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There's absolutely no reason why can't go all the way in this tournament, except for their players being considerably worse than most of the other countries' players.
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I always think that sort of argument is wrong though. if our players were so bad, they wouldn't be on the ludicrous five figure sums per week they are. or are the other nations players just massively underpaid? all about the manager, imo. I've always said it, put Mourinho in charge for a World Cup and we'd go close. but I think Hodgson is doing a good job. for the record, I think Brazil or Argentina will win it. with Diego Costa up front I think they'd be unstoppable
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I liked Hodgson's comments a few weeks back when he said they were going to attack and be adventurous. I think he learned a lot from the Euro's, and that playing for a 0-0 will always catch up with us eventually
Have you ever heard a manager say 'we are going to set up with 2 banks of four and punt it upfield and hope to score a header from a setpeice' ? I don't believe a word of it. Hodgson is hardly going to change now . Laurent Blanc said he was going to attack v Chelsea the other week. |
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I think England are marginally stronger than 2 years ago. This will be the youngest squad for a while and it might help them that expectations are so low. Football is a game were the best team doesn't always win and this is a cup competition where it will boil down to only 6 games. Luck will be hugely important. The draw, injuries, the woodwork, the referee, will all play a part. Bobby Robson, England's best loved manager of recent times was lucky, they were unimpressive in their groups in 86 and 90, he drew Paraguay in 86 and Cameroon in 90, got a last minuite winner against Belgium, yet paradoxically if the referee had spotted Maradona's hand of god and had Waddle's shot against Germany been 2 inches to the left and not hit the post, who know's what he would have achieved? In 1982 England won all 3 group games, yet ended up in a group that contained Spain and Germany and exited the tournament unbeaten. France who they beat comfortably in the group, ended up with Austria and Northern Ireland and made the semis. Brazil were the outstanding team of the tournament, yet went out to an inspired Paolo Rossi and an Italian team that drew all 3 group games.
The betting for the group and outright seem realistic to me. There is no stand out team. Neymar and Messi are out of form, Brazil look worthy favourites but on paper as individuals don't look that frightening and they could easily face Spain in the last 16. Spain are on the slide and have a horrible draw, Germany don't have a top striker and were outplayed by Chile recently, Argentina haven't got a great defence and Messi is out of form and Colombia are missing Falcao. Denmark and Greece won the Euros, Wigan won the FA Cup last year, Hull could win this year's FA Cup. This is football. |
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^Yes, it is a cup competition.
Most first and second seeds will get through the group stage. With good play and fortune probably get to the last eight. In the quarter-finals the hard luck stories begin. To get further you might need to beat a traditional superpower: Germany; Italy; Brazil; Argentina. |
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Playing in very high humidity and playing with a team full of tired players, will make sure that England will do well to get out of the group stage, plus those Liverpool players, will be mentally drained, even if they win the League, it will take alot out of them, although obviously Saurez will be likewise for Uruaguay
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Brazil have Samba but England are reported to be unveiling a new attacking format which the Italians call parcheggi di zoccoli
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has neymar ever been in form vastly overrated imo.
The betting for the group and outright seem realistic to me. There is no stand out team. Neymar and Messi are out of form, |
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I'd never seen Neymar until last years Confederations Cup, where he looked top class, imo. Made a telling contribution in maybe all the matches, which you often don't get from the Ronaldo's, Messi's and such. If he's fit and head is right, I think he'll be the star of the World Cup, looking forward to watching him.
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but this thread is about how awesome England will be
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bit different though, it isn't like the World Cup is a few days away
The timing is not significant . This is likely how Hodgson will talk in public right up to kick off . I actually agree England have better players than is generally acknowledged ; if Sturridge ,Sterling & Gerrard can tear premier league defences apart they could do the same to most at this tournament . But England had equally good players to Italy in Euro 2012 and look how Roy had them set up , made it look like a mismatch with a plucky non league side trying to earn a 3rd round replay . He has never admitted doing anything wrong there so i can't see him changing now. |
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if woy goes adventurous we will end up bottom of the group with zero points
if we play it spot on we may geta draw v uraguay and costa rica. |
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the only chance england have got is if they dive like they did in 1990 against cameroon
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why are they 33? if they get through the group and win the next game they'll be a good trade, surely. looking for a value back and 33 seems pretty decent
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thing is, people will say the heat is a problem but we usually always overcome stuff like that, it's the English mentality
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the best team usually wins the World Cup (if not, then it's the home team in "unusual" circumstances, or Italy):
2010 Spain. Best team 2006 Italy. Probably not the best team. 2002 Brazil. Best team 1998 France. Home team. Brazil probably the best team there but allowing Nike to pick their team for the final including Ronnie during his mental collapse cost them their chance. 1994 Brazil. Best team 1990 Germany. Best team 1986 Argentina. Best team 1982 Italy. Probably not the best team. 1978 Argentina. Home team. Probably not the best team, but it was fixed. 1974 Germany. Home team. Probably lucky to beat Holland. 1970 Brazil. Best team. 1966 England. Home team 1962 Brazil. Best team 1958 Brazil. Best team So for the last 50 years you need to be the best, at home or Italy. I don't see any case for england winning "because it's a cup competition and you don't need to be the best". Basically you do. And given it's in Brazil they're going to be awful tough to beat. And if they can be beat it will be by a better team controlling the game through possession and physicality. (Spain/Germany? ). England don't have the ammo. England are in a great position to make the QF if they can get out of the group because their group is paired with a weak looking group. Columbia/Japan/Greece/Ivory Coast. But hard to see Eng doing well against Uruguay and how Italy will play is anyone's guess. |
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I don't see how it's possible to be bullish either way about England's prospects. The team he will put on the pitch has probably not been seen as a team yet, it will contain a number of players with very few caps, and several with little Tournament experience.
I've said on another thread that there is the potential for England to be very good, which I haven't believed before a single World Cup since 1998, but there's also the potential for a relatively inexperienced team to be dumped out in the first round. The key is how Hodgson uses the pace and young legs at his disposal. It's reasonable to expect England under Hodgson to be defensively well-drilled and solid, but further forward he has talented young players available to him who are unexposed at International level and could surprise. I'm convinced he will grasp the nettle, and that we will find out whether Lallana, Barkley, Henderson, Wilshere and Sterling are the real deal. Who's to say they won't be? |
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two good posts.
Bigpop, you're right, I think, about Brazil being the side to beat, but remember, we should have beat them last summer, we probably came closer than anyone. I know it was a friendly, but Brazil take their friendlies quite seriously. Why is it hard to see us beating Uruguay? Italy for me is the tough one, as I think they're a very good side. But Uruguay are pretty much a one man side, from what I've recently seen. Cavani the most overrated player on the planet, certainly at this level, and Lugano is a clown that must be targeted. My prediction would be draw with Italy, win against Uruguay, and a hard fought win against Costa Rica. |
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prediction/possibly bit of patriotism creeping in
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Uruguay are a long way from being a one man side (and for what it's worth the ugly racist is a lot more dangerous than anyone in England's team). They won 4 of their last 5 qualifiers and they reached the last 4 in the last WC. They're a proper side and playing them in South America will see England rightly the market outsiders.
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their squad seems to be aging to me, is the thing, most of the team is nearly thirty and aside from Suarez have no stand out players. one of the three has to miss out and I honestly think Uruguay are the worst of the three, Italy the best
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but it'll be close and very likely won't be dull!
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Every England game is dull
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Anyone who thinks England will do well in the world cup , want there bumps feeling. For some unknown reason people tend to think cos England players play in the English premier league they will do well anywhere else. When will people realise that they are being kidded by the media and all the pundits in believing that the premier league is quality.
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The above post by terrytp, is absoloutly correct.
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A while back I analysed the 22 or 23 man squads of the semi-finalists of the last six World Cups to see what leagues were most represented (where did the players play their club football?).
Italy (88); Germany (86); Spain (52); England (40); France (34); Brazil (33); Netherlands (23). It just shows where the money is in football - the European leagues. Only one of the 452 players played in the Argentina league. My bet is on Italy at 30s. No reason other than good or bad they often end up at the business end of the competition, and the odds are huge. |
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England have beaten Spain and Brazil in recent times, and should have beat Brazil away, with many players missing, last summer. I'm not saying that means we'll win the WC, but if you think results like that can be achieved by a mug side you need your bump feeling if they turn up, England can beat anyone. there is always a surprise side, why not us?
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I agree with Kincsem too. Italy are a good side, especially if Balotelli is at it. only concern I would have about them going far is that they got to the last final of a major tournament, which, imo, makes it a bit less likely this time
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did you read that thing about how Prandelli is conducting a bunch of fitness tests on all possible candidates for the Italy side, to see how they'll cope in the conditions of Brazil? found that interesting and thorough by Prandelli
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England have a chance. But I think to have a chance they need to roll the dice.
Use the younger players. Drop the players that failed in South Africa. This was the 2010 squad. Select NONE of these. Glen Johnson Ashley Cole Steven Gerrard Michael Dawson John Terry Aaron Lennon Frank Lampard Peter Crouch Wayne Rooney Joe Cole Robert Green Stephen Warnock Gareth Barry Matthew Upson James Milner Shaun Wright-Phillips Jamie Carragher Jermain Defoe Ledley King Emile Heskey Michael Carrick Joe Hart |
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looking at that 2010 squad I can't believe they didn't make it out of the second round
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England have no phucking chance. How are this squad of under-achievers going to succeed where no European side has done before? The dreamers on here are unbelievable.
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They seem to forget we are going to play in high humidity, something we are not used to, as is the case for all European teams. However, our squad, whoever is in it will struggle, because we lack quality. No good goalkeeper, an ageing John Terry at the back, a drained Steven Gerrard, from losing the League Title and Wayne Rooney (over-rated) but does work hard for the team and Welbeck up front, tells me that teams will look forward to playing England, rather than fearing them.
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an ageing John Terry at the back
this has to be some sort of a joke right? He was totally FINNISH 4 years ago. No way he can be in the squad. |
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But he will be, which tells you why England, will struggle to get through the group stage. Also there are not enough English players, playing in the Premier League, as there are far too many over-rated useless foreigners playing in the League. A big clear out of foreigners in the EPL, would be a big help, for future years ahead.
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If John Terry is in the squad (and no way he will be) England might as well change the air tickets and head off to Majorca for a p1ss up.
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Sorry, are you people party to a debate I've missed?
John Terry will not be on the plane to Brazil - it has been ruled out publicly by all parties, has it not? I'm not 100% sure that Wellbeck will be either. Cricketnut, You claim that the prevalence of foreign players is hampering England's chances, but is that even close to the truth? For example, the 1974 and 1978 World Cups were both England-free, when you could count the foreigners in our League on one hand at the time. We missed the 1994 World Cup after making the semi-finals in 1990, again when foreigners in the League were uncommon. I'm not claiming that we have been a good team over the last fifteen or so years, but we have consistently qualified and made the knockout stages, and on several occasions it has taken penalties, or a questionable decision, to beat us. We have been hard to break down, pretty solid, even if we have lacked imagination. My point is that under Hodgson we are unlikely to turn gungho, so we should remain fairly solid defensively, and the new players we can field in advanced positions will perhaps deliver the flair, imagination and pace that we have lacked. That is the hope, anyway. |
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