Irish Sports
Welcome to Live View – Take the tour to learn more
Start Tour
There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
Syndicate here have had 27 entries (and entry fees) without getting a run .. full training fees all the time.
Today, with Gowran off, presumably it costs the same to bring a non-runner to the track as a runner ... usually costs several hundred with this syndicate ..
Two syndicates I know have lost about one third of their members in the past few months ... 80 bucks a month is a lot more of disposable income than it was a year ago ... it must be one of the toughest times in the history of racing / training.
Today, with Gowran off, presumably it costs the same to bring a non-runner to the track as a runner ... usually costs several hundred with this syndicate ..
Two syndicates I know have lost about one third of their members in the past few months ... 80 bucks a month is a lot more of disposable income than it was a year ago ... it must be one of the toughest times in the history of racing / training.
Show More
Without listing the 27 races, can you explain how you've been balloted out 27 times without a run. I know balloting is difficult but the fact is most trainers do not know how it works and owners won't educate themselves. Check out the balloting rules Directive 10 http://info.hri-racing.ie/notices/HRI_Directive_Book.pdf
As for syndicates, it is certainly a tough time for them, including my own. There is still interest from people to join syndicates but they are no longer interested in store horses and would prefer to buy horses in training. That's where we will try to find out next one......even from the point to point field or bumpers.
As for syndicates, it is certainly a tough time for them, including my own. There is still interest from people to join syndicates but they are no longer interested in store horses and would prefer to buy horses in training. That's where we will try to find out next one......even from the point to point field or bumpers.
if uv a horse that needs good ground ur caught in a right hole
thats why people who are struggling to pay for horses now are under extra pressure now
thats why people who are struggling to pay for horses now are under extra pressure now
its impossible to be balloted out that many times if your trainer is doing his job correctly.
give it a spin in the uk, most of the courses over there will sub your travel...
Well the secretary of this syndicate says that you do pay entry fees - even if you are balloted out .. this must be a goldmine for the authorities, if true ... I usually see 100 plus entries when I check ...
You do not pay if declared and balloted out is my understanding.
600 euro per run to get to the races is what this secretary says is the average cost of getting this nag to the post has been over the past 15 months ( probably includes jockey fee) ... a little under 30 grand for the period, including trainng and all other fees.
You do not pay if declared and balloted out is my understanding.
600 euro per run to get to the races is what this secretary says is the average cost of getting this nag to the post has been over the past 15 months ( probably includes jockey fee) ... a little under 30 grand for the period, including trainng and all other fees.
Racing Charges 2009
An owner can expect the following deductions from their account when entering and racing a horse.
*Entry Fee
0.7% of total race value
Declaration Fee
0.2% of total race value
**Bookage Fee
13.50 for an ordinary race
#Jockey Fee per Race
141.81 Flat
163.61 National Hunt
*Entry and declaration fees can vary for certain races.
** Higher Charges apply for pattern, group and listed races.
# Subject to national wage agreement increases. Subject to VAT 13.5% if the jockey is VAT registered.
Prize Money Deductions
Trainer & Associated Funds
10%
Of gross prize money less entry fee and SEBS
Jockey & Associated Funds
10%
Of gross prize money less entry fee and SEBS
Stable Employee Bonus Scheme
3%
Of gross prize money
Jockey Emergency Fund
1%
Of gross prize money less entry fee
SEBS Stable Employees Bonus Scheme funds distributed amongst stable staff
JEF Jockeys Emergency Fund welfare fund established
An owner can expect the following deductions from their account when entering and racing a horse.
*Entry Fee
0.7% of total race value
Declaration Fee
0.2% of total race value
**Bookage Fee
13.50 for an ordinary race
#Jockey Fee per Race
141.81 Flat
163.61 National Hunt
*Entry and declaration fees can vary for certain races.
** Higher Charges apply for pattern, group and listed races.
# Subject to national wage agreement increases. Subject to VAT 13.5% if the jockey is VAT registered.
Prize Money Deductions
Trainer & Associated Funds
10%
Of gross prize money less entry fee and SEBS
Jockey & Associated Funds
10%
Of gross prize money less entry fee and SEBS
Stable Employee Bonus Scheme
3%
Of gross prize money
Jockey Emergency Fund
1%
Of gross prize money less entry fee
SEBS Stable Employees Bonus Scheme funds distributed amongst stable staff
JEF Jockeys Emergency Fund welfare fund established
Celticboy, the biggest misconception is that if I get a ballot it helps me next time around. Not true. A ballot for an 80-95 handicap hurdler is worth nothing to you if you enter into an 81-102. In fact the ballot is worth nothing in an 81-102 as it is rating related. So if you have an 83 rated horse and you want to run in an 80-95 then you need ballots for that. A 81-102 works on the highest rated getting in so if you have an 83 rated horse there is a fair chance you won't get in irrespective of the number of times you enter as it is done from top down. If two of you on 83 fighting for the last place then ballots help but only ballots in 81-102 races. But your trainer should know that and if he doesn't the syndicate manager needs to get himself up to speed.
30k over 15 months sounds a bit expensive, even for a decent trainer. Ten months of bills at 1,500 and five months off at 500 is 20k and eight or ten runs would add another 400 a run (150 jock fee, 100 entry, 150 travel and lads expense) so maybe 4k which is 24k. That leaves 6k for other costs which looks high but then I don't know the circumstances.
30k over 15 months sounds a bit expensive, even for a decent trainer. Ten months of bills at 1,500 and five months off at 500 is 20k and eight or ten runs would add another 400 a run (150 jock fee, 100 entry, 150 travel and lads expense) so maybe 4k which is 24k. That leaves 6k for other costs which looks high but then I don't know the circumstances.
Best solution is to get a statement of your turf club account and the syndicate go through it, if there is a fiddle going on it will show up..........I know of a case where this happened.......
celticboy, sounds to me like your syndicate secretary (or trainer) is missing a trick here... you shouldn't have to pay any entry fee if you are not making the cut on the ballot... but, as you say, only if you declare... i've long suspected hri make lots of easy money like this... people check the ballot the day after entry and if it looks hopeless for them they move on and 'forget' to declare anyway to save the original entry fee
If you declare and are balloted out your entry fee is refunded.If you are so far down the list that you have no chance of getting in and do not declare you forfeit your entry fee.I would seriously doubt that any trainer would be so incompetent not to know the difference.
Tolmi, does the trainer see the HRI statements with the entry fees on it? Most of the bigger trainers know the balloting system inside out but smaller trainers are not as knowledgeable and they don't see the statement so owner has to bring it up. If you read the Directive, it is easy to pick things up a different way to how they actually are. The problem is that the rules are not clear with no examples to help you along which is prob the way HRI wants it. Confusion increases the coffers
Post Your Reply
Please login to post a reply.
Wonder
Instance ID: 13539