McCririck trying to put the boot in,won't let it go.

Horse racing is a minority sport.  It's getting less and less evry year as the younger generation have NO interest.

The BBC's viewing figures were falling through the floor with the relentlessly patronising Balding fronting the coverage.

Now C4's viewing figures are falling through the floor with the relentlessly patronising Balding fronting the coverage.

You don't need to be Inspector Morse, imho...

I agree with Millhouse.

balding fitz and gleeson need dropping.

I agree with Millhouse on his opinions of CB. That said, it wouldn't matter if you had Ant and Dec or the best racing presenter in the world fronting the coverage. The problem isn't with the presenters, it's just that bar the enthusiasts, less and less people are interested in watching racing

This sport was here before us and will be here after us.

Love It.

People,if interested,watch the prog. regardless of who presents.
I cannot stand Boyce,and his poor presentaton,yet I don't switch off,just press "mute".
Sporting events are just the same,regardless of who presents.
Clive Tyldesley and his sidekick Townsend are absolutely dire,the worst I can think of for footie,an opinion shared by many,yet we still watch,because we want to see the live event.

We have to accept this because the trendy intellectuals have decided that horse racing is dangerous to the horse. Instead of being neutral on the subject, they are positively against it for this reason.

Anyone who has tried to organize a National or Derby office sweep in recent years will be able to testify to this.

This point of view is, of course, actively fuelled by the BBC nowadays.

Think people want to see people who are not scared to ask the right questions that people are thinking instead of the toe the line questions that go on at the moment and maybe letting somebody like a Matt Chapman loose on Channel 4 might make people watch a bit more who is not scared to ask the questions that the present presenters will not ask or have been told not to ask.

Spudmurphy, half the problem is that the real agenda of the broadcast is to generate bookmaker advertising and entrench industry protectionism. They aren't trying to entertain us, they are trying to sell those things to us.

Given that much of any given broadcast is spent perpetuating bookmaking industry lies, and the show is largely fronted by the sons and daughters of industry figures (led by the niece of a Lord and the son of a Jockey Club Member), they are doing a pretty good job, imo...

Silly to say young people are not interested in racing. Student days in Ireland, sold out signs up at Goodwood despite ludicrous admission, seem to show that with proper marketing the young do have an interest. It's been stated on here before but C4's demise is abetted by a BBC style disdain for discussing betting, richly ironic with their reliance on tasteless, appalling advertisements for bookmakers.
Get rid of Balding as the first step. Let her focus on tennis or show-jumping back at the BBC with her racing hating cronies. Next, hire a few younger presenters with a passion for betting to connect with an audience who are watching because they enjoy punting. Steve Palmer could be entertaining.

bring back big mac........get rid of fitzy tanya gleeson and tom lee

call it a day,that is very different from watching on tv.One is a day out,fun,drinks,socialising,sport etc.,the other is plonking yourself in front of the tv in the afternoon when many are out and about,and not interested in getting back to watch,unlike the Grand National,which is still a major event,the Derby,unfortuntely,no longer is.

The BBC audience would have been bigger irrespective of who is presenting the coverage because households
without pay tv automatically switch the telly on to BBC1 and watch whatever is on at the time.

too many options nowadays for people for the derby to get top billing on the box on a saturday.

moving it from wednesday was a colossal error imo.

palmer knows even less about racing than he does about golf..

Ask someone to name a present day  jockey or horse, that'll give you a good idea how much interest the general public have in Horse racing.

tac........dettori probably only one

crowds well up on courses,ponte well attended, as is york beverly ,market rasen ripon donny.

BRING BACK BIG MAC

i'm firmly with millhouse on the relentlessly patronizing Ms Balding, I'd also add hugely egotistical,

i would have thought that anyone with a passing knowledge of whichever sport she happens to be fronting, would be affronted by her

sooner have big mac over these bufoons
cattermole,boyce,fitzy,cunningham,any day

Take the derby back to a Wednesday when it will be the top sport featured for the day - people might then make an effort to watch it even if it is a work day - if it has a higher prominence then peoples perceptions may suggest they have a bet and therefore an interest in the race

all through the 80s and 90s we had a sweep on the derby at work.

cant remember when we stopped, but it was a long time ago, most were interested when it was on a Wednesday.

sorry to throw a spanner in the works but on the 75% of ch 4 racedays in which balding deems are beneath her do the viewing figures shoot up.

You would think the figures would be up with all those new Indian and lesbian viewers

nice

"Horse racing is a minority sport.  It's getting less and less evry year as the younger generation have NO interest"

Agree 100% Kriskin !

saw big mac at wimbledon on 1/4 finals night, he looked a very sad person.

Jun 9, 2014 -- 5:47PM, Thin and Crispy wrote:

Ask someone to name a present day

Every year there is a new excuse for the lower viewing figures...

An England football match was one but to spin that the figures were down because of a Formula One practice is an all time low..

Basically no-one watches racing anymore because the younger generation realise that the whole sport is rancid...

Who wants to watch Channel 4 and listen to liars in the advertising breaks that seem to occur every ten minutes and even during the programme the alleged guests spout rubbish..

Who wants to bet on a sport that has more non-runners than an escape at a German POW Camp in WW2...

That would be an escape at an English POW Camp for German soldiers obviously as none made it home...

hardy kruger.........the one that got away???

Never got home...

German propaganda...

1. McCririck is correct; his motivation is questionable at the very least.
2. Balding is a liability with her self serving and patronising approach/demeanour
3. The "suits"(as McCririck would call them) will never admit error or failure. They are so conditioned to spinning everything they have lost touch with reality/the truth
4.Horse racing is betting driven; until this is acknowledged the C4 coverage will never improve
5. The bookmaker lies and propaganda have to go if the "show" is to have any credibility.


As an idea how about an item explaining how betting/probability/odds percentages work?

Elvis is dead.

It would appear that only the Tv Chiefs fail to recognise that Balding is the Kiss of Death for any show barring "My Gay Wedding"etc.

1 Poor presentation of the sport on c4. It is just not entertaining.
2 Flat racing is boring to most people and the Derby is becoming dominated by one trainer.
3 Too many other options either to do or to bet on. People want to watch TV when they want. Content on a 2 hour c4 racing day is probably 70 min.

If C4 want to improve their ratings then racing has to be sandwiched in between a sports magazine programme.

You mean like the late and great Grandstand ?

Pressure from high places took our wednesday, too many working hours lost was their argument.

This gay world is becoming very sad and for the vast majority its always been a turn off and long may that continue.

MJK - ouch, sharpen those claws! (but very funny all the same)

and MJK wonderfully non-PC.

btw, i am firmly in the return the Derby to a Wednesday camp, making it splendidly idiosyncratic in that British way. And thus special. Going to a Saturday has just dumbed it down, made it somewhat mundane. Just another big race on a Saturday.

I don't watch anything with Balding in it

Drop her(preferably from a great height)

very pleased so many others also can't stand Ms Balding's patronizing demeanour as i was concerned it was just my own prejudice given that she is so popular with the powers that be in TV land.

I think most people got bored with only one race every 40 minutes and switched off.

I am sure that if still on BBC that viewing figures would have dropped.The Derby is,unfortunately,no longer a major sporting event in the eyes of the general public.
Yes,the demise of viewers has been accelerated by switching to Ch 4,but probably not to the extent the journos are making out.
The vast majority of the population of this country have access to a multi-channel tele,so why should it make a big difference what channel the Derby is televised on.Personally I don't take to some of the presenters,yet it wouldn't stop me watching,as with ATR and the extremely poor S Boyce.
   People didn't watch,plain and simple,as the interest wasn't there.For the non-racing public,what is there to get enthusiastic about with a 1 1/2 miles Group1 at Epsom,compared with the thrills and spills of the Grand National.
  If,for whatever reason,I had to miss watching the Derby,so what.I would be more upset about missing the KG or Arc.
   Ask yourself how much the general public care about the Derby,especially since its move from a Wednesday.Yes,I still remember the sweep in the factory where I was working,and the enthusiasm for thev workers to buy a ticket,and listen to the live radio coverage.

CLAIRE BALDING IS A FANTASTIC PRESENTER,HER IN DEPTH KNOWLEDGE OF THE SPORT IS SECOND TO NONE AND WITHOUT DOUBT HAS THE UTMOST RESPECT OF HER PEERS,NOW PLEASE STOP THIS GAY BASHING NONSENSE BECAUSE QUITE FRANKLY FOR THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE ITS TOTALLY IRRELEVANT!

If you enjoy racing, and like having a bet, you will watch any racing that is on TV if you do not have access to another channel that shows racing live. The Derby is a special race, and a few extra people will watch it for that reason, but the adverts on C4 are a pain in the backside, especially when they are about to go in the stalls.

You're a gas, Factmachine, you almost had me going there.

crowds are ony up cos of concerts after racing, how many of these actually bet?

factmachine - it has nothing to do with her sexuality at all. it is to do with her patronizing, superior, domineering, egotistical attitude.

Happy Valley, add to that social class obsessed - you feel whenever she speaks that she's absolutely determined that everyone should know their place, imo...

Perhaps they should  take into account how many racegoers were at the other meetings last Saturday. I have never understood why on the few big race days we are still saturated with other modest fare.

The Derby like the FA Cup is simply just part of a wider televised sports selection.

millhouse - i agree with that, too, i just didn't want to play the "class" card, having grown up in a council flat, because others then think you have a chip on your shoulder and it can detract from the debate, but yes i very much get a sense of this too

put it like this, i can't imagine her voting Labour any time soon

In my opinion a big part of the turn off are the personalities involved, all of whom have shown themselves to have their noses firmly in the trough, and so it's impossible to like or respect them, or indeed trust them to tell the truth about anything.

It's like having to spend the afternoon with a bunch of people you can't stand, imo...

I take your point, Happy Valley, though anyone that starts a public address with 'My Lords, ladies and gentleman' most definitely wants us all to remember where we've come from, imo...

IM SURE CLAIRE WOULD BE THE FIRST TO ADMIT THAT SHE ISNT REMOTELY INTERESTED WITH THE BETTING SIDE OF HORSE RACING,HER JOB IS TO SET THE SCENE,INFORM PEOPLE ABOUT THE HORSES/TRAINERS/ECT,AND GET THE INTERVIEWS THAT COUNT,ALL OF WHICH SHE IS PEERLESS.HER ENTHUSIASM FOR SPORT FULL STOP IS A BREATH OF FRESH AIR,WHETHER OR NOT SHE WEARS CORE BLIMEY TROUSERS AND SHE LIVES IN A COUNCIL FLAT/OR BROUGHT UP WITH A SILVER SPOON,AGAIN IS TOTALLY IRRELEVANT,I HAVE NEVER MET THE LADY BUT I GUARANTEE YOU COULD HAVE A CHAT AND A LAUGH WITH HER.THE PROBLEM WITH CHANNEL 4 IS AS POSTED EARLIER THE BLUFFERS IN THE BETTING INDUSTRY NEED TAKING TO TASK AND CHALLENGING ON THE LAUGHABLE OUTRAGEOUS CLAIMS MADE ON THE LIKES OF THE MORNING LINE,WHICH ONCE AGAIN HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MISS BALDING!

I ask myself what is right with Channel 4 racings coverage? And I can't find a single thing. The show is so polished and slick but its very cold and formulaic. From the choice of music down to the ridiculous number of slow-motion camera shots to the charisma & charm free presenters like Claire and Nick to the completely boring and pointless Tanya and Rishi. I've simply stopped watching, which is a shame because I enjoyed the old style Channel 4 racing. The ratings for the Derby were dropping though the floor over on the BBC. So, when Channel 4 racing got the rights there was a brief upturn in ratings. So, what do Channel 4 do? They get rid of the production company that have done so well with its coverage over the years and brings in the same one that was failing over on the BBC! Of course, they were going to bring the likes of Claire with them when they came.

Sure, the previous format wasn't perfect and the presenters were getting a little lazy, but the actual production values of the show were far more enjoyable than what we have to endure now. As for McCririck, before Tanya became his side-kick I found him quite amusing and although I didn't agree with everything he said, he did at least spark debate about issues concerning the game. What does Tanya do? Simply pointless having her on the show. They should have just left JM on his own without Tanya picking up on his mistakes all the time.

All in all, you have to say the powers that be that ditched the old style format for this slick, boring, sanitized one we have now, have made a massive mistake and I can only see ratings continuing to fall if they persevere with this style of show and with the presenters they currently have now.

"McCririck trying to put the boot in,won't let it go."  

Agree, can't seem to accept that he isn't part of the show anymore, he should just let it go, looks a sad figure at the races these days. C4 threw him a lifeline years ago, had his time..... be grateful and move on...semi-retire or whatever...take the wife out !

Back to Balding
She only comes in for the high profile meetings....what do you think that does to the rest of the team
and says for them?????????????????????????

Since her 'odd couple' days on the BBC with Willie Carson, she has reinvented herself, on the back of the Olympics.
She is now a 'media person' who champions woman's right and gay rights

Can one be all thing to all people???????

Some of us are conservative with a small 'c', we are not interested in the world of sexual politics,
we watch racing to get away from this

The way people speak you would think the program used to be men only, that was not so, women have always been an important and integral
part of this program

What we have not had before is some rabid gay feminist...who claims men's football is violent and racist and everybody
should women's football

So the question has to be, is she attracting new viewers are driving existing viewers away????

I think she and Ch4 should part company, amicably
Let the rest of the team develop their own style

just my own opinion

"She only comes in for the high profile meetings"

That was never a good idea to have a presenter step in just for the big meetings.  I appreciate the racing coverage we get on C4 but what is really lacking is a strong personality on the team, main presenter really.

Yes I think the celebrity presenter idea is poor, it is not giving any chance of the idea of a team building up

and as Balding has made her own choice, where she wants to go in Media, then I see no need to have her as the main presenter anymore.
Have her on as a guest now and again of course, just not as main presenter.

I WOULD LIKE BRUCE FORSYTH TO PRESENT IT

This is getting like one of those multiple choice questions.

Is it all Clare Balding's fault because:

a) people are scared of catching lesbianism through their tv sets
b) she's a mad feminist who only tips in mares' races
c) she is too posh to mix with aristocrats, billionaires and even heads of state who own racehorses
d) (this seems to be a new one) she doesn't turn up every week so there is no team spirit?

or e) all of the above

i don't know whether it is her fault, i just can't abide her patronizing, controlling manner whatever programme she is on or presenting

In Saturday's Derby coverage she left some poor bloke mid interview because she saw someone she thought was more important to talk to...

My own view would be that no one wants to watch a channel where they deliberately use 'arty farty' cameras that only show half the field at any one time.

There were occasions at the Cheltenham festival where you could only see 3 horses jumping a fence out of a field of 24.

What's the point of coverage if you can't see the horses jumping the obstacles?

I said in was my own opinion Ramruma

I will never watch when she is on

Do wah Diddy  • June 10, 2014 3:55 PM BST
I WOULD LIKE BRUCE FORSYTH TO PRESENT IT

Whether I watch it or not is irrelevant
Who I vote for in an election is irrelevant
I am only one person

But when lots of people do something, then that is relevant

CH 4 Racing figures are down
If RUK and ATR are also down the same %, then people are not tuning into Horse Racing anymore
But if only CH 4 figures are down, I would say they have a problem

Like everybody else on this thread I have expressed my dissatisfaction and reason
Whether CH 4 take any notice of all these whinges, or any, well that is up to them?????????????
Personally I doubt it

The horses are still there, that has not changed, we can always mute
But I much preferred the old format, Big Mac and all

transfer her permanently to India
see how long she would last out there with her strident,outspoken 'views'

Channel 4 do fantastic job on racing including the superb Claire Balding.
One of the biggest problems is the attitude to racing from the hierarchy at the BBC.
On Saturday morning on the breakfast show the sports news was presented every hour by Mike Bushell. Not once was the Derby mentioned. Every other sport anyone could think of was given air time including a feature on beach footy from Dorset.
For Christs  Sake we are talking about one of the great sporting events in the world and the BBC don't even deem it to mention that it is happening on our doorstep in Epsom.
It's got sod all to do with the presenters it's the liberal left elite who are mainly employed by the BBC who have got an agenda that perceives horse racing as cruel. This in my opinion will continue and given 10 years even the grand National could be in danger.

I watched nearly every Morning Line and every live CH4 Racing - but it is now very boring and like others I am not turning it on anymore. Its too fast, technical and there is too much assumed knowledge. The presenters are ok but lack charisma.

To bore again Channel 4 could not present a programme without a resident lesbian, homosexual, angry Northerner and someone from an ethnic minority(?)..

Trouble is that punters want to watch a horse race and also not be told lies every ten minutes in alleged add breaks that feature people that are on the show spouting the self same bulls hit..

I would rather the BBC showed Royal Ascot and Epsom and the alleged racing channels hosted the liars so that maybe a new generation of horse racing fans could be cultivated..

Lets face it no young punter with a brain watches those bookmaker sponsored clowns on Channel 4....

"The superb Claire Balding"????
If there has ever been a more patronising individual I have been blessed not to see them.
Whether she is a Beaverite is irrelevant.

Almost all of them are in the ar$elickers club.

I have now cancelled RUK and no longer bother to watch any of it.

Mick Fitz was the final straw.

seaview   
10 Jun 14 21:16

Almost all of them are in the ar$elickers club.

Seaview, can you please name a few that aren't because I'm seriously struggling to think of any.

Claire Balding's voice gives my ar-e a headache.

I miss Johnny Francome.

Never heard one person who isn't a racing nut mention the Derby  or Australia at all .....whereas you hear lots of people discussing the Grand National before and after the event.

But why on earth would a 16 runner flat race in the middle of a Saturday in June be on a non racing fans radar ?

Only in a bygone era when it was run midweek and tv sport was very limited in both amounts and sports covered.

Yes all this moving big races to the w/e has messed it up a bit
The flat racing season was well planned moving from one big flat mid week racing meeting to the next

it is just all money now

Horse racing is woefully over exposed now, umpteen races......just to get the addict's in
but seems to have lost interest to anybody else

What makes people first become interested in racing?  Backing a winner.

What type of races now overwhelmingly populate terrestrially televised racing?  Impossible big field handicaps.

Why aren't people interested in watching racing on TV any more?   Maybe backing a winner is just too hard.

While the BHA has a share in the bookmakers' gross profits, the problem will only get worse, imo, because the bookmaking industry don't give a flying **** about the future of racing - they're only real concern is making it as easy as possible for themselves to remove punters' money...

Anybody who can't see that Balding and Cunningham are costing C4 viewers really needs help.
The Derby needs to be run on a Sunday as a stand alone Meeting  with 4hrs coverage on C4 fronted by Hislop, Luck,
Melish,Enzo,and Chapman and racing authorities need to promote it like mad!

factmachine
IM SURE CLAIRE WOULD BE THE FIRST TO ADMIT THAT SHE ISNT REMOTELY INTERESTED WITH THE BETTING SIDE OF HORSE RACING,

But it is not about Clair balding's interests.  The viewers, her audience, are interested in betting.
The viewers are not interested in lovely outfits, hats, nobility.
The viewers want information and opinion on training, breeding, form, jockeys, going.

MILLHOUSE,"MAYBE BACKING A WINNER IS JUST TO HARD"FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV FAV,GET A GRIP SON!

ALTHOUGH I MUST ADMIT I DO KNOW A PUNTER WHO LOSTON DERBY DAY,

I do not think it matters who the presenters are. BBC had the annoying Clare & Willie, Rishi, the fat bookie and the scouser amongst many other annoying presenters and they still got big viewing numbers. BBC will always get more viewers than C4, ad breaks could be one reason. Racing is in general decline. 48 hour decs and non runners, delayed races because of shortage of ambulance cover and lots of other sports available to bet on.

Can anyone with maybe BBC connections give a sane reason why there was no mention of the DERBY on Saturday.
On all of their sport bulletins every sport in creation was mentioned  but no mention of the so called worlds greatest flat race.
Do they hate racing so much or is it just spite because they no longer cover it.

Flat racing will never die because there is too much money invested in it.
The way I see it going in the future is that the TV audience will continue to decline until it gets to the point where C4 stop doing it.

No matter, the 'interested in horse racing' group will continue to have excellent viewing facilities via live streaming or the specialist racing channels. Results and statistics will come more to the fore. Betting shops will stop taking horse racing bets and there will be no on-course bookmakers.

racingstar - very well and succinctly put, imo, bravo

I miss John Rickman and the ITV 7,seriously though most people knew what the ITV 7 was even if they didn't bet, how many people outside of racing know what the Scoop 6 is, even when the Scoop 6 had a large payout available there was hardly any coverage outside of the racing media.
Racing should have one handicap race on a Saturday with guaranteed prize money of say £50,000 to the winner and prize money down to 10th place,they should commit to having 20 runners, so have a minimum of 6 reserves on stand by(pay them say a £1,000 if they don't run) get a link up through the National lottery and sell tickets through their terminals, the customers would have to predict the 1st 6. Any profits would go to good causes. The exposure to racing would be invaluable.
Yes there would be lots of difficulties like what happens if the meeting is abandoned, some courses have maximum fields of only about 14 or so(all weather tracks) and other things but I am sure there are people with the business acumen to over come these things if it was financially viable.
I think the French have something like this called the Tiecre
It would be important though to get the ticket selling outside of bookmakers shop and into newsagents, supermarkets etc, allot of people are not happy going into bookmakers but will quite happily buy a ticket in a newsagents(ie lottery tickets)

tonkability..........you was going great then you completly ruined  it when you  mentioned enzo and chapman