Frankel In Ireland

I totally agree with you for once, i think it would be a great idea, i know i would go up for it big time and so would a few of my friends, he'd be short for betting is the only thing but i suppose you could have that betting W/O Frankel. Ireland needs to attract some sort of sporting great to our shores, maybe tourism Ireland could offer something to Frankel's team to get them over.

I'd rather he went for the Arc, the Irish Champion Stakes used to be a great race but in recent years it has been a great big pile of crap in my opinion. I don't see the sense of another win over 8f [some have been calling for him to drop back on Champions Day] against the same horses he's been thrashing for the last year and a half. I don't really see the point in going for the English Champion Stakes over 10f where the opposition will be limited as well i'd imagine, [probably no Camelot, Nathaniel] he'd end up against Cirrus Des Aigles, Farrh [again] and Excelebration [again].

We already know he is the best 8f horse in the World, we already know he is the best 10f horse in the World now go and prove you are the best 12f horse in the World and prove those right who claim you're the best horse in history. The Prix De L'Arc De Triomphe is the best flat horse race of the year in my opinion and is the pinnacle of the season.

I don't see any reason not to go for it either. People have said the ground could be soft, so what he beat Nathaniel cosy on his debut as a 2yr old over a mile on soft ground. The trip is surely not a worry, he was not stopping in the Juddmonte over 10.5f and his brother Noble Mission has shown he stays that far and will probably stay 14f. I have no doubt he would win the Arc but even if he did somehow get beaten they already have a ready made excuse in the trip so it's not really going to effect his worth [would it?]. It's a no brainer for me, the best horses run in the best races and the Arc is the best race we have in Europe, however i have no doubt he will not run in it.

No chance of Frankel coming back to Ireland........pity.

Irish Champion Stakes is run over ten furlongs.
Premier would you not like to see him yourself,think of the crowds that would turn up at Leopardstoen.
Can't accept the Arc is the best race in Europe,it's always a rough race,wide draw means you have no chance,dreadful racecourse and run at the end of a long season so huge chance horses over the top,factor in the French stewards and you have a race where luck is all important.

I known it's ran over 10f, read my post again i never said otherwise.

Yes i would like to see him but i'd much rather see him step up again in the Arc it what in all probability will be a much stronger race and a much bigger challenge.

The Arc is clearly the best race in Europe in my opinion, you like your history, go back through it and look at all the greats that have ran in it and won it.

When I think of the Arc I think of all the greats that got beaten in it.
Running at Leopardstown wouldn't preclude him from running in the Arc.

Nathaniel is supposed to be running in both is he not? Many horses have used the Irish Cahmpion as a prep for the Arc so he could take in both if they really wanted too but the strong likelyhood is they will take in neither.

Anyway i can't see them leaving England with him, he will have nothing more than another racecourse workout in the English Champion Stakes and retire i'd imagine.

I agree,his trainers health will probably ensure he stays in England.

The lads in Ferrans who broke him and pre trained him reckon he will go for the Arc and then retire.
They are starting to break a beautiful bunch of yearlings at the moment and are looking forward to little Frankels a few years down the line.

premier, would STS lay claim to be the best horse in history at 8f and 10f, somehow I doubt it?, not bad to be thought of as the best miler and 10f horse ever don't you think?. Yes, I like you would love to see him contest the Arc because he didn't look like he was stopping over Yorks extended 10f, personally I think he would hose up in the Arc.

Wildman no chance of Frankel been supplemented for the Irish Champion it was never on the agenda at all, that they didn't even bother to enter the horse before the season started tells its own story.
The QE11 and the Qipco Champion are the only 2 entries he currently holds, both races fixed for the same day.

I've no idea what point you are trying to make silvergreaser, where did i say anything derogatory about being the best 8f and 10f horse ever? I said we already know how good he is at those distances and he basically has nothing to prove at those distances and why not step up and do it at 12f now, seen as you bring him into it just as Sea The Stars did.

I hope they're right Gant, would be a brilliant end to his career

You seem to be suggesting if he doesn't win over 12f it somehow taints his reputation?, would Shergar have won over a mile?.
Connections quite rightly had their reservations about the horse staying 12f, because in his early 3yo career the horse was virtually impossible to settle, he just wanted to runaway with his jockey, they've found the key to him and now he settles much better in his races, if he wasn't so headstrong as a 3yo who knows he might well have stepped up in trip much earlier, and then maybe even 12f?.

So do I........Best horse I have ever seen........The owner wants to go for the Arc but has left it to Henry Cecil and Tom Queally to do what's best for the horse.......Henry with the final call of course.

I never said that, i never implied that and you're making up things now so i'm out, good luck.

Not so sure i,d dismiss the arc with him,basically for what you are saying silvergreaser in that he settles a lot better,at York he took the preliminaries so well,very calm before the start,while the rest were well lit up.take the point with a big field can be a rough race,but can,t really see he,d have a lot to lose going for it and for stud purposes the 12f is the only thing he is short.

Why is France a 'dreadful country'?

Nothing to lose.......his first 4 seasons in the breeding barn will be booked out already.....owners mares plus selected proven producers.

Why is France a 'dreadful country?' ...Because wmfb says so in a cheap throwaway remark unworthy of that poster !

P.S. It isn't.

P.P.S. Frankel should go for the Arc . It's a pity he didn't lose one of his early races -people get so obsessed about an unbeaten record.

It's dreadful in my eyes,populated by some of the rudest people in the world,who in sporting terms are the biggest cheats in the world and I don't include Thierry Henri in that,are against us in the E.U. and have been since the start and finally never showed any appreciation for being saved in two World Wars indeed did the opposite.

Whatever gant says Wildclown backs him up whatever Wildman says the gant back them up if they are both in trouble they send for the 3rd musketeer Thickster, while Kavvie is the Dogtanian of the group.  France is a great country, would highly recommend a visit if you've never been, spent many a summer holiday there, touring around.

Calm down premier I didn't know you were that sensitive, I was just referring to your statement below;

"We already know he is the best 8f horse in the World, we already know he is the best 10f horse in the World now go and prove you are the best 12f horse in the World and prove those right who claim you're the best horse in history"

Obviously I picked you up wrong?, but your last line might suggest that unless he won over 12f he can't lay any claim to be the best horse in history?.
My apoligies!.

Rocketfingers.......go on back over to your fantasy thread.....We are discussing Frankel.

Wildman's xenophobia rearing its ugly head once again.

Wildman do you not think that Francophobia should be reserved for a seperate thread?.

Pointless call wmfb. Leopardstown ever, ever on the agenda and pf is right. The race has lost its lustre.
Arc should be the only stop but unfortunately, I doubt it.
They've been far too cautious with this animal. Done his talent a disservice in fact.
Wasted time running at 8f for so long.
He hasn't won one world renowned race in fact, which he could have done, had they let him off the leash earlier.
Shame.

"never, ever"

What world renowned races do you think he should have run in........The milers all did a runner to France to avoid him.

I knew that part would be picked up on!
Well I think the Derby was the first one but allowing for the fact he looked a dubious stayer at that stage, then I'll concentrate on this year. The Prince of Wales, (possibly the Eclipse), King George and Arc would be the major events in Europe I speak of. 
I'm aware of the POWs new found status, but I think it deserves a loftier status at this stage.
Some group 1s are more equal than others.
I'm not sure what you mean about the other milers btw GANT.
Everybody runs scared of him. Even connections of Nathaniel, who got closest to him than any other and deserves another shot.
The presence of other runners has nothing to do with the status of the races I speak of.
I just think they've wrapped it in cotton wool for longer than it needed and have missed the boat to an extent.

And they could also have given it a crack against Black Caviar at Ascot.
That would have settled a few bets, but connections didn't trust him enough.
A horse in a million but he could have won so much more than he did.

THERE a nice little seller in ffos las at the end of the month henry cecil is considering.i think we will see frankel once more only and its not in france or ireland the likely venue is ascot in oct...but i hope im wrong.

The Arc is a magnificent race and occasion.  Vive La France!

L'ignorance est toujours prête à s'admirer. Boileau

While I would love to see Frankel in the flesh in Ireland the sad fact is that the Irish Champion no longer has much international appeal.If Frankel is to appear outside of the UK I think the Arc is the only possibility.

9,000 turned up on a beautiful afternoon to see sea the stars in the same race. The simple fact is no flat horse will capture the public's imagination in this country.

rock of gibralter  ( the rock?)ran 13 times, frankels sire galileo ran 7 times,
they have proven that frankel is sound and has beaten everything put in front of him,
even though he has not won over 12 furlongs
if you have a staying mare will you be worrried to send it to frankel?
if you have a sprinting mare will you be worried send it to frankel ?
will you buggery they are exactly where they want to be with an unbeaten horse with stamina and speed the ultimate prize is the money to be made at stud,henry has trained and placed the horse to perfection to give him the chance at stud to make fortunes.

If Longchamp is getting thrown out out of the equation because of the poor track its not valid to put an American turf track in there in its place.
I'd go Irish champion stakes and Arc, Leopardstown looks like a decent line up and Longchamp may be a dodgy track but it didnt stop Zarkava or Sea The Stars, neither will happen obviously, I think they are scared out of their mind to push the envelope when they are holding pocket Aces incase ''something happens''. Frankel is still an exceptional horse

I think they are scared out of their mind to push the envelope when they are holding pocket Aces incase ''something happens''. Frankel is still an exceptional horse ....could/nt have said it better myself RICK.

thought he was born in Enland? Frankel (GB)?