Is Dettori past it?

When was he ever the most forceful?

Rewilding PoW?

He could go on riding top horses for several years. Quality over quantity. He has always been finesse over strength and even at his best has never been that bothered about riding through the line. Most of the weighing room are relatively weak, most are bridle merchants and Atzeni certainly isn't that a strong jockey. In a top race how many of the current weighing room would you rather have than Dettori? I am not a particular fan of Dettori but there are a large number of very ordinary jocks in there.

ok name your strongest finish riders over the last 20 years

ill give you 2-kevin darley...and hannu mikkala

No.....if the horse is good enough blah, blah, blah.

Mikkola much longer ago than, "Last 20 years," though ...

- along with Ari Vatanen and the tragic Henry Toivonen

having grown up in 50s and 60s i was spoiled or do you always think years ago was best in all sports?

I believe nethra is his winner today, oioi Frankie!!!

Yep, useless in a finish these days.

So weak it's unreal. Backed the winner and was glad to see Murphy up against Dettori in the closing stages!!!

Far too much emphasis on strength as usual.

When it makes the difference between winning and losing it's not surprising.

Exactly!!!!

You cannae change the laws of physics, how can anyone in their mid 40s be as good.

Positioning and judgment of pace make no difference to winning and losing then, just strength is it?

Not just strength obviously, but in a race like that it was the biggest noticeable difference between the first two home. They raced in very similar positions. The point remains that Dettori is nowhere near as strong as he was.

don't back dettori gents he's shot.

Sep 15, 2017 -- 9:24PM, differentdrum wrote:

He could go on riding top horses for several years. Quality over quantity. He has always been finesse over strength and even at his best has never been that bothered about riding through the line. Most of the weighing room are relatively weak, most are bridle merchants and Atzeni certainly isn't that a strong jockey. In a top race how many of the current weighing room would you rather have than Dettori? I am not a particular fan of Dettori but there are a large number of very ordinary jocks in there.

who do you think is the best jockey then?

I think most 7lb claimers would be stronger in a finish...

I'm not saying he's never gonna win another race but in the big ones where he hasn't necessarily got the best horse he's got no chance anymore.

There isn't anything like an outstanding jockey at the moment but some are just that much more frustrating than others.

Dettori is the best riding right now!Comfortably...Diff class.

Sep 16, 2017 -- 4:21PM, jedi sophie wrote:

Dettori is the best riding right now!Comfortably...Diff class.

go back to 1996

Why??

soba    16 Sep 17 14:42 
You cannae change the laws of physics, how can anyone in their mid 40s be as good.

Then why are jockeys regular riding winners just either side of 50?

My answer to my own question is it's nothing like football or tennis where you are called upon to perform to a high physical standard over a prolonged period, and so then of course those in their 40s and 50s won't be able to physically compete with rivals half their age. Whereas jockey are usually only at full physical capacity for a fraction of a race, as in when riding a finish and then get a 30 minute or so break before being asked to do so again for only a small part of the race.

There didn't seem much wrong with Dettori's strength in a finish on Westerland at Doncaster on Saturday when he beat the current Champion Jockey by a short head in a driving finish. Yet that jockey himself must be pushing 40 and just got given one of the better jobs in racing. Up until this season I think Jim Crowley had only ridden one Gr1 winner and has he ridden a Classic winner so far?

Also a little trivia question but can anyone name the 50 year old jockey who has ridden Flat race winners in the UK this season, including up to Group race level?

Monsieur Gants Blancs

He can't even get a magnificent one now, let alone a magnificent seven!

Losing his force ?

The guy cheated death in a plane crash so the answer is ..... No

ima_mazed66


Gerald Mosse

Well done Deltâ and I can't quite work out if Cork Langer got it too.

Good jockeys can go on into their 50s. Take Lester, Shoemaker, Doug Smith. Frankie will still do for me.

Frankie is still top class. Get a grip.

This one might be a bit easier but who is the oldest jockey to have ridden in the UK this season?

Oldest would be Gentleman George and a translation for earlier answer should really not be necessary, does anyone refer to him as anything but Mr White Gloves on your shores...!

I think if the George Duffield question was asked later on in the season, it might have been better.

I knew blanc was French for white but I'm only fluent in English and foul language.

man gets older and gets weaker - SHOCK

Yes, with Enable past the winning post 1st in the Arc at Chantilly.

YEP

Yes, and has been for sometime, my granny is stronger in a finish than him

Not as past it as Gerald Mosse who has just lost a Big Retainer.....I used to be his Biggest Fan but way past it now imo.

ttt

Vettori

Moore v Dettori - no contest

Looked an old man riding there compared to Moore

best horse didn't win the race - Weekender should have won - wasn't such a bad ride by Frankie -,but it was kind of a dumb ride
should have keep him up with the pace a bit more -

Bad judge of that race - and yes talking through pocket.  Poor positioning throughout.  How did it go 1.26 in running - was I watching something else?????

No contest presumably until the next time he beats Moore in a finish. Funny too that Moore is being labelled as overrated on another thread, so then what does that make Dettori?

I bet if Betfair was around when he went through the card at Ascot, someone would have complained that he only won the last by a neck!

ima_mazed66    24 Sep 17 21:09 
No contest presumably until the next time he beats Moore in a finish. Funny too that Moore is being labelled as overrated on another thread, so then what does that make Dettori?

I bet if Betfair was around when he went through the card at Ascot, someone would have complained that he only won the last by a neck!



They would have said that last race was a jockey's race.

hope it doesn't come down to pushing and shoving on enable, he hasn't got a lot of pushing and shoving left in him thesedays ...

betting-masta....you think that frankie is over..... well my friend his career wins are in excess of 18 million dollars... he averages 2/3 million a year... and he owns a chain of Italian restaurants & a frozen food business.
Oh by the way he rides the hot shot this sunday.....if he's finished I wouldn't mind being over the hill !!

By the way ...what are your career earnings to date & how  many businesses do you own ????

ttt

ttt

Probably won't get the plaudits but that was a brilliant no-nonsense ride

Hope some of these utter t its on this thread come back on.....Masterclass.....

jedi sophie • September 16, 2017 4:21 PM BST
Dettori is the best riding right now!Comfortably...Diff class.

Pretty stupid to judge him on that ride. He would have to have done many things wrong to get that beat. It was a good ride but she had a stone in hand. He's still useless in a finish these days but obviously has a good temperament for the big races.

betting_masta • September 16, 2017 3:51 PM BST
don't back dettori gents he's shot.

amongst others....

Useless in a finish? have a word min....

For someone who is seemingly over the hill he seems to be riding more Gp 1 winners than in his peak years

jedi sophie

ffs get over yourself detorri was on miles the best horse for me the question is does he make a difference on not so superior horses - no

he is nowhwere near the best jockey imo

fast becoming the JV of american racing in other words cant be bothered when there is no prestige at stake

Is he interested in the not so superior horses? NO!
Nowhere near my f ucking foot pal!IMO.....

Brilliant jockey who has cheated death , been in the big brother show , taken drugs and lived a playboy life style...

Well done Frankie you gave a very good horse a perfect ride.

We all make mistakes in life and you have returned right back at the top where he belongs.

cheated death?

Plain crash

Very very fortunate indeed,ray Cochrane ex jockey saved his life,pilot died! X...

The experienced pilot who was killed in the air crash that left champion jockey Frankie Dettori injured had no record of being trained for the kind of plane he was flying, an official report said yesterday.

Very intelligent ride by Dettori to switch Enable when the AOB clan - Idaho and OoSG - tried to out-manoeuvre/box her in, notwithstanding, she'd have won anyway. Winter just plugged on one pace, and unlikely to be seen over 12f ever again; Brametot had every chance, and despite having to switch late on in the race after holding a good position next to the rails could never get to the front and/or deliver to challenge; Cloth Of Stars ran extremely well to be 3rd behind Enable and Ulysses.

A majestic performance by Enable. Hope she stays in training next season!

How much do you think the result of her being covered by Frankel will go for in the sales ring if it ever happened?

About £1.5m if you wanted to buy a Leger winner.  Bit more if you didnt1

Wonder what Sheila no makes of it all..nice sacking

I wonder what posters here would have had to say about Gordon Richards towards the end of his career ?

She's unlikely to go to FRANKEL because her sire and Frankel are both by Galileo?

KINGMAN/OASIS DREAM/ARROGATE/DANSILI???  Not short of options though?

11/4
9/1

Cloth Of Stars ran extremely well to be 3rd behind Enable and Ulysses.


I thought Cloth of Stars was second.

dettori has won £15m prizemoney since fearing he was finished in 2013

Didn't another Frankie go on into his fifties ? ( as opposed to anybody else's fifties I presume ! )
It is of old Frankie Durr I speak.

Moore, Dettori, Fallon and SDS In their prime = joint 2nd best jockeys Europe have ever seen.. imo.

Add Pat Eddery too.