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11 Dec 12
21:48
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05 Jan 10
http://www.britishhorseracing.com
Owner Clive Smith spoke of being "extremely disappointed" in the reaction of trainer Paul Nicholls after Kauto Star's abrupt exit from the champion trainer's Ditcheat yard on Tuesday.
The winner of five King Georges and two Cheltenham Gold Cups for the owner and trainer, he had been officially retired in late October but was expected to remain at Manor Farm Stables in Somerset until Boxing Day, but he unexpectedly left Nicholls' care after Smith had announced on Monday that the 12-year-old would be moving away to be prepared by European bronze medalist eventing rider Laura Collett and long-time Great Britain manager and coach Yogi Breisner for a new career in the world of dressage.
"When Paul rang me I was on the runway heading to New York and he dropped the bombshell," Smith told Press Association Sport.
"The idea originally came about after talking to Di Arbuthnot of Retraining of Racehorses and she put me in touch with Yogi Breisner. Two weeks ago I had a coffee and a chat with Yogi and he suggested dressage and I was very impressed with the idea. Not that either of us thought he'd shown any previous inclination, it was just something new. Yogi suggested Laura Collett who is a European champion and a very good rider.
"Paul Nicholls has made out he didn't know anything about it, but I've kept him informed since May. We talked about eventing and he knew eventually he would be doing something away from the yard.
"I agreed to put him back into training but we made the decision on October 31 to retire him. We agreed he could stay at the yard until Boxing Day, but at Sandown on Saturday, I told him the dressage thing was coming about. I'm extremely disappointed in Paul Nicholls.
"We agreed about him leaving the yard and he even said Laura Collett could come and take away the horse. When I told him all this, he told me what a good job Neptune Collonges (Nicholls' 2012 Grand National winner) had done in dressage
Owner Clive Smith spoke of being "extremely disappointed" in the reaction of trainer Paul Nicholls after Kauto Star's abrupt exit from the champion trainer's Ditcheat yard on Tuesday.
The winner of five King Georges and two Cheltenham Gold Cups for the owner and trainer, he had been officially retired in late October but was expected to remain at Manor Farm Stables in Somerset until Boxing Day, but he unexpectedly left Nicholls' care after Smith had announced on Monday that the 12-year-old would be moving away to be prepared by European bronze medalist eventing rider Laura Collett and long-time Great Britain manager and coach Yogi Breisner for a new career in the world of dressage.
"When Paul rang me I was on the runway heading to New York and he dropped the bombshell," Smith told Press Association Sport.
"The idea originally came about after talking to Di Arbuthnot of Retraining of Racehorses and she put me in touch with Yogi Breisner. Two weeks ago I had a coffee and a chat with Yogi and he suggested dressage and I was very impressed with the idea. Not that either of us thought he'd shown any previous inclination, it was just something new. Yogi suggested Laura Collett who is a European champion and a very good rider.
"Paul Nicholls has made out he didn't know anything about it, but I've kept him informed since May. We talked about eventing and he knew eventually he would be doing something away from the yard.
"I agreed to put him back into training but we made the decision on October 31 to retire him. We agreed he could stay at the yard until Boxing Day, but at Sandown on Saturday, I told him the dressage thing was coming about. I'm extremely disappointed in Paul Nicholls.
"We agreed about him leaving the yard and he even said Laura Collett could come and take away the horse. When I told him all this, he told me what a good job Neptune Collonges (Nicholls' 2012 Grand National winner) had done in dressage
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I'd be surprised if Ruby is bothered in the slightest about it.
GandalfTheGrey
The horse should have been left with Nicholls, in familiar surroundings, with Clifford who loved him above and beyond, with other horses he knew, where he would have been kept fit and healthy. Nicholls was right in this case, it should always be about the horse.
Complete @rse-gravy. As much as PFN thinks he and Ditcheat have a voice on KS's future it is for CS to decide. The history between the pair has caused this ruckus as much as anything.
The horse should have been left with Nicholls, in familiar surroundings, with Clifford who loved him above and beyond, with other horses he knew, where he would have been kept fit and healthy. Nicholls was right in this case, it should always be about the horse.
Complete @rse-gravy. As much as PFN thinks he and Ditcheat have a voice on KS's future it is for CS to decide. The history between the pair has caused this ruckus as much as anything.
Why all this unfair criticism of Paul Nicholls on this matter? Kauto wouldn't have won half the races he did without PN and the rest of the team in his corner. All these great days at the racetrack that PN has helped orchestrate with Kauto seem to be all forgotten about by Clive now. What a throughly ungrateful man he is. Would it really have been so terrible to leave the horse with PN and his team? I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have been allowed to get fat in his box and would be out doing something active & fulfilling at the yard. All this talk about "class dressage" riders, cracks me up! I didn't know there was so many harden fans of dressage on here.
Don't see that Clive Smith has done anything wrong or why Nicholls has seen fit to orchestrate such a fuss. From a distance it looks like a pathetic tantrum.
Don't remember any similar fallout with said owner while his horses were in a large part helping to put Nicholls on the map as a trainer.
Don't remember any similar fallout with said owner while his horses were in a large part helping to put Nicholls on the map as a trainer.
Paul Nicholls trained the horse while he was racing and i bet he got paid very well for training the horses (and his other horses). It was his job to train the horse to the best of his ability (which he did) as he was being paid too.
The horse is no longer a racehorse, they between them decided it would be best to retire him from racing. It is therefore the owners choice what to do next and he has no obligation to just do what Nicholls feels is best (in his best interest more like!!), the owner has decided for the horse to be retrained at another discipline which will keep him active and busy. I don't recall Nicholls throwing a hissy fit when Denman was taken to do other things or Neptune Collognes.
The horse is no longer a racehorse, they between them decided it would be best to retire him from racing. It is therefore the owners choice what to do next and he has no obligation to just do what Nicholls feels is best (in his best interest more like!!), the owner has decided for the horse to be retrained at another discipline which will keep him active and busy. I don't recall Nicholls throwing a hissy fit when Denman was taken to do other things or Neptune Collognes.
Clive knows how much PN & the team love this horse and out of respect for this and the horse, he should have been allowed to stay in the yard. He'd have been in familiar surroundings and with people who love and know him the best. What a small and petty man this Clive Smith guy is.
Most dressage horses look thoroughly depressed imo.
They are both wrong to create such a furore over such a great horse. However, in my opinion I think that Mr Smith should have given the horse to Paul Nicholls for all the effort he and his team had put into getting him to the lofty heights he achieved. The horse would have had a life of luxury and care, way beyond what most horses get on their retirement and I expect the team would have kept him enjoying life with maybe hacking him out and the occasional appearances at major events. What a fitting retirement for such a great Horse. However, he has gone to be tried for dressage? The horse is twelve and probably getting a little stiff so why dressage.? Surely this dicipline is usually taught at a very young age. Also some of the movements are not particularly natural for horses to perform and talk about trying to teach an old dog new tricks, it could become stressful for the old boy that is my worry.
I wonder if Paul would be equally keen to keep his 90 rated Sky Watch cluttering up his stables after it has retired
I wonder if Paul would be equally keen to keep his 90 rated Sky Watch cluttering up his stables after it has retired
good post
good post
dressage can look cruel and not natural for a horse to do a bit like ballet dancing
Shameful on both parties, both may regret this spat. All the best Kauto.
I wonder if Paul would be equally keen to keep his 90 rated Sky Watch cluttering up his stables after it has retired
good post
Why is it? I'm sure if the horse stays in the yard for 9 years and wins a host of big races? Then the emotionally attachment that they had with Katuo, will come with that or any other horse currently in the yard.
good post
Why is it? I'm sure if the horse stays in the yard for 9 years and wins a host of big races? Then the emotionally attachment that they had with Katuo, will come with that or any other horse currently in the yard.
The horse is twelve and probably getting a little stiff so why dressage.?
An analogy might be asking a human to take up yoga at the age of 40-45. Would anyone say that is an unwise thing to do?
Kauto is not being trained for the Olympics (other than in the minds of Corals or Hills). Most likely, providing he enjoys it, will be trained for low level competition and see how he goes.
He will live in 5 star accomnodation, very well fed (with less of the "hot" food that racehorses are used to), be exercised and trained most days, massaged and have every need catered for. A lot of misinformation being spread on here that Kauto is going to a worse home or life than he could by staying at Ditcheat
An analogy might be asking a human to take up yoga at the age of 40-45. Would anyone say that is an unwise thing to do?
Kauto is not being trained for the Olympics (other than in the minds of Corals or Hills). Most likely, providing he enjoys it, will be trained for low level competition and see how he goes.
He will live in 5 star accomnodation, very well fed (with less of the "hot" food that racehorses are used to), be exercised and trained most days, massaged and have every need catered for. A lot of misinformation being spread on here that Kauto is going to a worse home or life than he could by staying at Ditcheat
Kauto will take to dressage and no doubt be great at it. He's a class act and could turn his hoof to anything. But, that doesn't make it right that a horse of his calibre should be asked to embark on this new career so late in the day. FFS, he's a racehorse and should be kept in horse racing surroundings.
So Nicholls only cares about horses that win loads of big races for him and brings in more business, thanks for clearing that up Whippin Piccadily.
If he wants to choose the horses in his stables future when they are finished with racing well then my advice would be to buy the horses or buy and only train his own horses, that way he can then keep which horses he wishes.
If he wants to choose the horses in his stables future when they are finished with racing well then my advice would be to buy the horses or buy and only train his own horses, that way he can then keep which horses he wishes.
that doesn't make it right that a horse of his calibre should be asked to embark on this new career so late in the day
it's not late in the day, picadilly. Though at OAP stage for a racehorse, Kauto is probably no worse than middle aged for a dressage or eventing type.
All that's important is that the horse is happy.... and there is little doubt that Clive Smith has only concerned himself with that issue. Whereas Nicholls probably has more sentimental and arguably selfish reasons for keeping him at Ditcheat?
it's not late in the day, picadilly. Though at OAP stage for a racehorse, Kauto is probably no worse than middle aged for a dressage or eventing type.
All that's important is that the horse is happy.... and there is little doubt that Clive Smith has only concerned himself with that issue. Whereas Nicholls probably has more sentimental and arguably selfish reasons for keeping him at Ditcheat?
When you've got hundreds of horses in your care its not easy to build up an emotional attachment to every single one! We all have our fav. horses, don't we? And why do we have them? Because they win big races and we win money on them. Our fav. horses tend not to be those that have pulled up 3 times at Towcester or one that's scrapped home in a selling hurdle.
he's a racehorse and should be kept in horse racing surroundings
would that be the same for every racehorse
or does the welfare of a horse only matter if it wins alot of classy races and alot of prize money ?
would that be the same for every racehorse
or does the welfare of a horse only matter if it wins alot of classy races and alot of prize money ?
A Cynic might say that the demand for "tours" would be a lot greater if KS remained at Ditcheat!!
Anyway, a most undignified show for a stars end of his career, surprised at both parties for making it so public, in the eyes of a lot of the racing world both have seemed to do themselves no favours at all by appearing in this light.
Anyway, a most undignified show for a stars end of his career, surprised at both parties for making it so public, in the eyes of a lot of the racing world both have seemed to do themselves no favours at all by appearing in this light.
if PN is so concerned , why doesn't he buy kauto star
The Kauto Star tug-of-love story is breaking racing fans' hearts
Celebrity horse cannot tell us if he is enjoying his new life in Strictly Come Dressage
Greg Wood
Wednesday 12 December 2012 guardian.co.uk
The news of Kauto Star's abrupt departure from the Paul Nicholls stable for a new career in dressage with Laura Collett was the perfect raw material for a Twitterstorm. It broke at a time when people were logging on in their lunch break, it had a 12-year-old celebrity caught up in a tug-of-love drama, and best of all, it was purely and simply a matter of opinion.
We can't ask Kauto Star where he wants to spend his retirement from racing, which could well be longer than his actual racing career, and so 140-character judgments could be swiftly formed and then imposed on the unwitting ex-racehorse on his behalf. His move into dressage, and away from the Nicholls stable, is either a Good Thing or a Bad Thing, according to your point of view, but unless Kauto Star himself decides to bust out of the Collett operation and head for "home", there is unlikely to be any objective way to tell whether he is enjoying the change of scenery and discipline, or missing his old box back in Somerset.
Kauto Star's main priorities in life are food, shelter and warmth, and Collett's highly professional operation, which is advised by the noted horse guru Yogi Breisner, is more than able to provide all three. Once his basic welfare is assured, Kauto Star also needs to have his brain exercised, and learning a new discipline will take care of that.
Kauto Star does not understand that the business, and personal, relationship between Nicholls and Clive Smith, the gelding's owner, have broken down. He does not understand that horse racing is a hugely popular spectator sport that is enjoyed by millions of people and keeps tens of thousands in employment. He does not understand that he won two Gold Cups and five King Georges. He does not understand that he is a horse.
This is essentially a human dispute, played out through the medium of a 12-year-old ex-steeplechaser. It also says something about the nature of the relationship between a racehorse owner and its trainer, which can appear to be the happiest of marriages when the horse in question is winning, but is often less harmonious behind closed doors.
It is trainers and their staff who do the hard work of turning a raw young horse into an outstanding champion like Kauto Star. The owner "just" pays the bills. But without that huge, ongoing financial commitment – Kauto Star cost more than £300,000, and Nicholls's weekly fee can't be much below £400 – the horse would not be there at all.
Both sides of the equation are essential, but that does not mean that it is a relationship of equals. Smith is Kauto Star's owner, pure and simple. As long as his horse's basic welfare is assured, he can stable him where he pleases, and Collett's yard in Wiltshire is much closer to his Surrey home than the Nicholls stable in Ditcheat.
The problem is that while the financial input is entirely Smith's, the emotional investment by Nicholls and his many staff, all of whom hoped to see Kauto Star spend his retirement in the yard, is immense. Smith will have been well aware of this, but presumably weighed the inevitable distress at Ditcheat against his own pleasure in having his horse just down the road, and came down in favour of himself. People are often like that. And if there was also an element of rubbing Nicholls's nose in it a little, and reminding him who is the boss, well, people are often like that, too.
Perhaps a lesson that we could all take from this is that if a horse moving from one stable to another can be a cause of such anger, we may be guilty of investing too much emotion ourselves. Kauto Star has, at least, come through his racing career unscathed, and has not been asked to continue in a risky business once his chance of winning at the highest level was gone. His sprawling fall four out in the 2010 Gold Cup with his head bent under his body could easily have broken his neck. How much worse would that have been than a career-change into dressage?
Perhaps the strangest reaction to the news, in fact, was the apparent belief among some racing fans that performing to music is somehow an ignominious way for a tough steeplechaser to end his career. One picture that did the rounds on Twitter was a horse in a tutu. It seems that for some, it is a little like Tony McCoy signing up for Dancing On Ice.
As it happens, McCoy's strength and balance might well make him a serious competitor on the ice rink, although the outfits and sequins might take some getting used to. But leaving that aside, what could possibly be demeaning about a horse doing something horsey? Dancing may not come entirely naturally, but then, neither does jumping steeplechase fences. If it did, they would not need to be schooled.
It could be much worse. Consider Corrida, who won the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe in 1936 and 1937. In June 1944, she was spending a happy retirement at the Haras de Fresnay-le-Buffard stud, not far from a beach in Normandy. She disappeared from her paddock shortly after D-Day. It is believed that she was eaten by retreating German soldiers
Celebrity horse cannot tell us if he is enjoying his new life in Strictly Come Dressage
Greg Wood
Wednesday 12 December 2012 guardian.co.uk
The news of Kauto Star's abrupt departure from the Paul Nicholls stable for a new career in dressage with Laura Collett was the perfect raw material for a Twitterstorm. It broke at a time when people were logging on in their lunch break, it had a 12-year-old celebrity caught up in a tug-of-love drama, and best of all, it was purely and simply a matter of opinion.
We can't ask Kauto Star where he wants to spend his retirement from racing, which could well be longer than his actual racing career, and so 140-character judgments could be swiftly formed and then imposed on the unwitting ex-racehorse on his behalf. His move into dressage, and away from the Nicholls stable, is either a Good Thing or a Bad Thing, according to your point of view, but unless Kauto Star himself decides to bust out of the Collett operation and head for "home", there is unlikely to be any objective way to tell whether he is enjoying the change of scenery and discipline, or missing his old box back in Somerset.
Kauto Star's main priorities in life are food, shelter and warmth, and Collett's highly professional operation, which is advised by the noted horse guru Yogi Breisner, is more than able to provide all three. Once his basic welfare is assured, Kauto Star also needs to have his brain exercised, and learning a new discipline will take care of that.
Kauto Star does not understand that the business, and personal, relationship between Nicholls and Clive Smith, the gelding's owner, have broken down. He does not understand that horse racing is a hugely popular spectator sport that is enjoyed by millions of people and keeps tens of thousands in employment. He does not understand that he won two Gold Cups and five King Georges. He does not understand that he is a horse.
This is essentially a human dispute, played out through the medium of a 12-year-old ex-steeplechaser. It also says something about the nature of the relationship between a racehorse owner and its trainer, which can appear to be the happiest of marriages when the horse in question is winning, but is often less harmonious behind closed doors.
It is trainers and their staff who do the hard work of turning a raw young horse into an outstanding champion like Kauto Star. The owner "just" pays the bills. But without that huge, ongoing financial commitment – Kauto Star cost more than £300,000, and Nicholls's weekly fee can't be much below £400 – the horse would not be there at all.
Both sides of the equation are essential, but that does not mean that it is a relationship of equals. Smith is Kauto Star's owner, pure and simple. As long as his horse's basic welfare is assured, he can stable him where he pleases, and Collett's yard in Wiltshire is much closer to his Surrey home than the Nicholls stable in Ditcheat.
The problem is that while the financial input is entirely Smith's, the emotional investment by Nicholls and his many staff, all of whom hoped to see Kauto Star spend his retirement in the yard, is immense. Smith will have been well aware of this, but presumably weighed the inevitable distress at Ditcheat against his own pleasure in having his horse just down the road, and came down in favour of himself. People are often like that. And if there was also an element of rubbing Nicholls's nose in it a little, and reminding him who is the boss, well, people are often like that, too.
Perhaps a lesson that we could all take from this is that if a horse moving from one stable to another can be a cause of such anger, we may be guilty of investing too much emotion ourselves. Kauto Star has, at least, come through his racing career unscathed, and has not been asked to continue in a risky business once his chance of winning at the highest level was gone. His sprawling fall four out in the 2010 Gold Cup with his head bent under his body could easily have broken his neck. How much worse would that have been than a career-change into dressage?
Perhaps the strangest reaction to the news, in fact, was the apparent belief among some racing fans that performing to music is somehow an ignominious way for a tough steeplechaser to end his career. One picture that did the rounds on Twitter was a horse in a tutu. It seems that for some, it is a little like Tony McCoy signing up for Dancing On Ice.
As it happens, McCoy's strength and balance might well make him a serious competitor on the ice rink, although the outfits and sequins might take some getting used to. But leaving that aside, what could possibly be demeaning about a horse doing something horsey? Dancing may not come entirely naturally, but then, neither does jumping steeplechase fences. If it did, they would not need to be schooled.
It could be much worse. Consider Corrida, who won the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe in 1936 and 1937. In June 1944, she was spending a happy retirement at the Haras de Fresnay-le-Buffard stud, not far from a beach in Normandy. She disappeared from her paddock shortly after D-Day. It is believed that she was eaten by retreating German soldiers
the whole saga is unedifying.
taking a sideways look, perhaps someone in the media might look into what has happened to the other 2 relatively high profile smith/nicholls horses.
royal auclair disappered in 2009, i dont recall a hullaballo over his retirement, and as far as i know he is not in ditchet, can i hazard a guess he was flogged to a "good home", and now (hopefully is enjoying a retirement) at the expense of the "new homes" owner rather than at the expense of mr smith.
likewise, not a dicky bird about masterminded, a multiple grade 1 winner, where has he been put out to pasture? thats, if he is still above ground.
a little investigation would be revealing.
taking a sideways look, perhaps someone in the media might look into what has happened to the other 2 relatively high profile smith/nicholls horses.
royal auclair disappered in 2009, i dont recall a hullaballo over his retirement, and as far as i know he is not in ditchet, can i hazard a guess he was flogged to a "good home", and now (hopefully is enjoying a retirement) at the expense of the "new homes" owner rather than at the expense of mr smith.
likewise, not a dicky bird about masterminded, a multiple grade 1 winner, where has he been put out to pasture? thats, if he is still above ground.
a little investigation would be revealing.
Harold, you're getting political now. Of course, I'd like to see horses of all abilities given a second chance after a racing. I also feel the racing industry as a whole could do a lot more to help with the welfare of retire racehorses. My point is that Kauto (a very unique & special horse) had a perfectly good home, a home that's been his for 9 years and was amongst people who loved and knew him the best. So, why take him away from this? There are so many other Ex-racehorse with an uncertain future who could do with this second chance.
Harold, you're getting political now. Of course, I'd like to see horses of all abilities given a second chance after a racing. I also feel the racing industry as a whole could do a lot more to help with the welfare of retire racehorses. My point is that Kauto (a very unique & special horse) had a perfectly good home, a home that's been his for 9 years and was amongst people who loved and knew him the best. So, why take him away from this? There are so many other Ex-racehorse with an uncertain future who could do with this second chance.
Like I say, small & petty are the words that spring to mind about Cive "ungrateful" Smith
Perobob. Where did you learn how to feed horses at greasy joes cafe. They dont get hot food these days that went out with the arc.They have balanced diets that are cold feed. Very rarely do you feed hot food unles its hot bran or a linseed feed which is occasionally fed not daily. Also hes not being taught yoga. Strangely enough hes a horse not a human being. As horses get older and Im on about ten years of age plus, inevitably like us with age they start to get stiff and rheumaticy. The horse may get stressed having to learn new tricks that he is not used to and this stuff is boringly repetitive. Also I expect the horse is not a quiet ride and no doubt he will be fidgety and hopefully wont take to it.
Clive knows how much PN & the team love this horse and out of respect for this and the horse, he should have been allowed to stay in the yard. He'd have been in familiar surroundings and with people who love and know him the best. What a small and petty man this Clive Smith guy is.
Why has Nicholls not kicked up the same fuss about Denman or Neptune Collonges iyo?
If it's that important to him, why doesn't he make an offer to buy the horse off Smith. He can't be short of a few bob.
Why has Nicholls not kicked up the same fuss about Denman or Neptune Collonges iyo?
If it's that important to him, why doesn't he make an offer to buy the horse off Smith. He can't be short of a few bob.
by "hot", was referring to presumably higher protein diets designed to get racehorses "revved up" as opposed to more stable foods
Gonzo can you imagine the uproar if he sold the horse no matter to whom?????
He should have gifted the horse to the yard who made him what he became.
He should have gifted the horse to the yard who made him what he became.
Pedro in which case accept my apologies. Yes they do get high proitein food that revs them up its true
Gonzo can you imagine the uproar if he sold the horse no matter to whom?????
Uproar from who?
The people who strongly think Smith is out of order in all this would be happy.
The people who strongly think Smith has the right to decide what to do with the horse would be happy.
99% of the world will care as little as they do now.
Uproar from who?
The people who strongly think Smith is out of order in all this would be happy.
The people who strongly think Smith has the right to decide what to do with the horse would be happy.
99% of the world will care as little as they do now.
The stable benefited enormously from Smith sending the horse to them. He could have sent it to Henderson and Kauto would have probably done just as well. It seems it is one rule for every other horse and one for Nicholls who is talking through his pocket.
I think most people would've liked the horse to 'put his hooves up' as it were for most retirees. The owner sees different and it's his choice. I'm sure he thinks the horse is in no danger. As for Nicholls, his usual self and par for the course. Amazing how all his top horses are the best we've seen etc. He shamefully had this mantle for Master Minded as a 2 miler when anyone with sense knew he was nowhere near as good as Moscow Flyer, and I don't see him waxing lyrical about Sprinter Sacre because it's not his horse. Standing in the parade ring after the Champion Hurdle like a lord and he didn't even train the horse.
It seems that the relationship between the pair broke down well before Kauto's retirement. If Smith does not want to have his horses trained by Nicholls then he is not going to leave his pride and joy at the stable.
Nicholls was the one who blabbed first not Smith
Nicholls was the one who blabbed first not Smith
As Keen leader has stated, it is a sad but true fact that no matter how good a horse, the owner often doesnt have the facilities, money or inclination to look after and pay for their horse after retirement. Smith is at least taking good care of this horse
Well done Clive Smith I say.
Nicholls is just a megalomaniac - for all his success he just has no class whatsoever.
Nicholls is just a megalomaniac - for all his success he just has no class whatsoever.
I'm quite staggered by some of the vitriol directed to both Nicholls and Clive Smith. The real horse racing lovers will hopefully agree with me that Nicholls and Smith have given us one of the greatest racehorses of all time through their skill (Nicholls) and bravery (Smith) by running Kauto in a variety of races and over a variety of trips. To then bring him back last season against a lot of criticism certainly provided me with one of the highlights of my lifetime as a jumps fan when he won at Kempton.
To start referring to Nicholls' weight or Clive Smiths arrogance is really quite sad as is the situation that's prompted this whole debate. Both seem decent people to me who sadly havent handled this situation particularly well. None of us can know the true motivation behind Clive Smith's decision and none of us can know for sure if it will be beneficial to the horse. What is not in doubt is the fact that the horse belongs to Clive Smith and that Paul Nicholls' is not the only equine expert in the country so I do not see anything wrong in the horse trying something else. I have sympathy for Nicholls and his team but also I understand Smiths point of view.
Maybe I am sitting on the fence but I do not understand the need to be so offensive against either man when they have done such a superb job handling Kauto during his racing career. For that I applaud and thank them.
To start referring to Nicholls' weight or Clive Smiths arrogance is really quite sad as is the situation that's prompted this whole debate. Both seem decent people to me who sadly havent handled this situation particularly well. None of us can know the true motivation behind Clive Smith's decision and none of us can know for sure if it will be beneficial to the horse. What is not in doubt is the fact that the horse belongs to Clive Smith and that Paul Nicholls' is not the only equine expert in the country so I do not see anything wrong in the horse trying something else. I have sympathy for Nicholls and his team but also I understand Smiths point of view.
Maybe I am sitting on the fence but I do not understand the need to be so offensive against either man when they have done such a superb job handling Kauto during his racing career. For that I applaud and thank them.
A long career at the Racing Post or as a pundit on one of the racing channels awaits you, Minig11. Fence sitting of the highest order!
Coming up on Skynews shortly Kauto Star starts a new career...Plumber
Electrician no a fecking ballet dancer
Electrician no a fecking ballet dancer
Spoke to a chap today who knows Laura Collett and her Dad well.He assured me Kauto will be well looked after.I aired my views and we left it at that.
KATOU NOW WILL LIVE OUT HIS LIFE IN CRUELTY & TORTURE
Crank nosebands, which operate on a pulley system that can be cranked so tight vets are now publicly protesting. Some have even released images of soft tissue and other damage, consistent with trauma from an animals’ cheeks being clamped against its molar teeth, and a noseband digging into the face.
Equally disturbing is the related practice of rollkur, a “hyperflexion of the horse’s neck” and “flexion of the horse’s neck achieved through aggressive force”.
Riders use crank nosebands and the lever-type bits characteristic of double bridles (mandatory for high level dressage tests) to apply covert force, reining a horses’ head in until the chin is virtually touching its chest - and holding it there.
The prolonged pulling posture riders adopt during the manoeuvre has been dubbed the “water skiing” style of riding. Rollkur is only used during training at home and in warm-up arenas prior to competition in the belief it creates a more flexible horse – a bit like the human equivalent of a vastly exaggerated yoga pose to make any lesser movement seem easy by comparison
Crank nosebands, which operate on a pulley system that can be cranked so tight vets are now publicly protesting. Some have even released images of soft tissue and other damage, consistent with trauma from an animals’ cheeks being clamped against its molar teeth, and a noseband digging into the face.
Equally disturbing is the related practice of rollkur, a “hyperflexion of the horse’s neck” and “flexion of the horse’s neck achieved through aggressive force”.
Riders use crank nosebands and the lever-type bits characteristic of double bridles (mandatory for high level dressage tests) to apply covert force, reining a horses’ head in until the chin is virtually touching its chest - and holding it there.
The prolonged pulling posture riders adopt during the manoeuvre has been dubbed the “water skiing” style of riding. Rollkur is only used during training at home and in warm-up arenas prior to competition in the belief it creates a more flexible horse – a bit like the human equivalent of a vastly exaggerated yoga pose to make any lesser movement seem easy by comparison
said the owner has final say buy kauto retirement in yard was prob best in horses intrest
Oh well if Big Mac said it well then it must be true 
Yes Smith owns the horse but he should realise Nicholls has done a terrific job and left the horse with him.
Of course the horse "belongs" to the owner but,FFS,Mr Smith,surely if any horse deserves to spend the rest of his time in a lovely big field or leading up Paul Nicholls youngsters up the gallops,then it must be Kauto.
The horse is the finest NH chaser i've seen in my lifetime,probably top 2 or 3 of all time,and i think this decision to go into dressage,given the very strenuous training involved.........well it's just wrong on so many levels.
I think Mr Smith is finding it hard to let go of the fame associated with owning a legend but i plead with him to just let the horse go back to ditcheat to see out his days.
Dressage is no way for this superb racehorse to bow out
The horse is the finest NH chaser i've seen in my lifetime,probably top 2 or 3 of all time,and i think this decision to go into dressage,given the very strenuous training involved.........well it's just wrong on so many levels.
I think Mr Smith is finding it hard to let go of the fame associated with owning a legend but i plead with him to just let the horse go back to ditcheat to see out his days.
Dressage is no way for this superb racehorse to bow out
yep,
yet for some strange reason Smith cannot see it.
yet for some strange reason Smith cannot see it.
Has it been revealed who ultimately made the decision on KS retirement ?
Buddlea, he does not want to see it. I expect if Kauto gets as far as any dressage competition he will be there acknowledging the crowd attempting to absorb the limelight. He should bow out gracefully and let the horse do the same.
Does seem to like the limelight that bloke.
Saw him at Kempton signing autographs once,signing autographs for achieving what exactly??
Saw him at Kempton signing autographs once,signing autographs for achieving what exactly??
I would love one of the crying so called do gooding experts on here to tell us what the horse SHOULD do for possibly the next 20 years ?
Perhaps stand in a field rotting and getting bored
The horse is a fairly inteligent animal and they respond VERY well to routine and exercise as well as being around other horses
Quite how a dressage carrer could do this wonderful animal any harm is simply beyond me and any right minded individual
If he doesn't take to it then it is 1.01 he won't be asked to continue
As I see it the owner ( who I nether like or dislike ) is simply offering the horse a dignified and interesting future without stress and to be looked after day and night
Amazing the ignorance on here
Perhaps stand in a field rotting and getting bored
The horse is a fairly inteligent animal and they respond VERY well to routine and exercise as well as being around other horses
Quite how a dressage carrer could do this wonderful animal any harm is simply beyond me and any right minded individual
If he doesn't take to it then it is 1.01 he won't be asked to continue
As I see it the owner ( who I nether like or dislike ) is simply offering the horse a dignified and interesting future without stress and to be looked after day and night
Amazing the ignorance on here
Saw him at Kempton signing autographs once,signing autographs for achieving what exactly??
Did he sack you or beat you up at school?
Maybe just maybe he was ASKED for his autograph on a Kauto Photo and like a gent SIGNED
Did he sack you or beat you up at school?
Maybe just maybe he was ASKED for his autograph on a Kauto Photo and like a gent SIGNED
Loads of racehorses packed of to the slaughter house daily doesnt seem to be much outcry for that on here.
Don't know if this has been mentioned elsewhere, however, is it just possible that there is a slight element of self interest on behalf on PN here ie. future prospective owners visiting the yard - "and over there in that field is the great Kauto Star" - just a thought that's all!
^Or CS saying "No way are they going up the gallops with my lad to see what other owners horses are like"
BHA
Yogi Breisner admits it is unlikely Kauto Star will develop into an Olympic-class dressage horse following his retirement from racing.
The 12-year-old left the care of trainer Paul Nicholls on Tuesday after owner Clive Smith decided to let his star performer try a new discipline after bowing out of the National Hunt arena.
Smith's plan was not popular with the Ditcheat team and the trainer asked the owner to remove the horse, with Kauto Star now being cared for by new rider Laura Collett.
The 22-year-old is a decorated event rider at junior levels and aspiring Olympian for 2016, and she will work with the gelding alongside long-time British manager and coach Yogi Breisner.
He admits his top priority is the horse's welfare and while he has yet to evaluate Kauto Star's dressage attributes, he believes any talk of an Olympic outing is most premature.
He told Sky Sports News Radio: "As we know he's had a fantastic racing career, he's been brilliantly trained and looked after by Mr Nicholls and his staff at Ditcheat and so this is just a matter of getting to see if he will settle into a different type of routine in life. If he does that comfortably, then maybe there's an alternative thing he can do, but we don't know that until we have started to work with him.
"Number one is how to look after the horse's best interests, his welfare and care and give him what he deserves in life after a magnificent racing career. If a horse is going to reach Olympic level, they really need to start their education when they are young, sort of four or five-year-old.
"So it would be a tremendous exception if a horse could come out of retirement from racing and then go into an alternative career that was going to lead to Olympic level, never mind a medal, in any of the three disciplines."
Yogi Breisner admits it is unlikely Kauto Star will develop into an Olympic-class dressage horse following his retirement from racing.
The 12-year-old left the care of trainer Paul Nicholls on Tuesday after owner Clive Smith decided to let his star performer try a new discipline after bowing out of the National Hunt arena.
Smith's plan was not popular with the Ditcheat team and the trainer asked the owner to remove the horse, with Kauto Star now being cared for by new rider Laura Collett.
The 22-year-old is a decorated event rider at junior levels and aspiring Olympian for 2016, and she will work with the gelding alongside long-time British manager and coach Yogi Breisner.
He admits his top priority is the horse's welfare and while he has yet to evaluate Kauto Star's dressage attributes, he believes any talk of an Olympic outing is most premature.
He told Sky Sports News Radio: "As we know he's had a fantastic racing career, he's been brilliantly trained and looked after by Mr Nicholls and his staff at Ditcheat and so this is just a matter of getting to see if he will settle into a different type of routine in life. If he does that comfortably, then maybe there's an alternative thing he can do, but we don't know that until we have started to work with him.
"Number one is how to look after the horse's best interests, his welfare and care and give him what he deserves in life after a magnificent racing career. If a horse is going to reach Olympic level, they really need to start their education when they are young, sort of four or five-year-old.
"So it would be a tremendous exception if a horse could come out of retirement from racing and then go into an alternative career that was going to lead to Olympic level, never mind a medal, in any of the three disciplines."
I dont think PN will lose any sleep now that smith wont be visiting
Sounds as though life will be quieter for you pedro.
Ananglogs. I know it was tonguye in cheek but I dont think PN needs a yardstick like Kauto, who in racing terms is an old timer, to see how his other horses are going do you.
ffs - edward is right and so is Clive Smith. The horse is not a cripple and needs routine and exercise (like so many other domesticated animals). These animals are intelligent but are not able to take the initiative - thats our job as humans to provide stimulation and exercise.
Kauto wouldnt have been stuck in his box doing nothing,Smith knows he is well exercised and looked after,him and PN have a clash of personalities that is the middle and both ends of it.
If PN hadnt been so soft this would have happened earlier this year
imo of course
If PN hadnt been so soft this would have happened earlier this year
imo of course
as jim mcgrath once said about one man kauto could have won this years king george with one leg tied up
why doesnt someone prepare a list of horses retired at pn yard over the last 10 years and ask him where they all are,he wont have a scooby where 99% of them are,and like the rest of us wont be bothered either
Two grown men who should have known better as to how to conduct themselves involved in a very public spat. I'd like to remember Kauto Star for the tremendous horse that he is and not have my memory tainted by this sad and sorry affair. It is the horse that matters not the owner and trainer feuding in public thus eclipsing his achievements. This should have been sorted out behind closed doors.
Kauto Star given go-ahead to join King George parade at his beloved Kempton on Boxing Day.
Kauto Star will still be paraded at Kempton Park on Boxing Day despite his acrimonious departure from trainer Paul Nicholls’s yard.
By HOTSPUR (JA McGrath) 12 Dec 2012
telegraph.co.uk
It is hoped that Laura Collett, the European eventing bronze medallist and aspiring Olympian, will trot the retired champion on to the course prior to the William Hill King George VI Chase.
Victoria Schlesinger, the Sunbury track’s press officer, said: “Clive Smith [Kauto Star’s owner] phoned from New York and said Kauto Star was 100 per cent committed to being here on Boxing Day.
"We will speak again when Clive gets back from the States at the weekend to firm up the plans. Laura Collett has been in touch and said she has cleared her diary so she can be here.”
Kauto Star won five King George VI Chases during his eight years with the Nicholls yard in Ditcheat, Somerset.
The trainer and his staff bid a tearful farewell to the great champion when he left on Tuesday following a fall-out between Smith and Nicholls over the gelding's retirement plans.
Kauto Star will still be paraded at Kempton Park on Boxing Day despite his acrimonious departure from trainer Paul Nicholls’s yard.
By HOTSPUR (JA McGrath) 12 Dec 2012
telegraph.co.uk
It is hoped that Laura Collett, the European eventing bronze medallist and aspiring Olympian, will trot the retired champion on to the course prior to the William Hill King George VI Chase.
Victoria Schlesinger, the Sunbury track’s press officer, said: “Clive Smith [Kauto Star’s owner] phoned from New York and said Kauto Star was 100 per cent committed to being here on Boxing Day.
"We will speak again when Clive gets back from the States at the weekend to firm up the plans. Laura Collett has been in touch and said she has cleared her diary so she can be here.”
Kauto Star won five King George VI Chases during his eight years with the Nicholls yard in Ditcheat, Somerset.
The trainer and his staff bid a tearful farewell to the great champion when he left on Tuesday following a fall-out between Smith and Nicholls over the gelding's retirement plans.
Spat is going public now on Boxing day... I bet Smith puts on his colours and rides the horse down the course and back waving to the crowd ecstatically...then someone running after him will be shouting "Sir!!! sir!!! that is not Kauto Star sir, that's one of Laura Collett's other horses, plus Kauto Star wasn't a grey sir'
Kauto is appearing on SPOTY AD,how will that go?
Fact..........not speculation........as previously posted?
Fact..........not speculation........as previously posted?
AD, you will be suggesting that Clive Smith has asked Laura Collett to teach Kauto how to do a karate kick aimed at his former trainer in the front row of the SPOTY event next.....
Clive Smith "Paul Nicholls was in a bad mood at the open day". "He came up to me with a tirade of foul language. He must have said 6 times he wanted the horse out of the yard that day never mind this Tuesday" Nicholls has be made aware of these allegations and strongly refutes them. . .Read more down at your local bookies in tomorrows Racing Post.
Front page of tomorrows Racing Post
KAUTO STAR OWNER IN NICHOLLS OUT BURST
Open-Day confrontation was 'final straw'
http://twitpic.com/bleywx
KAUTO STAR OWNER IN NICHOLLS OUT BURST
Open-Day confrontation was 'final straw'
http://twitpic.com/bleywx
Nicholls says he doesn't want to get into a war of words with Smith. Perhaps he shouldn't have been flapping his yapper off about it then.
Just read his column about it on here- coincidence that we can't post any comments?
Kauto Star Dressage
wildmanfromborneo 23 Dec 14 09:44
Some may remember the row between Paul Nicholls and Clive Smith over Kauto Star.
Smith wanted to send it to do dressage,Nicholls wanted to keep him in his stables.
Having watched Kauto Star doing his routine it seems clear to me Nicholls was right.
The horse wasn't enjoying it and was heavily sedated in my opinion,watching a champion racehorse that won over two million for his owner doing something he patently dislikes,watching him obviously full of something wasn't pleasant.
pa lapsy December 23, 2014 10:00 AM GMT
Looked at him there on youtube,not sure how the bbc can dress up the dressage like that but it looks a huniliating end of a career to one of racing superstars,he hated it as you said (nicely ignored by bbc). The horse seemed to realise he was the star attraction at the freak show and it was unpleasant watching.
wildmanfromborneo 23 Dec 14 09:44
Some may remember the row between Paul Nicholls and Clive Smith over Kauto Star.
Smith wanted to send it to do dressage,Nicholls wanted to keep him in his stables.
Having watched Kauto Star doing his routine it seems clear to me Nicholls was right.
The horse wasn't enjoying it and was heavily sedated in my opinion,watching a champion racehorse that won over two million for his owner doing something he patently dislikes,watching him obviously full of something wasn't pleasant.
pa lapsy December 23, 2014 10:00 AM GMT
Looked at him there on youtube,not sure how the bbc can dress up the dressage like that but it looks a huniliating end of a career to one of racing superstars,he hated it as you said (nicely ignored by bbc). The horse seemed to realise he was the star attraction at the freak show and it was unpleasant watching.
DRESSAGE FFS thats the 4 legged equiv to morris prancing, nothing like a dignified retirement doing the odd day at B & Q to earn beer money, they have him on s full back shift at kfc ...not right
i wonder what Denman is doing?
i wonder what Denman is doing?
talking of retirements, lets spare a thought for poor old Frankel who has to spend his days servicing the best mares in the land ;)
It really is shame horses can't talk because if you could ask Kauto if he would like to carry on with the dressage nonsense or be back at Paul's? I'm certain his answer would be along these lines. "Where's the horsebox? Let me get back there and see my great friend Clifford. I could just relax and be myself with him and he won't expect me to learn new tricks. I can also show the younger horses how to behave if they get too big for their boots"
I hope things change for Kauto Star very soon.
I hope things change for Kauto Star very soon.
Brother Mouzone 12 Dec 12 13:42
Most dressage horses look thoroughly depressed imo.
And me too now after just watching that Olympia clip on youtube.
Most dressage horses look thoroughly depressed imo.
And me too now after just watching that Olympia clip on youtube.
Smith and Nicholls deserve each other, both coonts in their own ways.
I wish i never watched it Br. Mouzoune to be honest,trying to make excuses really,maybe it was worth a try by Smith,maybe the horse had a bad day but the result of it was deeply unsettling.
C4 on Stephens Day will be singing the praises of him(rightly),not that long since he totally captured the public imaginations but they sure won't be showing that clip which is a pity.
Nice post Whippin Piccadilly 13.24.
C4 on Stephens Day will be singing the praises of him(rightly),not that long since he totally captured the public imaginations but they sure won't be showing that clip which is a pity.
Nice post Whippin Piccadilly 13.24.
Good article here about Kauto's demise - http://e-venting.co.uk/2014/12/kauto-star-whats-all-the-fuss-about/
Who gives a to55 what Clive thinks
He's just a spoilt brat
He's just a spoilt brat
If Smith is any sort of man he'll admit it's time to change tack....maybe I'm wrong but I thought that Channel 4 said he'd be at Kempton on Friday....hope they have the balls to quiz him.Nichols is just as dislikable,though!
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