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SAD IF ADRIAN HAS TO QUIT TRAINING AS DOWN TO 5 HORSES SURELY GIGGINSTOWN /JP MCMANUS /RICCI COULD SEND FEW TO THIS MAN WHO WAS GREAT JOCKEY AND DECENT TRAINER BUT EVEN BETTER DOWN EARTH BLOKE AS IM SURE ELLIOT AND REST TRAINERS HAVE NEARLY TOO MANY ?
JUST THINK SUCH FINE HORSEMAN BE SAD LOSS AND BOUND BE SOMEONE rich OWNERS COULD SEND HIM FEW DECENT TO TRAIN AS IVE NO DOUBT HE WILL TRAIN GRADE ONE WINNERS LIKE THE REST
I NO ITS LONG SHOT BUT THE LIKE OF HIM WILL BE SAD LOSS TO THE GAME AS NOBODY HAS PUT ANY MORE INTO THE SPORT THAT THIS TOP CLASS MAN AND ONE THE GREATEST JOCKEYS I EVER SEEN .
Adrian Maguire, born 29 April 1971 in Kilmessan,[1] County Meath, Ireland, is a racehorse trainer and former jockey.
Maguire began his career in Irish pony racing at the age of nine, in which he rode more than 200 winners.[2] In 1990 he rode his first winner under rules, at Sligo, before his first victory in the United Kingdom a year later. In the 1993-1994 season he rode 194 winners but lost the jockeys' championship by a margin of three to Richard Dunwoody. Maguire won a total of 1,024 races in the UK[3] and has been described as "the greatest jump jockey never to end up as [British jump racing Champion Jockey]".[4]
He announced his retirement from race riding on 28 October 2002, at the age of 31,[5] following a fall at Warwick in March in which he broke his neck and was lucky to avoid paralysis.[6] Maguire later became a racehorse trainer and is based in Lombardstown, County Cork.[7]
Maguire's nephew, Jason Maguire, is also a National Hunt jockey and won the 2011 Grand National on Ballabriggs.[8]
JUST THINK SUCH FINE HORSEMAN BE SAD LOSS AND BOUND BE SOMEONE rich OWNERS COULD SEND HIM FEW DECENT TO TRAIN AS IVE NO DOUBT HE WILL TRAIN GRADE ONE WINNERS LIKE THE REST
I NO ITS LONG SHOT BUT THE LIKE OF HIM WILL BE SAD LOSS TO THE GAME AS NOBODY HAS PUT ANY MORE INTO THE SPORT THAT THIS TOP CLASS MAN AND ONE THE GREATEST JOCKEYS I EVER SEEN .
Adrian Maguire, born 29 April 1971 in Kilmessan,[1] County Meath, Ireland, is a racehorse trainer and former jockey.
Maguire began his career in Irish pony racing at the age of nine, in which he rode more than 200 winners.[2] In 1990 he rode his first winner under rules, at Sligo, before his first victory in the United Kingdom a year later. In the 1993-1994 season he rode 194 winners but lost the jockeys' championship by a margin of three to Richard Dunwoody. Maguire won a total of 1,024 races in the UK[3] and has been described as "the greatest jump jockey never to end up as [British jump racing Champion Jockey]".[4]
He announced his retirement from race riding on 28 October 2002, at the age of 31,[5] following a fall at Warwick in March in which he broke his neck and was lucky to avoid paralysis.[6] Maguire later became a racehorse trainer and is based in Lombardstown, County Cork.[7]
Maguire's nephew, Jason Maguire, is also a National Hunt jockey and won the 2011 Grand National on Ballabriggs.[8]
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The problem is there are hardly any winnable races in Ireland. We have very little low to medium grade racing and this kills guys like Maguire. I don't see how any of the trainers who don't have top class horses make Irish NH racing pay (and they probably don't make it pay but are in it for other reasons). I'd bring in more of the rated novice chases they seem pretty good, bring in a new series of maiden hurdles for trainers who haven't won x amount of races in the last year, and a load of new low grade handicaps, I'd say we could add plenty and still have regular 16 runner fields.
I was willing his second on yesterday after seeing the interview, he is badly up against it as are many without a big owner,all this talk about things getting better,not really,the days of lads with syndicates are while still just about there are a lot less.
His son Finny is a decent enough jock and studying in Cork
Micheal Hourigan was also on ATR,imagine he has very few as well compared to 15 years ago, he is getting on though.
As an aside that bumper winner(As You Were) i thought looked very good,not quite Fayonagh visually but a clear second for me this season so far,one to follow.
His son Finny is a decent enough jock and studying in Cork
Micheal Hourigan was also on ATR,imagine he has very few as well compared to 15 years ago, he is getting on though.
As an aside that bumper winner(As You Were) i thought looked very good,not quite Fayonagh visually but a clear second for me this season so far,one to follow.
Half Brother to a Italian Derby winner as well Pa,I wonder what he would make at the Cheltenham sales...
Good topic norn: the politics of Irish racing and bloodstock doesn't get much of an airing here.
With 20-20 hindsight, Maguire and probably the likes of Culloty set up in the wrong country and should have stayed where they made their fame and fortune. Asking the big guys to support them is akin to a call for charity and that's not how they work. Most, with the exception of the Swiss resident - who operates his own Exchequer in Ireland - are ruthless for success and pay where they expect to find it.
Custom: I would disagree with your "winnable races" if that's your main argument regarding Maguire's decline. Its more likely there are no owners now to support all the small men and no-one is doing anything about it. I often think that HRI is so hamstrung by being an effective semi-state body that it has zero chance of finding innovative solutions to the present crisis. I know of other trainers personally who are in Maguire's predicament but all have a few acres to fall back on (or other options).
With 20-20 hindsight, Maguire and probably the likes of Culloty set up in the wrong country and should have stayed where they made their fame and fortune. Asking the big guys to support them is akin to a call for charity and that's not how they work. Most, with the exception of the Swiss resident - who operates his own Exchequer in Ireland - are ruthless for success and pay where they expect to find it.
Custom: I would disagree with your "winnable races" if that's your main argument regarding Maguire's decline. Its more likely there are no owners now to support all the small men and no-one is doing anything about it. I often think that HRI is so hamstrung by being an effective semi-state body that it has zero chance of finding innovative solutions to the present crisis. I know of other trainers personally who are in Maguire's predicament but all have a few acres to fall back on (or other options).
If we're talking about visually impressive bumper winners there won't be many more visually impressive winners than early doors who hacked up at punchestown 2 weeks ago
Mar 10, 2017 -- 4:05PM, RoyalAcademy wrote:
Good topic norn: the politics of Irish racing and bloodstock doesn't get much of an airing here.With 20-20 hindsight, Maguire and probably the likes of Culloty set up in the wrong country and should have stayed where they made their fame and fortune. Asking the big guys to support them is akin to a call for charity and that's not how they work. Most, with the exception of the Swiss resident - who operates his own Exchequer in Ireland - are ruthless for success and pay where they expect to find it. Custom: I would disagree with your "winnable races" if that's your main argument regarding Maguire's decline. Its more likely there are no owners now to support all the small men and no-one is doing anything about it. I often think that HRI is so hamstrung by being an effective semi-state body that it has zero chance of finding innovative solutions to the present crisis. I know of other trainers personally who are in Maguire's predicament but all have a few acres to fall back on (or other options).
You can't just say "he needs more owners". Owners aren't charities. You have to address why trainers like him make no appeal to the people who own racehorses. I know if I owned a racehorse the last place I'd send it is to one of Ireland's struggling trainers, there's just no point. If you have a bad horse send it to England at least it will be able to win there. If you have a good horse you send it to a trainer who is actually successful.
Of course, he needs more owners.
If I had a horse to race I couldn't see the point of giving one horse to Mullins or Elliott-you'd be a non-entity inevitably. Sending a horse to England is not to the liking of most, especially in the jumps game. Most trainers below a handful are struggling. I expect many people preferred to support a local guy or gal in the past and these trainers don't become bad trainers overnight (Hourigan, Moore, O'Grady, Murphy, Hughes, Doyle, Griffin etc.). That local or one-horse-man simply isn't there any longer - mainly economics - and the bigger the behemoths get, the harder it will be to compete or survive.
If you depend on training horses to make a living its a numbers game and those numbers that equal financial viability are a distant hope for many. The oligarchs don't care but they are causing a lot of the hardship by concentrating on three trainers in the smallest pond.
I think there's a lot of new thinking needed and there's not a spark of it at present.
If I had a horse to race I couldn't see the point of giving one horse to Mullins or Elliott-you'd be a non-entity inevitably. Sending a horse to England is not to the liking of most, especially in the jumps game. Most trainers below a handful are struggling. I expect many people preferred to support a local guy or gal in the past and these trainers don't become bad trainers overnight (Hourigan, Moore, O'Grady, Murphy, Hughes, Doyle, Griffin etc.). That local or one-horse-man simply isn't there any longer - mainly economics - and the bigger the behemoths get, the harder it will be to compete or survive.
If you depend on training horses to make a living its a numbers game and those numbers that equal financial viability are a distant hope for many. The oligarchs don't care but they are causing a lot of the hardship by concentrating on three trainers in the smallest pond.
I think there's a lot of new thinking needed and there's not a spark of it at present.
Royal while I agree good trainers dont become bad trainers overnight its possible that some of the so-called good ones were never much good anyway especially the ones who wouldnt even know how to lie straight in bed.
I do agree arkle and I know i've offered a few hostages above. It's a different debate though: good versus bad but I do worry what the Irish NH scene will resemble in a few years.
Maybe things are as transitory as ever:
M.V. winning everything in the 70's
Irish flat racing in the doldrums from mid-80's to mid-90's
Ireland struggling at Cheltenham
Sheikh Mohammed's dominance - Racing Post: will they (middle-eastern owners) win every Group 1 next season (circa 1998)?
Ballydoyle likely to ruin Irish flat racing in 2000's..emphatic no! now
Willie Mullins dominance for a decade............seriously under threat in the blink of an eye
I am probably morning for an older generation who have simply had their day.
If O'Leary hadn't fallen out with WP he was about to increase his numbers with him by 50% to almost 100 beasts-that never made any sense to me.
Maybe things are as transitory as ever:
M.V. winning everything in the 70's
Irish flat racing in the doldrums from mid-80's to mid-90's
Ireland struggling at Cheltenham
Sheikh Mohammed's dominance - Racing Post: will they (middle-eastern owners) win every Group 1 next season (circa 1998)?
Ballydoyle likely to ruin Irish flat racing in 2000's..emphatic no! now
Willie Mullins dominance for a decade............seriously under threat in the blink of an eye
I am probably morning for an older generation who have simply had their day.
If O'Leary hadn't fallen out with WP he was about to increase his numbers with him by 50% to almost 100 beasts-that never made any sense to me.
The main advantage that the likes of Mullins has over the smaller trainers is the fact that he is able to source high class thoroughbreds from France through the Harold Kirk and his agent in France. When I started watching racing 12 years ago, I remember 24 of the Cheltenham winners that year were Irish bred, 2 French bred and 1 English bred. French breds dominate the top racehorses now. A lot of the trainers Royal Academy mentions were top trainers at that time but have struggled since. I think they have suffered a lot because they have not been able to source the best horses from France. Mullins was one of the first Irish trainers to buy a lot from France and his massive success attracted new, powerful owners. Now, he has such a powerful list of clients willing to pay top dollar to buy the best French horses and other trainers could not compete in trying to buy these horses even if they wanted to.
They source high class rubbish as well but you tend not to hear so much about them.
There's more to it than sourcing the good horses. I'd imagine WM works a lot harder than practically every other trainer around but he obviously has a very good and reliable team also.
FAIR PLAY LADS SOME GREAT REPLIES FROM VERY RESPECTED POSTERS
LETS HOPE THAT ADRIAN GETS COUPLE DECENT HORSES AS IVE NO DOUBT HE COULD WELL BE GOLD CUP WINNING TRAINOR IN FUTURE .
LETS HOPE THAT ADRIAN GETS COUPLE DECENT HORSES AS IVE NO DOUBT HE COULD WELL BE GOLD CUP WINNING TRAINOR IN FUTURE .
Wouldn't be privy to the ins and outs of it lads but he'd be a loss to the game if he chucks it in.
Would have thought he's be a success at it.
Just looking at the Novice Chase @ Naas today all for runners owned by the same owner,surely not a healthy scenario.
Would have thought he's be a success at it.
Just looking at the Novice Chase @ Naas today all for runners owned by the same owner,surely not a healthy scenario.
Very few trainers making it pay. Quite a few are on payment plans with tatts/goffs for horses bought at the sales.
At least with that outfit you know they're ALL trying unlike others I could mention.
Nice to see his horse get up after a hard fall there.
He seemed quite keen on his bumper runner(same trio that ran last time) and thought it may come on for the last day,at around 7/1 he only has a few lths to find with the 7/4 fav,with the bare 8 looks to have a good chance of a place.
He seemed quite keen on his bumper runner(same trio that ran last time) and thought it may come on for the last day,at around 7/1 he only has a few lths to find with the 7/4 fav,with the bare 8 looks to have a good chance of a place.
I don't know some small trainers are able to get by. Couple points though I disagree with established trainers inside the rails being allowed to run horses in p2p. That's the only arena where small guys can window shop.
Point to point winners are reaching some astronomical sums so any trainer who doesn't have a big owner is up against it.
I don't see why small owners or trainers don't run horses in small field graded races. There is money to be made from place money. I would as it's 20 grand a year basic fees to train a horse.
Point to point winners are reaching some astronomical sums so any trainer who doesn't have a big owner is up against it.
I don't see why small owners or trainers don't run horses in small field graded races. There is money to be made from place money. I would as it's 20 grand a year basic fees to train a horse.
The problem with running in small field graded races is if you finish close to a good one you can expect a good rise in the weights.A good example is rashaan.
Rashaan was only hiked because he won and that was fair enough. If you finish a close 2nd/3rd/4th to a much better horse in a conditions race Phil Smith will more or less leave you alone, Swincombe Scorchio a very good recent example. I wish Noel O'Brien would take the same view.
Very big loss to racing. My favourite jockey of all time. Brought horsemanship to a new level and so so unlucky never to be crowned champion. Its a pity Paul Rooney wouldnt send him a few decent ones considering Jason Maguire is his racing manager. Rooney has plenty of horse with Elliott. Why not give Adrian a chance.
I'd say Jason is a bit of a mé féiner, didn't exactly advocate for his mate McCain when push came to shove I'd say. You'd wonder what would've happened to the likes of Peddlers Cross if McCain had had a jockey who could tell him when to back the fck off.
It was Rashaan last run at gorwan i was referring to.7lbs for finishing third.
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