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elisjohn
24 Sep 09 19:04
Joined:
Date Joined: 15 Jun 03
| Topic/replies: 18,216 | Blogger: elisjohn's blog
my mums will which seems did with her bank hsbc is around 30000 between 4 of us, not including the house, their rep called today and said that they would be taking around 7000 out for handling the will. is this correct or can we get maye a solicitor etc cheaper the bank said we had to deal with them. it seems that mum had put the bank and my brother as executors , is this our own fault
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Report Splicer Keats September 24, 2009 9:12 PM BST
Dont know your circumstances really, but my mothers was done with a solicitor for 2k, these vary wildly though, i was happy with the cost, but not the will terms :(
Report Partridge September 24, 2009 9:39 PM BST
you kidding? wasnted to do one myself just in case (only 30), but is this normal?
Report madasahatter September 24, 2009 9:48 PM BST
The link is to a book that has most of the answers - and comes strongly recomended by me.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wills-Probate-Administer-Someone-Consumer/dp/1844900185

They advise steering clear of having banks as executors as their fees can be exorbitant!!
Report michael knight September 24, 2009 10:08 PM BST
Mother and Father's will was done for around £400 with a solicitor.

7k is daylight robbery.
Report crediter September 24, 2009 11:49 PM BST
with violence..........
Report DFCIRONMAN September 25, 2009 12:43 AM BST
Interesting if what you post is "true"............................................

If financial people are under attack by NO WIN NO FEE solicitors, then logically EXECUTORS, usually solicitors and other financial services bodies, seem to be able to operate in a way that perhaps is open to major criticism ....in that they draft the will and then get appointed EXECUTORS etc ....

Surely there is a conflict there?!
Report DFCIRONMAN September 25, 2009 12:50 AM BST
FSA will sort em out ...................not !
Report getting better September 25, 2009 2:08 AM BST
Both my parents have died fairly recently and we used David Pell of Morley Brown. He's sometimes a little slow but very good and doesn't charge like the Light Brigade.
http://www.morleybrown.co.uk/people/pelld.htm
Report chisel September 25, 2009 8:38 AM BST
If they named the Bank as executor , they often charge a percentage of the estateiously include teh value of all assetts.

When I worked at RBS they would offer a free will service, but they only offered it free when they were named as executor. If they "sold" it to your mum without any input from family you may be able to claim that it was mis sold.

DISGRACE
Report chisel September 25, 2009 8:39 AM BST
Sorry typing gone wrong!

Should read that Banks when named as executors charge a percentage of teh value of the entire estate.
Report reb September 25, 2009 8:43 AM BST
elisjohn, ask them for a breakdown of the fee.
Report elisjohn September 25, 2009 8:45 AM BST
chisel, it now seems this what happened, she was offered a free will if named as executors, they didnt mention this massive charges, and yes she did it alone , were would you go from here as complaining etc. hope this is a warning to all to beware of banks
Report elisjohn September 25, 2009 8:49 AM BST
p s in my first thread on here i said did not include the house, but it does, house worth around 150,000,so would their charges seem ok now.the bank holds approx30000 in low risk shares,plus the house, and beneficiries of the will are 4 adults and 5 kids
Report chisel September 25, 2009 9:24 AM BST
Ells

Yes. 5% of the estate (180000) is£ 9000. I think you have a very good case to complain if she did it alone. Why the need to appoint the bank as executors on a simple estate? I can appreciate that if you do not have family that are capable of dealing with things the bank is a good option.

Banks really have a responsibility to your mother and her family(you) to ensure that when they sell a will they explain to everyone what is happening.If your mother was elderley she may not have known what she was signiong up for. Do you think your mum would allow the bank to charge her 9000? Was she offered the alternative option of simply paying for the will? This is a big rip off. An absolute disgrace. Ask teh bank to give you all the diocumentation available at the time of writing her will
Report HarryCrumb September 25, 2009 9:46 AM BST
Never make a bank or a solicitor an executor to a will.
Report chisel September 25, 2009 9:49 AM BST
Harry!

We know that , but it is a bit late for ellis.

I have heard some horror stories lately, but the bottom line is that if someone knows what teh cost is at the outset then tehre is not much of a problem. Howevr, solicitors have a nasty habbit of finding lots of additional work which costs a lot of money. Banks , on the other hand are worse! They charge a percentage of the estate , and dress the sale of teh will up as if it is FREE. That is misleading!
Report HarryCrumb September 25, 2009 10:08 AM BST
I find solicitors impossible to deal with. You cant get anything done in a sensible timescale, they spend far more time looking after their interests than yours and the fees they charge for next to nothing is a joke. Mine is currently threatening me because Im refusing to pay him a grand for a job he took months to do, didnt do properly and then quit half way through. Yet somehow he still thinks he is going to get paid his full bill.
Report buzzer September 25, 2009 10:08 AM BST
and people defend banks, and their charges, and tell people to shut up and pay what they owe! The banks are the biggest thieving, lowlife establishments around and get away with, what is basically, fraud time and time again!
Report DFCIRONMAN September 25, 2009 11:27 AM BST
Putting it in perspective-

If an insurance broker can be sued for not outlining, and proving they outlined, various options before someone took out an endowment insurance policy...................explaining fees/commission etc ...........and the sums involved are generally relatively "trivial"........then if someone DRAFTS a will and they have their name on will as EXECUTOR, and most wills deal with vastly more sums of money, "investment" business areas, surely there is a huge conflict of interest position when such firms get appointed EXECUTOR.

Trouble is it would need a legal firm to take on such "appointments", would be a major problem for most legal firms/banks etc etc.....................if not it needs the FSA to exercise some control on how wills are completed.

Maybe there is FSA rules on ensuring EXECUTORS are appointed fairly in such "conflict of interest" situations. ?????

Perhaps the fees indicated above for size of estate are not unreasonable......all depends how many beneficiaries, locating them,......how difficult to sell house, if being sold etc.....

As it was a BANK acting as Executor, then a solicitor would know whether their fees are excessive or not ......provided they know all the facts re case.....why not ask your solicitor? Also check FSA position.
Report DFCIRONMAN September 25, 2009 12:02 PM BST
Just read a bit of a web-site using Google

Fee tariff rates executors Scotland

Don't want to "spam" anyone's site ....but you should find site I have indicated ( an EDINBURGH firm)

The information there might help a wee bit! GL
Report DFCIRONMAN September 25, 2009 4:37 PM BST
CAN YOU SACK AN EXECUTOR?

Properly drawn up wills will stipulate who the executors are. Executors cannot usually be removed if they are acting in fiduciary and unpaid capacity. But, an executor who wishes to be paid as a
Report marvinho September 25, 2009 8:06 PM BST
Make sure you check what the position is with regard to your mothers agreement with the bank over the Will + Executor "deal"

It may be that you can remove HSBC as executors but you don't want that trigger a charge for the Will (could just imagine HSBC saying no problem removing them but as the original "discount" on the Will was conditional on them being appointed, the discount is gone and we want £xxx!)
Report ELISJOHNBROTHER September 26, 2009 7:58 PM BST
HSBC is charging £8000 incl Vat which was not explained to my mother when she signed the will. I've told the gentleman from the bank that I will act as sole exector. He said he would knock off £1000! I said to him that all needs to be done is to cancel 4 direct debits, sell the house(one of the family is going to buy it) and send distribute the money to 9 beneficieries. I'd already cancelled the direct debits, 4 simple phone calls.Simple. So how on earth can they justify a charge of £8000. Banks are robbers. In the end he admitted that the bank had no legal right to act as exuctors and decided to send a form for me to sign to discharge their duties....for a small sum of £250 + vat
Report what do i do now? September 28, 2009 7:25 AM BST
elisjohn -

HSBC is charging £8000 incl Vat which was not explained to my mother when she signed the will. I've told the gentleman from the bank that I will act as sole exector. He said he would knock off £1000! I said to him that all needs to be done is to cancel 4 direct debits, sell the house(one of the family is going to buy it) and send distribute the money to 9 beneficieries. I'd already cancelled the direct debits, 4 simple phone calls.Simple. So how on earth can they justify a charge of £8000. Banks are robbers. In the end he admitted that the bank had no legal right to act as exuctors and decided to send a form for me to sign to discharge their duties....for a small sum of £250 + vat

-----------------

well done mate. fuacking cunnts want kicking to death. how many bereaved people, who are under far too much stress and upset to be bothered, just let these ***s get away with it? yr mums dead, and her bank is trying to screw there last bit of cash out of her - absolutely disgraceful.

what a way to earn a livinjg - ripping off emotionally distressed human beings. im surprised the banks havent diversified into undertaking - they could really put the boot in then.
Report chisel September 28, 2009 9:37 AM BST
Elis

Top job mate! You really could not make up what the banks do at times!. This "free Will" stunt has been going on for years.
Report clouded leopard September 28, 2009 10:59 AM BST
7k ?

i nearly choked on my cornflakes

surely all you have to do is write a little letter and get the girlfriend to sign it

thats what she told me anyway :p
Report kohaku September 28, 2009 4:59 PM BST
lol

You can do it yourself for nothing.
Report TJM September 29, 2009 1:07 PM BST
Well done. 1 up for the man in the street :-)
Report crediter September 30, 2009 10:03 PM BST
why the bank estimated 7-8k is for their time....with four people in will ..could mean lots of sqabbling and contesting various points as to there own favourable or not gains...in fact 3-4k would seem a norm.
Report ImSoLuckyLucky! October 4, 2009 11:58 AM BST
In todays Independent
Suggested that the only solution is to
apply to the High Court

High cost

Neogiate with them to a lower rate
To avoid high court action

:)
Report elisjohn November 22, 2009 2:30 PM GMT
thanks all, we took advice from here and told hsc to more or less get lost, cost us a couple of hundred , well worth it, money has come through now and we dont have to fork out the 6000
Report wolsey end November 22, 2009 7:38 PM GMT
elis - really well done.

how many people, emotionally distressed after a death, dont bother, though?

banks = parasites.
Report chisel November 23, 2009 1:09 PM GMT
Eaxactly

Well done ellis, and good luck to you and your family
Report towers21. November 23, 2009 6:37 PM GMT
i work for company that sells wills - stores them - and allows as many changes as you want in your lifetime

we charge £200

we pay £30

anything over that is a complete rip off

HTH
Report noddys ryde November 25, 2009 3:48 PM GMT
itclegal provide executorship services for about a quarter of what a bank / local solicitor combine charges.
Report overboard November 25, 2009 5:27 PM GMT
Never ever ever use a bank as executors. Its a flat rate percent.

Solicitors much cheaper and if there is a house in the estate and a tax return to sort out, are going to be needed anyway.

Never use one of these cowboy will writing firms if you actually have any money to leave. IHT etc is very complicated and you need a specialist lawyer not a kid with a tick box lid.

The above represents my views having sorted out my first wifes estate and both my parents. My fathers estate was complicated and there were many properties to deal with here and overseas. I found a good lawyer and was very pleased with the service and costs involved. I couldnt have done it myself.
Report Platini November 25, 2009 6:07 PM GMT
some shocking figures there.

Isn't it free to do a living will yourself?
Report The Knight December 5, 2009 11:33 AM GMT
Do not pay that!

Did my mum and dad's will myself. Took both to probate myself, took mum's house (dad died first) through land registry to transfer ownership and even handled conveyancing myself when sold.

The fees charged for this stuff are outrageous.

Incidentally, the Land Registry office I used to transfer house to me was brilliant. Did all forms online and then called them before printing them off so I could check what I had done was correct.

Girl there was excellent, helpful and seemed to have the view they were tired with dealing with solicitors ripping off the public.

Try to do as much as you can yourselves, both now and in the future.
Report unitedbiscuits December 8, 2011 5:58 PM GMT
Well done forum, good work.

I'm just bumping this cos of my concerns, which elisjohn was kind enough to address.
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