picture of you

pretty stinking.

3.12

Rotten to the core.

Incredible,kept opposing it while leading until pulled up .Nice to be on the inside.

Very bad. So blatant. Horse was still pulling still had plenty left in the tank.

pulled hard innit.

and will any action be taken by the authorities...doubt they'll even bother to ask for an explanation!

The horse is total hound! De Bromhead couldn't get a win out of her and horse was beaten at odds on in her final start for him. So how do you think Ralph is going to do any better with her?

just watched it..it was very free during the race but jockey was pulling it up as they approached the hurdle and then took it wide and pulled up..it hadnt been put under any pressure and was still disputing the lead..a drift is always suspicious and that run certainly was.

When shea raced off a similar layoff

7th

Picture Of You
511-2
9/2
T: H De BromheadJ: Rachael Blackmore
Held up towards rear, took keen hold, not fluent 3rd, in rear halfway, pushed along in 7th approaching straight, ridden and no impression before 2 out, no extra op 5/1

So a hound and probably needed the race too....she might win a weak seller and I mean weak, but she wouldn't be carrying my money!

*she

susp imo.

I beg to disagree.
I backed the winner win and place as I didn't think much of picture of you s form and thought it over rated and by timeform comments.

Knowing how a lot of the the Irish horses often take time to acclimatise to English yards I thought it a false fav and was very pleased to see the massive move for crying lightening , who was good enough to run with credit in a listed bumper last time out.
So in my opinion only had to jump well enough first time over hurdles to win.
The fact there had been money backing it down from 10s this morning would surely lead one to believe it had schooled sufficiently well.

I only watched the race on my phone but picture if you looked like it was verging on the side of unsteerable and hence why he was taken to the outside and pulled up.

Happy to be disproved as always, but that was the way I saw it.
.

Apologies but ran out of space on my phone screen - combined with the fact it hadn't run for 5 months, was turned over at 1-3 last time out , wasn't a world beater and could Alistair Ralph improve a Henry de brom cast off ?   I seriously doubt it.
Mug money made it fav / stable whispers possibly , but the right horse won in my opinion.

as 1 10 has started the after-timing

i laid it for a place, and again i/r when it veered off. on atr pics. droners must have been asleep. i also backed the 3rd for place at 10

fairly comprehensive after-timing there

Evening Mitolo,  no aftertiming going on  .
Just explaining to those who are crying foul because of the drift that the horse should never have been an odds on shot and why the market was correct at the off.

If I wasn't a gentleman , a less polite way of putting it would have been to say those who studied the form properly came to the right conclusion - Crying Lightening was the superior horse with loads of potential and should be backed accordingly as the only other opposition to it was an exposed dog that de bromhead couldn't manage to get a win out of and a Hobbs point to pointer having its first run under rules and it's first try over 2miles.

The other runners were 50s and 300s...

Interestingly enough I have just looked at the results comments on the rp site and they are EXACTLY what I said above for how the horse looked in running.
If I could see it on a 4 inch mobile screen then I suggest they all could see it too, so they are just talking through their pockets, rather than questioning their selection process.
.

I suggest you have another look at the race mate...

Yes, the drifter pulled a bit but not unduly hard.
But it had jumped six hurdles straight and true and was still leading without ever being asked a question when inexcusably pulled wide and pulled up.

How is that 'riding to obtain the best possible placing'?

The person talking through their pocket is you because you happen to have found a winner and seem intent on telling everyone.

depends who moved it 2.42 to 1.73

paudy, you out there son ?

Racing has been crooked since the day they began racing horses.

Madhatter,
First point,  I'm not talking through my pocket. I did not come on here and start a topic about me winning . Others are crying foul play so i came on here to give a viewpoint of why it wasn't.

Main point, I followed your advice and have now re watched the race.
Please don't take offence, but it's not my job to teach you how to race read, but I obviously can see / understand more in 1 viewing on a mobile than you have done.

I don't have the time or the inclination to count each fence to take you through the race step by step, but the horse is lit up a d goes off in front. It's a short necked yoke with a high head carriage - my most hated type of horse to ride.
If you're not a horseman you'll have to take my word on this but something like the 2nd or 3rd hurdle the horse is thinking of running out, jj feels this and takes necessary action. She has the same idea coming into at least 2 other hurdles and jj gives her a slap as she is thinking of ducking left and right.
Then the hurdle before she pulls up if you see her waver on the approach and she is hanging like a gate so badly that he has both hands on the off rein trying to hold her straight , and then I think she rocks her jaw and she goes hard left so he eases off and pulls her up.

I'm not trying to cause an argument but if you don't believe me then re watch it and go to slow mo and blow up the picture onto the jocks hands coming into the last hurdle she jumps before pulling up. 

The only other person I know on the forum who rides horses is Acey , he might if you ask him, look at the race and tell you what he sees.
The reason I say this is everything I've told you that is happening is what I see as a horseman, someone who doesn't have a lot of experience won't be able to see what I'm telling you is happening.

I don't want to be mocked or ridiculed but I know what they are thinking when I'm riding them or watching them,  as I'm sure Acey does too. It's what comes with a lifetimes experience of riding them.
.

tolo pmsl..

you laid it for a plaice on atr when it veered off 20yds behind the drone and GPS..

i play ev race on the drone..as soon as the GPS detects deceleration every penny is instantly stripped from the market.

Apologies for phone autocorrecting - Not rocks - should read -  she locks her jaw and goes hard left.

The money trail gives the explanation.

approaching the last hurdle it jumped burke is absolutely strangling it for no reason imo..when it landed he never tried to steer it to the right..he almost let it run off the track...
the game is as bhent as a shepherds crook,so for that reason i trust fck all.

Rico, to trot out an old cliche, have you ever sat on a horse??

well oneten and acey have, so ignore what you see, they know.

clothes horse?

Where can I watch replay? Sporting Life show a message say no compatible source was found for this media

as soon as the GPS detects deceleration every penny is instantly stripped from the market.

you don't need to have ridden the winner of the oaks to know what's happening on here.

it did pull hard, granted.  but sometimes they pull hard and win, so I'm told. 

that was getting laid as if it was never winning, hard puller or not. 

7.4 about a 2's on hard puller, that's ballsy.

rico, that will do, your views are now back in the game.

oneten is currently preparing to unveil his 10-1 ticket on the winner, the horse he knew was far superior from its mid div listed bumper run, and his big lay of the useless morning favourite, sit tight.

No price is too short when you know

Yes G Hall, but which money tail are you referring to ?  The biggest market mover of the day was Crying Lighting backed from 10s into 11/8.

The future that is

Deptford replay on atthe races website. Just Google horse racing replays on then click on at the races and you're there.

Then the hurdle before she pulls up if you see her waver on the approach and she is hanging like a gate so badly that he has both hands on the off rein trying to hold her straight , and then I think she rocks her jaw and she goes hard left so he eases off and pulls her up.

abso nonsense...approaching the hurdle he has both hands together above the horse back and is strangling it,when it hands he make no attempt to steer it to the right..quite happily lets it go straight ahead.

one, yep just watch, have to agree with rico^

The hobbs horse was also backed in the market.

amazing how he managed to steer it round to the right on the 1st circuit ok.

Swifty why fabricate stuff about me that isn't true ?
I asked you about this previously when you had a pop at me sometime ago for no reason.

I never backed it at 10s, and I never claimed to either. I got 3.8 on here.
And I never laid the fav . Neither have I claimed to.

As to the mid div listed bumper run was in a good time for the day and if you do your homework properly you will see that it's listed bumper run placing was sandwiched between horses that had won their bumpers.

And I'm not going to give you anymore than that as the rest is my private workings and my edge.   Sorry .
.

oneten 23 Feb 25 17:24 
I beg to disagree.
I backed the winner win and place as I didn't think much of picture of you s form and thought it over rated and by timeform comments.

Knowing how a lot of the the Irish horses often take time to acclimatise to English yards I thought it a false fav and was very pleased to see the massive move for crying lightening , who was good enough to run with credit in a listed bumper last time out.
So in my opinion only had to jump well enough first time over hurdles to win.
The fact there had been money backing it down from 10s this morning would surely lead one to believe it had schooled sufficiently well.

yet ewe could have laid fav at 1.6 and bet winner at 10/1 you done neither?

oneten, you came on with your aftertimed betting expertise, this thread was more about the alarming drift of the (hurdle) form horse and its subsequent performance/ride.

as for your private workings and edge, you followed the money (clearly you didn't fancy the 10s available) and have nicely back-fitted your reasoning, well done.

Sorry but this is what I mean. If you don't ride you can't see it.  find someone else on the forum who can ride and ask them.
What I'm telling you is happening is fact, whether you are able to see it or not. 6 or 7 strides before take off at the first in the back straight and it does the same again 6 or 7 strides out from the last hurdle it jumps,  you can see it hanging badly to the left and the jock is pulling with both his hands to the offside to try to correct it.  I can see from his hands and the horse's head carriage and the angle of it's head, that it's trying to **** it's jaw.

You can poo poo me as much as you like but if you're so sure you are right, then email it into the studio and tell them you think it looks dodgy and ask one of the ex jocks on the panel to review it. They'll tell you the same.
Then be man enough to come back on here and apologise.

6 or 7 strides out from the last hurdle it jumps,  you can see it hanging badly to the left and the jock is pulling with both his hands to the offside to try to correct it.

not what i seen..he's strangling it and hands are in centre of its back.

Whatever swifty. You are showing yourself to be a loser who can't stand it that someone can have sound workings and read form. 
If you haven't got an edge then there is no point being on here.

I didn't take 10s because I didn't see 10s . When I went through the race it was already down to 3.8 to 4 1 . So I missed the bigger prices . Annoyed yes, but i am truthful and didn't pretend I got fancy prices, so I fail to see what your issue is.

Sounds like jealousy to me, but maybe you'll enlighten me ? 

I have no need to follow the money nor backfit.

In case you hadn't noticed I quite often stick bets up pre race on here and most win.  Unlike yourself , who I've never seen post an opinion / winning advice before a race ?

Rico, that's what you see. But with no disrespect if you can ride a ton of horse flesh at 30 miles per hour over a fence then you'd be seeing what I can see.

I can't teach it and I can't explain it any better. Sorry.

If I was wrong , how can you explain the rp in running comments are almost exactly the same as my appraisal of the horse ?
And I didn't look at the rp until an hour or so ago when I said that I did.

The horse drifted. Plenty (including yourself) knew she was not going to perform to her best. That's the issue here, the pulling up just competed the job.

I can't say i've ever noticed your tips, I don't follow tips on an anonymous forum full of wannabes and fantasists.

As for jealousy, not really my thing, the drift and ride was interesting, I had it with 3 other winners in a bet, I will admit it was a lazy selection in hindsight but I still shouldn't have all but known my fate before the race was run. What has the trainer done with the horse since he's had her, that's really the question for me.

Anyway, well done on your win, you'll find out how much expert fee you'll be paying in just an hour!

Swifty , I dont put them up as tips, but I discuss a race prior to the off and offer an opinion with reasoning to engage in a balanced discussion. If it helps anyone then great and if someone has a different opinion to me great also as it might shed a light on something in a different way to how I would look at it.

I dint know she wasn't going to perform to her best , it wouldn't have bothered me if she had done as I felt she was the inferior animal.

Like yourself I wasn't privy to what the trainer had done with her since he had her. But as she hadn't run for 5 months I would not be wanting to take risk my money guessing whether she was straight ot not .

And I never back a horse on its first run for a new trainer. I believe it stands up to scrutiny, a trainer who has been training and running a horse knows what it has taken to achieve it's previous results.
A new trainer of a horse, won't know any if it has idiosyncrasies until they've run it, so you are taking a leap of faith by backing it.

Sure there are the odd exceptions, such as when uknowhatimeanharry went to Harry frys from a 3rd div yard and he says he has found the key to it and it's a stone better than its shown, then I will back it, sure.

I wouldn't expect Alistair Ralph to improve a horse out of H de-Brom, so would not back it first time out for him.

Anyway,  I'm off to bed , life's too short to argue. Makes it interesting to discuss different viewpoints and opinions, but not worth trading insults.

oneten
6 or 7 strides out from the last hurdle it jumps,  you can see it hanging badly to the left and the jock is pulling with both his hands to the offside to try to correct it.

i will reiterate..that comment is absolute nonsense..

he's strangling it with both hands in the centre...after jumping the hurdle he makes no attempt to steer it around the turn. Although he managed that feat perfectly well on the 1st circuit.
it was very smelly imo.

ps,oneten..post last weeks p&l.

it quite simple..takes a few seconds and will re-establish your reputation.

TIA.

Rico when a good rider is on a horse a lay person cannot see what they are doing to make it go correctly, such is the finesse with which they (hopefully) ride.

Everyone can see what an unskilled person is doing on a horse, as they lack that level of skill and finesse, so a casual observer can see them tugging on reins one way, booting it another way...

I'm not getting into this as I don't want to come across as boastful but let's just agree I can ride to a very high standard. Ex Assistant trainer won a host of top races. Not prepared to disclose what and where on a public forum.

I can see things when someone is riding a horse that the majority of other people cannot see, as the signals are too subtle.

If the horse was being laid for lumps in the run then I suggest that there were probably people with a decent level of horse knowledge seeing the same as me and then acting on it.
It wasn't me as I'm not an ir player nor do I lay very often.

Please don't start with that p and l rubbish with me. I never talk money.  Those that boast tend to be shallow and vulgar.  Nothing wrong with my reputation,  I'm friends with half the top 10 flat and nh trainers under the age of 55 as I've  grown up with them all from pony club days and I intend to keep it that way.

I don't know anyone who rides on this forum except for Acey. So I suggest ask him to watch the rerun or ask the ex jocks at atr - they would probably love to review something if you think it's smelly.
I have no doubt they will see the same as me 100%.

Anyway, as I said yesterday evening, life is too short to argue backwards and forwards on here and I don't have the time .
The forum is a pleasant distraction at times but I will not be drawn into these silly squabbles I see going on ,on here. Sorry

Oneten, you emphasise 10/1 available but then say you never saw 10s, neither did I with any on oddschecker. You state you know what a horse is thinking, that would funny if it wasn't so sad, you also say she cocked her jaw but no mention of that by the jockey. Rico might not be a horseman but in this case his eyes were functioning perfectly.

Your 4" screen obviously did not give you a good view of the jockeys hands just before he steers her wide, backers have every right to ask questions in this case, the jockey said the mare hung left handed throughout but that is not what I saw and assume most others think the same.

There is a big difference between riding a horse and reading a race, most punters have sufficient eyesight and no need to be able to ride a horse to see what is happening. By your own admission you were watching on a 4" screen so your view is not only inadequate to immediately come on here with your patronising nonsense but makes you look like the aftertimer of the year to date.

I have probably been watching racing a lot longer than you, and I was riding from age 4, never had the ability to read a horse mind despite that.

Seems you went from asking how to get your kids back on here to now the resident expert who can tell everyone else they are wrong from a 4" screen, genius barely covers your abilities.

(Ring price: 9/4 5/2 9/4 2/1 15/8 7/4 15/8 7/4 15/8 7/4 13/8 11/8) SP 11/8fav
(Ring price: 4/1 7/2 10/3 3/1 11/4 5/2 9/4) SP 9/4


only 2 with a conceivable chance if picture of you was getting pulled up, looks like someone fancied both of them.

CagliariG 24 Feb 25 12:01 
I have probably been watching racing a lot longer than you, and I was riding from age 4

adopted by Jimmy Savile.

ps,oneten..post last weeks p&l.

it quite simple..takes a few seconds and will re-establish your reputation.

TIA.