2012 Total Galway figures:

Quick question, if say a bookie takes a bet of 10k, decides to lay it all off, if he lays if off in the ring i presume that would mean that the turnover was 20k. if he decides to lay it off via betfair the money leaves the ring and turnover falls.

So in effect the bookies are feeding the very animal that is killing them.

So the question is why do they indulge in a practice that will wipe them out?

I would imagine the net margin the bookies worked off this year massively increased,probably compensated their decline in turnover.

Ballinaman

A lot of the oncourse bookies are just arbers,they are taking no risk at all.They avoid the premium charge aswell with their corporate account status.

Dj, you will excuse my question but why do you think the net margin has increased ?

DeargDubh

Obviously the arbers will work off similar margins.Net and gross  Margin will have increased because of the amount of short priced favourites that were beaten,Galway is traditionally a bookmakers bonanza but this was accentuated by underfoot conditions this year.The overounds throughout the festival were also disgraceful.

Thank you dj

Dj are you implying that on course layers are exempt from premium charge?

Tolimi

I know off-course independent bookmakers and oncourse bookmakers whose accounts have a corporate status and are exempt from premium charge but it seems to be a very grey area.

Bring down the overrounds you will get more punters back. Simples !

Someone better give the racing authorities Rocketfingers advice and solve racings woes.
The overrounds only apply to betting shop punters,no one betting on the racecourse bets at S.P.,the S.Ps are dictated by the chains and don`t reflect the on course market.
If Never Give Up got over his obsessions he could explain to Rocketfingers how the betting market works.
Failing this the forums archivist could come down and explain the market as he knows it inside out.
Look at the misconceptions already on this thread,ten thousand bet and hedged means twenty thousand turnover,it doesn`t,arbers are result dependant,they aren`t.

Majority of arbers are not result dependent.Have you ever even used Gruss??One click and your profit is leveled on whether selection wins or loses.

Does that not make my point.

No it doesn't you said arbers are result dependent-Majority are not,just another example of a subject that you speak with an authority on, when you have a very limited knowledge of the subject.Have you ever even used Gruss??

Read my post again,i said they aren`t.
Notice how i don`t fly into a rage when you misquote me,you also said that arbers were result dependant in your reply to DeargDubh,seem to be changing tack.Your other bald statement that there are corporate clients who pay no commission is also wrong but i was prepared to let that go as you are so sensitive.

"arbers are result dependant"

U know nothing about the premium charge and are never likely to need to.U have had to give up laying because you value your own opinion so highly that you become drawn into believing an outcome can not happen.U have admitted this too me on past threads as your major weakness- A mug psychology if there ever was one.

Wildman, don,t know whether i read or heard corporate accounts are waived premium charge,i tend to agree with dj and what he said there,believe thet are also given favourable/bottom commission rates ie around 2% mark,though not certain there to be honest.Is it possible you leftout the word mean in the last sentence of 22.11 post?

wildbore is to busy mentioning my name several times each day that he gets confused now easily

Reading through your post again wildman,i picked it up wrong,seems clear enough you did say arbers aren,t result dependant

Just Read it again myself,I read it wrong aswell.

I never said they bet commission free ,I said, I know of some of them whose accounts are exempt from premium charges.

hes wrong about the overrounds

Hows that Kingrat?

he stated overrounds only apply to betting shop punters.

Think that was in reply to rocketfingers who stating the over-round on starting price returned,you would as wmfb is saying get considerably better pre race.

are u a bookie sport?dont make me laugh

Are you Australian?,no i,m no bookie,agree with you in part on course books could be a bit more generous,but the sp returns can give a misleading picture pending on who the final prices are taken off.

that maybe,buts it is a moot point.i was in ballybrit for 4 days and i didnt have 1 bet in the ring,because they are fcking robbers.and that my friend is a factor in bookmaker's turnover been down,i think that is rocketfingers point

Thats fair enough,hope you had a good few days there even beside the racing,i,m not disagreeing with yourself or RF and do know what you mean.On courses books struggling economy main reason but exchanges another ,consumer a lot more savvy these days which is a good thing. goodnight.

I have an opinion and I state it,why this so enrages dj876 is a mystery as he gives his and as he states came on giving advice on betting.When I get it wrong I say so,Laying Is The Hard Bit and Ruby Looks Injured being two threads I created that come to mind so I am not trying to conceal any betting disasters.Funnily enough despite dj876 intemperate comments I have paid the premium charge,no sooner was extracted from my account I went on a soul destroying losing run and despite requests from me it was not returned.
Pa Lapsy reasons for the collapse of bookmaker turnover are correct,one other factor for Galway would be the fact that the punters were shipping heavy losses.
Punters have never had it so good,I remember 20 per cent tax off course and 6 per cent on course,this tax differential meant all serious punters went racing also the only place to watch racing was on the course,those days are long gone which is why those particular bookmakers are in terminal decline.

I read your 20.11 post wrong Wildman and being impulsive me jumped in on maybe a thread i should have stayed away from.Still i,ve respect for both yourself and dj both of ye knowledgable and clever.
Surprised that when you received notification by email for the premium charge you didn,t stop there and then,by accepting it you are in fact colluding with it,(it being a "tax" on winners imo which i,ve never seen a good reason for,suppose its because they can.).A good strike rate,a bit of trading and being plus the relatively little amount of 8k can qualify you for membership. The unjustness of it is shown exactly by your experience.
Small disagreement with ye in regards the 20% in the olden days,if you were known in the betting office at all the 20% became 2% as two books were in operation behind the counter.

ah the good old 2% days!!

Des Fox and Jim Mulligan bet most of us tax free on the course,think its safe to say that now.

knew jim well , a real gent ....i remember having a bet with him at galway one year , he was having a bad festival , it won at 10/1 , he paid out and you'd never think he had done his town halls .. a real bookie....

yeah,cheers lads,a pair of mug punters!

workrider,what ever happened to jim,s son who took over from him.