What A Fackin Farce...

i would ban them all.

Class horses , d1ck head jockey`s ?

Little runt couldn’t do that last week on Tiger Moth

It never fails to amaze me how thick jockeys are.

Curragh MAIDEN Winner - HOSES up in Epsom Derby.

The race has GONE

Marquand was the only one who chased him,but his horse wasn't good enough.

A great result that for horse racing - the leading group 1 race in the UK - that the same happens as in the rancid 8.15 at navan yesterday.

they weren't exactly reeling him in at the end

Must have been 1000-1 2 weeks back , another Obrien disaster for the ITV build up team

Completely jockeys fault for two reasons

a) The timings during the race showed he wasn't going a stupid pace 

b) Plenty of stamina in the breeding. Wasn't going to completely bomb out.
 
Is there social distancing in the Steward's Room for a dozen or so jockeys?

Idiots!

That really was embarrassing.

Obliterated them

Tricast 55k :o

I so want to be a backer.  Not a layer.  I miss the thrill of shouting a horse home after backing it.

But with these incompetent little men in charge, who provide the answer to the old question "what has four legs and a **** half-way up its back", laying is the way for my good self.

Epsom 4th July The Derby

Serpentine
MatchedLow: 29 High: 1,000
On this market:£470,244
On this selection:£5,357
Last price matched:29

Price% Chance
The information on this page may be slightly delayed.
Price, Exchange Available and Traded
Price    To Back    To Lay    Traded
29            £73
30            £125
32            £153
34            £369
36            £708
38            £872
40            £1,332
42            £872
44            £323
46            £105
48            £44
50            £46
60            £8
80            £25
90            £30
100            £48
110            £28
120            £2
130            £20
150            £13
160            £6
200            £32
210            £0
250            £44
270            £9
300            £11
700            £6
720            £1
800            £4
1000            £38

That is on the Antepost Market

Our jockeys, with one or two exceptions, haven't a clue about pace. If you asked any of them what the first 4 furlongs were run in you would get

15 different answers.

The Pinnacle

Aidan Quotes...

great pedigree blah blah
AlwaysThought he would stay very well
Wayne said he galloped all the way last time and couldn’t pull him out
He took time to come together
He got hemmed in over 10f at the curragh but Won well last time
We had to let him take his chance
Over the moon
No point holding him up so we sent him on his war

It's all damage control.

Get over it ffs, great ride by EJ, AO'B told him the horse would stay further so he went for it. Credit where its due.

Relative to my earlier post, the 5.10 at CHelmsford just now.,  Inept incompetent little dagoe on the GonGolfin (sic) horse who posted it three-wide the whole race.Anyone who backed that had no chance with that little p r i c k on board.

these days it's just another race .....

The Derby devalued yet again by Ballydoyle.

If that had been the Kentucky Derby  all the pundits would have slagged off every  other
jockey.But not one word from any of them.

Shoemark wont make the same mistake Acey,you can say "Glendun" that!!!

makes Grevilles ride on Dancing Brave seem ok in retrospect after that race

Take the winner out and they all finished in a bunch...doubt theres anything particulary special behind (maybe English King)...the filly Love would pick them all up and spit them out IMHO

They couldn't even catch the 2nd.

Not by Ballydoyle, Pils., but by the riders who allowed a runner such an easy and long lead. A donkey could have won given the circumstances.

Jul 4, 2020 -- 5:03PM, granitjack wrote:

It never fails to amaze me how thick jockeys are.

yep...and yet most of the figures jockeys who CAN judge pace don't get a sniff of a group 1 ride

welcome to british racing!!

Jul 4, 2020 -- 5:18PM, N-east Correspondent wrote:

makes Grevilles ride on Dancing Brave seem ok in retrospect after that race

1000 layer thought a nice free evening meal and got his table booked for this evening.

I lost a pound on the race my 50p e.w went on an outsider which along with a lot of other gee gees was never put in the race.

Reminded me of Slip Anchor the winner.

Jul 4, 2020 -- 5:20PM, wondersobright wrote:

Jul  4, 2020 --  5:03PM, granitjack wrote:It never fails to amaze me how thick jockeys are.yep...and yet most of the figures jockeys who CAN judge pace don't get a sniff of a group 1 ridewelcome to british racing!!

Absolutely shocking wonder - 2nd and 3rd did nothing wrong and Oisin can be forgiven for 4th. The rest should be banned. Frankie didn’t even have the decency to ride out for 4th - looked like a 7lb claimer in the closing stages.

geoff m 04 Jul 20 17:22 
1000 layer thought a nice free evening meal and got his table booked for this evening.

i dont think he thought 1000 was value when it got beat in a maiden in june

stewarts rise
They couldn't even catch the 2nd.

Or the third for that matter. In fact if you ignore the winner, its two huge price rags outstaying a bunch of short priced rags with hardly any tactical advantage

oisin did plenty wrong granit on a much better horse than the front 3

That the two rags in second and third all the way round weren't caught is surely the most damning indictment of the jockeys on the more fancied horses.

you can say that again

Frankie What a joke

They will be laughing on the 10 o'clock news tonight what a joke would say that Tom Marquand has behaved impeccably what a lovely guy he must be question is would he have got closer to the winner why they jocked him off is a mystery hindsight is a great thing head in hands jobbie.

Never be the same opportunity again.

I think he will get his chances in future but I doubt the trainer will.

I think he will get another opportunity (maybe several) in future but I doubt the trainer will.

they weren't exactly reeling him in at the end


  Quite agree Eric, winner wasnt stopping anytime soon.

Watched it again now, and twice. He didn't go that fast in front, so no wonder he won. Some poor tactics behind? Yes, most likely. Normally, with that longer more than 3 furlongs straight once you come off Tattenham Corner at Epsom, you expect to catch a leader who is normally tiring. Think about it, you have to make a quick decision. If you make the wrong one, in a mere 10 to 15 seconds, you have lost the chance to make amends.

Normally, with that longer more than 3 furlongs straight once you come off Tattenham Corner at Epsom, you expect to catch a leader who is normally tiring

that's true in years where the leaders go too hard but this year but what the jockeys in behind have been guilty of is riding for position rather than for pace

unforgiveable imo

The Aussies have the perfect saying for ye English, it goes something like, whingeing Pommies....

Jul 4, 2020 -- 7:18PM, wondersobright wrote:

Normally, with that longer more than 3 furlongs straight once you come off Tattenham Corner at Epsom, you expect to catch a leader who is normally tiringthat's true in years where the leaders go too hard but this year but what the jockeys in behind have been guilty of is riding for position rather than for paceunforgiveable imo

As usual - in total agreement wonder. Few riders from that race covered themselves in glory - of the jockeys on the principals only Murphy I think rode any sort of credible race.

AOB watched the race with his family at home. He said Donnacha said after 5f "Emmet wins here" in a post race interview immediately after the race.

A shambolic performance by all the jockeys except the front 3 from the outset; Dettori and Murphy ought to be ashamed of themselves not waking up to what was happening at the front until way, way too late.

Disappointing, my favourite flat race a farce again.

I believe the mafia covered all angles as usual, if they can nick it from the front then they will. They always have one at the lead just in case those behind mess up big.

Safety in numbers

I don’t think Murphy can be criticised too much. He had his mount probably far more prominent than expected. I guess he was expecting one of the other idiots to give him a lead. The likes of Moore, Dettori, Dwyer, etc haven’t even given punters a run for their money.....

At the 12f this bunch of 3YO look v ordinary and much of a muchness except for Love even though the clock suggests that the colts aren't that far behind the fliles

Problem is the only ones that cares who wins these races is joe punter
All the jocks will get their turn  tis the same in NH
Tis like betting on ‘friendly’ matches

makes Grevilles ride on Dancing Brave seem ok in retrospect after that race....Classic

Anyone know the sectionals of the winner vs the winner of the Oaks ? If ever sectional timing was going to have a use it would be today

Makes me laugh, they let the pacemaker go , we have 2 rags finnished 2nd and 3rd ,what was the problem all these so called DERBY horses getting to them , A very poor Derby won by a horse who could not win, but was probably trained for the race and despite being a stone out
of the ratings won with half a stone in hand

The race has become a comedy If beggy had been riding the winner I would have been on small ew .

the OBRAIN TEAM .

3 weeks back he would have been 7 stone out of the ratings

It was an awful misjudgment from all but the winning jockey.

Probably Oisin was on a non stayer so that whole thing is an elephant.

But the 7f race earlier broke the track record.

The lack of ability to pace for conditions  has been shown up horribly here for many jockeys. But it has been an obvious flaw for a long time. A UK based jock with a good head clock is priceless.

Also, actually paying attention helps.  Look at that Kirby ride today where he guessed or knew the apparent bias was false.

Jul 4, 2020 -- 11:39PM, GoBallistic wrote:

Anyone know the sectionals of the winner vs the winner of the Oaks ? If ever sectional timing was going to have a use it would be today

They are available on Racing TV twitter feed, it is interesting comparing the positions of Love and English King at key stages of the race.

After the fifth furlong, English King was 4 lengths ahead of Love
After the eighth furlong Love was 8 lengths ahead of English King
After the tenth furlong Love was 7 lengths ahead of English King
At the line Love was 9 lengths ahead of English King.

You miserable lot.
It was exciting to watch. Jockey did a great job, on what might turn out to be a very good horse.

Were sectionals recorded? If so does anyone know what they were ?

Facts may well be right about the winner but you can't help thinking that the jockeyship of the rest left much to be desired.

There is a huge advantage to a trainer having multiple runners in a race. Forgetting team tactics for a moment consider this: Most race outcomes

are determined by the pace of the first half of the race. With 6 entries a trainer can run a pacemaker, a tracker a couple of mid pack runners

and a couple of come from behind types. That way he's got all pace scenarios covered.

In this instance the pacemaker had no company and the jockey was able to get a long breather into him coming down the hill while the rest just

sat and waited. If he'd had company early on he wouldn't have been able to get a breather in and might well have come back to the field.

Look at The Oaks. Tear away front runners were also a huge distance in front , at one point it  seemed the chasers might not pick them up. But they did - and Love showed her greatness.

Same happened in The Derby, but this time the winner didn't come back and the rest couldn't pick him up.
I don't think it was a poor horse ' allowed' to win by poor judgement of chasing jockeys.
They wrongly assumed it was ' just ' a pace horse.

EastLower Gooner    04 Jul 20 17:02 

Little runt couldn’t do that last week on Tiger Moth Angry


What a nasty personal comment.
You need to think before you post.

Looking back at Derby's from the past it is noticeable how many winners came from a long way back. Most of them, though,  were really class horses.

Yesterday I don't think the race was a very good one for Derby standards, but we shall see in the future if the first three all improve - especially the first and the third.

Yes, the jockeys behind looked to have got it wrong to a certain degree but one lesson I hope they, and punters, should take from this race is that any O'Brien, lightly-raced horse with few credentials, is rarely just a pacemaker nowadays. Last year's Irish Derby saw a similar outcome.

In the end, horse racing is a very uncertain sport. If it wasn't there would be no betting on it because who would ever lay bets when the outcome was entirely predictable? Yesterday was a great example of this.

BUT, a great shame it has happened in our most famous race with the attention of the world upon it. Although those of us who are mature and experienced punters know that what happened yesterday is part of the game (and I'm not wholly excusing the jockeys with that statement) there will be a large number of casual punters, plus younger ones who have not yet learned to take the ups and downs, who are now convinced the game is wholly bent when it isn't - although we all know strokes are pulled.

Yesterday was not a stroke, it was just a combination of things.

EK would smash the winner in a rematch with different tactics - im convinced by that! - I love how jockeys all saying their horse inxeperienced and none of them blaming themselves :) but yes its racing and these are why its unpredictable

Jul 5, 2020 -- 10:38AM, racing6699 wrote:

EK would smash the winner in a rematch with different tactics - im convinced by that! - I love how jockeys all saying their horse inxeperienced and none of them blaming themselves :) but yes its racing and these are why its unpredictable

Maybe, but another AOB horse will be in front at the line.

Thanks grendel for pointing me towards the sectionals
.
https://twitter.com/RacingTV/status/1279500951313940486/photo/1
.
https://twitter.com/RacingTV/status/1279499338654404608/photo/1

Serpentine did the first 5f in the same time as the non-jigging pacemakers in the Oaks.  Seems likely he went faster than ideal.  Some of the others probably went slower than ideal.  He's obviously very progressive, probably going to be underrated, but possible this race will take a while to recover from

grendel .................... Marillion fan ?

Beowulf's mother.

Monster slain by Beowulf.
Or were you just fishing ?

you think he named himself after beowulf's mother and not a marillion song?
odds please SS

kevin Blake thinks Love ran in The Derby and as a result, all the jocks rode a proper race. Bonkers or what

kevin Blake thinks Love ran in The Derby and as a result, all the jocks rode a proper race. Bonkers or what

Yep, named after the 17 minute classic

Wonder if in the scenario Ryan Moore had picked Serpentine to ride, the other jockeys would have let him go 10 lengths clear, i rather doubt it.
Even Lordan who rode the winner in its maiden and won by 9 lengths easily, rode at Naas.

derby
113 fs% for EK, RE etc confirm the visuals that they were set too much to do
fs% par for the track config is c108
...conclusion even pace through the race has fluctuated somewhere between the winner & the 2nd/3rd
jockeys 1st time riding in the derby 1st & 2nd
great to see egg on all faces

Good point, stewarts.

A lot of people not giving Serpentine the credit it deserves in my opinion.
Let's all just wait and see how it performs for the rest of the season shall we.
If it wins the Arc then the ranting on this thread will seem pretty stupid!

Jul 5, 2020 -- 12:02PM, stewarts rise wrote:

Wonder if in the scenario Ryan Moore had picked Serpentine to ride, the other jockeys would have let him go 10 lengths clear, i rather doubt it.Even Lordan who rode the winner in its maiden and won by 9 lengths easily, rode at Naas.

we've seen enough evidence from RLM that he rides for position & not pace

Injured........retired

oisin

"I haven't seen the sectional times but I am sure it will back up that Kameko's slowest sectionals are definitely the last two furlongs."

Jul 5, 2020 -- 11:53AM, grendel wrote:

Yep, named after the 17 minute classic

Named after the poor mans Suppers Ready

I remember Suppers Ready Trained by Henry Candy and ridden by, wait for it.....Malcolm Eatwell.