Betfair SP rip off

I wouldn't touch fixed odds on this site at all. I think they are manipulating the exchange very heavily too.

That sort of betting is best left to bookmakers.

I have emailed betfair about this.
done a £2 yankee in france and had a 12/1 and 6/4 winner although they were showing at 3.05 and 15 when I bet them.

I was expecting at least £65 for SP maybe more, but I received £16 back.

It's obviously well wrong and still waiting to hear how I can get 7/1 for a double at 14/1 and 2/1.

Betfair is becoming a bookmaker and manipulation of the exchanges has been blatently obvious for some time now.
Its never long before greed takes over and punters walk.

Something strange certainly going on with betfair SP.

betfair software is first in the queue

1 high profile lower odds,but every day every race 20% or more better odds,ask them if they give you the 12s ,you will refund all the extra cash you ve made in the last 5 years when odds were bigger.

thats the risk ,95% of the time you gain ,occaisonily you are worse off.

if as the thread is surjesting ,they are squeezing the odds all the time ,it would be pointless ,because as with mrs green it p$ssses people of ,so if it happens alot - you will stop betting with them ,so the saving you think they re making ends up being a loss as you ve closed your account.

you have to trust them to give you whatever the odds are ,you bet with them because you believe they re the best,they re not stupid enough to try and make you not believe this by nicking bits of money here and there - they have to give you a good service ,so you come back.

i do think in some special cases its bad customer service to make you have the true odds,if they low,its worth them standing it to keep customers happy,but thats an accountants v customer service decieson.

moondan 07 Oct 12 18:17 Joined: 18 Nov 10 | Topic/replies: 723 | Blogger: moondan's blog
Betfair is becoming a bookmaker and manipulation of the exchanges has been blatently obvious for some time now.
Its never long before greed takes over and punters walk.

your right - but they ve got to keep you squeezed ,but not too much .

aye, to anyone who has been around since the spinning clock days, the change is pronounced.

you know i thought it was the books manipulating the markets in the last ten minutes, sice they all started the BOG offers, honestly never crossed my mind it was bf, the light has come on now tho.

colusion within the bookmaking trade i meant, as the books prices all change higher or lower within seconds of each other on oddschecker etc.

I'm in same boat. Fekin outrageous.  Their excuse is "someone wanted to bet it for plenty just at the off" Why would anyone take all prices down to 3.15 when all they need to do is bet it at sp with any high street bookie. Total bollocks. Time to close my BF account

I don't even know what final prices I got from betfair as they don't have longchamps on their results page.

did I really get 2/1 for a 12/1 shot.

I am afraid so and you should complain.

thats why i hardly ever back horses on here now . some of the odds on the fancied horses are shocking and you can always get a guaranteed price with a bookie which you cannot on here.....the idea of fixed odds on here laughable too.

i stated this years ago,betfair need to have a plus or minus 20% differencial to industry SP,

i.e if betfair SP is lower or higher the max loss or win will be SP + 20% or minus 20%.

they need a safety net for punters and themselves.

it could be 30% - but cant leave it open ended - too much risk built in either way.they need to be fair to punters aswell as themselves.

how many races in britain or ireland has this happened to in the last 2 years ?
out of the 16,000 races or so ,not many i would think .

maybe they should just not do bfsp on races which are not in the u.k or ireland

After the Comply or Die fiasco they reckoned it would never happen again because they would be more proactive in the SP market. There was also an instance when someone had a large amount going on to a horse at SP which won and they were boasting on a forum thread about how the SP for the horse held up despite the size of the bet. Maybe it held up because they were proactive then but they then believed their own publicity (a common trait among city & ex-city ponces) and expected the sp market to look after itself.

Got to agree with willie the milk. Why would anyone buy a bet at 12/1 all the way down to 2/1???? I just can't believe that I'm afraid!

is this the french race winner that was 10s in books of here bf spo around 3.12. i only notice dit after reace, place sp was abvout 4, something obv went wrong with win sp.

There is a difference between 'Betfair SP' and 'fixed odds'

cant see why any1 uses fixed odds. no bog, no double result, and generally poorer prices.

And different from Multiples.....Betfair Forum Chat November 2011

MULTIPLES

Why are the prices on multiples substantially shorter than the same Team/person etc as singles? (Onehundredandeighty)

Unlike the exchange, when a customer places a bet on the multiples product, the customer is betting against Betfair. With Betfair multiples the difference between the exchange price and the multiples price is known as the margin. Every sports betting operator applies a margin to each runner in a market, that is how the operator makes a profit in the long term.
If we were to offer exchange prices in the multiples product, once we take into account operating costs, the product would be likely to make an overall operating loss.
Although the difference in the exchange price and the multiples price may seem substantial on occasions, regular odds comparison exercises on featured high-profile multiples have demonstrated that Betfair multiples is consistently best in market for horse racing, and market leading for football.
John, Trading Team Manager.

Why does Betfair charge 5% commission & give poor prices on multiple bets? Surely 5% commission is enough without taking 10% and sometimes more off the exchange prices? Do you not think that Betfair is taking customers for a ride on multiples? Betfair is charging more than bookmakers with these bets. (Boogiecat)

In terms of offering poor prices in the multiples product, regular odds comparison exercises on featured high profile multiples, have demonstrated that Betfair multiples is consistently best or second best price available in the industry.
Betfair is aware that once commission is added to the price, we become less competitive. As a result, Betfair is currently reviewing this with one of the potential outcomes being the possibility of scrapping commission on Betfairs multiples / sportsbook offering. 
John, Trading Team Manager.

I have only been with Betfair for 4 years approx, in that time I have thought its been easily the best betting experience I have had in almost 50 years.
The concept is beautiful, betfair are in a win win situation and unlike bookies they cannot lose and because of that the punter is in no danger of having his account closed because he is a regular winner.
Now we are told that is going to change. Fixed odds on horses means Betfair will be taking risks and that means they will manipulate the market to their own ends.

Ladbrokes are said to be interested in getting into the exchange markets and perhaps thats the future but the punter will only lose as his edge is ever shaved.
Betfair are making a huge mistake by gambling with the multies markets and fixed odds because they will become just another bookie who hates to lose.
Somewhere down the line, another company will offer what Betfair once did and they will be happy with a healthy commission and bring punters together and have no care about who wins or loses.
Greed brings even the mighty to their knees in the end.

What price would they have returned Fujiyama Crest?  My guess 1.45

All you UK punters better pray for the death of FOBT's and a return to your High Street bookies taking bets when they do die, now that the poacher has turned into a gamekeeper, at least the traditional bookies weren't as bad as these Betfair gangsters.

what price was voler la vadette ?

What a load of cobblers ! I use Betfair every race, every day, and always beat industry SP. Betfair is the greatest thing since sliced bread.What are you moaners doing wrong ?

we're backing horses with betfair that are returned 12/1 industry SP and betfair want us to believe that it should only be 2/1

now you tell us, apart from betting with betfair and losing 10 points, what are we doing wrong.

artie ,
how good is it for layers at sp.?
and if you are correct how long before they are gone ?

THIS IS A COMPANY AND THEY HAVE SHAREHOLDERS ,THEY ARE THE PRIORITY. THEY HAVE TO MAKE THEM AS MUCH PROFIT AS THEY CAN ,THE MORE THEY GIVE YOU THE LESS FOR THE SHAREHOLDERS

THIS IS SOMETHING YOU NEED TO KNOW

YOU MIGHT NOT LIKE TO KNOW THAT ,BUT IM HERE TO TELL YOU THE WAY IT IS

shareholders are not doing very well this year

they'll be doing even worse in future if people can't trust betfair any longer

What do you expect betting continually like pigs in a poke

only a matter of time before it goes tits up.  I am reminded

of the free lunch adage.

I emailed them yesterday to point out their "obvious" mistake when I received £16 for a £2 double that included a 12/1 winner.

I just now received this reply

Thank you for your e-mail.

I have checked this for you and the prices for the indvidual runners were 2.64 for Olympic Glory and 3.04 Ridasiyna. Therefore
the correct amount has been added to your account.
Please do not hesitate to contact us if you have any further enquiries.

Kind regards,

Betfair Helpdesk 

No explanation but just the bare facts.
customer service second to none.

I think I will probably leave some money on this site for a football bet now and again but it is not worth betting horses on here if betfair are going to manipulate the markets to such an extent as they did yesterday. 
it's hard enough gambling on winners without gambling on betfair prices as well.

Outpost with respect, free lunch springs to mind, truth is there is no such thing............

I agree wee eck but for a company running a non stop TV ad campaign boasting about giving better prices than their competitors, you can guarantee that they won't want to boast about yesterday's odds.

outpost, that advert is a myth and always has been. Yes you get fabulous prices on

no hopers but on fancied horses traditional bookmakers prices with the concessions

offered are superior imo. Best of luck.

1.01 Mrs green is a, fat, bald, middle aged man who sleeps with his stinky dogs at night.

betfair are shooting themselves in the foot with this,if BSP is sometimes lower than SP by a few points  - no problem its swings and roundabouts,but to allow a high profile race be so out (i.e 10 points)then the bad publicity and lack of trust is too damaging to their future ,its just better to stump up the money themselves rather than stand their rightful ground,people feel ripped off - even though they havent been,as the odds are whatever they are,surely its better to cream 0.1% off the big price winners(much bigger than SP)and keep a continengy fund for low BSP s ,

if this happens more and more - then people will stop betting with them and take a price in the shops,if it only happens occaisonly - then stump the money up,someone isnt looking at the bigger picture.

When a race goes off, if you immediately click on the horse on the screen, the 'market information' page comes up, and on this page is the Betair SP. I don't see how they can change it, if it says 12/1, then you get  12/1.  Whenever I have a multiple bet I take a screen shot of the BF SP as my horse go off, not had any errors yet. Then again, I didn't indulge in France yesterday.

the page isnt 100% upto date - so your arguement is pointless,its based on trust and what usually happens ,i.e they tend to give better prices ,but you do expect near industry SP at the very least,customers shouldnt havwe to be taking screenshots to prove a case,surely betfair should be trusted better than that - if they arent ,they need to change attitudes .you cant have a ,take what you arwe given attitude ,if that reguarly becomes very low odds - it as to be within 20% of SP .customers forget all the extra BSP s - they just remeber the one bad one,if this had been returned 9/1 ,people may have grumbled but accepted it as part of the deal with getting bigger odds most of the time.

exactly comingupthehill.

as soon as betfair realised what had happened they should have stated that there was a minor glitch and that the few people who backed the 12/1 winner would get paid the ISP of 12/1. 

it might have cost betfair only a few hundred, maybe even a few thousand to put this right, but you then have thousands of happy betfair punters who know that betfair will play fair with them.

as it is now, not only the few folk who backed it are unhappy, but lots of others are unsure about when the next price rip off will happen and are wondering how dodgy is it to bet on multiples with betfair.

this will almost certainly cost betfair a lot more in lost business than it would have cost them to put it right on the day.

has anyone put forward a theory as to why this has happened?

I mean, presumably, the normal odds on offer on Betfair prior to the off were in accordance with being slightly higher than Industry prices. Were they or was the price difference evident there too?

Was it because of the confusion that ensues on Arc day re Industry taking their prices from Pari-Mutuel? But why that should affect betfair SP?

all I did was a £2 yankee and a few quid a win on each for an interest and my single was paid at 15.39 whereas my multiple with the same horse was paid at 3.05. quite a difference.

betfair are trying to claim that somebody came on late and bet the horse at all prices for big money but that seems highly unlikely.

anyway it only cost me around £50 with betfair fiddling the SPs so I walked into town today and did my £50 multiple in Billy's shop so betfair would have got their £50 back today and had a customer for years to come.

as it is, I need to re-open my Bet365 account.  they didn't close it - I did because they resticted my single bets but they still take multiples.

Just means I will get much bigger odds for my multiples and no deductions so it's win win for me.

I'm out. 365 for me from now on

Outpost was your single at 15.39 a bfsp bet or was it taken in the live market before the off. What I really am asking id did bf have 2 sps, one for singles and one for multiples

there is only one BSP returned, this is then reduced by 5% for multiples (including singles placed within the multiples platform).

Thanks swifty

so I think that betfair's explanation sounds reasonable - there is no profit for anyone in 'making' this happen . The person that lumped on just before the off certainly didn't score and he spoilt it for a lot of other people.

betfair the bookies will have profited but it is fairly clear and visible that they do not rig betfair sps on a routine basis

no , but also clear that it's little better than a tote dividend

Nothing good ever lasts !

perhaps this expains the lack of longchamp BSP results for longchamp as the waters are now mudded!

I agree that the Betfair SP can be surprising at times but don't forget it always balances out at 100%. If, as suggested the odds were manipulated down, you would just have to lay every horse (in proportion) and you would always win. Basically, if you feel that SP was mean then stop backing and lay everything!
Longchamp was strange, some weird stuff, including 5 horses trading at 1.35 or less in the same race!

We have in effect now 3 possible price results on the befair platform which are last price, Betfair starting price and fixed odds of which only one price can be calculated but maybe the mechanism of working out the BSP at Longchamp was affected by another factor that made it difficult to publish correctly?

bf_fananatic 09 Oct 12 00:22 Joined: 17 Jul 11 | Topic/replies: 7,116 | Blogger: bf_fananatic's blog
perhaps this expains the lack of longchamp BSP results for longchamp as the waters are now mudded!

Absolutely, I hate it when you get home from the shops and discover you've picked up a bottle of Evian rather than Highland Spring...

closer to tap water on this occasion

I believe Betfair are now reconsidering this glitch and are looking to make it right with their affected customers.

Nightmare!

How do you do multiples on the exchange,I thought Sportsbook only does this.

Back in the day,

They weren't *really* on the Exchange, you couldn't trade them actively.

It was just that before BF had a proper Sportsbook (and for a couple of years after) they offered Racing (*) multiples at BSP-5%, which were decent value IMO - but you were betting against BF, not another punter.

(*) and I think Football multis too, but little/zero interest in that.