They Must Have Been Forewarned.

A similar thought struck me.I would have thought it a relatively easy case to make that if NE had to lead the chase himself then he wouldn't have won either.it's interesting that BG said he was riding to strict instructions. If this is the case then I think he will win his appeal.

Unusual betting patterns is an area that the stewards would need to tread very carefully.

Not saying you are wrong. But if no unusual betting patterns, on what grounds will they win appeal ?

That post was meant for Wildman

I think they will win if BG and AJM stick to the story about instructions.The horse is a hold up horse and if his instructions were to wait then he has a very good case as to why he didn't take up the chase earlier.Betting patterns would imply something far more sinister.

There have been other cases where a horse was given too much rope and wasn't caught.I recall an amateur riders race in Leopardstown and a bumper in Ascot in recent years.I dont think anyone got a ban anywhere near today's level.

The length of the ban shows a stopping rather than an injudicious ride.
I don't think it was.
Having said that Barry Geraghty has shown himself a poor enough rider in the prevention department.
Lots now are appreciating how good Tony McCoy in that aspect of the game as he always got away with it.

I don't back those colours because there is someone on a rival exchange doing some judicious laying.

I don't have much sympathy for the connections here as although they might not be guilty in this case they have been guilty many times in the past.

Just saw a replay of this race , if the disciplinary process which resulted in this 30 day ban is purely related to this one ride then the stewards have lost their collective marbles . Noble Emperor finished way ahead of the others in the race bar the winner , who stole a long lead such as we see every day in Irish racing . They usually come back though , this one didn't .

The stewards need to be careful , the connections involved in this situation are very important to the whole Irish racing scene .  Not advocating they should get any leeway because of that , but sometimes those in power pay too much attention to the noise buckets who live amongst us . This one worries me .

Just watching this again , who was the starter ?  There was about 20 lengths difference between the winner ( who was obviously going to make it) and the horse at the back as they came in from the collecting area . Kevin Blake describing it as a ragged start , completely agree , stewards losing credibility by the minute here .

Kelly where have you been for the last 15 years and youre only worried now when stewards for a change show a bit of mettle. The horse which was allowed a big lead was almost joint favourite. Unlike most cases where a runner gets away he is a rag/no hoper with no form and very often out of control/pulling for his head. He wasnt any of these and if BG couldnt see this well I give up. It was obvious for the last half of the race that they had given him too much rope and no one behind was interested in making any effort to go after him. Ill ask a hypothetical question - if BG was told just before the race that JP had a bet of a million on his horse would he have ridden a different race. I think we all know the answer to that.

Caught with their trousers down , they'll take their punishment this time , a appeal is inevitabe imo , but they'll draw a line in the sand . Their biggest fear would be if the stewards decided that they should take a more expansive look at goings on from those colours . What would really kill them is the stewards deciding that WRITTEN instructions BEFORE the race would become the norm ,this would leave them wide open to investigation on a race by race basis and they certainly don't want that...

Your dog and fleas analogy is so right Arkle.
Such a shame he made this move as certainly as a jockey not much between him and Ruby, a legend up to yesterday but even allowing the horse isn't possibly the most straight forward he didn't make any attempt to win this race.Fair point that he is trying to do something that is alien to him and made a balls of it.
Know you are against bans Wildman(i thought Barry Browne got heavily penalised,not pretty but back to Ras for an in depth look might have been enough imo).
Morning price for Velocity Boy was 4/1,went off 2/1,it was a gamble,whether it was coincidental or not i don't know.

Noble Emperor was a drifting favourite.
Velocity Boy was a strongly supported second favourite.

My point is someone seemed to know beforehand what was going to happen and acted accordingly.

If the stewards can't make that connection then the appeal will be upheld.

Interesting you are championing the stewards in this case Arkle . We obviously have a different view of the race and the resultant action . And I suspect we dont share the same views on the connections/ owner  of Noble Emperor .

For the last 15 years I have been in the same place I have always been Arkle , love sport , have always punted on and off course , and I respect most of those involved in racing which is one of our most successful products on a world stage . Horses are not machines , fact , Petite Etoile with the best jockey ever aboard , got beaten . Coloured my views on racing that Saturday in July many years ago .

Petite Etoile didnt stay.

I'm generally against bans for jockeys but if there is evidence of stopping I favour them.
Bobby Brownes ban was very harsh.
Barry Geraghtys ban would be correct if they can make that connection.

One of the questions to be asked is "Did Velocity Boy show any marked improvement in form from previous runs "  .  I had no involvement in race , saw it for the first time an hour ago or so .  But if someone backed Velocity Boy from 4/1 to 2/1 that would have caused Noble Emperor and other horses to drift , just hope the stewards were not looking at the wrong horse .

If Barry Geraghty has been judged guilty of riding an injudicious race , what about the other riders in the race , they were given a by ball apparently , the winner poached about 10 lengths just after the off ( which was a ridiculously ragged start , all horses are supposed to start equally in a race )  , on top of being given a handy lead by the starter .The best horse does not always win the race ( unfortunately, punting would be easy if that were always true) , and Noble Emperor also apparently lost a shoe during the race . Hope Betfair put up a market on the appeal .

The other horses finished tired though whereas Noble Emperor had a lot left.

Lester blamed himself for that defeat wildman , and Lester was not known as a shrinking violet in relation to comments about his riding . Taught me a lesson though , no such thing as a certainty when horses and jockeys and owners and trainers  are involved . 4 factors in that statement , and there are other factors too to be added .  Easy to be the rider in the stand , far easier than actually doing it to everyones satisfaction . Particularly for those with financial involvement which always colours views .

Velocity Boy would have won regardless yesterday.  He was eyecatching first time up in Navan.  They then gave him an easy in Cork and struck quite rightly with its third run off a long break.  He was always going to make the running as he did when he bolted up at Christmas a year ago.
If BG had tried to chase the winner down from a mile out such as Dreapers horse did he wouldnt have won anyway.  Dreapers ended up tailed off.

BG was in a no win in from the start.  He was hoping something would bring him there but it didnt.  Winner won with his head in his chest and the race was over half way round.  There are far more clear cases of stopping than this one.

In general Kelly I agree with most of your contributions on these forums but I dont in this case. On another thread you have complained as to why the bookies offices in your area are now deserted. Of course technology/on-line is the main reason but many people have given up betting or wont touch it because of the dishonest goings-on associated with the sport and it will all die a slow death unless someone says stop. I would hope that the Limerick stewards have decided enough is enough and have said so in no uncertain manner. Many people on here have said that they keep well clear of most races with those colours and I am one of those also. This is very sad. It is ludicrous to suggest that JP himself had a few quid on the winner or laid the loser - why would he bother and as we all know he'd be lucky to get a fiver on anyway. Its quite likely that JP didnt even know the horse was running. But as I said earlier its quite likely some/many others did quite well out of it and sadly others not in the know lost their hard-earned. And that is the kernel of the problem and the sooner the nod-nod-wink-wink/clever hoor(!) element is removed from the sport the better and there is an awful lot of removing to be done. There are many legitimate ways of plotting a bit of a touch without breaking the rules.

On a point of information Arkle at no point did I pass any comment on financial involvement on the race by connections of Noble Emperor .

Bookies shop desertion I suspect has nothing to do with any of the people involved with yesterdays race at Limerick , apart from anything else we dont have the luxury of bookies shops open on a Sunday , courtesy of our fundamentalist brothers . So our punters have to bet on line on Sundays , and that possibly enhances a taste for the activity .

Racing to me is cleaner now than it used to be , partly due to more transparent coverage of nearly every race . And with an ability to trace betting trends I am happier than before that miscreant behaviour can be tracked down .  Yesterdays race in my opinion ( via reruns and media comments) reflects badly on starter , stewards and  all jockeys involved , but Geraghty 30 day ban ( assuming it relates specifically to yesterday , which is not exactly apparent in the stewards wording) is overkill , and bad for racing . The Irish stewards generally have a better approach to racing as a sport than their counterparts in other places in the world , but I think they got this one wrong .

We beg to differ on this one. I believe they got the previous 1000 instances wrong.

There was a race at Fairyhouse were the connections were lucky not to recieve a ban , blatant and guess which jockey was involved...

since last year the stewards seem to have grown a pair both here and next door in dealing with martin. this from last year.

         
DENIS O'REGAN will sit out Cheltenham Trials Day this month after being hit with a ten-day ban by Bangor stewards for failing to take all reasonable and permissible measures to obtain the best possible placing on Delvin Road, who finished fourth in the 2m4f maiden hurdle.

Forming part of a rare two-strong raid by Irish trainer Tony Martin, the seven-year-old appeared to be tenderly ridden by O'Regan in the last half mile of the race, which was won by Lough Derg Walk.

Stipendiary steward Simon Cowley said: "At the end of the back straight he was in fourth place and we felt he should have either made an effort to show the horse had nothing left or if the horse had some more running in it, it would have run on.

"At that point in the race he appeared to do very little on it and that is what concerned us."

O'Regan told the stewards his instructions were to get Delvin Road settled and creep into the race, and that he was left in fourth place at the end of the back straight when the leaders quickened away and his mount had no more to give from that point.

The stewards took into account the vet's report that Delvin Road was found to be lame after the race before dishing out the punishment.

Cowley added: "From our point of view it's not necessarily a get out of jail free card as the jockey did not report anything when he came back and from looking at the video the horse didn't appear to be distressed or lame in any way that we could see."

O'Regan, who declined to comment on the matter, has the right to appeal the ban which runs from January 20-29 inclusive.

also trying to remember the bumper race, both were trained by martin with the jock on the outsider which was cruising refusing to go by the well backed fav.

c byrnes bumper

laetitia and alpha royale

yeah my bad....hopefully no slur on mr fkn byrnes.

Is this a turning point for the game do you think , lots of people at the tracks seem to know to stay away from certain races when these colours are involved . Lots of h/cappers winning with a stone in hand in recent times . Maybe the stewards looked at that and said enough is enough .

It would be great if it turned out to be the case Workrider though you would want to be fairly optimistic by nature.

I was dopey enough to back Rathpatrick at Thurles,the wang before the off was seismic,the market spoke and ran accordingly, good job done that day and reveiwing the race you couldn't put your finger on any singular thing.
Next time out it ran to it's Punchestown running at Cheltenham.

There has been a definite attempt to lay down the law with JP this season pa. Do you remember there was a horse of Jessie's (Tri na Cheile I think) who was given a ban and there was also a day where they called about 5 JP horses and into the stewards room and gave them warnings. This is a further escalation of their attempt to show JP he is not above the law. I don't know will this be the end of it or will they continue, it will probably depend on the appeal hearing.

Pa backed Rathpatrick that day ,stank to high heavens , then runs stones above that run nto , rancid from all concerned .

High Tail It NA? not seen seen. I had the utmost sympathy there as it was first time out and was ridden turning in but only really picked up late.
There have been a few threads on here this NH season concerning the colours and enough comments and none good, it is common knowledge and it is time something was done, a horse running on its merits is in the sports best interest.

Barry to appeal I see.

That's the one wr, it was longer ago than I thought

Blaming the starter is a red herring as none of the other jockeys were arsed in the slightest to get anywhere near the start in line with the leader and the race was over before the first hurdle - good blog by Kevin Blake on the ATR website about it

i wasnt looking at the race live as i was at a match.the first i knew of it was a text i got.i came home and viewed it ?.my first thought was i had missed something?.i will as i always have done agree that this crowd get away with it big time both sides of the irish sea.  some people less informed than others are puzzled as why horses in low grade races drift big time in the betting often run stink.whats the point they ask?all they gotta do is look at the amount turned over in the top right hand corner of the betfair screen.2mill for a small race of a tuesday is not unusual.  the stewards had the right idea but picked the wrong race.as kevin blake said the sectionals will prove that..and the instructions given before the race that the horse need cover.though maybe if he needed cover picking a small field race wasnt the right race for the horse.

Strikes me that the trainer aspect of the situation may have been the big factor in the equation .

I also wonder why this should happen in of all places JP's homeland where he is very well regarded for a variety of reasons .

Re stewards , as far as I know from picking the brains of a relation who often stood in as a steward , the stipe runs the show more or less completely .  Who was the stipe this time ? ( I am assuming the stewarding arrangements have not changed dramatically since I was a regular on course race goer ) .

There is a card that is so high and wild you can only play it an odd time.

After the Fairyhouse incident a visit was paid to the Curragh.
An Aga Khan type threat was issued,it was taken seriously leading to the subsequent climbdown.

Will this card be played again and will it be as effective.

Snow Bride won The Oaks.

the increase in VAT for racehorse buyers also brought threats of boycotts that have already been withdrawn after a token resistance at one sale. Lots of talk lately of "bully pulpits" and face them and their modus operandum down is the way to go. Let them train their horses elsewhere and see how the lack of Irish-style adulation will make them quickly tire of that particular strategy. Its the oxygen that keeps them going-that and gambling.

The game will survive without anyone and, even as it is, it will take a lot more than  a few wealthy owners to restore the jumping game here to anything considered stable.

As for the game played by these boyos in general: you could never be suspicious enough, often enough or on guard enough to understand the depth of their ability to manipulate any market at any time. Anyone who believes otherwise (Kelly, ima-mazed wtc) is naïve in the extreme

I find myself totally in agreement here R.A. Yet the Trump, Palin, tone is ironic...

It is a pity barry got a bad start.If he had got a good one he would have been able to get some cover behind Velocity Boy.It is a front runners track after all.Maybe barry did not know this?I see Noble Emperors mark went up a pound.So the handicaper must think he ran ok.

Good article by Alan Sweetman in todays Racing Post re this incident. Wonder do the stewards read the Racing Post ?

Alan Sweetman is an excellent journalist with a good sense of integrity about it but he has become rather anodyne in recent years certainly in comparison with Kevin Blake in terms of frank expression on the important nitty gritty racing issues of the day

The Noble Emperor appeal has just got underway at The Turf Club. After approx one hour Turf Club barrister Louis Weston has concluded his questioning of Barry Geraghty.