vautour gold cup 2016

The only way Vautour will stay the GC trip (an extra 2 1/2f) is in a horsebox - the horse came back to Cue Card quicker than lightning at Kempton. Sorry!

you may be right impossible but with better going and more restrained tactics  plus the horse being peaked for march  and going favoured left handed think its highly likely he will stay! imo of course !

Immediately afterwards I thought he'd ran a good trial for the GC and was a bit too keen through much of the race and really going RH on soft ground isn't his optimum conditions. His chances for the GC went up in my estimations as he is a vastly different horse round Cheltenham than anywhere else, Can be sure Ruby will be switching him off for the first circuit, Have to agree with you foyles as 10/1 is a great price and on the day I had plenty telling me I was stupid but since they have had time to reflect coupled with Ruby's wishing he'd ridden with more restraint most are starting to come around to the idea that the bookies over reacted to the defeat.
Best of luck for March.

must admit it was only after looking at the prices a few days ago and seeing the 10s made me look at replays of the king George and to me also he ran a great trial for the gold cup after all he had  the king George won everywhere bar the line  and yet has drifted from around 5s or 6s  if memory serves to 10/1 ,only had a handful of chases and should be a more to come !

lot more to come ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Agreed. I'm one of these people who debates whether 3m round Kempton is a easy 3 miles at all. I know many subscribe to that thinking but in a KG we all know they go off hard and horses have little chance to get in a mid race breather so it's always a punishing finish.
Cheltenham on the other hand may be a undulating course with the famous uphill finish which has changed many a result but horses can get the luxury of a breather coming down the hill for that final push if they are travelling well enough and the jockey is savvy enough, Think we both know Ruby will be free-wheeling down the hill giving Vautour ample opportunity to fill those lungs before kicking off the bend.

my way of thinking also gutty good luck !

I'd go for the champion chase. Best horse in the field and would rip them to shreds. More prestigious as well.

If they thought he was the best 2 mile chaser in the yard he'd have gone the Arkle/QMCC route.

can't see him getting home,myself.
Still we'll find out if he runs.
  GL OP.

If it's good ground and he runs I don't think we'll find him petering out until after the last if at all. My view is after the last but if he were mine I'd be wanting to find out.

jist settle him in front getting into a good rythm and they'll not see which way he went he WILL stay imvho

reason he drifted is cos he failed to stay well enough over a lesser distance than the Gold Cup,so makes perfect sense.

The unknown part if thinking of backing him is the reasons why he failed to stay well enough.
Guess that's where the price and the decision to back  comes in.

Personally I like to believe what my eyes tell me. He failed to hold on at 3m. I see him struggling over 2 f more.
Also got the worry of Ruby wanting to ride him and Djakadam as he always does,so the Ryanair becomes a problem.

Good luck though Foyles,hope he runs for you.

yeah good points  budd ,my theory or hope  is that he may have just "blew up" near the line and they didn't have him as  peaked for this race as they will hopefully for  the festival ,obviously only guessing as to fitness levels but he travelled so  well all through the race bar the last half furlong or so and beaten a whisker , I think he will stay the gold cup trip o.k in  ground and track will suit better than Kempton . as you say the main fly in the ointment is rubys influence as to  what race vatour lines up in but at a double figure price for what was after all a near perfect "trial " in the king George looks too generous  and worth the risk imo  .

10s gone at laddies ,only sid james going 10s now !

You done that foyles, they all sit up and take notice!!

^^^^^^^ that's what I was thinking budd

How can you not like this horse... the moment he was chinned I put a bet on him (and on Cue Card).  Kicking King was a similar horse ticked the 3 mile box and then went on to win the Gold Cup...

He had the same question marks around him - regarding whether he would stay the trip.  The only thing in his way is how well Djakadam does.. But they will NOT win the Gold Cup with him - but Vautour its a totally different story.

Can't have Vatour and Kicking kings KG classed as similar.KK would have won his KG by a distance.Vatour looks as if 3 mile is his limit so I would like to see if he can win a 3 mile grade 1 or 2 race before the GC.I can see Vautour reversing form with CC but beating DC Djak and DP will be some feet for horse that has never won at 3 miles.
After all that I do agree 10s is a big price.

Kicking King looked like a stayer at Kempton,Vautour did not.
Djakadam has proved himself in the Gold Cup,Vautour has not.
10 is a price you could take to find out of course,but no matter what price his is,he dont stay then he don't stay.
To say Djakadam won't win the Gold Cup is a tad silly when he came so close last year.

I Think What he means at this stage Vatour has more  potential  than Djak had

The price of 10/1 for Vautour says two things.... (1) Vautour is very unlikely to run despite what WM has said, and (2) Vautour, even if it does run, will be very unlikely to get up the trip up that Cheltenham hill; he might beat Cue Card at Cheltenham but most unlikely the likes of DC and Djakadam if these two jump the last in pursuit.

Nonetheless, I do hope Vautour runs as it will set it up for the others with a truly run race.

I Hope He Runs And if so Rupert Will Ride And if That is The Case I will Be All In As on way Home Last Year Just Caught The End Of The JLT After Landing At The Airport And The Impression  That I Got Was WILLIES 1ST GOLD CUP WINNER AND I'VE SEEN NOTHING TO CHANGE MY MIND THINK COURSE FORM OF THIS HORSE IS IMPRESSIVE AND IS UP THERE WITHBTHE BEST THINK CLASS WILL CARRY THIS HORSE THRU SO FFS WILLIE RUN HIM IN THE GOLD CUP,APOLOGIES FOR GRAPHIC  AS USING  A TABLET USUALLY  A DESKTOP ALTHOUGH CRAP AT WRITEUPS

from the lead he had and the way he
was travelling in the KG,a GC horse
would have won.Petrol ran out it seemed
to me.

on looking back at replays of the king George i noticed that vautours head was cocked out to the left, watch the replays   its there , suggesting to me that the horse is totally unsuited by going righthanded , it affected his jumping went left at many fences and was not as spectacular  or fluent as he was in the jlt and looked ill at ease going right handed  ,he also got a bit too close to the last at Kempton and with a better jump would probably held on . cant see them blasting off in front in the gold cup and setting it up for others , connections will have learned from Kempton and will hold onto the horse for longer !

Cue Card didn't jump the last any better.
Don Cossack was never happy in that race
but would have gone very close if staying
up.Out of that race he's the GC horse,to me.
  GL

my take is that despite being totally unsuited by the track and not jumping as well as he can he has been beaten a short head in one of the best trials for the gold cup ,if he had held on a won by a short head what price would he be now ? any opinions

he would'nt have travelled as well in
the race if unsuited by the track.
Even if he'd won a sht hd,he was being
reeled in all the time by Cue Card.

you may be right penzance !  guesswork and opinions .

all the big guns show,will be a cracker.
   GL

Nothing been said about Cue Card being better going LH - career stats are 9-18 LH and 3-9 RH.

For me, Cue Card does n't like Kempton particularly, did n't jump as well as he did at Haydock and prefers better ground (though his aptitude for a softer surface seems to have improved as he's got older) - and he still won.

That's not to knock Vautour 'cos I agree he'd also be better LH and on better ground.

Issue with Cue Card for me is not his age per se or whether he'll stay (pedigree says yes) but whether after a hard race and career defining performance at Kempton, he can be ready to produce the same standard in the Gold Cup at age 10 (point of regression can't be too far away).

I'm less convinced Vautour will stay but if connections decide to run him in the Gold Cup that's a good enough signal for me.

^ that's 3-9 for Cue Card after King George by the way so before King George, Cue Card's strike rate was 50% LH and 25% RH.

Foyles,TFR,If you're interestd.
DC 183
CC 181
Vtr 180p
Djm 171
DP 169p
RTR 167.
        think these are right got 'em on the net.

thanks for putting up those timeform ratings penzance !good man !

am going  shyte or bust with this one  vautour ! wearing my heart on my sleeve here but  sometimes you get a " hallaluyha moment " !( well i do now and again ,its rare and needs taking full advantage of as you can never have enough on ! if it wins of course , the last hallaluhya moment  was synchronised when he won his  gold cup ! excuse the aftertiming but I think I put it up a day before the race on one of the forums  anyway , and i did not take maximum advantage of the situation . ) when one horse just sticks out at you and it seems clear as day that it is going to win. have had a fair bet on it(well for me anyway ) but feel the  need to keep  lumping  on especially when /if the gold cup is the confirmed target..........for now will just keep sticking money on every day and see if I can have  significant lump on come race day ,of course it could go tits up may go for a different race etc(shi te appens ) but  if you dont buy a ticket you wont win the raffle ! he who dares rodders! an all that ,the next problem will be   getting cash to lump on as I dont want to break into any savings ,not the way to go imo, so will be looking at buying and selling to raise the funds for this " investment " and any wins on infrequent  bets on the daily races will also go to the" cause "....................may be a roller coaster ride and may hit the buffers but fook it its only money! you only live once  and ya cant take it with ya  ..........................onwards and upwards !lets roll ! ...............either see ya at the poor house or dining at the ritz ! good luck all ! will update daily ...............going to sotrt out some stuff to sell and the lump on begins !

You may or may not triumph but you certainly take the prize for most cliches in a single post.
Good luck to you.

cheers good luck with the don Cyclops ............

Granted gd Spring ground on Gold Cup Day, I would think he has to have a crack at the race (Vautour) he's a better horse left-handed imo, likes Chelts & he would be held up in mid div (by Ruby, if he rides him?) So unless it comes up very soft, I would expect to see him in the Big 1.

No way will Ruby jump off Vautour,

massive fan of Vautour...ground will be a huge influence in riding arrangements. participation and indeed result. Given similar conditions to last year i can see Vautour bowling down the hill with an extending lead.THEY MUST RIDE HIM AS IF HE GETS THE TRIP. Many races have been lost by being conservative with the stamina.If the petrol tank runs empty so be it..RW has been quoted as sating he stays from 2m to 4M..and i think is kicking himself for trying to nurse him home home in KG.

Connections MUST GO for The Gold Cup..unless ground description is heavy.

This horse is a class apart..and soft going at Kempton in KG takes at least as much stamina as Chelt in the spring on goodish ground

Im in Foyles camp and have a few quid on..took the ludicrous 12/1 after KG..Absolute mad price.

So guys you have to run in The Gold Cup...you sometimes only get one chance.

He might not need to if the ground came up soft at the Festival?? 
Big fan of Vautour myself, but unless the ground was gd/ish for G C day, I could not fancy him to last home, lots of natural speed & befoe anyone jumps in, I know Kauto did as well, but he won his 2 on gd/ish ground, well beaten against Denman on soft.

i'm very keen on the horse - i have a few issues about backing him however and if he were mine, this year he would be going to the ryannair... his choke out style of racing needs training out of him especially in regards this years gold cup, comparisons have been made with kauto star but for me he was a different type in regards running style and vautours main problem isn't class but is in how he has always been ridden, as now they are struggling to get him to drop the bit...

i think though in a years time he will be a tad more relaxed and could stay the trip, ground will be important for him though and granted good ground i certainly wouldn't want to be layer but that is factored into the price you are getting now, i'd want 7's on the day even on good ground as the unknown of, will he won't stay needs factoring into the price, it seems like he is good value now but not for me with the ground unknown... its also needs to be remembered how much slower they were going in the last 3 furlongs in comparison with the novice on the same day to know there was a speed collapse and it became a war of attrition

anyway despite my reservations i think he is very good, would i back him today, certainly not and would want a price even on the day, although given good ground i doubt i'll get it

after todays shenanigans vautour is near on fav with most firms

Good ground an d the mighty Vautour will go off 2/1.

That would be a tad short for a horse unproven at the distance.

I'd guess a lot depends on what kind of week Mullins has been having. If he's been cleaning up and the ground is good then he may well be that short in my view. If he's "only" had three or four winners it may be 4-1. If he goes of course.

Cue Card has plenty of form on better ground, and at Cheltenham. Also he was up with the pace at Kempton all the way and found plenty. Imo Cue Card has done nothing wrong but win, two Grade 1`s and a 2 and i think its down to his trainer all the negativity. Same thing as last year with Coneygree. If W Mullins trained Cue Card imo he would be fav for the GC. Will be interesting to see who Ruby rides come march.

Vautour, just like Djakadam prior to his fall over the weekend, is currently heading the market solely on its connections despite the perceived staying power (or non) over the CGC trip and hill finish, a music to other runners.