IS THE CHELTENHAM BUMPER

depends how good a trainer you are and if you think that the Melbourne Cup is better than both.

Different distances

Different distances

You don`t say!

ROP will never win in Chelt, hill finish

Had this conversation with a fellow forumite on the phone after yesterdays race. Maybe they should aim this cue card at the arc

Would love to see Dunguib run in the Prix Royal Oak - the ground was the only reason he was not aimed at the Ascot GC!

Giant Strides i wanted to hear what the response was to what i said and that is what i expected the extra half a mile is some difference. It showed that Rite of Passage  needed the extended trip of 2 and a half so going for the melbourne cup might not suit him maybe the Cadran

his like Kasbah Bliss,top horse but should be narrowly defeated everytime he sets his hooves in prestbury park

I just realised that Rite Of Passage must be the first horse since Levmoss forty-one years earlier to bring off the Leopardstown November/Ascot Gold Cup double.

The sad part is that I am (just) old enough to remember Levmoss!

Fair enough RVW but we are talking about 15 months and this is a vastly improved horse now compared to then. He was still travelling turning for home yesterday. He was beaten (like all the others a long way out by Dunguib.
Think about this. If I told you then that ROP would win this years Gold Cup, how much of a certainty would people have made him that day for the Bumper? And what mental institution would you have committed me to, if I suggested it after the race!?
The rulebook I took years to learn in relation to racehorses has for me,been ripped to shreds over the past year,and this animal is one of the greatest mysteries of them all.
I would usually agree with you that he should stay at the trip for the Cadran, but on the basis of what hes done in such a short space of time, then he is surely expected to improve again by the time Melbourne comes around. Fascinating stuff but not for my pocket!

Correction to my previous post above: Enzeli also completed the Leopardstown/Ascot double in 1998/9.

The really sad part is that I am old enough to have forgotten this. despite backing Enzeli practically every time he won!

what odds would ROP have gone off in chelt this year if we knew he would win gold cup?
I'm stunned, didn't seem like a stayer at chelts to me. and i piled on him at chelt.

monksfield , i think incredibly levmoss won a h/cap under 10 st at the curragh either a week before or maybe even the same week as the arc , i had  only  started backing horses around that time  ,so am relying on memory so not set in stone . i backed levmoss at 33/1 on the sat with a bookie at shelbourne on the sat night 10s in those days was a lot of money to a lad  as i'm sure you're  aware     

i remember laying him at chelt this yr but if i knew he was this good i prob wouldnt. In the bumper2yrs ago he struggled coming up the hill, not good to win the next yr, the form of that race gave me the same reason to lay willies fancied horse aswel.Dunguib turned over on the first only reinforced the theory
Dermot did say all along that he would consider taking ROP to melb cup so winning the ascot gold cup shouldnt come as too much of a surprise, he was highly regarded by the master trainer.

Weld said today that he can handle heavy but is not physically strong enough to quicken out of tacky ground like at cheltenham this year, there is also a theory going around which the trainer has never commented on that he is better on a flat track.

Workrider,

I just checked my 1969 form book.  Your memory is not too bad. Levmoss won the '68 November handicap.  Next start back over a mile in the Gladness in March '69, fifth of six as outsider of the six to 3yo stablemate Rocked.  Next start won the Ascot Gold Cup.  Next start Curragh Wed. 10 Sep '69 won the Leinster Handicap with 10st 10lb.  No French results in '69 Sporting Chronicle Racing Up-to-date Form Book.