetude, stakes-winner Time Thief and stakes-placed Imvula.
Interestingly not one of these horses has been able to win a race after leaving Australia.
His 3yo son, Helmet, goes to the post today, in Australia's most prestigious WFA race, as a warm favourite. He has the class and weight advantage to win, but is unproven at 10f.
It's been a stellar week for EAE, siring his second, group 1 winning two year old filly, in last 7 days. After his daughter, Overreach won the Golden Slipper last week, The Darley owned Guelph, stormed home to win the 7f, Sires Produce Stks.
Siring the Slipper winner last week, pushed EAE ahead of Fastnet Rock, on the General Sires list.
Siring the Slipper winner last week, pushed EAE ahead of Fastnet Rock, on the General Sires list.
He seems thoroughly on the up in whichever hemisphere you like doesn't he Castiron.
It will be interesting to see if better mares take him right to the top. His fee suggests those hopes are certainly harboured.
It will be interesting to see if better mares take him right to the top. His fee suggests those hopes are certainly harboured.
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