uk runners only a handful ran in eclipse. irish derby/oaks , and now 2 in K, George

1st time poster it was a Saturday night and after the referee stopped the fight the crowd through bottles and drinks in the ring.

minter took a proper beating,plenty of claret everywhere

Out of interest Diff who would you say is outstanding at that distance this season? Or do you see them as much the muchness?

Was Los Angels ever going to show before his Ascot flop? As it is you have a former Leger winner setting the pace for a Leger winner and none of the Classic crop / dual Classic winners are showing.

4 runners if you disregard the 150,s shot

I hope Rebel's Romance wins, think he deserves a real big one in the UK.

Regarding the minter hagler fight 1st time poster I always remember it was a Saturday as back then on a Saturday I would always go in the local cricket and bowling club in the afternoon as there was a bookie in going tax free,well there was an older lad who was always in who bet in 10p patents or .25 p each sometimes.50 each way well on this Saturday he asked the bookie what price was hagler for that nights fight most including me had never heard of hagler ,the bookie replied 2/1 the old fellow pulls out £50 and says I’ll have that on hagler then,well it was like the pied piper everyone followed him in ,it was probably the only club/pub in the country where everyone was cheering for hagler.

Tend to remember the odds for those big yesteryear fights Jimnast as followed boxing closely , these days if they fought in the back garden i'd close the curtains , seemed to be 8/11 vs 11/10 for this one.....

According to The Times, the bookies had Minter as 8/11 favourite with Hagler at 11/10, although the previews of the fight tended to paint a different picture. "I feel Minter is in grave danger of losing to Hagler, the man good judges rate the most capable and dangerous in the division," wrote the Mirror's Frank McGhee, who was not alone in voicing his concerns. Srikumar Sen in the Times was chillingly accurate in part of his assessment: "For British supporters, the bout could well have an unsatisfactory ending with the referee stepping in to prevent Minter losing too much blood."

If the booing greeting Hagler's arrival to the ring on the night was inevitable, and the disrespectful whistling of the US national anthem by a minority not totally unexpected, the hostility in the crowd was something else. "Wembley Arena was reeking, not so much of nationalism, but had a decidedly rancid smell of racialism," noted Harry Carpenter after the fight, and stories of over-zealous fans ripping up any banners held by Hagler supporters were commonplace. Hagler's wife, Bertha, was advised to leave her stars and stripes flag safely tucked away, through fears of trouble. Very wise.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/that-1980s-sports-blog/2013/oct/03/alan-miller-marvin-hagler-1980-boxing-low-point

Not only did we get tax free then we got an inflated price looking forward to the return of the illegal bookmakers courtesy of the gambling commission and online bookmakers.

Wasn’t aware of his wife been advised to leave her flag at home ,it’s a shame that’s not a policy now it seems all flags welcome besides you know who,Russian and the Union Jack.

good days jimnast/hayden

RR’s prize money total is quite sensational.  Has any horse ever won more?

I don't think there is an outstanding horse - at least they haven't shown it yet - hence last time I looked it's 10/1 the field for the Arc. We haven't had too many greats in recent years. To compensate we get plenty of cheerleaders trying to invent them.

I don’t think there’s been a real top class horse since kingman of the top of my head plenty of good ones

Well done drum.  Ever the sneerer.  You seem to know it all.

Loyal

Uk trained I would think enable would have won more ,not seen ged for a while he would know for certain.

Diff, “They shouldn't have frightened away the opposition”

So there was nothing to scare away and it’s just the small field that you don’t like?

The two you mentioned have yet to prove that they are that level. One formiline ties Merchant to the horse that’s not going and he’s won 2 Deeeerbies!

Lost AP money talk? On Merchant?

Trained by Freddy Head, Goldikova is the only horse to have won three (2008, 2009, 2010) Breeders' Cup Mile races.

My fav miler franking the form of another great Zarkava.

And I couldn’t care for ratings. To be a true great you have to do it out of your comfort zone.

Look no further than Jan Brueghel, I believe; the monkey has enormous ability, just quirky and hard work for Moore. I think the winner will get a good reception in The Arc market.

But, it cannot be an outstanding renewal if one is a St Leger winner, the other an irregular winner.

Also won a good Queen Anne and then a very good 2nd in the same race a year later beaten by canford cliffs who’s next run was in the dual on the downs.

Yes and when beaten by Hannon’s at Ascot Pesiler wore the wrong boots! Forgot his! Borrowed a pair and put up a 1lb overweight!

2 lb to be exact delashay not sure if her record still stands but at the time of retirement had won more group ones than any other European trained horse.

Even better when you consider the allowance she then wasn’t getting. A true great for me. I remember telling all the old boys in the Nanny to get on that night for her first Breeders Cup. 5/1!  Never got so much love the day after!

I believe the the record still stands and she was a narrow second also?

Yes a length which the overweight may have made a difference however I’m not one for exact science in a top class horse race .

Nor I and I can still see Pes in my mind being interviewed on ATR that morning saying we’ll go to the Champange Bar!
His wife was immaculate, my father and I said oh La La!

Something that always stuck in my mind was when sir Henry was been interviewed and was asked the question you face the runner up on 3 ld worse terms from your horses debut sir Henry replied if I can’t improve a horse 3 lb from its debut I’ve no right to be training horses.

What horse was it that they referred too?

He was in decline as far as owners go when I started watching. Still had Juddmonte, remember Star Cluster was a filly he liked, she was beaten by Red Evie and Spencer.
.

I wouldn’t remember which horse delashay I would guess the interview was mid 80s

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, wrong thread or not, you know what was weird? When Riposte won for his wife Jane after at Ascot.
Said RIP.

On the track her name RIPost

Have a good one and if we take a positive from the lack of runners this weekend, it means we have more to show up elsewhere and the season goes on.

Great royal ascot that year riposte winning for Julie and estimate winning the gold cup for the Queen

Regarding the king George it never pleases me when the derby winner doesn’t show up

Have a good one

Great memories, see this morning that the post has Harbinger as the top rated winner. Figgis had talked about Crystal Ocean and Poets Voice highly. I’d forgot what a great battle that race was too.

Who was the German colt ridden by Murtagh? Was a late withdrawal from the Arc that year.

Novelist

They’ve written this in the article :

Harbinger won in a course record time and it was felt he had the potential to be one of the greats.
2.26.78

Novelist
2.24.60

Didn’t seem correct on reading as I’d remembered the German colt relished the hill and had put up a great time and a career best.

Delashay

Harbinger is the only top class  horse I’ve seen on the flat that I just couldn’t have an opinion on to his merits in the all time list on king George day he as outstanding but never ran again .

It was a small but good field, with Youmzain, Workforce etc…

When Enable had Waldgeist in behind 2L back PC Boudot said to Fabre that he’d knew they’d win the Arc later that year.

Looking at her form I’d forgot that she’d won a 3 runner KG!

makes me laugh to see loads going on about horses visiting from another country and pillaging the big prizes

all that great history, the u k tradition disappearing... no one standing up for it

lets just all moan about and do feck all about protecting your traditions your ways and your racing history

makes me laugh to see loads going on about horses visiting from another country and pillaging the big prizes

all that great history, the u k tradition disappearing... no one standing up for it

lets just all moan about and do feck all about protecting your traditions your ways and your racing history

Where’s the moaning? I for one welcome international competition and thankfully the race is open to geldings.

The success of the winners - and the placed - of the King George in the Arc
In the English Summer Arc, the success of the winners and those placed is very often synonymous with success in the French Arc... but it also works in the opposite direction...


Undoubtedly one of the best springboards for the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe, the 'King George' is obviously a major goal in itself, but its winner and even his 'placed', are experiencing great success on the first Sunday of October (5 October this year) in the tricolor flagship race over 2,400 meters. Bluestocking is a glaring example, she will make the Arc her own in 2024, about 70 days after his second place in the King George behind the Frenchman Goliath, who beat her very clearly, but who could not compete for the Arc as a gelding (like Calandagan). As for the Enable crack, it will not only achieve the double in 2017, but will also win the 2018 Arc and the 2019 and 2020 King George. Third in 2019, Waldgeist will shine at Longchamp two months later in the 'QPAT' with P.-C. Boudot. Even more surprising, the case of Workforce, penultimate in 2010, then crowned in the Arc a few weeks later with Ryan Moore (who will be in the saddle on Saturday on Jan Brueghel). Second in 2023, Westover will also finish 2nd in the Arc. First in 2016, Highland Reel will rank 2nd. Winner in 2014, Taghrooda will be 3rd at Longchamp. We can also have the opposite way... With Danedream, who will make the 2011 Arc his and then the 'King George' in 2012... Ditto for Hurricane Run (2005-2006) and Montjeu (1999-2000). These two races are, so to speak, twin and both in one direction as well as the other, the list is far from exhaustive...

Going back to ‘78 only one Gelding has won the race.  That was last year.

The former winners of the King George at Ascot was denied in The Arc eg Taghrooda, Postponed and Enable: 1st had stall 15; 2nd (ran in Meydan, but beat Found at Epsom easily); 3rd was denied due to a deluge (heavy) on race day.

Today the winner with the exception of Calandagan will be fancied for The Arc eg Jan Brueghel and Kalpana. I cannot fathom how Calandagan is shorter than his conqueror at Epsom Jan Brueghel.

Apparently the purse for the King George & QE2 next year will swell to £2m. This is great news. I hope this is not represented by another small field like today ie 5, 1 is a pacesetter for another.

Why have they reached for cheek pieces?

You can see on the head on Moore using his whip to stop him passing at Epsom having had the run of the race. If Mikel goes that close again I’d be surprised, but they’re jockies!

I can only say to make Jan Brueghel focuses a bit more; Jan Brueghel is quirky with plenty of ability. I think 3.6 is tremendous value.

Fair play Impossible, I know you like the horse, hard to knock his record.

I’m behind watching just seen AOB 0-16 in G1’s with first time cheek pieces.

Have to be with Kalpana at the prices.

I understand Calandagan is a formidable adversary. However, prior to his St Cloud win and Epsom run he was rather nondescript and tame even when losing out to Danan Decile, Anmaat and City Of Troy.

I like Jan Brueghel because he's the best of AOB's older horses, and I believe is his 1st string for The Arc unless one of the 3-yr old fillies really impresses in an Arc trial in September.

Kalpana is a stonking price if the ground is softer. The form of Whirl on a line thro' Minnie Hauk was unimpressive, I believe. Anyway, this is horseracing; the horses have a habit of putting us in our place - a humbling phenomenon.

Kalpana has not run over 12 furlongs since her last winning run at Ascot but the form of that race is not all that great. I don't think that 10 furlongs is far enough for her to show what she can do. Calandagan seems a bit soft to me. The sixth prize would have been about £20k but no owners of decent 3yos seem to think it worth having a go. If the pacemaker drops right out the 5th prize of £40k would have been there for the taking.

Mental, is it not? A £20k public gallop is still not sufficiently attractive for some trainers. Wake up trainers!!

Indeed sageform quite incredible

Whirl is still unexposed over 12f as is Minnie Hauk, unimpressive last time and you’d have to question the form. Did she give her true running at the Curragh, had wemightakethelingway much further back at Epsom.

It is the owners final decision. I quite understand a trainer not wanting to have one finish last. Time for Rugby. Lions by 20 points?

The question with Kaplana is if they need further are they good enough? Los Angles was better over ten and we know about him.

Thanks I’ll be watching and hope so but can’t see that wide a win!

increased prize £ wont attract the 3 yr ols ,if AOB,johhnny  g ,becket.THE FRENCH etc continue to dominate the 3 yr old division common sense mus t tell people they,ll have lots of older horses/owners to place,if their nor running in KG in summer where are they running, no los angeles today and still no need for AOB to run a 3 yr old,is anyone bothered if the 3 yr old also rans dont turn up,theirs a 3 yr old runnig at york today and for the stayers st leger coming up,and if AOB has a real hot 3 yr old he targets triple crown rather than KG, ascot CEO jus proving why  a bog average in european terms  godolphin horse can rack up £11 mill in prize money

in uk/european group one terms rather than the superstars oilly bell and co are  trying to sell you, CALDAGAN,REBELS ROMANCE, KALAPANA are can we play you every week horses and all 3 are in a 5 runner race including a 150,s shot

Despite all the talk it’s a no bet race for me.

Trapman was talking of Calandagan needing cheek pieces or a visor at Epsom, Jan has them, both are short for me on that score.

Graffards was furious with Paquier after the Champion for going too soon. The horse had been beaten with a diff jock learning about him.

I’ve posted that AOB took advantage of his slow starting at Epsom. He’s been easy to predict for the opposition, last time at Saint Cloud he tracked his main rival Aventure, I expect the same stalking and try to make use of his long acceleration at a course he loves. Moore will try to test his stamina.

The prize extra prize money I believe is to try and attract a Japanese Colt. Ascot are always keen to attract them.

A top 3 yr old is unlikely to be risked running in the King George at Ascot unless it's head and shoulders above the others; its potential breeding value is the barometer - not prize money. The owners are almost entirely and insanely wealthy already.

*The horse had been beaten with a diff jock learning about him. (Since the Champion) Epsom was Mikels first ride and I also shared that he didn’t like the soft.

AOB could have ran the Irish Derby runner up. Other targets and form lines to protect for now?

Calandagan is 1.49 to finish in the top 2 for those shortie backers. But, taking a shortie on Calandagan?

sageform • July 26, 2025 11:03 AM BST
It is the owners final decision. I quite understand a trainer not wanting to have one finish last. Time for Rugby. Lions by 20 points?

They’ve come out a lot quicker this week

Excellent point sage on the available priz-money.  It is a nonsense really.

A confined 2-y-o race at Ascot today is worth £27k to the winner but has just 7 runners. I am tired of the approach of most trainers in not tilting at these races.

“ Moore will try to test his stamina.”

Some thing said by AOB with Chapman and Ed’s repeating the tactics.

Boom!

A complete disaster with tactics from Coolmore. Well done Calandagan backers!

Wd Dela.

I just cheered it Loyal, not my price, but heard him called a lot of names and he’s an admirably consistent horse. I’m pleased for the trainer, who I’ve had a hard time working out.

Surprised at Kalpana and that gives the Whirl form a boost, which we’d touched on earlier.

Another G1 at Ascot not won, talking about making it a stamina test, can’t believe a word that they say. Odd tactics, same as Los Angles

Jan was being scrubbed before Continuous

I'm glad the French have won. He's the rightful winner.

7 to 4 all week and itv have red drfiting aqiggle against the horse for 10 moins at 11 to 10, whats that all about ?

7 to 4 all week and itv have red drfiting aqiggle against the horse for 10 moins at 11 to 10, whats that all about ?

wins shortest price its been all week and gets the red dirfter squiggle off itv

Jul 26, 2025 -- 4:24PM, Delashay wrote:

Another G1 at Ascot not won, talking about making it a stamina test, can’t believe a word that they say. Odd tactics, same as Los Angles

yep LA in the POW another massive coolmore own goal

Jul 26, 2025 -- 4:28PM, 1st time poster wrote:

7 to 4 all week and itv have red drfiting aqiggle against the horse for 10 moins at 11 to 10, whats that all about ?

yep only 1 horse for money
wonder how much of that money knew coolmore were going to lay an egg with the tactics

Fair play impossible I’m sorry about yours, just didn’t think the horse deserved being called soft. There were legit reasons for his defeats, I’d posted on the AP that they said the ground was too soft at Epsom. It was his first run back after returning from Dubai.

Makes you wonder wonder? Very strange tactics and if I’d of been a backer of Jans I’d be peeved with that. Very.

We all know what he’s capable of and those tactics didn’t to play to his strengths.

As a punter there’s nothing worse than expecting your horse to do something and then they decide to break the mould and do something completely different that makes NO sense.

Just managed to lay Jan at 3 in-running. I was not expecting that tactic deployed; I'm just glad he turned up.

Took you a while to let us know. 

they,d already broken the mould putting head gear on

It wasn’t positive and I thought that he looked big. Certainly ran like a fat one with those iffy tactics.

Any mention anyone as to the French colts next race?

Nothing in the Chappers interview.

Thank you LH

sorry , but how can the so called GOAT run his top horses so unconsistent,

Connections from the beaten horses have given their takes on the race and their horses except AOB. Why? Who came up with the idea of 2 AOB's horses making the running for the other 3 runners? How can a Leger winner make the running in a 12f race? AOB tried that in the Prince Of Wales not backfired big time.

A brain-fog from AOB and Coolmore. And, this is in addition to fitting 1st time blinkers on the horse. An extraordinary co*k-up from AOB and Coolmore unlikely to be repeated, ever!

imbecile
How the hell do you think a Leger winner should be ridden in a 1m4f race?

continious  was cantering all over jan 3 out , but was beaten further today than he did when doing the donkey work in the coronation , actually i backed the horse at 180 , by race time was around 60s ,   god knows what this stable is doing

Possibly the AOB team had contingency plans in place in case the cheekpieces lit up Breugel too much and Ryan didnt then want his pacemaker in front to make it too excessive a pace and signalled same to Lordan , though pace didnt look excessive . Perhaps Continuous losing front shoe played a part . Perhaps they wanted him as a ' blocker ' . Who knows .

Perhaps it was simply a case of people who know next to nothing about training thoroughbreds telling their trainer what to do.
I believe that to be the most likely scenario.

Paul as you’re a horseman, how much effect can losing a show have?

elisjohn • July 26, 2025 8:11 PM BST
continious  was cantering all over jan 3 out , but was beaten further today than he did when doing the donkey work in the coronation , actually i backed the horse at 180 , by race time was around 60s ,   god knows what this stable is doing

John it goes to show how badly Brugel ran. Looked like an unfit horse to me.

Continious has a knee action as dramatic as Ancient Wisdom. He looks a shadow of himself but needs soft, most likely heavy to show anything like his true running.

Re lost shoes its an open question , but depends on the horse , ground , pain , damage . But horses win having lost them too . There is an Edinburgh study that is too complicated for me .

Thanks and unless we know the damage caused during the loss we can’t tell….