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im asking because i believe that racing uk being high definition now makes them a fair way behind live..im sure atr is around 8 seconds behind live and racing on itv is also way behind live due to high definition tvs and pictures etc..so im rather confused as to how to obtain faster pictures. any ideas guys?
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but how do i get them willie? its very cryptic speak in here? of course i would keeep schtum!
dj dazzler 22 Apr 17 01:27
very intresting willie..so how much cost is involved setting up this motorised satellite and biss code thingy? and im lost on this facetime thing..isnt that just like skype for talking to mates on ya phone?
Willie Shafter. 23 Apr 17 00:34
prob about £1,000 ish for the sat equipment then setting up cost....biss codes you'll be looking at £200 ish a mth
very intresting willie..so how much cost is involved setting up this motorised satellite and biss code thingy? and im lost on this facetime thing..isnt that just like skype for talking to mates on ya phone?
Willie Shafter. 23 Apr 17 00:34
prob about £1,000 ish for the sat equipment then setting up cost....biss codes you'll be looking at £200 ish a mth
The biggest delay is watching ITV or any terrestrial channel on Sky!
Is it now the case that Turf TV pictures in the shops arE ahead of RUK?
i think ruk is now way behind because its high definition
parispike 27 Apr 17 13:01
Is it now the case that Turf TV pictures in the shops arE ahead of RUK?
tomhunt 27 Apr 17 13:59
no
YES
Is it now the case that Turf TV pictures in the shops arE ahead of RUK?
tomhunt 27 Apr 17 13:59
no
YES
theres been some interesting things said on this subject but bottom line is im none the wiser how to get the fast racing pictures! not all of us understand tecky speak lol..
parispike 27 Apr 17 13:01
Is it now the case that Turf TV pictures in the shops arE ahead of RUK?
tomhunt 27 Apr 17 13:59
no
YES
right
Is it now the case that Turf TV pictures in the shops arE ahead of RUK?
tomhunt 27 Apr 17 13:59
no
YES
right
Any bookies like 365 streams any good? just wondering if on par with Betfair time wise or behind? can end up way behind at times if load the stream too far away from the off at mainly atr tracks.
look get ruk its about 1.4 to 1.7 secs behind you can make a few pounds forget LBV it would drive you mental I just dont play atr meetings at all not worth the hassle
invisible layer, what a joke you can't load up early or it slow up 
I've got RUK tips, just wondering for atr tracks.
Thefear - it's not all the time but happened more than enough so load up as late as possible!
Thefear - it's not all the time but happened more than enough so load up as late as possible!
dj dazzler 28 Apr 17 11:39
theres been some interesting things said on this subject but bottom line is im none the wiser how to get the fast racing pictures! not all of us understand tecky speak lol..
i'll repeat..get a large satellite motorised system...get it set up..then source a daily code supplier..then expect a bit pi$$ on till you get the gist of things...
eveythings hard till you get used.
theres been some interesting things said on this subject but bottom line is im none the wiser how to get the fast racing pictures! not all of us understand tecky speak lol..
i'll repeat..get a large satellite motorised system...get it set up..then source a daily code supplier..then expect a bit pi$$ on till you get the gist of things...
eveythings hard till you get used.
Warwick are we talking 7.0e gcukenc feeds or others? Was told 7e turns to dubai racing when all that stuff is on and returns in spring uk races, and with the right softcam/powervu no need to install biss keys manually as can be set to auto roll. Used to have 80cm dish for 13e and 19.2e for football feeds before encryption stuff changed things so got shut of the eyesore and went down the iptv route for sports. Wish I'd kept it to have a play but inplay horses never bothered with that much. Need even bigger dish was told for other racing feeds so never really followed anything up as seemed hassle
Just been having a look, sis is on 4.8°E is that miles behind? can get plenty of football on that sat only need a huge dish 
the fast feeds are on 30.8e and 12.5w..layer you're still in the ice age.
haha I know, not in the loop as don't bother much inplay. 12.5w free atr fast feed it seems. But inclined orbit motorised set up required for 30.8e sis, then you need keys - so can imagine that would be costly but not bad for anyone that takes it seriously. Was getting confused with this powervu lark - could get it easy if was 4.8e as thought feeds on there, just bookie channels it seems.
no justification getting them now..the games as hard as ever.
Willie tells you right with the last comment but I'd go a step further....game is done - on the flat at least and there wont be a comeback for a multitude of reasons. Those that say it isn't are the ones trying to nick a monkey to a bag a week and with all due respect to them - it's those of us trying to take 10k a week out of it via 8-10mil of annual turnover in addition to the bots which keep it alive. Those betting in tenners to green up for fivers don't generate any liquidity.
For the heavy type of player who takes a 2/3% net yield after comms for his 10mil in annual turnover - the game's done, three of that type I know of personally + me all now generate virtually zero in turnover so that's 40-50 million in annual IR liquidity gone just between us annually.
The aim of in running now is to not bet in the last 3 furlongs or leave any lays of volume in the system whatsoever - and that's with live pictures let alone off RUK HD or the satellite.
National Hunt is still reasonable if that's your bag at least. I'd say that will remain the case for another 12months - then barring a major festival and an odd freak graded racing laden Saturday - unless you're scratching around for a bowl of rice the rest of it won't be worth playing either.
T'was good while it lasted but nothing lasts forever - just look at PokerStars and the hundreds on there who were making 500k a year only 24/36months ago now....same players don't win 25k annually online now. Fish all gone and house got too greedy - in the grand scheme of things online cash games were a small niche market and IR on horse racing is exactly the same.
To quote a good mate of mine - in the end everything turns to Hovis!
For the heavy type of player who takes a 2/3% net yield after comms for his 10mil in annual turnover - the game's done, three of that type I know of personally + me all now generate virtually zero in turnover so that's 40-50 million in annual IR liquidity gone just between us annually.
The aim of in running now is to not bet in the last 3 furlongs or leave any lays of volume in the system whatsoever - and that's with live pictures let alone off RUK HD or the satellite.
National Hunt is still reasonable if that's your bag at least. I'd say that will remain the case for another 12months - then barring a major festival and an odd freak graded racing laden Saturday - unless you're scratching around for a bowl of rice the rest of it won't be worth playing either.
T'was good while it lasted but nothing lasts forever - just look at PokerStars and the hundreds on there who were making 500k a year only 24/36months ago now....same players don't win 25k annually online now. Fish all gone and house got too greedy - in the grand scheme of things online cash games were a small niche market and IR on horse racing is exactly the same.
To quote a good mate of mine - in the end everything turns to Hovis!
I'll add that the pre race markets are going the same way barring big days and festivals so this isn't just an 'IR' thing.
Try getting a monkey to a grand matched midweek anywhere on a 12/1 shot even 5 mins before the off (before that it's actually pointless) which isn't deemed a non runner by the insiders (easy to highlight these, you can have 5k on in 30 secs!) - you feel you've turned water into wine just to get the bet on - let alone God forbid have it then win.
How much does one get for a post round these days - might start delivering the R/P instead of buying it
Try getting a monkey to a grand matched midweek anywhere on a 12/1 shot even 5 mins before the off (before that it's actually pointless) which isn't deemed a non runner by the insiders (easy to highlight these, you can have 5k on in 30 secs!) - you feel you've turned water into wine just to get the bet on - let alone God forbid have it then win.
How much does one get for a post round these days - might start delivering the R/P instead of buying it
Yeah all you peasants trying to snaffle a grand in coppers each week you grubby little turds doff your cap at the mighty studious and his chumps as they exit stage left cos they can't get their squillions anymore...
Making 2% off a boatload of turnover isn't squillions dusty - wish it was but it ain't. The prep and trading time works out at about £20 an hour over a year after expenses. It's just you're able to work 16hours a day legally 7 days a week is all.
It's betting in every RUK race everywhere - it's hard work but in an enjoyable grinding sort of way and almost all of it is break level stuff - I've always known that as does anyone else who plays that way.
As for being mighty - started the game with a 5k bankroll, racing uk and gruss - the 'chumps' all did the same, not one with a bean behind 'em or a pound ever given to them. I know where I came from but I also know how Betfair works and why I was able to kick on - it was due to big players/liquidity providers & strong markets when I was betting in fivers myself. My fivers didn't add to the markets.
I'm just highlighting one of the fundamental reasons why the markets are going as they are - which goes for pre race too - there's no layers left willing to take a chance and the bigger players are pulling their money out as you so eloquently put trying to do as you say.....'win a grand a week in coppers' - helps the markets an absolute zero long term.
Anyone getting into IR betting on racing is like starting a press for printing newspapers - game is gone. Find an edge in Football or an American sport if you're looking to get into betting is the advice to anyone reading in wondering on whether to start playing IR and how it works.
Nuff said anyway. GL to all.
It's betting in every RUK race everywhere - it's hard work but in an enjoyable grinding sort of way and almost all of it is break level stuff - I've always known that as does anyone else who plays that way.
As for being mighty - started the game with a 5k bankroll, racing uk and gruss - the 'chumps' all did the same, not one with a bean behind 'em or a pound ever given to them. I know where I came from but I also know how Betfair works and why I was able to kick on - it was due to big players/liquidity providers & strong markets when I was betting in fivers myself. My fivers didn't add to the markets.
I'm just highlighting one of the fundamental reasons why the markets are going as they are - which goes for pre race too - there's no layers left willing to take a chance and the bigger players are pulling their money out as you so eloquently put trying to do as you say.....'win a grand a week in coppers' - helps the markets an absolute zero long term.
Anyone getting into IR betting on racing is like starting a press for printing newspapers - game is gone. Find an edge in Football or an American sport if you're looking to get into betting is the advice to anyone reading in wondering on whether to start playing IR and how it works.
Nuff said anyway. GL to all.
'Chumps' was meant to be 'chums'
It's still condescending to assume people 'scratch around' or play for 'bowls of rice' when each cut their own cloth accordingly. Had you mentioned it earlier then perhaps those with their two Bob bets could have lost more in the process.
The shrewdies survive while the ones who stretch themselves too far will fall.
If either the return is no longer worth while or those you won off went skint....or more likely the house took market share, the fact nobody turns up here to scratch out money for fun, it's hard for all.
It's still condescending to assume people 'scratch around' or play for 'bowls of rice' when each cut their own cloth accordingly. Had you mentioned it earlier then perhaps those with their two Bob bets could have lost more in the process.
The shrewdies survive while the ones who stretch themselves too far will fall.
If either the return is no longer worth while or those you won off went skint....or more likely the house took market share, the fact nobody turns up here to scratch out money for fun, it's hard for all.
The bottom line is that it's the losers that create liquidity, not winners.
If people win they use winnings to churn for more profit, whether that's 10k a week or 1k it's still taking out.
Losers lose revenue they made elsewhere, that's the origin of the wealth here.
So if people grew wise, skint or as was the case BF took the lion share then that's the natural way of things, the market matured.
If people win they use winnings to churn for more profit, whether that's 10k a week or 1k it's still taking out.
Losers lose revenue they made elsewhere, that's the origin of the wealth here.
So if people grew wise, skint or as was the case BF took the lion share then that's the natural way of things, the market matured.
studious- Those betting in tenners to green up for fivers don't generate any liquidity. Well that's what i do,last seven days made 3700 and gave back 3700 in liquidity and you say it can't be done. Only started 9 months ago.
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(relates to event settlement date)
2017-04-22 00:00
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) to
2017-04-29 11:30
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) Get P & L
Horse Racing: £3,761.17 Total P&L: £3,761.17
Horse Racing Showing 1 - 20 of 226 markets
Market Start time Settled date Profit/loss (£)
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m2f INHF 28-Apr-17 19:45 28-Apr-17 19:52 13.31
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 3m2f Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 19:35 28-Apr-17 19:43 1.60
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m Nov Hrd 28-Apr-17 19:10 28-Apr-17 19:21 84.44
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m7f Nov Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 19:00 28-Apr-17 19:08 4.77
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 3m Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 18:40 28-Apr-17 18:48 27.15
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m3f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 18:30 28-Apr-17 18:38 22.92
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m4f Grd1 Nov Hrd 28-Apr-17 18:05 28-Apr-17 18:12 21.15
Horse Racing / Hunt 28th Apr : 3m1f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:45 28-Apr-17 17:54 2.79
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 2m Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:40 28-Apr-17 17:45 8.61
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m Grd1 Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:30 28-Apr-17 17:40 2.23
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:20 28-Apr-17 17:25 22.27
Horse Racing / Sand 28th Apr : 1m2f Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:10 28-Apr-17 17:16 4.77
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 6f Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:05 28-Apr-17 17:14 0.00
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m5f Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 16:55 28-Apr-17 17:03 0.88
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 5f Hcap 28-Apr-17 16:30 28-Apr-17 16:32 35.57
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m5f Nov Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 16:20 28-Apr-17 16:28 4.77
Horse Racing / Sand 28th Apr : 5f Hcap 28-Apr-17 16:05 28-Apr-17 16:10 1.97
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 6f Hcap 28-Apr-17 15:55 28-Apr-17 15:59 18.14
Horse Racing / Perth 28th Apr : 2m4f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 15:45 28-Apr-17 15:54 9.55
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m4f Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 15:40 28-Apr-17 15:48 40.68
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(relates to event settlement date)
2017-04-22 00:00
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) to
2017-04-29 11:30
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) Get P & L
Horse Racing: £3,761.17 Total P&L: £3,761.17
Horse Racing Showing 1 - 20 of 226 markets
Market Start time Settled date Profit/loss (£)
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m2f INHF 28-Apr-17 19:45 28-Apr-17 19:52 13.31
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 3m2f Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 19:35 28-Apr-17 19:43 1.60
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m Nov Hrd 28-Apr-17 19:10 28-Apr-17 19:21 84.44
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m7f Nov Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 19:00 28-Apr-17 19:08 4.77
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 3m Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 18:40 28-Apr-17 18:48 27.15
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m3f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 18:30 28-Apr-17 18:38 22.92
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m4f Grd1 Nov Hrd 28-Apr-17 18:05 28-Apr-17 18:12 21.15
Horse Racing / Hunt 28th Apr : 3m1f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:45 28-Apr-17 17:54 2.79
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 2m Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:40 28-Apr-17 17:45 8.61
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m Grd1 Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:30 28-Apr-17 17:40 2.23
Horse Racing / Chep 28th Apr : 2m Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 17:20 28-Apr-17 17:25 22.27
Horse Racing / Sand 28th Apr : 1m2f Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:10 28-Apr-17 17:16 4.77
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 6f Hcap 28-Apr-17 17:05 28-Apr-17 17:14 0.00
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m5f Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 16:55 28-Apr-17 17:03 0.88
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 5f Hcap 28-Apr-17 16:30 28-Apr-17 16:32 35.57
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m5f Nov Hcap Chs 28-Apr-17 16:20 28-Apr-17 16:28 4.77
Horse Racing / Sand 28th Apr : 5f Hcap 28-Apr-17 16:05 28-Apr-17 16:10 1.97
Horse Racing / Donc 28th Apr : 6f Hcap 28-Apr-17 15:55 28-Apr-17 15:59 18.14
Horse Racing / Perth 28th Apr : 2m4f Hcap Hrd 28-Apr-17 15:45 28-Apr-17 15:54 9.55
Horse Racing / Punch 28th Apr : 2m4f Hunt Chs 28-Apr-17 15:40 28-Apr-17 15:48 40.68
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I agree with your last post Dusty that's a fair summary of things.
In regards to the previous one, I don't have any issue with people having a go at me but don't take my words out of context put your own spin on them and then have a go - that's not on and pointless.
I never said winning 500/1000 a week was scratching around or a bowl of rice sum. Where did I say that?
I then used those terms to assess where I felt the game would be in 12months time if it continues down the current trend. I think that's what it will be like and if you're on here to win 200/300 a week as a full timer - you're earning less than minimum wage which is a bowl of rice. If I have fault it's that my language can be a tad crass but I call an apple an apple not an orange.
I'm not knocking people on minimum wage, most jobs that pay that are hard work and demoralising I'm sure and I think the min wage in the UK is a disgrace but regardless of that, it is a bowl of rice and if you're on here full time to earn min wage - a bowl of rice is what it is also. That's not condescension it's just what it is.
Roder - I think you misunderstood what I was referring to in regards to the generating of liquidity via turnover. Well done on your win of last week - that's a great effort but if that's a typical week for you in another 9months your total commission will be between 63.1% and 63.7% and that will be problematic.
I'll come back to you tonight when I'm having a beer watching the boxing - well done though genuinely - that's great work, shows a lot of discipline and not easy to do especially in less than a year of playing.
In regards to the previous one, I don't have any issue with people having a go at me but don't take my words out of context put your own spin on them and then have a go - that's not on and pointless.
I never said winning 500/1000 a week was scratching around or a bowl of rice sum. Where did I say that?
I then used those terms to assess where I felt the game would be in 12months time if it continues down the current trend. I think that's what it will be like and if you're on here to win 200/300 a week as a full timer - you're earning less than minimum wage which is a bowl of rice. If I have fault it's that my language can be a tad crass but I call an apple an apple not an orange.
I'm not knocking people on minimum wage, most jobs that pay that are hard work and demoralising I'm sure and I think the min wage in the UK is a disgrace but regardless of that, it is a bowl of rice and if you're on here full time to earn min wage - a bowl of rice is what it is also. That's not condescension it's just what it is.
Roder - I think you misunderstood what I was referring to in regards to the generating of liquidity via turnover. Well done on your win of last week - that's a great effort but if that's a typical week for you in another 9months your total commission will be between 63.1% and 63.7% and that will be problematic.
I'll come back to you tonight when I'm having a beer watching the boxing - well done though genuinely - that's great work, shows a lot of discipline and not easy to do especially in less than a year of playing.
Dusty your last post, I agree with all bar the simplification of 'losers create liquidity'. It's not that simple in the slightest. Sure they do but someone winning and making 3% on significant turnover and someone like roder above are two different entities.
Both win, both are using profit to win - but both have an entirely different effect on the market as a whole due to the manner in which they generate said profit and the losses they incur en route to doing so.
You know what I mean cos I've read your posts before and you know how it works - so to say it's just losers who create liquidity is just false.
Last post till tonight as got to crack on with trying to make a copper or two!
Both win, both are using profit to win - but both have an entirely different effect on the market as a whole due to the manner in which they generate said profit and the losses they incur en route to doing so.
You know what I mean cos I've read your posts before and you know how it works - so to say it's just losers who create liquidity is just false.
Last post till tonight as got to crack on with trying to make a copper or two!
I see the argument that winners create liquidity and when they stop others suffer.
But if they are net winners they by definition win off of losers, so the bets matched against them that no long exist or losing bets that others wont now have.
Its those that are able to win regardless of liquidity that will continue to survive after those with poor efficiency and higher expectations have long packed up and taken their 'liquidity' with them.
But if they are net winners they by definition win off of losers, so the bets matched against them that no long exist or losing bets that others wont now have.
Its those that are able to win regardless of liquidity that will continue to survive after those with poor efficiency and higher expectations have long packed up and taken their 'liquidity' with them.
Earning the national minimum wage by watching horse racing can in no way be compared with earning the same by cleaning the local bookies or collecting supermarket trolleys.
That really is comparing apples with turds.
That really is comparing apples with turds.
lot of in running track players will bite the dust this yr and thats 1.01...
i know some who are paying £50,000 a yr for seats..then there is travelling exes,food etc,premium charge..impossible to make it pay for some.
i know some who are paying £50,000 a yr for seats..then there is travelling exes,food etc,premium charge..impossible to make it pay for some.
fair enough studious, it just read to me like you were saying that the little fish were going to suffer because you big timers werent bothering anymore.
Marx said that all profit derives from child labour, and imv all winners take from the actions of workers outside of betting and all the rest of us just churn it around and bf clip the coin each time it gets traded.
Marx said that all profit derives from child labour, and imv all winners take from the actions of workers outside of betting and all the rest of us just churn it around and bf clip the coin each time it gets traded.
Groucho's kid was once at a pool party and the owner of the pool said sorry no jews
To which Groucho replied 'the child is only half jewish, can they go in upto the waist?'
To which Groucho replied 'the child is only half jewish, can they go in upto the waist?'
studious- did you pull in a few bags today? only a pittance here.
od:
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(relates to event settlement date)
2017-04-28 23:00
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) to
2017-04-29 18:56
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) Get P & L
Horse Racing: £681.37 Total P&L: £681.37
od:
Download to Spreadsheet
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(relates to event settlement date)
2017-04-28 23:00
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) to
2017-04-29 18:56
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) Get P & L
Horse Racing: £681.37 Total P&L: £681.37
Roder don't need his arm twisted up the back to post the p+l that's for sure!
very interesting lads...my mate used to bet i/r a lot until bout 6 years ago when atr got miles behind and now ruk is in hi defintion thats miles behind too! all we do now is feed the on track boys easy money we are nearly furlong behind..my mate was also asked to pay 40p premium charge and was told take it or leave it..he has not been on betfair since..he went on daq but never bets in running anymore obviously..he said he will only ever go back on betfair if they stop charging premium charge.i wouldnt mind betting in running but its no point now days by sounds of it..shame realy but as the guy said earlier nothing lasts forever.
roder..not bad for betting in tenners and greening up ir.
Brilliant scores by roder tbf
Not a chance he's only betting in tenners though, liabilities certainly won't be tenners
Not a chance he's only betting in tenners though, liabilities certainly won't be tenners
how far behind live is blv on the fibre tracks where trp show the pics ?
roder do you seriously only bet £10 per horse. do you just back then lay at 1/2 the price or what
i know this might be a daft question...but wouldnt it be in betfairs intrest to make their live pics actually LIVE! so that everybody would thus watch on here and be encouraged to bet in runnning on an equal footing with guys on the track? now shoot me down lol :)
if the suppliers would allow it im sure bf would manage it.
you know what amazes me is that people who run ruk must read these forums and realise how many more people would subscribe if they can make their pics live or within one second..going hi definition has put them as far behind as atr i think
Dazzler RUK are aware of all that and that's why their HD channel is quicker than their SD channel - it's 1.3secs behind live.
Now a few years ago 1.3seconds seemed like a fair marker but now every single track in the UK and most in Ireland are now virtually viewed bang live at home and in exchange offices by many a crew.
The irony being is that these crews think they have pictures to 'get the lot' but by now are probably quickly realising that 'the lot' is nowhere to be seen as that sort of money is only thrown into a reasonably fair market (which was the case a few years back and beyond) by the heavier staking punters who provide a fair chunk of 'risk taking' liquidity in addition to the bots who provide most of the liquidity.
Hence the pool of money In Running, once Betfair take their considerable slice is like a pie being eaten from the edges in....with each quarter that passes less is available for consumption until.....
The ultimate reason for this is that you have had one set of tracks which have never been truly playable from home (ATR ones) and now the RUK ones are a shadow of what they were. RUK HD as fine a picture as it is, is still 1.3secs behind and that's further behind live than it's ever been.
The only thing that will rekindle the markets (not get them back to what they were as a lot of the fish money isn't there anymore) is clear sub 1 second pictures across the board available online (not through a sky box) that don't stutter or buffer.
These pictures are 100% achievable with present technology let alone future technology however the reason they have not occurred is the bookmakers don't want them and the pictures on ATR at least are deliberately slowed down according to their wishes while on RUK they deem 1.3 seconds sufficiently quick for the home in running player - it probably was 2/3 years ago but that's no longer the case.
As racing is seemingly run by a group of not a scooby do'ers who don't understand that to attract youth and a new audience into it, in running betting is their vehicle, we are left with bookmakers who have no viable In Running product to rival Betfair's and who are the primary funding agent of ATR - dictating that pictures stay in the ice age and in doing so keeping the sport miles behind football, cricket and tennis as an interesting betting medium to the tech generation. Sure it will never have the broad appeal of in play betting on football, it's a lot more niche than that but it can make a start on it - however the vested interests of the bookmakers hold it to the floor while the supplicating agents they have within the racing channels and at the BHA push their agenda.
Until bookmakers en masse want super latent pictures - the chances of an improve to the status quo is zero and hence we have the shambles we have presently where the current edge is sending a mate to the track to point an iphone at a screen somewhere rather than everyone booting up a stream online which could be marketed by the sport across the various demographics and give it a chance to garner interest in a different way.
All of this is hardly a surprise...I mean what do you expect from a sport which managed to sell it's jewel in the crown to a bookmaker in Fred Done, instead of working proficiently towards a strong centralised betting system (Pari Mutuel or racing run exchange) and running the bookmakers out of town....the sport said here you go Fred and the Vaseline is on us free of charge too.
Now a few years ago 1.3seconds seemed like a fair marker but now every single track in the UK and most in Ireland are now virtually viewed bang live at home and in exchange offices by many a crew.
The irony being is that these crews think they have pictures to 'get the lot' but by now are probably quickly realising that 'the lot' is nowhere to be seen as that sort of money is only thrown into a reasonably fair market (which was the case a few years back and beyond) by the heavier staking punters who provide a fair chunk of 'risk taking' liquidity in addition to the bots who provide most of the liquidity.
Hence the pool of money In Running, once Betfair take their considerable slice is like a pie being eaten from the edges in....with each quarter that passes less is available for consumption until.....
The ultimate reason for this is that you have had one set of tracks which have never been truly playable from home (ATR ones) and now the RUK ones are a shadow of what they were. RUK HD as fine a picture as it is, is still 1.3secs behind and that's further behind live than it's ever been.
The only thing that will rekindle the markets (not get them back to what they were as a lot of the fish money isn't there anymore) is clear sub 1 second pictures across the board available online (not through a sky box) that don't stutter or buffer.
These pictures are 100% achievable with present technology let alone future technology however the reason they have not occurred is the bookmakers don't want them and the pictures on ATR at least are deliberately slowed down according to their wishes while on RUK they deem 1.3 seconds sufficiently quick for the home in running player - it probably was 2/3 years ago but that's no longer the case.
As racing is seemingly run by a group of not a scooby do'ers who don't understand that to attract youth and a new audience into it, in running betting is their vehicle, we are left with bookmakers who have no viable In Running product to rival Betfair's and who are the primary funding agent of ATR - dictating that pictures stay in the ice age and in doing so keeping the sport miles behind football, cricket and tennis as an interesting betting medium to the tech generation. Sure it will never have the broad appeal of in play betting on football, it's a lot more niche than that but it can make a start on it - however the vested interests of the bookmakers hold it to the floor while the supplicating agents they have within the racing channels and at the BHA push their agenda.
Until bookmakers en masse want super latent pictures - the chances of an improve to the status quo is zero and hence we have the shambles we have presently where the current edge is sending a mate to the track to point an iphone at a screen somewhere rather than everyone booting up a stream online which could be marketed by the sport across the various demographics and give it a chance to garner interest in a different way.
All of this is hardly a surprise...I mean what do you expect from a sport which managed to sell it's jewel in the crown to a bookmaker in Fred Done, instead of working proficiently towards a strong centralised betting system (Pari Mutuel or racing run exchange) and running the bookmakers out of town....the sport said here you go Fred and the Vaseline is on us free of charge too.
Perfect post from studious. Absolutely sums up the situation.
A few individuals have got rich from the iphone pictures. Unfortunately they were holding them rather than betting off them.
Someone I spoke to at Racing UK said they would consider selling faster pics for in running but they are afraid the general subscriber would be peeved by this. If it costs more to have faster pics RUK are in a dififcult position because at £20 a month they are already reasonably expensive for anyone already subscribing to sky sports etc. So they have three choices:
a) sell fast pics to richer customers/exchange shops and p1ss off your fanbase
b) speed up the channel but increase prices
c) status quo
A few individuals have got rich from the iphone pictures. Unfortunately they were holding them rather than betting off them.
Someone I spoke to at Racing UK said they would consider selling faster pics for in running but they are afraid the general subscriber would be peeved by this. If it costs more to have faster pics RUK are in a dififcult position because at £20 a month they are already reasonably expensive for anyone already subscribing to sky sports etc. So they have three choices:
a) sell fast pics to richer customers/exchange shops and p1ss off your fanbase
b) speed up the channel but increase prices
c) status quo
dj dazzler 02 May 17 09:27
you know what amazes me is that people who run ruk must read these forums and realise how many more people would subscribe if they can make their pics live or within one second..going hi definition has put them as far behind as atr i think
aye you're correct..albeit around 6 secs out.
you know what amazes me is that people who run ruk must read these forums and realise how many more people would subscribe if they can make their pics live or within one second..going hi definition has put them as far behind as atr i think
aye you're correct..albeit around 6 secs out.
Studious great posts. The fear , I think they are wrong to think normal non-IR subscribers will decide to cancel if someone is getting pictures about 1 second quicker. All pictures on TV football and especially racing on ITV/ITV4 are way behind live. Anyone got any news about the SIS in-running plans for bookies ? They have announced it so are trials happening now or when ?
A very good thread. Well done lads. Lots of truths being written here,which is refreshing,as opposed to the usual drivel.
a few lads recenly were thrown off irish tracks for facetiming
must say some cracking replies guys..i do love intelligent people who actually know their subject but put it down with bit of passion.all in all we are singing off same hymn sheet but shame the rest of racing doesnt. i missed out on the facetime thing and iphone thing.. surely the delay in mobil signal from track puts you behind live already!
Someone I spoke to at Racing UK said they would consider selling faster pics for in running but they are afraid the general subscriber would be peeved by this. If it costs more to have faster pics RUK are in a dififcult position because at £20 a month they are already reasonably expensive for anyone already subscribing to sky sports etc.
They can't be too worried about increases as they were happy enough to cut the £20 in half with most of us now only paying the ten quid.
They're quite welcome to stick mine back up to the 20 for the sake of faster pics.
They can't be too worried about increases as they were happy enough to cut the £20 in half with most of us now only paying the ten quid.
They're quite welcome to stick mine back up to the 20 for the sake of faster pics.
The Fear:
Someone I spoke to at Racing UK said they would consider selling faster pics for in running but they are afraid the general subscriber would be peeved by this. If it costs more to have faster pics RUK are in a dififcult position because at £20 a month they are already reasonably expensive for anyone already subscribing to sky sports etc. So they have three choices:
a) sell fast pics to richer customers/exchange shops and p1ss off your fanbase
b) speed up the channel but increase prices
c) status quo
How about
d) speed up the channel, but keep prices the same and recoup any additional costs, if they exist, via the increased number of subscribers they'd get as a consequence?
Someone I spoke to at Racing UK said they would consider selling faster pics for in running but they are afraid the general subscriber would be peeved by this. If it costs more to have faster pics RUK are in a dififcult position because at £20 a month they are already reasonably expensive for anyone already subscribing to sky sports etc. So they have three choices:
a) sell fast pics to richer customers/exchange shops and p1ss off your fanbase
b) speed up the channel but increase prices
c) status quo
How about
d) speed up the channel, but keep prices the same and recoup any additional costs, if they exist, via the increased number of subscribers they'd get as a consequence?
very interesting this is guys..im learning quite a lot lol..facetime is close to live but i imagine tricky to get a decent picture ? and agree about ruk..if they offered live pics i bet they would spike a load more customers thus make more profits..
It's the way every other technology firm has prospered since man discovered fire. Increase the profits by improving the product. Even if a firm can't themselves see a use for the improved product, it's assumed that there are people out there who will, so you go ahead and do it as a matter of course.
not tricky to get decent picture if 4g is available...need to be out in the sticks for poor coverage.
there was one track i use to play from home on they web site half a second behind live, it was a bag of sand and more guaranteed every week the problem was they slowed the pictures down just before Christmas by 30 seconds fast pictures can be done bookies don't want it that's the problem and there nothing anybody can do about it legally
i notice betfair suspend wel before some commentrys finish now days..even betfair radio is miles behind live
I have a motorised dish I would like to sell if anyone is interested- very lightly used, near Leicester.
looks like its very hard to make money in running these days full stop
out of intrest does anybody reading this actually bet in-running exclusively still? i can only imagine you need to be really well set up to make it pay nowdays
I bet ante-post on the Classics/Cheltenham and have a pre-race bet once in a blue moon but at least 99% of my betting is IR on RUK and LV.
WOWZA 11kv thats impressive set up mate! so can you talk me thru that set up please..is it just for you or do you let a mate share? its most proffesional set up ever. do you use ruk and atr or you get faster pics? you deserve to make money with that set up.
It's ok having a setup for two people I guess....
But I bet the mastabation between races gets a bit awkward
Or is it competitive?
But I bet the mastabation between races gets a bit awkward
Or is it competitive?
well hope 11kv comes back and talks us thru that impreessive set up! imagine that with faster pics..it would be a dream lol
looked great..i dont think id back bags dogs tho..unless you got info..id mainly bet in running if i had faster pics..and a bit of pre race laying..and the odd bet of course.
While i was moving into a new property i had to wait about a week for my infrastructure to be set up (WIFI and TV pictures) so what i did was sit in the coral from about midday to 5 o clock. I would place £1 win bets every now and then to keep them sweet.
Obviously i was watching the SIS feed in shop and would use betfair on my phone.
I was able to get good bets on inrunning. The trouble was when Voda sent me the bill for £360 odd pound.
Then it dawned on me.....the shop had wifi
Obviously i was watching the SIS feed in shop and would use betfair on my phone.
I was able to get good bets on inrunning. The trouble was when Voda sent me the bill for £360 odd pound.
Then it dawned on me.....the shop had wifi
'I was able to get good bets on inrunning.'
post a couple.
post a couple.
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