Did i miss the dylan kitts controversy debate on the opening show itv this morning

Was it not even mentioned?

missed first half hour why im asking

thanks, its all a cozy set up they dare not step out of line or they will be gone, who would want a job with no credibility that you were forced to not speak the truth of what you thought, thats just so wrong but if they are happy to take the money in a job like that good luck to them

Stewarts did they show the ride and give their thoughts?

Kitts should get a free pass,he’s between a rock and a hard place,he’s trying to build contacts to get rides,wants to please the owners,what can he do,he isn’t in a position to tell the owners no.

We say the customer is always right,so how can you balance this with his duty and his obligation.

BHA,should ask him,if you come clean to instructions,you’ll get let off,

Perhaps when registering a horse,all owners must sign an agreement to never ask jockeys to not ride for best possible position.

I agree comingupthehill.  I believe he has been warned of dire retribution should he not comply.
There are some very, very nasty people around.

Showing as owner F A Clegg only owned Hillsin since 21 June 2023. Interesting Clegg said he never requested Kitts to ride. Imagine this could get quite murky and take a while to sort out.

There are 2 simple questions that need answering. Why did the horse drift from 2s to 11s. And then WHY was he given the "ride" he was...

* Kitts

Its unfortunate for the jockey but they need to make an example of him, ban him for the 6 months or year on a suspended sentence.
It would keep him honest knowing that the next time he is caught then he's fcuked.

as ive said earlier..if kitts had no intention of winning by wotever means,why thr fck was he so close up way out?

Didn't read the original thread about the ride as i don't like to berate young 7lb claimers who will generally riding to instructions. I was concentrating on the fav in the race and also noticed the eventual winner travelling well and put up a thread regarding the winners improvement after being quite well backed into 13/2, didn't take much notice of this Hillsin ride during race so didn't wish to comment.
Have watched the race this morning and hard to argue the ride did look awful towards the end after travelling really well throughout the race, made ground effortlessly to get near leaders in back straight, rider appeared not to want to get to the front and let horse drop back a little whilst still travelling easily, just waiting to presumably push it out to win on run in, but as everyone says did nothing.
My feeling is that the horse is a bridle ponce, reviewed it's previous 2 races when  PU over C/D and 3rd at Exeter, travelled well behind leaders at Exeter and came to join leader 2 out, Kitts started to push the horse and hit it with the whip which made horse veer to the left, tried to ride out a bit more vigorously but horse found no more dropping to 3rd, probably his best run so far. At Worcester nto held up but travelled well before stumbling at 5th, Kitts started to push him and horse did make ground for a few strides but quickly dropped out of the picture at home turn(couldn't see how vigorously or not horse was ridden as fell back), was pulled up a couple of hurdles out when back in view.
I'm sure Kitts rode to Chris Honours' instructions but clearly didn't know what to do after the last, if he'd ridden him more vigorously or whipped him would the horse have gone on i'm not sure and we'll never know, at least until he is ridden more vigorously. Look at all his previous form going back since with a very good trainer in Gavin Cromwell and Claire Harris, some of the IR comments:

  Always towards rear, cajoled along before 4th, outpaced and pushed along 7th, well behind from 3 out, tailed off
  Held up in rear, some headway after 6th, pushed along and lost ground after 8th, got well behind before 3 out, tailed off
  Midfield, ridden 2 out (usual 3 out), weakened last (usual 2 out)
  Chased leaders, midfield when not fluent 4 out, soon ridden, weakened after 3 out, beaten when hit 2 out
  Pressed leaders, pushed along and weakened quickly before 4 out, pulled up before 2 out

If Cromwell couldn't get a race out of it, a horse that clearly has ability even when they backed it at Limerick twice when backed into 11/2 and last race at 5/1 after being huge prices on most of it's runs tells you something.

  My opinion is horse doesn't like being pushed or ridden to any degree, and throws in the towel quickly, a bridle ponce. Of course it looked bad and horse may well hack up nto but years ago a stable i had horse with had a similar horse which made absolute fools of us.

hold it up at rear on rails..aint difficult plenty other manage it.

First and only time he got busy on the horse was when he was cemented for 3rd place close home.

Based on this ,it should have won then,has it wasn’t pushed or ridden,think that’s the point.

comingupthehill: The point about bridle ponces is that it doesn't matter whether you ride them vigorously or sit there doing nothing. Either way, they won't put their heads in front.

I don't want to go overboard on this, because the ride, and more particularly the betting, looked awful. But it might help explain why some people chose this particular horse as a vehicle to lay at any price.

haydey conquers wiv reeko..sense at last.

He surely and clearly did not ride to win; he'd have tried harder, but he did not despite travelling the best just before the finishing line.

I do not believe Kitts has been pilloried. He may be a claimer, but he's also a professional. Not long ago he was banned for 14 days for a similar offence in the eyes of the authority.

A professional jockey - claimer or not - must do their utmost riding to win. In this case it was evidently clear he did not. He might have been riding to instruction nevertheless, if the instruction is unscrupulous he still ought to put professionalism ie ride to win or achieve the best position possible over the order of the owner or trainer.

The trainer Mr Honour was not happy with Kitts effort at the finish either so much so he asked the owner to take his horses away, and he was not part of "this".

If you watch the whole race he gave ground all round the outside and also at the start.
Can't believe it never traded at less than 13 given the way it was travelling in 4th round the home turn is my opinion. The jockey originally was trying to settle it at the back of the race.

Agree with hayden the only time he got active was when the win was out of the question and 3rd was booked right at the finish.

You can't really use the bridle horse argument as he never asked it the question when it had a chance of winning and to be fair it seemed to be making ground when ridden.

To be honest given the way the horse has been positioned during the race I would say the trainer has had him absolutely spot on and the horse was well in... something the trainer or punting connections might have taken advantage of pre race hence it being backed strongly originally. As Hayden also says maybe someone missed out on the price and plans changed.