U.S. Horse Racing
Who makes these consistently stupid decisions, are they not answerable to someone higher.
Obviously the traders have video feed cause they are turning in-play. Who is actually trading in play with no video feed made public? Can't all be bots.
Makes you wonder!
I've played in-running on the US racing almost every day for the past 7 years or so and I can assure you that someone or some people have access to pics at least 5-6 secs ahead of the Betfair video at just about every track. Most winners go 1.01 or 1.02 at the furlong pole.
https://time.is/New_York
and compare the times you will see there is at the very least 3 seconds - sometimes more - between the 'live' video and the actual time.
Absolutely no chance that the BLV at the US tracks is only 1.5 secs behind live. Most winners are trading at 1.01-1.04 half a furlong out (6 seconds), even in close finishes.
But the important thing is if everyone playing is in the UK on a level playing field and they can't play the markets Stateside then playable.
People are either using live pics from somewhere, or GPS data, as the Betfair market is always well ahead of what we see on BLV. Don't forget that there's a 1 sec delay in placing bets too.
Also interesting is that the bookie PariMatch offers in-running betting on some US tracks (usually Wednesdays onwards) - load their markets up alongside the Betfair market when a US race is off and running, you'll see that the PariMatch odds often move around 1 sec earlier than the prices on Betfair do as they leave the final turn (they suspend as they hit the stretch), suggesting they are using GPS tracking or live pics. For example a horse in front might be trading at odds-on on Betfair and looking like the winner as they turn for home but will suddenly jump out to 8/1 on PariMatch, then lo and behold one second later they go huge on Betfair and 2 secs after that we see them being caught on the run for home.
This is a screengrab from Zia Park earlier (Zia Park is in New Mexico so is 2 hours ahead of New York time, but the mins and secs are the same).
The 4.53 at Laurel Park there, the 4 and 8 were fighting out the finish inside the final furlong and the camera zoomed in on just those two. Meanwhile the 9 horse was trading at odds-on despite not in view. Eventually the 9 horse emerged into shot and challenged the 8 horse all the way to the line, only to lose out in photo finish.
Laurel is a TPD track so the bets on the unseen closer would have been from GPS. Once you trade with GPS it becomes clear how much it is driving the US markets.
You can tell exactly how far behind the pics are for all TPD tracks because the GPS data is roughly 0.5 secs behind live. BFL is about 1 sec behind TPD and therefore about 1.5 secs behind live. The old style streams before they upgraded to fibre were more like 2-3 seconds.
Nov 23, 2023 -- 5:08PM, Martin Chuzzlewit wrote:
Whoever is betting using a considerable time advantage certainly isn't using the same pictures that we get on BLV.The 4.53 at Laurel Park there, the 4 and 8 were fighting out the finish inside the final furlong and the camera zoomed in on just those two. Meanwhile the 9 horse was trading at odds-on despite not in view. Eventually the 9 horse emerged into shot and challenged the 8 horse all the way to the line, only to lose out in photo finish.
Agree entirely with this. Plenty of races are fairish. Occasionally someone gets a complete bonus.
Nov 23, 2023 -- 6:48PM, jamee1 wrote:
You're making a very big assumption that the track clock on the live stream is accurate to the second, and very often they're not. Laurel is a TPD track so the bets on the unseen closer would have been from GPS. Once you trade with GPS it becomes clear how much it is driving the US markets.You can tell exactly how far behind the pics are for all TPD tracks because the GPS data is roughly 0.5 secs behind live. BFL is about 1 sec behind TPD and therefore about 1.5 secs behind live. The old style streams before they upgraded to fibre were more like 2-3 seconds.
I get what you're saying regarding GPS, whoever is using that is way ahead of BLV, but not what you're saying about the track clocks. It doesn't really make much sense.
For what you're saying to be true, then EVERY track clock must be wrong (because none of them are showing as just 1.5secs behind the world clock), 2 or more seconds wrong in fact (apart from Mountaineer which is faster than the rest), and isn't it strange how they are ALL running slow - surely the law of averages would mean at least one of them would be fast?
I don't see how, with todays technology, a track video would not be linked to the perfectly accurate time freely and easily available - it's not like the pre-internet days when the clocks had to be set manually. Surely it's more of an big assumption to think that all the track clocks are running behind time (does no-one ever check?) than the more simple and logical explanation that the live video has more of a delay than you think.
It's not just that. When you're playing in-running regularly (like I have on just about every day for 7 years) then you get the feel of how far you're behind and which tracks are more playable than others. I just can't have it that the BLV is only 1.5s behind live and just 1 sec behind the GPS players. Often things happen on the Betfair market and it's not for another 2 or 3 seconds that that move is mirrored on what we are seeing and what the commentator is saying.
A race the other day had 5 horses in a line at the half furlong pole (6 secs from the wire), all being hard ridden and it was impossible to be confident of which one would win, yet the 7 horse suddenly jumped in to around 1.3 (outsider pre-race) and then went even shorter, and lo and behold that's the one that edged ahead late on to win. This happens regularly and they rarely get it wrong, which they would if they were only 1s behind.
A question for you regarding the GPS players - whenever there is a tight finish (even very tight finishes or with a dodgy angle), the last price matched on the winner is nearly always very short (often 1.03 or shorter) while conversely the last price matched on the beaten horse is nearly always long odds-against. How do the GPS players know, without pics, which horse got it's nostril ahead on the line? If the tracker is in the weight cloth then there's no way to be sure of a photo winner as all horses are different lengths and many photos come down to the head bob. Whoever is confidently betting in these photos simply must have access to pics and it sure ain't the BLV ones.
GOLDEN GATE FIELDS is approx 3.2 secs behind tonight.
Woodbine shows 1.5 secs behind
Churchill Downs shows 1.5 secs behind
Gulfstream shows 1.5 secs behind
Laurel shows 1.5 secs behind
Tampa Bay shows 2.5 secs behind
Aqueduct shows 7.5 secs behind
These are all TPD tracks and they all look to have exactly the same delay vs GPS so most likely Aqueduct (and perhaps also Tampa) just have their clocks wrong.
