Trainers need a wake up call..Mann definately

Those hats he wears ( at a jaunty angle may I add) don't come cheap!

Written to the Racing Post this morning. Wrote the other day - they did not publish it they don't want to upset their mates.

Mann is a fool. He does not know how much it costs to get a horse to the races (admitted on ATR) so how can he possibly comment on the adequacy or other wise of prize money.

Racing is just making itself look greedy , out of touch with reality and utterly clueless. These people are millionaire by and large. The ones that don't make it pay will have to go and do something else - that is what economic downturn us all about weeding out the wheat from the chaff and encouraging new growth.

Its about time some of the owners got together to smash the cartel on training fees. These are remarkably similar everywhere regardless of size , quality of results etc. If trainers livelihoods were more closely linked to prize money I would have more sympathy but they are not. They are getting fleeced fro £250 pw per animal if it is running in a seller or winning the Derby. Plus the inevitable margin on all other costs such as vets , shoes , transport etc.

I have lost total respect for Mann over this.

This is the same man, I would add, that could not tell two of his horses apart for three months, and did it twice!    Getting used to paying fines., but they should be banned, as any other sport would do, Man Utd deciding not to play just before KO, it would be a national headline, but nobody cares about these two bit richard soles

Poor old John Spence might be warned off for five years because of finger trouble - does that mean Alan Jones goes to the wall!

Well that seems to have summed up the situation nicely...

(The original post, that is).

£900 its over surely the course and sponsors can come up with that. Sorry I'm in the trainers corner on this one.

Yet another bunch of clueless posters.

Racing has always been about self interest. Greedy trainers are more than happy to besmirch the name of the sport for the sake of £900/

Where do you draw the line Layboy? If that idiot Richard Hughes refuses to race in next years Queen Anne because its nor worth £1,000,000 should the course come up with that?

Go on then Motley enlighten us

Hip Priest your stupidity has sunken to even lower levels, shut up will you, ffs.

Come on lads, lets not get personal,   even a Motley Fool has an opinion, not sure what it is tho, perhaps its good old charlies nickname,

I cant be bothered, you are a bunch of fcuking idiots. I'm not going to waste my time.
I'll the thread to you. GL.

To be fair to all I think that most trainers seem to do alright

if the cars they drive and the Gaffs they live in are anything

to go by, I often see trainers who are less than household names

arriving at the sports driving £60000+ cars and several I have

visited seem to reside in £1000000+ houses

The prize money in this country, the greatest horse racing in the world, is pitiful. I am no expert in this matter but I remember a horse called Running Stag, trained by the Mitchells, who was an average listed class horse at best, go over to America and return with over a million dollars in prize money, without winning a race. Trainer fees in America I'm sure are no different to that over here.
I have looked into Racehorse Ownership, its not the trainer fess that put me off, its getting place prize money of £600 that gets me. That pays for the day not even a week. My opinion means nothing but if a racecousre can charge £5.50 for a pie then its prize money can definetely be higher up the scale.

Whilst I've no sympathy for wealthy trainers, when they're running round for less than they were 20 years ago, perhaps it's time for someone to make a stand.

Btw, good to see ATR getting a bookie on to tell us anyone other than the bookies should be making up for the £900 shortfall...

Always good to see a company promoting the agenda of its sponsors, imo

Why do punters NEVER get to air their views on ATR,Racing UK,Channel 4 etc.    WE have to listen to the same old faces,Francome,McCririck,Fitz, trotting out the same old brown tongue rubbish, yet it is us who  are the basis of it all

Bristol could the answer be that those in high positions who run, control

and are ruining racing considers us punters as mugs?

Its irish night at wuss this evening, it will be rammed to the gills with people paying 18 or 20 quid a head to enter.

Arena and northern need to start putting theyre hands in theyre pockets rather than just take take take.

Im all with the trainers, however a 0-135 at wetherby was worth 3200 quid rather than the 9k tariff, the idiots than ran in that are as bad.

Take out the 6 grand race at Yarmouth today - Northern Racing of course - and the horses in the other 6 races,are running for an average of 2 grand a race and 2 of them just 1600 quid. There is too much imbalance between prize money, and definitely too many horses chasing a shrinking pot.

It's bookies that have ruined this sport so have absolutely no sympathy for them - they need to pay more into a sport they have bled dry for over a generation. Punters get no say because punters that do eventually get a gig on ATR/RUK know what side their bread is buttered and immediately get on the gravy train and keep their gobs shut. Spineless, all of them.

Worcester still staging six races so do they care?

you are correct bilbo, racing is a prostitute for the high st big 3.

Mann  should get a   3  month ban

What do you expect from a sport that is still in the dark ages .. run by numptys for numptys

Will  Mann  pay   for the loss  of levy on this race

I agree bilbo bookies need to pay more, but will they?....not while they hide behind the obscene profits they make from fobt's and running offshore to escape paying tax.. Threaten a Tote system and hear them squeal. We might even get racecourse admissions reduced to an acceptable level.

courses get all the media rights money (millions) to pay for staging the racing, so the least they can do is use all of that money (plus sponsorship money) and put it towards prize money to encourage owners to race their horses at their tracks. 

this is one time when greedy trainers are sticking up for their owners (probably so that owners have more money to give to the greedy trainers)

Everyone is missing the point .. whilst they are all arguing over a few hundred quid they dont see that the sport is in dire need of an overhaul like all other popular sports have had to generate increased interest and more income.

I find it absolutely ridiculous that anyone could criticise trainers taking a stand over the ridiculously low levels of prize money.

And it's not the lifestyles of the trainers we're talking about here, it's the fact that more and more owners are getting out of the game.

motley01
Date Joined:     19 Jun 10
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11 Jul 12 11:34 Joined: 19 Jun 10 | Topic/replies: 656 | Blogger: motley01's blog
Hip Priest your stupidity has sunken to even lower levels, shut up will you, ffs

Not only are you clueless Motley but you are also f@cking literate. Are you in a relationship  with Charlie Mann?

Not only are you clueless Motley but you are also f@cking literate. Are you in a relationship  with Charlie Mann?


Faux Pas

ha ha LOL!

I must have started drinking this morning even earlier than Motley.

It was Champagne - what with me being a trainer and all.

Not much time for trainers but prize money in this country is pitiful.
Belle Royale ran in 24 races in England. It won 8, was second 7 times and won a total of just over £90K. It was sold to USA and won £96K in its first race.

Totally different financial models. You cant just tinker round the edges. The biggest trick we have missed is to have a Tote monopoly with a 5% deduction with money coming in from other international pools.

agreed but that's exactly the point : most of the cash generated by racing is being creamed off

So striking tonight is pointless - it punishes Worcester but the real issue is BHA, Levy Board , thieving bookies etc.

agreed again. If they were not going to run they should simply not enter in the first place.

Thought better of Pipe - I know him fairly well and this is disappointing.

bookies dont give 2 fcuks about racing.FOOTBALL AND FOBT MACHINE have taken over.racing is going down hill very,very fast.i agree with some of the others that some of these trainers seem to do ok out of the game with big houses/stables and driving nice cars.

If the bookies don't care about racing they would be happy to stop paying the levy and allow racing to follow the French pari-mutuel system would they?

That seems to fund racing properly; there are loads of tracks in France, all with prize money worth winning, and subsidised transport for horses to the races, decent premiums for Breeders, etc etc

The betting is crap though

So would you prefer good betting, by allowing a virtually unregulated proliferation of bookies paying almost nothing for a product that isn't worth watching;

OR

A more restricted betting product which properly funds a huge and diverse industry, which is flourishing and growing as British racing degenerates into nothing.

Not wishing to be mean to others I would love it if the meeting was called off just after race 6. Would steal the thunder (see what I did there) from this pathetic protest.

Erm. What happened to the idea of owners putting up their money to run their horses against others.Think they were called stakes races.

Well that boycott was highly effective.

I can see Ralph Topping and his mates rushing to re-domicile their businesses in the UK and to ensure that they jolly well pay up their fair share to help racing.

Congratulations to all concerned.

Do racecourses charge hat wearing trainers when their horses are often clearly there for a 'day out'?

The short priced ones than run quiet races at the back.

How much do they pay the racecourse for the use of the stable and the use of a two mile gallop with hurdles provided?

Good point. They are missing a trick there Apologist

£12,500 on offer today at Stratford and 5 runners

bilbobaggins
11 Jul 12 12:38 Joined: 06 Jul 01 | Topic/replies: 4,207 | Blogger: bilbobaggins's blog
It's bookies that have ruined this sport so have absolutely no sympathy for them - they need to pay more into a sport they have bled dry for over a generation. Punters get no say because punters that do eventually get a gig on ATR/RUK know what side their bread is buttered and immediately get on the gravy train and keep their gobs shut. Spineless, all of them.

head on nail

Nice to see this thread of mine ticking over nicely, and all in agrreement for once, not ONE person thinks Mann is 1.A trainer  2.got any bottle 3.Has not, or possibly cannot, reply   4.A trainer with any business plan, i.e.he does not know how much it costs to send a horse to the races, just bills owners a ball park figure,     He has made himself look foolish,  paricularly today at Stratford