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25 Apr 16 14:05
Date Joined: 13 Oct 10
| Topic/replies: 12,539 | Blogger: tony57's blog
won as he liked on debut in a decent bumper @newbury for henderson,right after the race the trainer said he,ll come here, friend of mine who was there on the day was very impressed with this 4yr old by azamour, i think he,ll be short enough but should take some stopping if runs up to his debut and has come on for it.
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Report Kelly April 28, 2016 9:47 AM BST
Wet snow here up north , and cold to boot . Anyone near Naas ?
Report Bigwillystyle April 28, 2016 12:04 PM BST
Raining since 7 this morning.
Report punchestown April 28, 2016 1:41 PM BST
Still raining heavy,got to be getting into the ground at this stage..
Report winsamsoon April 28, 2016 1:48 PM BST
Josies Orders, Alpha Des Obleaux and Invitation Only all look solid. The fact that a few odds on shots have been beaten this week is probably meaning that that these 3 are bigger than they should be. I think if this were Tueday again all 3 would be odds on.
Report norn iron April 28, 2016 3:37 PM BST


Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 28, 2016 4:23 PM BST
WD Bryan Cooper...great jump at the last sealed it (no bet)
Report maxheadroom April 28, 2016 6:51 PM BST
salsify 10s for the hunters tomorra value?
Report kavvie April 28, 2016 7:02 PM BST
douvan is some horse.willie said there in an interview on rte he might go gc route.. he could be the best for a long time if he stays..
Report tonkability April 29, 2016 11:41 AM BST
Making my first ever visit to track today
5-30 My Tent Or Yours
6-05Jers Girl
Report workrider April 29, 2016 2:26 PM BST
Yankee for today. Bonny Kate . I.Thief. A Toi Phil. Avant Tout .
Report Kelly April 29, 2016 9:47 PM BST
Some great performances today , pity about the site outage here though .
Report Snookerpunter April 30, 2016 12:05 AM BST
Bonny Kate must have a wind problem. Again cantered into it, a huge leap 4 out putting her odds on to my eye, only to be beaten half a furlong later. Very similar to her Irish National effort.

Great scenes for On The Fringe. Fantastic performance. VVM battled well. She went off an absolutely stupid price(Thank God for the outage!!)
Report CheltenhamRoar April 30, 2016 12:18 AM BST
Identity thief will be some chaser, 3miles and fences is what this fellow needs now
Report workrider April 30, 2016 11:14 AM BST
Backed Bonny myself Callit , and was unhappy from the start , when she won here the last day she jumped out and made all, and they never saw her again . I'm sure thats the way to ride her ,unless she has a problem that is . Noels horses are running poor , had a look at his in the bumper ,looked really well ran like a drain . A couple of kids near me thought they'd finished as they past the line first time in the H/Chase they'ed backed OTF and were going mad thinking it was beat , when I told them they had to go round again they calmed down , second time around they were delerious with joy . Pity they only pop up at festivals , Punchestown lost a big oppertunity , never once were this kids asked their opinions about racing .
Report maxheadroom April 30, 2016 11:41 AM BST
bonny kate lost it at the first two fences jumped sideways for some reason. at the end of that hunters race all i could hear on atr way ole ole ole. fkn muppets imho.
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 10:10 AM BST
JP had some festival , which might have caused a little gnashing of teeth in some quarters . 
Very little praise forthcoming on here for some excellent performances from those in his colours , main input concerned those who disappointed ( presumably that's down mainly to pocket talk ). In relation to those  who under performed in light of form and betting markets, one was trained by Henderson , two by O'Brien . Presumably they are part of the conspiracy theories prevalent .
Report workrider May 1, 2016 10:37 AM BST
Kelly , having been at Punchestown for most of the week ,and  listening around the course ,very few punters hold that outfit in the same high esteem as you seem too . I heard them say, that outfit are non punter friendly .Anyone who deems them otherwise are fooling themselves imo. They care little or nothing about us , we are cannon fodder for them ,the friendiness has all but gone from punters .
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 11:00 AM BST
High esteem is not a term I would apply to the scene , workrider . I always am in favour of a level playing field  though , so one sided viewpoints dont attract me  , and until someone comes up with positive proof instead of hearsay  they get the benefit of the doubt.  All of the JP horses I backed this week won for me , 3 only , all overpriced in my opinion pre race  , none in handicaps .

I dont back in handicaps ( except extremely rarely ) , particularly those in the cavalry charge category, and most of JP's horses run in handicaps , so I would rarely have a complaint about most of his horses on a pocket basis .

Horses can make fools of us all .  Air Force Blue has been a short price for the 2000 Guneas for the last 6 months , started odds on , finished second last I think , virtually first horse beaten , yet the "vibes" coming from the connections was all good .

When you have as many horses as JP has , punters expecting even a considerable number of them to run exactly to form is a pipe dream . People highlight the ones they want to , forget about the failed "gambles" .  JP does not need the money , its sport for him .  Employing as many trainers as he does leaves a lot of doors open , if I were him I would stick to a couple of tried and trusted trainers , but ultimately that might result in the sport ( particularly NH) becoming completely lob sided .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 12:18 PM BST
I could have sworn you said before that you dont bet on horses anymore kelly just 3 or 4 bets a year I thought, yet low and behold 3 bets 3 winners this week alone.
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 12:28 PM BST
Backing to trade , the wasp .  You have to read ALL the content of my posts , not just pick out parts of them .  I was tempted though by the 9/4 Jers Girl , laid it back though at considerably less , so it was a nice winner .  Thought about not laying any back .
Report snap crackle and pop May 1, 2016 12:30 PM BST
It's as simple as this lads, Kelly has the game by the absolute bawlox!
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 12:47 PM BST
I had dozens of bets this week , the wasp , mostly at Punchestown where there was value betimes  , some firms betting a quarter the odds a place all races .   The 9/4 Jers Girl only lasted 15 minutes , most people will not have seen it unless they were Johnny on the spot .
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 12:53 PM BST
Snap , crackle , pop , I work at it . And I win .  And I am not greedy . Its out there if you know where to look ,( and where its a waste of time ) , but increasingly its getting harder to find value .  Outside of the big meetings the bookies are running a very tight ship , with the inbuilt benefit of big over rounds on races they know attract attention because of media hype .

Anyone can do it , most cant be bothered for various reasons , I have plenty of time and interest , its just the way the cookie crumbles .
Report snap crackle and pop May 1, 2016 12:56 PM BST
And you certainly know all the right places to look Kelly!

Game by the absolute short and curlys fella, fair play.
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 1:09 PM BST
I was out and about each morning around 9.a.m  , having walked the dog etc at 7.a.m , ( sometimes earlier depending on wake up time ).  generally I did not get home until after 3 p.m , racing to start at 3.40 generally ( Punchestown , although there were a few other transactions pre Punchestown  start at other meetings .

Think that entitles me to earn a few bob .  Not every week is like that though , depends on whats available .
Report snap crackle and pop May 1, 2016 1:17 PM BST
The dog probably unearthed a few good tricasts and forecasts on the morning walks too.

In a league of your own fella.
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 1:20 PM BST
So the 3 winners are now 3 trades you couldnt make it up
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 1:52 PM BST
Trades are winners in my book , the wasp. Little and often , but the bigger the odds the more profit generally as I always keep a few quid or more up my sleeve , sometimes to lay in running .

Dont think I have done a forecast or tricast for last 15 years or more , snap . Picking a winner is hard enough without getting involved in these .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 1:56 PM BST
the 3 green and gold winners you bravely aftertimed were in fact 3 succesful trades ?
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 2:04 PM BST
Snap , anyone with a brain , time , resources , AND INTEREST , can do what I do . I started on the journey 15 years ago approx , told anyone who listened exactly what I did , and advised them to copy .  Not one did .  My conclusion was that most people are lazy and couldn't be bothered , or had not the time or inclination . I just kept trucking , but its buttons now compared with then .

Sometimes ( most times) you only get one bite at the cherry . Loads missed out I reckon . Anyone could operate now for a limited time , until the books find out and pull up the drawbridge .  Then it might be multiple accounts etc , never did that myself generally ( one or two did some bets for me occasionally , but I didn't want to compromise them long term ) .
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 2:11 PM BST
The term after timed is designed to indicate certain traits , the wasp , as far as I know my only reference to the 3 JP horses was in this thread . And it was in response to others who said that JP's horse activity was not punter friendly .  It was to me , I left out any others he had this week ( and he had a lot , 9 in one race apparently ) .

People who find it obligatory to try and solve every race no doubt finish up in the poor house , and statistically they will back a lot of JP horses in the course of their travels . I dont . Maybe thats why I am pretty sanguine about his horses activity , they dont cost me money generally .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 2:23 PM BST
so again were the 3 brave winners you aftertimed again winning trades or winning bets?
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 2:29 PM BST
I am going to have to ignore your posts , the wasp , if you have anything constructive to say you are free to fire away .  Otherwise stop trying to score points .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 2:36 PM BST
thats what i thought kelly hard to keep track of all the waffle, the only surprise for me is you hadnt backed leicester for the premier league aswell
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 2:41 PM BST
Seldom bet on soccer , it bores me generally . Look up my post re Leicester .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 2:48 PM BST
For a fella who seldom bets on racing nowadays you sure do have a lot of winners after the event of course
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 2:58 PM BST
I still bet a lot on racing , the wasp , just not for big amounts cause I cant get on . Nowhere did I say I dont bet much on racing , another invention by you . You have to read and interpret the posts ,I cant help it if you dont cop on .
Report TheWasp May 1, 2016 3:19 PM BST
See irish open thread ive brought up for you kelly
Report Arklearkle May 1, 2016 4:19 PM BST
I reckon your ass is out on this one Kelly. Youre a good one if you can get out of this. I reckon even the racing appeal board couldnt save you now.
Report Ozymandius May 1, 2016 8:35 PM BST
F**k me, The Irsh Soros is now
Report Ozymandius May 1, 2016 8:36 PM BST
telling us at what time he walks his frickin dogCry
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 10:57 PM BST
3 in a row , the mud throwers are out in force .
Report Kelly May 1, 2016 11:19 PM BST
Arkle , your post follows on the wasps unbelievably naive interpretation of a factual post , taking part of a line and taking it as evidence that I only indulge in 3 or 4 bets a season . I bet most days , mainly trading , often in running . One objective I have though is to finish up minus on my Betfair account lest the dreaded premium charge ever pops up .Backing winners with the bookies and laying off on here is an integral part of  that  , gives an added edge to winner seeking .

Do you have a dog Ozy ?  If not I recommend it as it gives you time to think things through when communing with nature , and the dog , and other dog walkers who generally are decent people ( and non snipers) .
Report Tolmi May 1, 2016 11:48 PM BST
You are surpassing yourself tonight Kelly.Your latest reply begs a very obvious question.Would you not be better off financially by not trading at all than trading to make a loss on your Betfair account??

While I am very aware that you much prefer to dispense your wisdom than to accept advice you might permit me to give you a couple of tips...

If you are trading in running without fast pictures you would be better off giving the money to your local charity or buying something nice for your dog.You will not win or in any way improve an already traded position.

Secondly if your description of your trading activities is correct you will never have to worry about premium charge.You either misunderstand the concept of more likely feel the need to try to impress people on here as you try to massage your already inflated ego.You will lose more money by your trading strategies than you could ever pay in premium charge.
Report Kelly May 2, 2016 4:35 AM BST
Tolmi , when ( or if) I ever start to lose I will accept advice from anyone . Until then I will continue as I have done for 15 years plus on here. When I started on here I was still working full time , and it took me a year to figure out  systems which worked positively .  There was no betting in running then on a lot of events as I recall , particularly on place markets on horse racing which I pushed for with Betfair .They started them , stopped them , and started them again eventually.

Re betting in running I confine my activities to specific sports where there are "natural breaks".  eg  cricket  between overs , golf  , soccer ( discounting the 10 seconds at goal kicks for instance ).  In horse racing 5 furlong sprints are useless , but 3 mile chases or hurdles afford opportunities sometimes . You cant beat the tracksiders ( I never bet in running for instance on tennis unless I suspect someone is injured ), but there are a lot of strange figures which pop up occasionally in running. People  make mistakes.   

I have posted before re avoiding premium charge , for a long number of years I would have been in the firing line , but I took a conscious decision to attempt to go negative and it worked . And you can turn a positive on here into a negative by reversing the figures using another exchange provided you time it right . Does not work all the time , but often enough to make it worth while . Golf is the easiest  , particularly towards the end of a tournament where the markets on here often go over the 100% mark and there is liquidity .  I seldom if ever  bet on womens golf  , no liquidity.

Any activity I indulge in takes time and effort , long hours and study occasionally , most shy away from that effort I suspect .  Nobody is going to put in long hours unless they have something to show at the end of it , and lots of people have jobs to do which occupies them most of the day .

Re trading on horse racing nearly every horse fluctuates by about 20% or more in the course of market movements . If you have a nose for those market movements you can most times winkle out guaranteed profit( small percentage wise) , but you need patience and time  .  Guess its akin to currency trading at which JP makes his money ( or his guys do for him ) .

As I say if I ever fall into a losing habit I will cut and run pronto . I have never been one to chase losses either , learnt that early in life ( well pre exchanges) .  There's always another race / event .

The only thing that worries me is the FPP / Official result scene , have been caught out in that situation  , but it happens seldom and I guess its swings and roundabouts which evens out in the long term .  Seldom a big worry these days as the sums involved are generally nowhere near what they used to be .
Report Ozymandius May 2, 2016 7:46 AM BST
You have a long winded way of saying very little.

Why not just copy and paste the following:

I am The Oracle.
Report Tolmi May 2, 2016 8:16 AM BST
Pretty typical response Kelly.Lenghty and verbose with plenty of self praise even managing to work in a JP comparison!!

However as usual you totally failed to address the points raised.Why trade to lose money?Anyone with even a modicum of intelligence can see that you would be better off not trading at all than losing money by trading?

I repeat my earlier assertion.You have absolutely zero chance of being liable for premium charge with the betting style you have.You would be some man if you could consistently beat the odds with the bookies and also trade back on here to have potential premium charge.

But then again you are some man.
Report Kelly May 2, 2016 9:25 AM BST
Tolmi , if you back a horse ( with the bookies) at 9/4 , and hold it and it loses , you lose . self evident . If you trade off at 6/4 you get 3/4 of a point guaranteed profit with no liability if it loses . I usually split the difference unless I feel the horse has a really excellent chance of winning .

A bird in the hand etc.

If you consistently back winners with the bookies , and lay off equivalently on here , you finish up with a minus Betfair balance .  Simple sums . Picking winners is the key though , if you keep picking losers you will finish up with a Betfair  plus balance .  Backing winners is the main reason the bookies have closed all my accounts effectively .
Report Tolmi May 2, 2016 9:37 AM BST
As I suspected you don't really understand what you are doing and how Betfair and it's premium charge work.

I'll give you a clue.It has nothing to do with the bet you have placed with the bookies.

You still haven't answered my question.If you trade in the anticipation of losing why trade at all?
Report Kelly May 2, 2016 9:50 AM BST
Tolmi , I cant put it any simpler than in previous post .

Premium charge I understand is designed to trap the consistent winners on Betfair , if you back winners consistently over many markets they will get you .  If you back winners with the bookies they will close you down . The only way around is cash betting  ,as anonymously as possible .  Most contributors on here know that .

Trading /arbing by definition guarantees profit .  Betfair and the bookies are just convenient tools .
Report TheWasp May 2, 2016 10:09 AM BST
kelly and his usual waffle, trading one minute win bets the next then back to trading cash betting for 15 years at the best prices no problem either
some man is right
Report Tolmi May 2, 2016 12:04 PM BST
Seriously Kelly are you for real?

I have asked you a couple of questions about your trading and you have replied with pearls of wisdom such as backing and laying off at shorter.A ten year old could understand that yet you carefully express the point as if you were Einstein explaining his theory of relativity.

Obviously if one were able to trade on here by backing and laying at shorter consistently then the ensuing profit could bring one into the realm of premium charge.However if one is beating the market with cash betting and trading back on here with close to a 100% book then the premium charge is an impossibility. If you can't understand that then all I can say is you are only embarrassing yourself with your contributions on the topic.

I have asked you a couple of times now why you trade back if you are doing so to make a loss on Betfair as per your earlier post.You have avoided answering it so far so I can only assume you don't have an answer.
Report Dan Chipowski May 2, 2016 12:12 PM BST
Don't understand why people bother with Kelly.

Most had him pegged ages ago on here. Still spouting his same drivel.
Report Ozymandius May 2, 2016 12:52 PM BST
A ten year old could understand that yet you carefully express the point as if you were Einstein explaining his theory of relativity.

Spot on.  have been saying it for years.
Report freddiek May 2, 2016 2:17 PM BST
god Ozy, you're one petty little creep.
Report mincer11 May 2, 2016 2:23 PM BST
^^^^^ Mock RA man up in arms ^^^^^
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 1:27 AM BST
In words of one syllable Tolmi , slowly , the reason you try to generate loss on Betfair is primarily to avoid premium charge .  Got that ? Lose on Betfair , no premium charge.

If you succeed in doing so , generating ( more) profit elsewhere , you will probably negative any other (consistent) profits you make on other markets . If the profit elsewhere shows up in bookies accounts , they will close your account . But Purple wont . Cash wins are OK , untraceable unless you use "loyalty cards" .

Pure logic . Sorry if it goes over certain peoples heads . Every winning cash bet ( balanced out by loss - less obviously- on here )improves the position regarding staving off premium charge . But beware being a serial cash betting loser , that will generate serial profitmaking on Betfair and may get you onto the slippery slope .
Report Tolmi May 3, 2016 6:35 AM BST
How's this for pure logic Kelly...

Trade on Betfair and lose 10K.

Don't trade and you break even.

By not trading you are 10k better off.

Got that??
Report Tolmi May 3, 2016 6:37 AM BST
And before you start spouting more drivel you can forget about telling me you lay the losers on purple and the winners on here or some other warped logic.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 8:51 AM BST
Tolmi , if today , and tomorrow and daily for a year I walk into a bookies and lose £1k every day , laying it back on here( winning EVERY day on here ) , how long will it be before I am paying premium charge , starting from a zero winning/ losing position ?  You claim to be an expert on premium charge , knowing how it works  , so the answer should be easy .
Report Tolmi May 3, 2016 9:25 AM BST
Its worse you are getting.

I'm not talking about walking into bookies and losing nor am I talking about winning every day on here.

I am talking about your assertion that you want to lose on here.I am simply asking you why trade at all if you are trading to lose on here?

My 06.35 reply could not be simpler.If you can't follow that I could refer you to your earlier quote about going over peoples heads.

Very much unlike yourself who comes across as a self professed expert on everything I have at no stage claimed to be an expert on premium charge.If you would be man enough to withdraw that assertion I would appreciate it.

However I do know enough about premium charge to realise that nobody could remotely hazard a guess as to what premium charge one would pay based on your example,It is based on the rate of commission generated to profits made.Person A could make 1000 per day and never pay premium charge and person B could make 1000 per day and be paying it every week.I have no desire to embarrass you further on the topic but will refer you to the age old "when you are in a hole stop digging"advice.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 10:25 AM BST
Tolmi , there are two reasons for wanting to lose on betfair . Firstly there is no commission  if you lose , and secondly there is no possibility of premium charge .  Pretty simple , its the cheapest way to travel .

Re premium charge , when it was introduced I counted myself lucky that I had sort of anticipated it , but for a different reason . I had run into negative from large positives , and I intend to stay negative , seems the safest way to operate to me , provided overall you win .

Its not rocket science , it is pure logic .

You claimed that I knew nothing about how premium charge worked , to me that claim implies that you do  . It now appears that you are not an expert on premium charge . I can accept that , with an equivalent discount .

I know enough about premium charge to know that given my activity on here over a long time over dozens of markets daily , a winning habit would be punished somewhere along the line . No intention of ever paying premium charge .

Re activity on b/f and purple , there is little difference between them odds wise on horse markets , except for a slight time delay normally , I refer to purple as b/f plus 30 seconds usually. Gives you a choice where you want to lay back , skill is in placement relatively .

My activity on here is minimal compared with what it used to be , but I still like to win , being a competitive animal . The less commission or premium charge( if any) you pay , the more you win . Purple only charge 2% on winnings too , another factor , provided you play by their rules .  Its all about sums and profitability .
Report Racingqueen May 3, 2016 11:01 AM BST
thats quality trolling Laugh
Report Temlett May 3, 2016 1:29 PM BST
Terrific stuff from Kelly again and I really enjoy the bit about taking advantage of extra place concessions and 1/4 odds available for additional places with bookmakers.

I know Bet365 did it for most of the week and I think Coral may well have done as part of their Irish plans. In addition Betfred were doing it in some races and Powers dipped into it in some races but not all of them and were 1/5 in many races (although there is little point in watching them closely).

Kelly says he took advantage of these and stresses the work that was put in each day from about 9:00 to 3:00 after he left his bored stupid K9 friend back at the house. Now given that nearly all of the firms cited above are online based, how has this been achieved when someone is out until 3:00? Powers have 5 shops in Belfast as far as I would know and their promotional limits are low, with guaranteed prices limited to reduced stakes. With 1 on the Falls Road and 1 on the Andersonstown road, we have to factor in petrol, taxi fares of something like that (although the great man probably has this covered with a free bus pass.

So the shops that could be used are limited and some are considerable distances apart, yet he executed this strategy effectively despite not being on a computer from 7 in the morning until just before racing was about to commence.

This is leaving aside the fact that he wins consistently with bookmakers to avoid the premium charge, yet still gets extra place concessions and guaranteed prices and also gets these even though he is first out of the traps to get 9/4 about Jers Girl.

It really is a hilarious tale. I used to think your spin was confined to a few sports such as Golf and to your high level of IT skills even though you are a man of advancing years, but you are a horse trading expert, an IT guru, an exceptionally fit individual that covers a citywide area faster than anyone. In addition the latest string to your bow seems to be assessing tennis injuries while watching on the TV, which the traders miss.

You are a remarkable man.
Report TheWasp May 3, 2016 1:40 PM BST
only backs 4 horses a year and cant copy and paste ,what a guy
Report Tolmi May 3, 2016 4:10 PM BST
On a serious note Kelly do you understand my 6.35 post.I would have thought it fairly simple to follow?

Re premium charge can you explain to me the difference between player A and player B in my example?
Report pa lapsy May 3, 2016 4:30 PM BST
Player B is fcked Tolmi.
Kelly as it was a thread discussing Punchestown races twas a pity you didn't stick them up beforehand even to say you thought they were overpriced.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 4:50 PM BST
Temlett , 3 Powers shops are 1 minute apart and we are all allowed friends are we not ?  All you need is the money . Used to have 7 shops at least within reach , two on top of the ones mentioned . Plenty of advice from people on here to employ an army  , that probably never occurred to naive me . And there are phones in our part of the world . Guess that didn't occur to you .  And we all are allowed friends in other parts of the country are we not if we choose . 

Did you get any 9/4 Jers Girl ?

I did not take advantage of extra place concessions , another invention , but whats new . But 1/4 a place all races is a good concession where there are 8 runners or more . Read the posts , dont just invent things .
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 5:07 PM BST
Pa , Jers Girl was 7/4 all day up to approx 1.00clock . Widely available .  Then 9/4 for 15 minutes in Powers  when it was 7/4 on here .  Last thing on my mind would be wasting time on here posting when there was work to be done . They pushed out 4 horses each day between 1 and 2 , 15 minutes on each .  Billy's have been doing that for a long time . I backed one with them at 6/1 , started 7/2 I think , Music something , ton per customer ( per shop that is if you know topography) . It lost . But you have to be quick  , time waits for no man .  There aren't any queues though , that finished years and years ago .
Report pa lapsy May 3, 2016 5:16 PM BST
You "wasted" enough time telling us about it after the race though Kelly,whether you were using it as an exxample or not.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 5:50 PM BST
Pa , there have been hundreds of "Jers Girl's " over the years . The concept of posting tips or fancies on here I gave up many moons ago , you got no thanks for it .  Anyway betting for me was always in the moment , I spent a lot of time on course when the market moves came suddenly and often at the death . Decision time .  Sharpens the senses .

I posted re 3 of JP's horses , specifically because everyone on here was complaining about his colours ( and largely because they didn't win --MTOY a prime example . Probably 90% of his horses lost at Punchestown , guess that tots up to a lot of people who backed losers in his colours.  I only backed to trade , but beating the odds represents a "winner" .  I probably missed "winners " in that respect in his colours , Marlfield started pretty short given morning price , but only lasted one jump . Thats racing .
Report TheWasp May 3, 2016 6:00 PM BST
not often id agree with lapsy but in this case he has kelly sussed, so the 3 winners are now just winning trades again you couldnt make it up
Report pa lapsy May 3, 2016 6:07 PM BST
Your perogative whether you put up an opinion or not Kelly,i see both sides of the coin in that regard. I sincerely believe the few that do on here aren't looking for "thanks", some talk about the racing,others have a strong opinion,no harm whatsoever,as it is yourself that presses the button.
You did post re 3 of JP's horses but the races were over and while good for you i'm not sure why you are telling us.
Think it is Marlbrook you mean.
You must have had a fair big balance in the daq at the time to lay all that back.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 6:16 PM BST
Most of my laying activity pa is on here , some days it works OK over there. . It is useful , needed it last Saturday ( site down ) . Has its uses , but only for horses and golf for me ( soccer occasionally) . Useless for the cricket  , which is normally in running .
Report pa lapsy May 3, 2016 6:24 PM BST
Just as well you had the account Kelly as you said yourself you laid it off there, you needed slightly more than 3 times what you staked on Jers Girl in it.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 6:52 PM BST
Temlett ,I never mentioned 200 , And the 1/4 odds was not in Powers . Attempt to invent again . If you followed posts you would have known that I did not have a bet at Cheltenham in a Powers shop , no value during that meeting , and up here their offices were relatively sparsely populated during Cheltenham . There's another story re that , but cant post it on here , might get someone into trouble .

They loosened the reins a bit at Punchestown I suspect , maybe the bean counters did their sums and wanted turnover .
Report Temlett May 3, 2016 7:26 PM BST
Of course you never mentioned 200 - I am saying that is likely to have been very much the max bet allowed, especially if you are known not to be a punter or a judge but simply a concession punter that just pops in at this 1:00 - 1:15 time slot and lays back later. The max may well have been 100 * 5 shops covered, less expenses and payments to your men on the street, unless they are just good natured souls that have little else to be doing.

Anyway the rest of the forum can continue with fairytale for the remainder of the evening if they wish.
Report wildmanfromborneo May 3, 2016 7:26 PM BST
The concessions apply to 25 euro only where I am,not alone that but if you have a hundred on you don't even get the concession to that part of your wager.

It annoys me when I hear about them betting double result and money back when it only applies to small wagers.

Bookies are granted a licence by the government part of the conditions of that licence should be an obligation to accept wagers not just fleece problem gamblers.
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 7:41 PM BST
Hear , hear , wildman . Aussies have some decent rules in some states re bookies . Mind you the bookies there dont have a lot to compete with except the tab which takes a fair whack of the punters money each race .

PP had concessions re second to SP fav , max £25 per customer  , free bet refund ( win part) ,. How they define a customer is open to question . On their 15 minute specials it was £100 per customer per horse . Decent offers both . No 1/4 odds all races though .

There are more bookies than PP though .
Report Kelly May 3, 2016 10:41 PM BST
Tolmi , the friend I trust absolutely punted daily for me in/ around 3 different bookies shops , and sometimes used his friends for top ups , cash in the hand , docket back to money man . No 10k exposures . Nobody ever transgressed . I was always open with anyone who enquired what the "movers" were which I was backing  , everybody knew , no skin of my nose as long as I was "on" , helps when you want a "favour" . I was just acting as a conduit for information as to what was actually happening on the markets , most punters did not have access or time , and I was always up to date . After some  local bookies  barred me everybody wanted a word . My mate is still only a phone call away thankfully , but opportunities are rare these days , and generally only last fleetingly .

Nearly every bookies I go into in this part of the world I reckon I know a substantial number of the punters in there ( diminishing though) and  often the staff , I have been frequenting those haunts for half a century . They know the score and will manage a message if approached .  Cant be bothered generally though , only when the ball hops the right way do you get a proper hold of it .

There is no general plan though , once upon a time there was , daily. Just occasionally it reverts to days of yore , few and far between though nowadays .  Blame the internet , ATR , RUK , Sky , etc , armchair punters are the dart nowadays .
Report Temlett May 4, 2016 9:21 AM BST
Tolmi 03 May 16 16:10 
On a serious note Kelly do you understand my 6.35 post.I would have thought it fairly simple to follow?

Re premium charge can you explain to me the difference between player A and player B in my example?
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 24, 2017 10:59 PM BST
((( PUNCHESTOWN 2017 )))..... Starts 3.40pm on TUESDAY 25th
((((( PUNCHESTOWN 2017 )))))
(((((((( PUNCHESTOWN 2017 ))))))))
(((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN 2017 )))))))))

SpoilSports Champion Steeplechase (Grade 1) of €250,000.00

Reminder... "Vatour" beaten last what you say

Un De Sceaux Winner 11/10 
Disko 18:40 Winner 11/10 
Ronnie O'Sullivan Snooker Championship - Winner 9/4
Spoils 15.36 accum
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 12:11 AM BST
6.05 Goffs Land Rover Bumper

What a pity last years winner Coeur De Lion passed away.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 12:50 AM BST
Still to come Wed & Thursday...
Presenting Percy in Wednesday's three mile novice hurdle
Sizing John in the Gold Cup
Great Field in the Ryanair Novice Chase
Report mrtopnotch April 25, 2017 6:40 AM BST
Harrington in superb form at the moment.
Really looking forward to watching Great Field.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 1:35 PM BST
ROCONGA has been thoroughly progressive in his career thus far and might be able to continue on his winning ways here. He won his last hurdle race last August, returned with a cracking flat handicap win at Cork latest and will like today’s surface.
Nearly time to get to the carpark for the inside info on this JP / O'Grady combo connection me tinks ! Devil
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 6:19 PM BST
"To come out here (in Punchestown) and win is different league. Fox Norton is a beautiful horse - I think he'll stay any trip myself." - Trainer Colin Tizzard.....and with Thistlecrack, Cue Card, Native River, Finian's Oscar, Fox Norton – safe to say he is probably looking forward to next season.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 8:53 PM BST
IRISH Trainer Championship -

GORDON €4,063,145
WILLIE €3,782,625

5 Days left of the National Hunt season the Trainer Championship is going down to the wire.
€2,287,500 Prize Money Remaining. 5 Days and 30 Races to end of Season !
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 25, 2017 9:58 PM BST
(((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 2. )))))).......Wednesday 26th - FIRST at 3.40pm again
(((((((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 2. )))))))))
((((((((((((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 2. ))))))))))))

3.40 Dawerann 20/1 for Gordon tia but it could be a Close Shave for Jessie.
4.20 Burgas 14/1 Meade Cooper Gigginstown.
4.55 PRESENTING PERCY 11/4 Davy again.
5.30 GOLD CUP evens for Sizing John.
6.05 FAYONAGH 2/1 again JJ.
6.40 Mr Diablo 12/1 from 7/2 Polidam.
7.15 Mystic Theatre 5's for WPM & PWM.

BEST OF LUCK viewers for the rest of the week. Devil
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 26, 2017 4:09 PM BST
A close shave alright for Jessie, won by a short-head Devil MAJIC
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 26, 2017 4:11 PM BST
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 26, 2017 4:13 PM BST
Burgas in to 10's
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 6:00 PM BST
(((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 3. ))))))..... THURSDAY 27th
(((((((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 3. )))))))))
((((((((((((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 3. ))))))))))))
(((((((((((((((((((((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 3. ))))))))))))))))))))


Dan Chipowski • May 2, 2016 12:12 PM BST
Don't understand why people bother with Kelly.
Most had him pegged ages ago on here. Still spouting his same drivel.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 7:24 PM BST
Trainer Championship - GE €4,231,780 vs WPM €4,079,200 - 3 Days left, 16 Races & just over 1M Prize Money Remaining.
Report workrider April 27, 2017 7:34 PM BST
It's hotting up alright.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 7:40 PM BST
mrtopnotch • April 25, 2017 6:40 AM BST Harrington in superb form at the moment. Really looking forward to watching Great Field. Happy days
Report mrtopnotch April 27, 2017 8:40 PM BST
Enjoyed that !
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 10:22 PM BST
UPDATE € 4,232,655 vs € 4,105,825.....fa in it.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 11:23 PM BST
ROLL ON (((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 4. ))))))..... FRIDAY 28th
(((((((( PUNCHESTOWN DAY 4. )))))))))

FIRST AT 15:40 - A 2m4f Hunters Chase gets us going Shin A Vee 2/1 vs Enniskillen (JJ Codd) 9/4 or will the Buzz Kill Bob ?????
16:20 - A great Grade A Novice Handicap Chase 2m5f between Woodland Opera 5/1 and my money machine Diamond King at 6's.....some match.
16:55 - Mares Handicap Chase (Grade B) 2m5f watch in Slowmotion the match of WPM/Ruby's Retour En France 7/1 vs the aptly named Definite Ruby a 10/1 punt for Gordon.
17:30 - Champion Hurdle (Grade 1) 2m class 1 Petit Mouchoir at 4's while Ruby picks 5/1 shot Vroum Vroum Mag.
18:05 - Champion Novice Hurdle (Grade 1) 2m4f class 1 tricast of Finians Oscar 15/8 with Death Duty 9/2 and Lets Dance 9/2 tia. Decides the Trainer's Championship ???
18:40 - The Champion Hunters Chase of 3m120y will be all Bolger/Codd's 12yo On The Fringe 5/2.
19:10 - 2m Novice Hurdle goes to Riven Light 7/2fav - 6 of the last 8 favs won this - and a Ricci treble while Bryan Cooper fights for his Avenir D'Une Vie (for a double).
19:45 - A 2m2f Flat Race rounds off proceedings with the most unusual spectacle of Patrick Mullins riding a Warthog (for Pipe) in Punchestown...My God, what next! Devil
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 27, 2017 11:39 PM BST
note for Sat Air Horse One and Apples Jade.
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