Constitution Hill 175 Faugheen 176

Apparently Nicky was a bit more polite.

Faugheen wouldnt see which way hed gone.

Fully agree Howard and Geoff.....walofs

Matt Chapman will probably disagree and I do respect his opinion...but I think we are right

Beggars belief,as said so many times,trust your own judgement because the ratings are only an opinion from some dipsticks that know less than real observers that have seen as much if not more than they!!!

Whose ratings are those?

Quite happy to have Constitution Hill well above Faugheen, but I wouldn't have him above those from the vintage era.

Name one you would have above at the same career stage DD?

Just looking back I see Faugheen won his Champion from Arctic Fire ( who subsequently only won one G1 , at odds-on, and also won the county h'cap )  and an 11 year old Hurricane Fly. So are they thinking the latter was still as good as his rating

The ratings I pay most attention to are the Racing Post ratings and black spot....I think they are excellent in the long run. Just my opinion, but have had many a nice priced winner using them....and no I can't give you an overall P/L figure, as I don't keep meticulous records.

DD RP  The news the Michael Buckley-owned Constitution Hill, who won the Fighting Fifth, Christmas Hurdle, Champion Hurdle and Aintree Hurdle under Nico de Boinville, has ended up on a mark of 175 – 1lb shy of Istabraq and Faugheen – in the Anglo-Irish classifications was greeted in a relaxed and respectful manner by Nicky Henderson, who said: "I'm proud to think he's up there with those horses."

Hurricane Fly is the only other hurdler to have hit 175 since the rankings were established for the 1999-2000 campaign.

RP ratings are worse than tits on a bull e.g the highest rated 2 year old in 16 years (debut) Asadna at Ripon,beat nothing and a dipstick opinion layemall or do you concur?

I can see why HF gets a high rating because he ran in ( & won ) a lot of G1's.  Would like to know which performance/s got Faugheen the 176. Maybe over 3 miles

DD name a single horse in training that could get CH off the bridle? Other than a group horse coming off the flat that can hurdle there is nothing and has not been in the same stratosphere as CH even among the "Vintage Crop" of hurdlers and I saw most.

btw words from the RP not the ratings

Cag , agree. Wonderful horses late 70's NNurse  Pigeon Monksfield even Bird's Nest but they all kept beating each other.

Cag...you've got your opinion and I've got mine re ratings and anything else. I don't think the people who come up with some ratings that I don't agree with are dipsticks.....I just don't agree, simple as that.

I would have him behind every winner between 1968 and 1981. Those horses had proper campaigns, and were not wrapped up in cotton wool. They returned from one battle after another. I would also have Golden Cygnet above him on the basis of what he was going to achieve before his fatal fall. Unfortunately, Constitution Hill doesn't have the same sort of yardsticks to be measured against.

That is fair comment layemall but imo the RPRs given by their employees are no more informed or valid than plenty on here who have no vested interest other than saying what they see.

That is fair comment layemall but imo the RPRs given by their employees are no more informed or valid than plenty on here who have no vested interest other than saying what they see.

And I mostly agree with that statement Cag, if the plenty was changed to some.

More perhaps than you realise layemall but sad to say a good few reluctant to voice an opinion imo?

Yes you're probably right there.

Would have GC as a very good horse on his performance at Cheltenham. I take the Ayr race with plenty of salt. Too late in the season. Maybe he wasn't 100% either. But maybe he was. Just one race. CH has shown a lot more. Highly likely State Man is a very good horse.

Completely agree. Form of champion hurdle looks solid. State man consistent performer rated 167 was beaten 9 lengths who had just comfortably beat the previous champion hurdler of 2 years then won comfortable after.

Think Faugheen is the anomaly and has been pushed up by Arctic Fire as Howard mentioned as how did he get rated 169 which both State Man and Honeysuckle have never achieved?

I am sure I would have State Man and Honey suckle in their prime to beat an Arctic Fire in his prime.