Whip ban - I'm Finished

It's my belief that due to the way jockeys are now having to ride and the way that some horses run, that over half of all runners are now in with less chance of winning than they once were.

Certainly over the jumps I reckon that there are far more horses over eight years old that are so set in their running ways that they will never ever win another race.

switch to in-running.

It's my belief that due to the way jockeys are now having to ride and the way that some horses run, that over half of all runners are now in with less chance of winning than they once were.

Presumably, therefore, you are pleased with the new regulations.

lazarus2/ascotboy loves to get whipped

I dont like the flat and was really looking forward to the jumps but right now I feel like giving it up for good. I had my first bet before I was 10 years old in the Grand National and that was many years ago. Football is an alternative as practically everyone is trying. However there is nothing to beat a really good competitive jumps race but I fear the BHA has effectively castrated the sport. Total VTW for seven races today at Fontwell was about £16,000. That is the real problem and changing the whip rules will just make that worse rather than better.

But Roger, even if I had the nerves of steel (which I don't) to bet in-running I would only ever be tempted if I was actually at the track and in possession of a super dooper lap top and even then I'd be worried about pressing the wrong button.

lazarus2, I'm far from pleased, especially at the predictable chaos that was bound to ensue with Paul Roy at the helm.

pocket talk

It has certainly made me take a long look at my betting activities. I CANNOT bet with the same confidence as before. At the weekend I had a fair few horses coming with every chance , only to see the jockey avoiding the persuader when it mattered! How many times has a horse been cost the race because the jockey "dropped" the whip? I rest my case.

It doesn't seem to have dented the confidence of the insider sc.um any. Their gambles are still improving two stone on previous runs while most of you are campaigning on their behalf.

you'll get used to IR after a while.

Arklearkle 27 Oct 11 18:50 
I dont like the flat and was really looking forward to the jumps but right now I feel like giving it up for good. I had my first bet before I was 10 years old in the Grand National and that was many years ago. Football is an alternative as practically everyone is trying.......

Ironically a stopped betting on football about a decade ago when far too often it was officials deciding results and not the players. Balls crossing the goal line not given, ones that didn't were, penalties given for dives, stonewall penalties not given. The same with offside goals given, onside goals not given, handballs not seen, handballs given that weren't. Players who should have been sent off but not and those that shouldn't have been were, first scorer genuine goals chalked off, correct scores and/or match result changed by goals allowed or disallowed .......it's far too much of a minefield to be a serious betting proposition nowadays.

Sure you're cut out for betting, ima_mazed66?

'EVILROYSLADE
27 Oct 11 19:03

I CANNOT bet with the same confidence as before. At the weekend I had a fair few horses coming with every chance , only to see the jockey avoiding the persuader when it mattered! How many times has a horse been cost the race because the jockey "dropped" the whip?'

Dont know...cant think of many. I too had a fair few horses come with every chance at the weekend...only noticed one occasion when the jockey may have put the whip down cos he'd reached limit and it made absolutely no difference to the result imo. The day i start using that as an excuse for my losers will be the day i give up the game.

What I would like to know is where has big mac hidden himself?

I would like to see all jockeys put their destiny in their own hands
and strike until things are as they should be.
Without jockeys there would be no racing, without the poor quality rulers of racing, common sense would prevail.                                                                       
Racing MUST rid itself of the old school tie and all the buffoons that do so little to enhance the sport and manage to park the bus in so many cul-de-sacs.
As per usual they just dont get the obvious and it really is about time they did.

One thing the whip debate has given us is opportunities for posters such as the one above to try and cram in as many hackneyed cliches as possible. Well done for getting old school tie in. And cul-de-sacs too. That was a good one. Perhaps next time mention ivory towers? Or ask how many winners they've ridden?

Finnish,

I trust you wear the old school tie and dont get the obvious.

What we have here is a man made muddle of english proportions the rest of the world understand that.

There is no good reason for a change of rules, the charges are absurd.

duncan idaho     28 Oct 11 08:57 
'EVILROYSLADE
27 Oct 11 19:03

I CANNOT bet with the same confidence as before. At the weekend I had a fair few horses coming with every chance , only to see the jockey avoiding the persuader when it mattered! How many times has a horse been cost the race because the jockey "dropped" the whip?'

Dont know...cant think of many. I too had a fair few horses come with every chance at the weekend...only noticed one occasion when the jockey may have put the whip down cos he'd reached limit and it made absolutely no difference to the result imo. The day i start using that as an excuse for my losers will be the day i give up the game.



Spot on Duncan. Hysterical nonsense being spouted all round.The same losers that find any excuse as to why their bet lost - now have another reason !!

There's still the Breeders Cup Friday week, plenty of good betting opportunities there

TBH, im waiting to see how it plays out on the better jump racing, i only really play on the bigger meetings anyway so a winter off wont hurt, i just dont think that the One hit difference does compensate for the longer distance and dynamics of NH racing, i dont HAVE to play so therefore i wont

i dont think its the old skool thats introduced this ....more the new skool ....but anyway from now on im concentrating on virtual racing and online bingo

duncan idaho 28 Oct 11 08:50 
Sure you're cut out for betting, ima_mazed66?

Yep, which is exactly why I no longer bet on football and why when a jockey breaks the rules I feel they should be thrown out.

I like to think if I get a call wrong and it's down to my judgement then that's fair enough but if it's down to things outside of my control like bad officiating in football or horses interfered with, costing them several lengths and beaten by much less or a jockey breaking the whip rule when my own jockey obeys it, then that's another matter. So considering all of that I think I'm very much cut out for betting.

I've recently cancelled my online subscription to the Racing Post website as a result of the racing part and expect to scale back on my betting as a result of the new whip rules, and won't really get back involved again until they are changed for the better or until the initial teething problems start to settle, especially seeing as the jumps have yet to get going.

I suspect though that your comment was based more on who was doing the saying rather than what was being said.

Wasn't 2 out of 3 of So You Think's defeat excuses put down on here by many (I wonder were you one of them duncan idaho?) to breaking whips rules? The smell of hypocrisy from this forum at times can be really overpowering.

I think it would be long odds on that Jockeys using whips would have an advantage over those that did not.

I am pretty sure that those Jockeys that use up their allocation of hits early in a race will be at a disadvantage to those that have saved theirs.
I have watched horse racing since the early sixties and am comfortable that their is no problem except in the minds of those that are looking for a cause.
There is no doubt that many horses will be denied a life of luxury because of these rather pointless changes and when I hear our leaders say they think britain should take a lead in this it explains all to me, deluded is not a strong enough word.
I think they would be better employed trying to put britain at the top of the prize money league instead of at the bottom.

The answer is simple  the BHB  dont bet. Over the last two weeks
Ive seen horses lose who should have won.. and horses won that should have lost .. forget us punters. What about the guys who put the show on the road ... not trainers not jockeys  not the BHB  not the RSPCA  Not the Bookies .......THE OWNER  the guys who make racing possible . In my opinion the owner should be top of the pile   not at the bottom

Someone was asking was there a video of Mike Parry getting whipped by Perry Groves the other day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFiBOwqD9BI

I still can't decide whether this helps or hinders the argument.

The 'jockey' in that video would be deemed a non-trier had he been on a horse. They were at best equivalent to taps in the backhand position. I preferred the Greg Wood version which established that hitting a horse on the hoof while it was at rest probably wouldn't hurt it.

ima_mazed66
28 Oct 11 11:24

I suspect though that your comment was based more on who was doing the saying rather than what was being said.

Wasn't 2 out of 3 of So You Think's defeat excuses put down on here by many (I wonder were you one of them duncan idaho?) to breaking whips rules? The smell of hypocrisy from this forum at times can be really overpowering.


Genuinely dont know what you are referring to there, ima. I've never got involved in any SYT debates and not aware i've any history (!) with yrslf.

Of course to establish the correct size and weight ratio we would have to have a dwarf riding on the back of someone twice the size of Valuev with a whip around 3/4 of the size of the present one, oh and we'd have to measure skin thickness so he might have to wear a skin tight wet suit as well

A small race a Catterick a few days ago showed what the game is like now. Fallon on the fav could and should have won,but,mindful of a ban he only hit the horse 3 times. The horse was beaten in a photo,with Fallon saying IF he had given it a couple of more smacks it would have won

Mindful of a ban he administered 4 hits less than allowed while the winner was hit two or three times more than allowed. Sounds just like old times imo.

No whip would've meant both would've received the same number of slaps (zero) and nobody would've been worried about a ban. Doesn't give the jockeys much room for manoeuvre between trying and not trying though which is why the whip is so important too them.