dreary,dreary me FRANKIE

Disappointing.

But I would like to give a shout out to the racecourse manager in Ireland who called out Dettori on his farewell tour for ramping up appearance money.

He might of been out of the country a lot,so made sense,

that much sense he spent a fortune trying to hide how much sense it made from the public,
Gary Barlow,Jimmy carr  and  co thought paying less than 3% tax made sense 99.9% of public thought they were thieving koonts who should be in jail

"It's for the kids."

Greedy Tory . What a surprise.

Frankie Dettori named after HMRC anonymity battle over ‘tax avoidance scheme’
The jockey said that new advisers ‘are working hard to unravel the mess that I have been put in’.

Frankie Dettori at Royal Ascot (John Walton/PA)
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Jess Glass
1 hour ago
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Frankie Dettori has been involved in a legal battle with HMRC over his anonymity, after using a “tax avoidance scheme”, it can now be reported.

The jockey can be named after losing a challenge over his anonymity in proceedings at a specialist tax tribunal, after HMRC and the media, including the PA news agency, said he should be identified.

Mr Dettori said on Monday that he had been told the structure he used was approved by HMRC, adding that new advisers “are working hard to unravel the mess that I have been put in”.

Mr Dettori, who is Italian, originally brought an appeal to the First Tier Tribunal against HMRC’s decision to deny him some deductions for income tax.

In 2019 he asked for his case to be paused and more than a year later asked not to be named and for his case to be heard in private.

A judge in 2021 said that the “preliminary matters” could be heard in private, while a different judge in 2022 ruled that Mr Dettori should be anonymised.

We’re committed to ensuring everyone pays the right tax under the law, regardless of wealth or status

HMRC

HMRC brought a challenge and, in January this year, the more senior Upper Tribunal ruled there had been “material errors of law”, and overturned the decision to have some of the hearings in his case in private.

Mr Dettori then made a bid to continue his anonymity, telling the tribunal that he was withdrawing the initial legal challenge over the tax deductions.

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His lawyers argued that someone who has lost a bid to be kept anonymous should be able to withdraw their case without being named.

PA, the Times, the Sun and non-profit Tax Policy Associates, as well as HMRC, opposed the jockey’s anonymity, saying that not being named should be the exception and only when justified.

“The fact that the taxpayer may be in the public eye and may prefer the public not to know about his affairs does not justify the principle of open justice being restricted,” Hui Ling McCarthy KC, for HMRC, said in written submissions, describing the structure used as a “tax avoidance scheme”.

In a judgment in November, Mr Justice Miles and Judge Thomas Scott ruled in favour of the media and HMRC, and on Monday, Mr Dettori was named in the ruling.

The judges said: “If one steps back it is clear that something has gone awry… (The Taxpayer) has obtained the benefit of privacy for all preliminary proceedings, without having produced any evidence of harm or prejudice, for an open-ended period, in a situation where, should he decide to withdraw or settle his appeal and not pursue the privacy and anonymity application, that benefit would not be reversible.”

They also said that it was “a blanket derogation from open justice by the backdoor”.


Frankie Dettori at Royal Ascot (John Walton/PA
PA Wire
After the lifting of his anonymity on Monday, Mr Dettori said: “A few years ago I employed the services of professional specialist tax advisers to look after mine and my family’s financial affairs.

“A structure was created and I was told that it had been approved by HMRC.

“Years later HMRC is now challenging that structure. My former advisers have since been dismissed.

“My new advisers and management team are working hard to unravel the mess that I have been put in.

“They are also working closely with HMRC to resolve the matter as swiftly as possible.”

An HMRC spokesman said: “We welcome this decision, which represents an important win for the principle of open justice.

“We’re committed to ensuring everyone pays the right tax under the law, regardless of wealth or status.”

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Frankie Dettori
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An HMRC spokesman said: “We welcome this decision, which represents an important win for the principle of open justice.

Ask the coont how he's doing trying to claw back the 4 billion they spaffed/gave away during the great Covid heist.

deary deary me

Frankie demonstrating his Lester Piggott approach to Tax

same old with these peeps, think there above the law, pure greed...
if ye misclaim any benefits they fooking have you, n what ye get on
uni credit or wotever, 100 qwid a week, any freud n us peeps will get
community payback or jail...these feckers earn millions a year n wont pay
a penny

If everyone paid the right amount of tax and claimed the right amount of benefits the government would have so much extra money that they wouldn't be able to spend it all.

There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion
Everyone wants to pay as little tax as possible
If he's employed an accountant to try and save him money, and the accountant uses dubious methods, he probably trusts their expertise and although he ultimately signs it off, it's not a Lester situation, imo

so you think Jimmy carr and gary Barlow were right in thinking paying 3% tax was ok whilst their cleaner paid 20%

No, 1tp
I think that people with the talent to earn lots of money at sport or entertainment may not necessarily have a grasp of tax laws

And if they are advised by an "expert" that they should be liable for X amount then they might rightly think that is the correct advice

Others may know they are absolutely trying to fiddle

1tp
How are you doing by the way?

He's gone out for a drink and Gregg Wallace is babysitting his kids

I fail to see what the public interest is whilst the investigation is ongoing. Even HMRC think they are social justice warriors these days.

Some of the best replies on twitter are.

Who’s Frankie dettori.

Racings crying,we can’t even break through with a tax dodge.

racing post are interested its all over it

now you know why so many pot holes newmarket

Frankie has probably paid millions in tax over the years,plus all the tax he’s generated through betting,there’s a lot worse than him.

Plus,I don’t know the law,but surely if a professional tax adviser,accountant,told you to organise your income like this,they should be struck off,
What’s the point of seeking advice from a registered accountant,tax adviser if he basically can say anything to you,and then bears no responsibility.

the adviser in ? has been basically warned off but carry,s on working through/advising other companies in background,Frankie should have bought a farm wonder how many jocks,trainers have their properties down as farmland,footballer,s used to use charitable status/movie production of companies that never made either a film or charitable donation,its how much tax they've avoided not paid thats the ?,Jimmy carr wants to pay 3%,Tony Jacklin etc used to pay 90% before moving to Jersey but karma tracked them down and they all lost millions in Loyd's insurance meltdown

If as Dettori claims (possibly rightly) that he was badly advised then why the long lived attempt to hush it up? Surely better to be open and simply point the finger at his advisers from the outset. Now, having been outed, he just looks like a slimy tax dodger trying to keep his dirty business out of the public domain. His protestations now just sound like damage limitation.

Own goal.

when he gives one a bad ride at R Ascot now it will be "pay your taxes "

Possibly as someone's finances are private? A bit different if you're paid out the public purse like Starmer to have your finances raked over on twatter. If there is a conviction, fair enough. Otherwise certain people assume anyone who is simply being investigated by the utterly inept hmrc is 'a slimy tax dodger'.

Ed Chamberlain readying a 'Frankie is great' dossier for Saturday as we speak

is this why he was auctioning off all that tat?

didn't hear anyone say we shouldn't have known about Jimmy carr,Gary Barlow etc trying to get away with paying 3% tax and all the ealmon Holmes/MSM mob.why should Frankie be any differen,if he,s already blamed his rax advisors he,s admitted guilt but unlike us plebs he gets an invite to come to an agreement with HMRC over a cup of tea

No idea about those cases, it's a point of principle for me that we all enjoy confidentiality until there is a conviction. Unless there is of course a public interest, if the individual gets money from other tax payers, and/or takes decisions that impact the public (eg councils, law makers, bbc, plod). If you'd worked for or with hmrc you'd know they are incompetent. Many of these cases were facilitated at the time, then hmrc retrospectively changes the interpretation of their own rules and guidance.

BBC [us] to pay out millions to settle historic tax avoidance claims

https://www.taxwatchuk.org/bbc-tax_avoidance/

I have no opinion on whether FD is guilty of anything or not, I have not seen his accounts or the advice he received from advisers or hmrc.

the golden rule of taxpayers in UK,is everyone is personaly responsible for paying the correct tax,ignorance of tax paid /hiding behind a tax adviser doesn't cut it,
you owe 100 quid tax on a few grand  interest from  a savings acc and turned fill a tax form in they,ll come for you,that's why for people used to PAYE its important to keep track of your tax liabilities ,for those not used to it filling the tax form in as far worse experience than the few sheckles you might owe in tax, the 1000 pound intrest free with rates rising will have caught a lot of people unawares gone from been able to have around 40 grand in a savings acc to around 20 grand

Unless you 'work' for the bbc ?

I'm stating that there is no public interest at this point, and FD is entitled to confidentiality. I never stated anyone employing an adviser is free from any culpability for errors in their reporting. You're getting your wires crossed.

the public interest is he,s admitted using a banned aggressive  tax avoidance scheme but blaming his advisers for it,which isn't an excuse in TAX AFFAIRS

what business is it of yours? thousands of people are investigated every day. I'm not saying the outcome should be private.

On the blaming the advisor.

If the advisor said I can organise your accounts to reduce your tax by maybe 10%.
Then fair enough.

If he said ,alright mate,I can make sure you pay nothing,got a great scheme.
Then it’s Frankie’s fault.

Because he’s a public figure and that has helped him make his money,then he can’t really say ,I demand privacy,can’t have it both ways.

Our job is to minimise a client's tax liabilities, within the legislation at the time. That's how I organise my own personal affairs. Contrary to left wing ideology, not many people want to pay more tax than they absolutely have to.

Yeah,

But if 2 accountants advise you.

1 says I can limit your tax as best I can
The other says
I can offshore you in the Antarctic film industry ,whilst investing in pork bellies,so you’ll pay nothing,then clearly it’s your own fault.

As I stated, what tends to happen is that hmrc's interpretation of their own rules changes. Either different people different departments, or a new broom. Rachel from accounts had her people recently declare expensive clothing as office costs. Accounting often comes down to interpretation and judgement, which is not homogenous.

Cider, now the case is going to court there is every reason it should be public knowledge. That's the way our justice system works.

The tax EXPERT Dan Neidle has said that the firm advised Dettori that the scheme was "approved by HMRC". Neidle's view is that if they said this it's "outrageous, possibly fraudulent" and that "no-one with the slightest tax knowledge would think it could be HMRC approved".

Now you might retort that well Dettori has simply taken bad advice. Maybe. But if so why the attempt to keep it out of the public domain? Surely an immediate hands up , I took bad advice would be the sensible course of action?

Yeah,agree,they change their view,then back date it has an avoidance scheme.

But to be fair,they only do that when it’s obvious it is.

Tax experts always one step ahead,so hmrc,just catch them later,

Has anything with tax,the onus is on the payer to prove it,justify it,explain it.

They don’t allow,we ve seen a loop hole,so we took it.

Paris,

The scheme to avoid tax is hmrc approved.its obviously not.

Hey,hmrc,we ve from a worked around,can you sign off on it,

No.

Thanks for letting us know,we ll close it

Calling someone an expert, doesn't make them an expert. Plus, there can be more than one expert on a chosen topic, and their opinions may not be aligned. I appreciate that some people accept 'expert' opinions without looking into the detail themselves. I'm not one of those, so not passing judgement on the case itself. I simply believe that we are entitled to the assumption of innocence until proven otherwise. As you may deduce, the OP has already determined guilt before looking at any evidence, or the case being heard.

Wasting your time with 1st TP cider, everyone is guilty in his pea brain and fair game. He might have a different view if he had to spend 3 months and a lot of money on tax specialists/lawyers trying to educate HMRC on issues they should be conversant with. All started when I gave my wife LPOA when I was ill and they started questioning trust funds and potential ( in their minds ) about CGT fiddles and inheritance tax.

Despite everything having been done by tax specialist lawyers they could not wrap their heads around what to the lawyers was crystal clear. As for Frankie being named in public, a disgrace only that shower could get away with, as you say unless in the public interest tax affairs should be private until/when an offence has been attached.

Imagine 1st TP might have a different view if the DWP published his benefits in the local paper making innuendo's about spending his life on a gambling Forum?

tea time, lads

Indeed, I am usually advising people on behalf of hmrc! I suspect many people who have not had the pleasure of direct dealings with them believe they are one of the very few state functions that still work broadly competently. Sorry to disappoint! Only last weekend they scheduled MTD maintenance they day after filing deadline. You couldn't make it up, I'm assuming they wanted to get it done before having a month off for Xmas.

Why don’t the hmrc have a ,we ll do your books department.charge a fee.

It’s literally Tom and Jerry.advisors spot a loop hole,hmrc close it down,then back track your accounts.

It’s comical really.

I,m 65 calgari which gives you roughly 50 yrs of evidence to find me claiming as much as a penny from the benefit system and have been on PAYE for 49 yrs and have 49 yrs NI payments in,but I hope you break your FOOKING  BACK whilst digging

tax avoidance added to been banned for drug abuse and trying to scam Irish race courses out of money for charity, Frankie hardly trying to defend a squeaky clean image

Are you part time 1st TP? Only ask as you are on here on celeb threads in the middle of the night and early in the morning.

very rare you,ll find a post from me on here after 8 o clock at night,but I do sometimes post a few early in the morning and I,m now fully retired after been semi retired for last 5 yrs

1TP.
Hope you live till you’re 100,and no doubt have many operations to keep you going.

So 49 years paying in 35 years taking out.

I’m happy to fund this for you.
Plus your free schooling ,roads,street lighting,police,fire brigade.etc etc etc,all too many to mention.

From 0-18 the state benefit system gave you the knowledge and joy of creating your future,
Then from 65- to 100,don’t worry,we’ll look after you,no matter 2hat your needs.

Thank you for giving a bit back when you worked.i know your net bill is thousands in debt,but that’s fine,the state will fund the short fall.

unfortunately within 11 months I,ll be back paying PAYE again when state pension  takes care of the 12,570 ,and I,ll be paying tax  on dividends etc,we've all got to do our bit so Frankie can dodge his tax in peace

Jolly good fellow,taking it in the reality and jovilality  it was meant.

No doubt you ll cling on till 110,just to max out the state credit card.

To any pensioners on here.

The biggest share of the benefits budget is state pension,so if you’re retired,I d keep my mouth shut when moaning about the feckless claiming benefits.

not even Frankie's tax adviser is going to prevent me and the Mrs  from  paying tax for the rest of our  days on the plus side it comes with the entitlement of a free moan

Hence grumpy old men,is a thing.

You should have bought a farm for 3 million,then can avoid tax altogether.
But then march on Whitehall moaning about it.

fook me there's another tax you've reminded me of VAT on my static caravan or holiday home as the posh people call them,that's another grand a yr  VAT, 1 nil down at Leeds I was happy an hr ago or at least only mildly grumpy