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workrider
21 Sep 12 23:31
Joined:
Date Joined: 29 Jun 02
| Topic/replies: 15,386 | Blogger: workrider's blog
rambled down to hx tonight to partake of a once magnificent occasion , the puppy derby ..what i found was both sad and begged the question...why ....the crowd was smaller than usual for this unique race night ...plenty of young people enjoying good food and drinking plenty of beer ....the atmosphere was as you would expect on such a night ..filled with laughter and craic ....the biggest surprise though awaited me as i walked from the noise of the grandstand out to the betting ring ....low and behold as i arrived into what has always been the holy of holys ....i was stunned to see only two bookies in operation ...thats right two bookies at the 2nd biggest track in dublin....were there is room for 14 bookies all we had was two....the amazing thing was they were father and son ....thats right , on one of the biggest race nights of the week two bookies running the show ....monopoly or what , surely this situation should never been allowed happen....a  sad way for greyhound racing , to have fallen to such depths , from a once great game , to this new low imo....
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Report never give up September 21, 2012 11:43 PM BST
only 3 standing last few years ,2 hegartys and farrell
Report workrider September 21, 2012 11:54 PM BST
farrell not there tonight , so guess who's taken over ..a disgrace imo ..should never have  happened and should be looked into right away ...a shameful way for irish bookmaking to end up....
Report Kelly September 22, 2012 12:01 AM BST
Used to go to HX in the early sixties when I was living in Dublin . Preferred Shelbourne and it was closer to where I lived so went there more often .  Both tracks were busy then  , have not been to HX since mid sixties , was in Shelbourne a few times in the eighties .

Hx sounds like it is going the way our tracks up here went in a downward spiral .  Celtic Park used to have crowds of 10,000 plus regularly in the thirties and forties  , second largest crowd ever at a greyhound meeting anywhere in the world , 42,000 there one night .  Often wonder where they all stood .  And there were 200 bookies "on the outside " .  Plus those who took the real money inside .  One bookie I knew was 3k up after the first 3 races one night ( my uncle clerked for him )  , a semi-d in Belfast cost £500 then .

Dunmore was the best track in these isles at one stage , but never had as good crowds as Celtic . But falling crowds and economic forces were at work , and inevitably both disappeared , and the "Troubles" did not help . I was in Dunmore the night the off duty policeman was shot dead , friend of mine in the doggy scene  , only there for the sport and the craic  . Hastened the end .

Sad to see these once iconic venues and their history going under  , guess there are a lot of counter attractions nowadays , once upon a time the tracks were one of the few outlets for a bit of sport and a bet .
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:08 AM BST
The game is in serious decline for the last 3 years.........you can ge
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:09 AM BST
sorry about that lads......key stuck.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 12:18 AM BST
some good points kelly ,  a wake up call for greyhound racing , especially this track is badly needed ,i got out of the game myself a few years ago , having bred , owned , trained greyhounds , i felt the game had nothing to offer me in the end ...i sponcered races at both tracks as well , its a game for the big kennels imo ..the sad thing is the small man like myself , were often sacrificed to the big trainer , now its come back to haunt them ....looking at tonights attendance it was evident that the people who spent most of their lifes going to the dog track are now thinking twice about attending a track were only two bookies are standing , and like myself are now not bothered either way..a sad state of affairs ....
Report workrider September 22, 2012 12:20 AM BST
ffs gant , stay of the drink mate , this is happening all to often now with you....Laugh.. please carry on you were trying to say...?
Report never give up September 22, 2012 12:28 AM BST
a lo of tracks the same now w/r.............galway 1 book............lifford 2 books...............drumbo 4 books some nights
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:29 AM BST
You can get a dog on every 2 weeks if you want...........Runner pools at an alltime low at tracks...........Dogs are getting faster and shelbourne is running 50/60 spots fast so it's best left to the big boys to race against themselves up there..........you would want a dog doing open times unrecorded to win an A6 in shelbourne.........
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:31 AM BST
More than 2 bookmakers at a track now is very rare.
Report never give up September 22, 2012 12:31 AM BST
a5 competition wednesday nite

Race 1 - Dobbins @ Shelbourne A5 525 Final   (Grade : A5) Flat 525 Video Available
Pos.     Trap     Greyhound     Prize     Wt.       Win Time     By     Going     Est
Time     SP.     Grade     Comm.
1.      Trap 6     DROOPYS CARL      €400.00      69      28.65             Sand      28.65       1/5      AA0      Ld 1,drclr
2.      Trap 4     SLIPPERY MICK      €160.00      77      28.65      13L      Sand      29.56       4/1      A4      EvAw,BBlk 1
3.      Trap 1     TYRUR QUEVEGA      €100.00      62      28.65      3L      Sand      29.77       3/1      A5      EvAw,BBlk 1
4.      Trap 3     TYRUR TESS      €70.00      58      28.65      nk      Sand      29.79       8/1      A5      EvAw,BBlk 1
5.      Trap 2     REGARDS TO PADDY      €70.00      71      28.65      1L      Sand      29.86       5/1      A5      EvAw,BBlk 1
Report workrider September 22, 2012 12:38 AM BST
gant , as a doggie man i was saddened at what i witnessed tonight , lots of people are turning their backs on this great game , the little man was for years the backbone of greyhound racing , but during the celtic tiger i think he was forgotten , now its payback time ..as you know gant lots of guys have give up breeding dogs , simply because it wasn't paying its way ..on the trackside of things...i think managment forgot who was the real power behind the wheel , and became shortsighted and played to the big lads ....now as i say , the arse has fallen out of it....
Report Inthemiddle September 22, 2012 12:39 AM BST
There will be no books at some tracks soon... The strokes always went on, but when there was betting they went "un-noticed" for want of a better word. Stroker A had a touch while punter bcd... Still bet away unbeknownst to it.... Soon to be no bookmakers in some tracks IMO
Report workrider September 22, 2012 12:40 AM BST
hard to believe alright ngu....
Report never give up September 22, 2012 12:42 AM BST

Sep 21, 2012 -- 6:40PM, workrider wrote:


hard to believe alright ngu....


28.58 in his ist round

Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:45 AM BST
Lads are turning their backs for financial reasons.........the hobby breeder is not there anymore.........the leisure money just isn't there.......The lads I know that don't race anymore aint got a new hobby.
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:47 AM BST
That dog did 29.62 in his first unofficial after been baulked.....he was well touted and owned by the great JBM.
Report never give up September 22, 2012 12:48 AM BST
very little people buying pups anymore
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:50 AM BST
People are more selective........try get a pup out of a top brood and you will find they are spoken for.........you might get a bitch.
Report maxheadroom September 22, 2012 8:10 AM BST
problem is like horse racing the rush to attract the drunken student u25 type who have little interest in betting driving out the dedicated racing types who where the bread and butter of racing.the atmosphere now resemables a disco more than a racetrack.
Report irishone September 22, 2012 9:15 AM BST
There are some great points made here but I feel a few are misguided.
The number of bookmakers are in decline due to a reduction in punters disposable income because of the difficult economy.
Those tracks that shut simply failed to keep up with the times. 
Lots of people are turning their backs on this great game because other entertainment is more appealing.
The buzz for most people who go (losers) is picking the odd winner not doing the bookies. We have RPGTV on in our local Friday nights, 1 euro sweepstake every race. It ain't the 5 euros you can win its the buzz of watching the dog win and cheering it home. 
I dont think managment can ever afford to forgot who was and still is the real power . The government here via the igb bales out greyhound racing, that's the real power.
"rush to attract the drunken student u25 type" , has made the sport a social event, six packers (mugs to betting gurus) are keeping the sport going in the UK, restaurents are helping both here and over there.
There are three stakeholders in terms of supporting the game here, those that do it for the sport (trainers, owners etc), those that go for the social event, and those that make money out of the betting (pro punters/bookies) and the track management (government puppets imo) have the devils own job trying to juggle the needs of all .
The most fundamental difference however between here and the UK  is that the government is fully supporting one of our basic traditions,and long may it continue,  our sport has not yet succumbed to the rise of Allah as has happened over there through membership of local councils, communities, schools and churches.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 9:54 AM BST
irishone ,some of your points are indeed valid , my own take for what its worth is simply this ...re bookmakers at hx ...one family now control the betting , the s.p.etc ...they also have a notice at hx stating that a bookmakers maximum pay out on a midweek night is 1,000 euro....as inthemiddle says the strokes were part of the game and i'm sure still are... as i'm sure gant will confirm , you could be taking a dog out of the kennels and  someone would tell you they fancied their dog ...or otherwise ..its part and parcel of the game ...prizemoney is so poor now when i looked at the card last night i was taken aback ....its worse than it was several years ago ...btw the bookie now standing was known in his day for landing to odd touch....as gant says the hobby breeder is no longer there either ....people want ups for little or nothing now a day...overall a sad day for a wonderful sport ..god be with the days of setting off to trial a few down the country ...waiting hours for your turn ...seeing the times yours returned , been elated as you headed back home dreaming of that stroke you you were about to pull...him not coming out of the box or worse been chinned on the line ..heady days indeed may they r.i.p....
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 10:21 AM BST
The buzz at schooling sessions is still there but the long wait for trials is gone........The game will survive and come good again.........dogs are faster nowdays and the crap is weeded out........Provincial tracks are trying hard as they always did......City tracks wanna get the finger out as they take the crowd for granted.........Shelbourne saturday nighters probably think we are telling porky pies.
Report wildmanfromborneo September 22, 2012 11:16 AM BST
Would the fact Listowel is on have any bearing on the number of bookmakers standing?
It's not that long ago when a group of bookmakers chartered a helicopter and flew back from Listowel to attend Shelbourne Park,admittedly it was Derby final night.
Report JayTrumpOldTomDubbl September 22, 2012 11:33 AM BST
3 bookies in Thurles most nights, and thats not the case in Waterford where you have just the one (Sharkey),he takes a decent bet though. Curaheen Park will be interesting over the next few weeks, LAURELS and I was told in Thurles last night that Curaheen could have 4/5 bookies for the duration of the Laurels ,(fancy Cuil Cougar),Youghal has one bookie and 2 maybe some Monday nights, so its the same all round.
Poor IGB management has a fair bit to do with it, but the current climate plays its part with money scarce everywhere especially with Fill Hogan and Noonan looking for all our bits of spare cash. Listowel was too much 7days Sad. I can see a few of the dog tracks closing within a few years as there wont be enough dogs to go around.The game is winding down though there is still a market for a good dog, witness The Kasco unraced at Thurles with at least 3 dogs sold, one to Charlie Lister. Also the Tyrur kennell cutting down to small numbers.The compass prefix rarely appears now, and its going to get worse.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 11:57 AM BST
sadly the answer is no wildmanfromborneo ,the staple diet at hx appears to be the two bookies ....i know some of them are having a hard time of it atm...i was talking to a bookie last night who wasn't standing , he told me that on derby night the only bookies to make money were the two backing w/o the favs ...the clever money is taking over at both horses and dogs ...if sidney keeps doing what hes doing they'll be only very small fish left to fry...who knows , the top trainer will kill the golden goose unknown to himself....
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:06 PM BST
Nobody really cares if 2 or 3 bookies stand at a meeting as long as they are prepared to take bets........I remember a bookie a few years ago and it was a night out for him.......he took his seed money out of the atm on the way to the track.....so he wasn't up to much for starters........he paid his 5 times the entrance fee and talked **** for the night.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 12:12 PM BST
gant what dog tracks need bigtime is atmosphere ....now i'm no bookies advocate , but with 2 or 3 bookies the place is simply dead ...more choice is good for the punter ...nothing like two or three runners scouring up and down looking  to lay off , while prices change at the drop of a hat ...sadly those days appear to have gone....
Report wildmanfromborneo September 22, 2012 12:19 PM BST
When you think of the catchment area in Dublin it is extraordinary that Thurles can have four bookmakers,Enniscorthy eight bookmakers and a Dublin track is down to two and as you say operating a cartel.
Used to bet with Jim Mulligan and he always went from the races back to the dogs as did many others,days that are gone.
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:19 PM BST
Sadly I don't remember that far back.........Very hard to generate atmosphere when the lads looking at the bookies have no money to punt or in most cases owe the bookie.
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 12:21 PM BST
Wildman.......Thurles can well have 4 bookies but they will take shag all especially with the hare driver marking the cards.
Report wildmanfromborneo September 22, 2012 12:33 PM BST
Fair points GANT and you have inadvertently hit on the reason Never Give Up no longer attends.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 2:20 PM BST
gant i'm only talking ten years back ...place buzzing , even allowing for the resession there was always plenty of bookies willing to take your cash ...i heard a story last night that would sicken you about how it came to be that only 2 bookies were standing ....a story for another day....its people like yourself i'd worry about ..people who live the game , no you see your lively hood been slowly eroded ...there are takers in this life and there are givers ..sadly more takers than givers ..what they dont realise is they are killing the game...
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 2:39 PM BST
We have cut back bigtime but thank christ it was only an expensive hobby......The way it's gone you would get more at an under 16 hurling match in Meath than Longford or Mullingar dogs........A match last night had the guts of 300/400 people at it.
Report workrider September 22, 2012 2:44 PM BST
a friend who reared mine has also given up...he fed the best of everything ...yet we have the igb acting as if theres nothing wrong ..heads in the sand ....a really sad tale...
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 2:54 PM BST
The frontline IGB employees are still grafting and fear track closures........The industry is always beaten with the stick that it's government funded.....It's one of these situations that has to get worse before it's cured.
Report Rocketfingers September 22, 2012 3:09 PM BST
But if guys can't make it pay they'll stop doing surely?
Report kavvie September 22, 2012 3:51 PM BST
one of the bigggest problems over the years has been the bookies betting to crazy overrounds.it has taken time but punters simply walked away.goose and golden egg spring to mind.take a look at the returned prices in igb.ie and its self explanatory.one i seen was 4/5 evs 5/4 and 2/1 the other 3.nice!!
Report Santry September 22, 2012 4:33 PM BST
Myself and my dad owned and trained our own dogs out of our back garden in the 70's and 80's with some success. At that time there was an inside and outside in both Shelbourne and HX. As a kid we watched Derby Finals from the hill in SP. Watched Yellow Printer and Own Pride win Derby's from there.There would be about 10 bookies outside and 30 inside in those times . Good memories.
The game has obviously declined in recent years and because I don't go any longer i'm not in a position to say why. For some reason in my own mind I always associate the rise of Paul Hennessey as a conveyer belt trainer with the demise of the small man. May not be fair but thats my idea.
I think the fact that Horse Racetracks charge approx the same entry now as the dogs where before there was a big difference has affected dog crowds.
Report Distant View September 22, 2012 4:47 PM BST
Have been there for each round this year.

Packed to the rafters for first round but that was made up of loads of English and others that were over for the weekend and the Derby final.

Last night was terrible and there was no traffic to the 2 bookies either. It was like a Monday night from 5 years ago.

I spent half the night chatting to Aidan about the exploits of Tina Marina, Premier County and Climate Control.
Report GANT007 September 22, 2012 4:48 PM BST
Paul Hennessey was probably the one who first started the numbers game......A nice fella and has done well considering his wife showed him how to put a collar on a dog.
Report slickster September 22, 2012 8:51 PM BST
what percentages were they betting to last night wonky?
Report never give up September 22, 2012 9:07 PM BST

Sep 22, 2012 -- 6:33AM, wildmanfromborneo wrote:


Fair points GANT and you have inadvertently hit on the reason Never Give Up no longer attends.


could u explain this comment wildbore/dark rosaleen????????????? p.s dont ruin another thread stalking me please

Report ambush September 23, 2012 11:20 PM BST
think there are only 46 greyhound bookmaker permits in ireland being used at the moment.amazing to think enniscorthy has almost 20% of doggie bookies in the country.no bookie in galway last night i believe.
Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 12:48 PM BST
Never Give Up to answer your stupid question,try just following the thread,you are a perfect match for Rocketfingers ye both have low attention spans and find long threads difficult,retread the thread slowly and you are bound to get it.
Report never give up September 24, 2012 1:33 PM BST
dont have to read it again wildbore/dark rosaleen my stalker....u said i no longer attend which is more lies from u................stop ruining threads with ur obsession of me weirdo
Report bobbybocala September 24, 2012 1:42 PM BST
never give up.....ya still attend.....but ya are hiding when ya do......must be hard to go to the dogs and .
Report bobbybocala September 24, 2012 1:42 PM BST
hav to avoid the bookies.......
Report never give up September 24, 2012 1:48 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 7:42AM, bobbybocala wrote:


never give up.....ya still attend.....but ya are hiding when ya do......must be hard to go to the dogs and .


never had to avoid anyone in my life clown

Report bobbybocala September 24, 2012 1:55 PM BST
why does everybody say here that you do then.....dont know who u are.....but from what i read the bookies are chasing ya round Ulster....
Report never give up September 24, 2012 1:59 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 7:55AM, bobbybocala wrote:


why does everybody say here that you do then.....dont know who u are.....but from what i read the bookies are chasing ya round Ulster....


everyone ?only  ur cross dressing friend has said it ...........bring up one thread were its said from anyone else other than ur friend or u will also be known as a liar

Report bobbybocala September 24, 2012 2:01 PM BST
im only saying what they are saying never give up.......as i said i dont know who u are.......
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:05 PM BST
who are they??name them please
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:05 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:01AM, bobbybocala wrote:


im only saying what they are saying never give up.......as i said i dont know who u are.......


you dont know who i am but u make these claims???????????????????????

Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:08 PM BST
He said it himself in one of his nocturnal rants,asked for help,thought Dark Rosaleen was the tote girl at the dogs,thought she was the girl in the restaurant ,thought she was chasing on some bookies behalf,he is obsessed with the now seemingly defunct Dark Rosaleen and tis that is the real shame.
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:11 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:08AM, wildmanfromborneo wrote:


He said it himself in one of his nocturnal rants,asked for help,thought Dark Rosaleen was the tote girl at the dogs,thought she was the girl in the restaurant ,thought she was chasing on some bookies behalf,he is obsessed with the now seemingly defunct Dark Rosaleen and tis that is the real shame.


LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh

what a liar u r since u were exposed as dark rosaleen on here u have gone crazy....u even admitted that u cant go a day without mentioning my name,u make all theses childish claims but cant back any of them up............just stick to stalking me and ruining good threads tootsie

Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:12 PM BST
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xm-UzSz5UmY
Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:17 PM BST
I have done you some service,you used to post just smileys that graduated to regurgitation of other posts with twomor three word replies,now you are becoming a valued contributor with long three line posts.
To complete your rehabilitation I will post a quiz with a question about pony races,that should enable you to break your duck and make the twelve hours you spent previously trying seem somehow worthwhile.
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:20 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:17AM, wildmanfromborneo wrote:


I have done you some service,you used to post just smileys that graduated to regurgitation of other posts with twomor three word replies,now you are becoming a valued contributor with long three line posts.To complete your rehabilitation I will post a quiz with a question about pony races,that should enable you to break your duck and make the twelve hours you spent previously trying seem somehow worthwhile.


i have never been on one of ur attention seeking quizzes,why would i when all u do is google the questions and answers..........im sorry that u have gone crazy since u exposed urself as dark rosaleen and im sorry that u cant go a day without mentioning my name

Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:23 PM BST
What was Man About Towns other name?
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:26 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:23AM, wildmanfromborneo wrote:


What was Man About Towns other name?


i dont want to be involved wildbore as that case is still going on

Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:29 PM BST
Brilliant you got the answer right in that you knew what I was on about,great to see you break your duck,well done.
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:30 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:29AM, wildmanfromborneo wrote:


Brilliant you got the answer right in that you knew what I was on about,great to see you break your duck,well done.


oh dear,does that excite u

Report kavvie September 24, 2012 2:34 PM BST
this thread stated out a s a comment on the puppy derby.the usual suspects have it taken over bikering at each other.how many times have we seen the same sh1t over and over again?betfair should really do something about it..same people same comments..
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:36 PM BST
kavvie,every time i go on a thread wildbore comes on and ruins it cos he feckin stalks me everywere.............this is the 2nd thread of workriders hes has done this on
Report kavvie September 24, 2012 2:40 PM BST
stop commenting on stuff so for a few weeks.he mite go away
Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:42 PM BST
Kavvie tis you that's ruining Never Give Ups finest hour,he has got a racing question correct,he has desisted from using smileys and has a post of three lines,now that's what I call progress.
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:42 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:40AM, kavvie wrote:


stop commenting on stuff so for a few weeks.he mite go away


fair enough kavvie,but it cant stop itself

Report lapsy pa September 24, 2012 2:45 PM BST
The forums are dying in any case,golf and general betting are ghost towns these days,horse racing one is getting quieter all the time.Not saying anything against the two of ye but ye are hastening its demise here.
Surely time to call a truce between yourselves.
Report kavvie September 24, 2012 2:48 PM BST
here here pa.one as bad as the other
Report never give up September 24, 2012 2:48 PM BST

Sep 24, 2012 -- 8:45AM, lapsy pa wrote:


The forums are dying in any case,golf and general betting are ghost towns these days,horse racing one is getting quieter all the time.Not saying anything against the two of ye but ye are hastening its demise here.Surely time to call a truce between yourselves.


lapsy pa,i have never come on here looking for anything that wildbore has wrote,but everyday or whatever thread i have posted on he makes comments thats nothing to do with the thread at all........he just stalks me like a lost sheep,its sad and weird

Report freddiek September 24, 2012 2:52 PM BST
but WMFB makes a contribution to the forum. He starts plenty of threads and has views on a range of sports, in addition to all the nonsense with yourself. Ive never seen you post anything that wasnt related to your squabbles with him
Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:53 PM BST
Pa Lapsy I have made an effort to post stuff of interest,I have made an effort to rehabilitate Never Give Up with some success I might add,he has gained a devotee through my efforts,am I not entitled to a little bit of a laugh.
Report lapsy pa September 24, 2012 2:54 PM BST
Never give up never had a problem with you,you know your racing imo,(Paddy o dee),Wildman makes a very good contributions to the forum in general.Its is the same merrygoround and whatever ye did to each other can,t be that bad that it is a war between ye all the time.
Report wildmanfromborneo September 24, 2012 2:58 PM BST
Damned Pipes of Peace,another avenue of pleasure is getting shut off.
Report Ozymandius September 24, 2012 2:59 PM BST
They can't stop.  They need each other.
Report lapsy pa September 24, 2012 3:00 PM BST
Thanks Wildman.
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