Consort

you didnt think to tell us that before Sandown?

As it's the Sandown race i'm referring to, that would have been problematic (or proof of detailed prophesy).

did you see Consort before Sandown?

yes.

so why did you not tell us before Sandown he was every inch a top class Group 1 horse

Isee where you're coming fromnow.I was just posting my thoughts on a FORUM about a race at RA. You it semms think that is not what forums are for i take it ?

14L improvement (plus more from hold up bias in the guineas) ina line through room key is a bit too much to ask imo.

races are not run on paper G1

at least you told us before royal ascot.

now gonna have to re adjust my speed figures to turf instead ffs

Yes I looked at both races and the distances between them. Consort looked a class above them at Sandown and was not extended has aparently grown plenty(2/3yrs) and has 'gone forward' since then. He's taking on a double 2000 winner I know but at 13/2, until he's beat I'll be with him.

Golden Horn the only horse in training who would have a chance against Consort.

So you're already with Consort for tomorrow ? How long has this been the case: as I have only     this last week joined the forum.

At 10-1 I could see where you're coming from but at current odds he's already priced up like he's a Group One horse, imho...

for good reason imnsho

I can't dispute your logic but sometimes it's a combination of gead and heart. I had, for me, a sizable bet at Sandown and 2f out thought Moore had blown it. The way he won (yes it takes a leap of faith to some extent) was just very impressive with bundles of improvment to come.

both times of consort were slow........

Group races are just as likely to be run at sedate pace as any. Small fieled tomorrow and 70TP in a listed race (only his 2nd race)with his head in his chest.

he beat rubbish in a slow time and is only 6\1.........with those doubts i would want double figures

Belardo on the other hand, who has shown that he is a Group One horse, is five times the price...

for good reason

if a lesser trainer had consort it would be 12 or 14\1

Was 12/1 for ages after Sandown, the shrewdies are on.

the form of the Sandown race is irrelevant to me, I already knew what he was, you will see a very different animal again tomorrow, will leave that last run well behind

I thought the Tercentenary was the right race for him but the fact he runs here I think speaks volumes considering the trainer and thats why he is the price he is

there is no possible reason to think Belardo can beat Gleneagles on fast ground, thats why he is the price he is, he is exposed in the context of the race

I should add, at the start of the season I backed Consort for the Guineas at 33/1, he was my Guineas horse since he won his maiden so hes always been up to this level in my book, he had a setback and missed the race and the chance to achieve worthwhile form, he apparently only started coming to hand not long before Sandown and thats why I suspect you will see a different horse again tomorrow

he should be much sharper physically and mentally and if his work was not backing that up I think he would running in the 1m2 G3, of course he has it to do on paper having only run in a listed race and taking on the winners of the English, French and Irish Guineas, but if there is a better unexposed candidate to take them on I have not seen it

tomorrow we will find out exactly what he is

Oneyaallbeenwaiting4, Dewhurst winner beaten less than two lengths in the Irish 2000 Guineas at 33-1, or Listed and maiden winner having his third ever race in a Group One at 13-2, is a no contest in terms of where the value is, imho...

he beat 5 horses rated 100+. Horses that had ran in G1's and 2's. He beat them despite a questionable ride by Moore and he beat them without extending himself in any real way. You can argue the point of price I accept that but to say he beat rubbish is frankly absurd.

If that's for me, I didn't say that enpassant.

I think he's probably very good and likely to be up to this class, but at the prices, which is ultimately the ONLY thing that matters, he's pretty poor value against a Dewhurst winner and two Guineas winners, imho...

I backed the Dewhurst winner in the Dewhurst, not many did, but I wouldnt back him at any price tomorrow, not saying it cant happen but if it does there wont be a decent reason to explain it, imo for something to be value there has to be a reason for it possibly winning, could understand maybe if it had come up soft ground but seems to me the only way Belardo can win is if the fav does not run his race and thats before you even take Consort and Make Believe into consideration and I think the betting reflects that

his form is obviously not too far away but its far enough away when talking about a Group 1 and id rather play Latharnach at 50/1 because ive always rated him, the ground is right for him and he has not yet been exposed by the favourite

he beat secret brief whose been beaten at epsom since and the cumani horse who was well beaten in his 2 previous starts at higher level.....hardly world beaters

room key the 4th was just over 4l behind was 14l behind gleneagles

what if Room Key came on for his first run of the season, what if Consort was value for a lot more than the bare form and what if he comes on again a for what was only the second run of of his life and his first after a setback

too many variables and possibilities to just read racing off paper

Gleneagles is the one to beat but he wont be beating Consort 10L, dont worry about that

enpasse.....struggling to see the good horses he beat....personally i dont think gleneagles is that special but he may   not after to be.....if you are backing consort you are backing the trainer because what its done on the racetrack needs improving.....thats not saying he cant

if you are backing Consort you are backing potential, maybe the best since Kingman

13/2 could look the bet of the century

It's certainly credible to crab there bare form in terms of G1. Those horse though have competed at group level and Consort looked in a different league to them.

13/2 is poor poor value for inexperienced listed race winner against an improving dual guineas winner , and the rest are no mugs either

I may be totally wrong but the stoute yard doesn't have anything near the quality of previous years in general and I think is running with hope rather than expectation , I don't doubt the horse is quality but 6s is terrible value ,

if this was trained by lesser than stoutey it would be 16s 20s

8's into 5'WH & Lad someone thought the odds were ok. The argument about it being SMS and not a 'lesser trainer': Stoute (and highclere) have classy animals to gallop with and choose from and hence where to enter them.

bit anorakish but there is also a line through Integral that gives Solow the clear beating of N.O.T.

*Solow thread

you may be right enpassant and if you back it I hope you are

The price just looks very skinny on achievement and experience , I wont play on this one I don't think just enjoy it

Skinny I guess but for those that have crabbed his form ect (with fair points)and therefor his price: there is plenty money waiting to back him for layers, particularly those that think he ought to be nearer 16's.

with all the greats stoutes had over years he has won this once , and you need to go against solid top class form from a horse with maybe more improvement to come

to go against that with a listed win , 6s isn't value but I also know it wont be disgraced either but it wont be winning tomorrow

Does anyone have the end of this sentence from a gallop report as frustratingly it ends there on the site I was on:

CONSORT be part of the action next week, a prospect made ever more juicy after he had gone half a dozen lengths clear of

wow that's frustrating , I want to know aswell

I know oddly I found another site and it ended the same.

Just think, if the line ends with.....Integral... you might have to reconsider !

Make Believe for me GL All

Consort beat Secret Brief that had finished last on his 2 previous runs and has subsequently got beat by a horse that was an also ran in Gleneagles Guineas.
The Guineas also ran gave Secret Brief 4lb.
If Consort finds a stone improvement he migh have a chance up against the winners of 3 GUineas.
4 me lay of the day.

the race is run on grass mate not the racing post

johnny Barnes : beaten 5 1/4L by Consort
Johnny Barnes : beaten 4L by Vert De Grece
Vert De Grece: beaten 3/4L BY Gleneagles

Now I'm not arguing that form lines are undisputable in terms of who wins but it is there for those that are using pure form lines to crab Consorts credentials.

The 2nd at Sandown had the run of the race at Epsom and let the form down. None of the other Sandown runners have raced since. Will need to improve by ?? I'd say almost 10lbs unless the Fav runs poorly.

Bit of an insult to Consort that they didn't even mention him when previewing thr race on the Morning Line.

Jun 16, 2015 -- 8:49AM, G1_Jockey_4 wrote:

the race is run on grass mate not the racing post

anyone who took the bigger prices is on a fair price but 6\1 is a little skinny

When I backed Kingman for the Guineas before the Greenham, it wasnt on the strength of his 2L defeat of Emirates Flyer and Music Theory, for anyone who seen the class he showed on debut, the form of that race became irrelevant.

Suggesting Consort needs to find a stone is ridiculous, the Guineas this year were average renewals at best and Gleneagles was made to work to beat a similarly unexposed type last time in Ireland. Endless Drama wouldnt be in the same class as Consort for my money. Gleneagles is a decent miler in a poor year, also debatable how much improvement he has left in him, he could be vulnerable to something catching up with him and surpassing him as we often see happening in this division, especially to the ones who won the 2yo races. I wouldnt want anything to do with 4/6 about him today.

kingman won his maiden in a sensational time..........consort won his in probably the slowest time of the day

Like a few other unbeaten horses, you never quite know until they are tested at this level. The French Oaks fav. had all the stats in its favour but finished out the back. I am willing to take a chance with Consort who was not prepared early for the Guineas. Belardo only has 3 lb. to find on Gleneagles and he is 33/1!

sage.......its all about price ........people who have 14s and 16s have a good bet but i would struggle to make a case for him at 6s

was never 14s or 16s, was put in at 12/1 best price, been no bigger than 8/1 since being confirmed for the race

12s is better than 6s

enpassant if you think johnny barnes on gd to firm @ Sandown performed to the same level as his soft ground second in the Criterium International its time to take up another sport.

As added garbage to the Consort form White Lake who waltzed thro the filed like a knife thro butter looking for all a 7 f hoss had finished last of 7 in the Craven and the 4th Room Key finished 16th of 18 in the Guineas.
Consort is a horse of plenty of potential but @ 6s in this company @ this stage of his career no thanks .
Agree with Cardiffc its all about the price and imo 6s is wrong.

Looks a top 10f horse. Running here because fav might have an off-day and the place money is useful anyway.

goeff: You seem not to have taken the point I was making on board, it was that pure form lines need interpreting and therefor are open to conjecture and debate. So in a sense we agree. Hope that clears it up for you.

Glad we agree then enpassant that the next 3 horses Consort beat last time out where either last or nearer last than first on their previous outing.
All open to interpretation and debate tho.
I wont wish you good luck as I will have done my conkers.

hahaha

Connections seem confident on Ch4 and Fav is sweating up.

he sweated up before both guineas...seems to be a trait with some in the giants causeway family.

I will be amazed if Consort beats Gleneagles & Make Believe

Lovely pacemaker.

seriously, how did it trade at 1.83

8 hurdles and the triumph hurdle beckons

Had the run of the race and still not on 1st two

1.83 backers really need a trip to specsavers.

hit 1.02 to place...ONLY laid stake off  at 1.14

seriously, how did it trade at 1.83 Crazy
it is always looking workman like in running
but its no slouch

geoff m • June 16, 2015 4:28 PM BST
1.83 backers really need a trip to specsavers.

Consort will never win a G1

I was wrong i thought he needed to find a stone
Its clearly a stone and half