gleneagles 2000 guineas

They must have seen my Lucky 15 thread 

now another 5 grand somebody fancies it

Perhaps MT can`t get on anywhere else.

AOB looks to have other good types for this race so the vibes must be good.

wanting £4K @ 9/2 now....all but PP & Viktor going that or bigger on Oddschecker

All over the Racingpost about the Gleneagles gamble.

Is it that time of years already?
Bookmakers reports a man went into their branch and bet £50k in cash on some useless nag.
I'm panicking.  Did I miss the price?  Yawn.

Yep its that time of year.
Week after cheltenham a major guineas gamble.
Shocking price tho Gleneagles. for what hes achieved.

He's won three group races (4 if you include his disqualification). One(2)of them was a Group 1

Night Of Thunder - had only been placed in a Group 3
Dawn Approach - 2x Group 1's and a Group 2
Camelot - 1x Group 1
Frankel - 1x Group1, 1x Group 2, 1x Group 3
Makfi - 1x Group 3

Gleneagles is solid enough form to become a Guineas winner.

We seem to be subjected to this Coolmore propaganda year after year, with the R.Post very much the cheerleader for the latest hype horse. It annoys me because the 'gamble' becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy as there is a lemmings effect. Then, a week before the race AOB announces the horse isn't ready yet & it's job done for the bookies as they fill their satchels on a heavily backed NR. Or, the horse isn't remotely the horse he is talked up to be & gets beaten in the race. Regardless, 7-2 is a joke price at this stage.

Has there been any Coolmore propaganda re: Gleneagles?  I think his dramatic reduction in price has come as a surprise to most on here.

Australia was a 'hyped' horse but then came 3rd in the race and won The Derby, so 'hyped' with some justification perhaps?

Prior to that Camelot was hyped and he won.

Actually, as a backer of Gleneagles I'm getting a little bit concerned that he hasn't been hyped.

Gleneagles shockingly wasnt european 2 yo last year...how on earth wasnt he?? the figures boys talk absolute bollox

Its a matchup between the PROVEN form of Gleneagles (deservedly fav)
against the    mythical or projected ability of Fadhyan

Its between them 2... no need to make it complicated.  Ivawood doesnt stay and the rest are as poor a crop as weve seen in years.  Coolmores other ones are pure derby types. Highland reel is being re routed to France.

It leaves you Gleneagles and Fadyhan. One goes straight there the other wins the greenham at 8/11 and becomes a shorter price than he is now.

Isnt difficult

O'Brien, who won the 2,000 Guineas on Camelot in 2012, added: "Anything that puts it up to Gleneagles in the Guineas will really be an exceptional horse. I don't even think you'd need a good gallop either: he has lots of pace, relaxes and can handle anything pace-wise."

Certainly seems to be a fair bit of hype there with JOB already saying that it will take an exceptional horse to beat Gleneagles in the Guineas.

Speaking in an interview in Tuesday's Racing Post, the two-time Derby-winning jockey said: "Gleneagles is closely related to Giant's Causeway and he would remind you of him in an awful lot of ways. I'm really excited about him.

I wonder if this horse will still be spoken of in the same breath as Giant's Causeway in a few months time? I reckon there's more chance he'll be lumped in with the likes of One Cool Cat, Hold That Tiger, Minardi and Orpen, who were all strongly fancied Guineas flops for the yard

Jonjon, I'm not sure how you make the race a match up between those two?

On what basis is Richard Pankhurst written off? Rated the same as Gleneagles despite being much more inexperienced. He beat Toscanini (a fair yardstick imo) by 2.25 lengths further than Gleneagles did.

I'm sure there are probably others that can have a case made for them at good e/w prices too.

So how is the race between Glenegales and Faydhan?

Speaking in an interview in Tuesday's Racing Post, the two-time Derby-winning jockey said: "Gleneagles is closely related to Giant's Causeway and he would remind you of him in an awful lot of ways. I'm really excited about him.

Giants Causeway was by Storm Cat.
Gleneagles`(by Galileo) Dam is by Storm Cat....so that makes him nephew to Giants Causeway through Storm Cat.

Gleneagles is very closely related to the filly Misty For Me ( Both by Galileo and both Dams by Storm Cat ) and both with a similar 2 year old campaign( but different sexes ). Misty For Me finished off her 2 year season with a victory in the Marcel Boussac at Longchamp.

She flopped in the 1000G behind Blue Bunting but then won the Irish 1000G. Non of this may be relevant of course.

Minardi strongly fancied? By whom?!

Minardi was the 6/1 ante post Guineas fav after his Middle Park win, he went off 5/1 on the day. Admittedly Gleneagles is currently shorter at 7/2, but most punters agree that so far the race has a weak ante post look to it, therefore the market has been pretty lifeless. It wouldn't have taken an avalanche of money to propel Gleneagles to the head of affairs under these circumstances. All I take from it is that Gleneagles has been showing enough for Coolmore to be satisfied he's their first choice. Whether he holds his position or gets even shorter will depend on the forthcoming trials and if he continues to impress at home when asked to do a bit more. Whether he does or not I will still be opposing him, as he's had enough appearances on a racecourse to get a decent handle on him and I believe the value of his form is very ordinary indeed.

JOB actually says in his interview today Gleneagles does not show much at home.

Doesn't really surprise me, sint, as for me he hasn't shown a great deal on the racecourse, he's won group races that have been group races in name only. I reckon he's where he is by default, due to being Coolmore's pick of their (below average) milers and the fact that there has been no outstanding opposition, apart from possibly Faydhan but the picture still isn't clear about that one at the moment.

Gleneagles is a best price 7/2.
Last Year's 2000 Guineas winner was 40/1.
This reminds me of Alhaarth, a 2/1 Guineas favourite after a string of 2yo wins.

Stoute has a couple of smart looking maiden winners in Convey and Consort. Be interesting if they line up in the Greenham.

Giants Causeway was by Storm Cat.
Gleneagles`(by Galileo) Dam is by Storm Cat....so that makes him nephew to Giants Causeway through Storm Cat.


Gleneagles' dam You'resothrilling is a full sister to Giant's Causeway.

Figgis:  That's from this week, not from before the money went down. There was no 'hype' before that happened and most people seemed surprised about it.

Gleneagles' dam You'resothrilling is a full sister to Giant's Causeway.

yes so Gleneagles is Giant Causeways nephew. As stated.

If your sister has a son.....he is your?

Shrews, sure, I'd bet the original money was 'informed' money, it wasn't a hyped gamble. Although we don't know the amounts, as I said I don't believe it would take much to move this particular market. We also don't know how much was each way money. I remember the Geoffrey Chaucer Derby gamble last year. As johnnyrant said, then there is the lemmings effect. When Coolmore have a bunch of horses targeted at a race and finally decide which is their main hope I expect the money to be the first indication, then more money to follow, regardless of how good that horse really is.

That said, when the jockey starts saying it will take an "exceptional" horse to put it up to Gleneagles I think we can say the hype has started.

so that makes him nephew to Giants Causeway through Storm Cat.

You neglected to mention that he is also related through the dam Mariah's Storm. I am just making that clear for others reading this.

Ok Jack, good point appreciate that miss.
And then you have the Roberto lineage through Mariah`s Storm.
If Gleneagles has inherited his uncles attitude then all bodes well. As tough a young flat horse i have ever seen. It was a a fantastic season for racing when Giants Causeway and Kalanisi were doing battle. Hope we get some great rivalries this season also with his nephew sticking his neck out.

Is their no one else who thinks that IVAWOOD is the one to beat ??

What has this horse done wrong ??

On my reckoning should be favourite.

I agree that Ivawood's form is much closer to Guineas class than the form of Gleneagles. He's actually my top rated, marginally ahead of Faydhan, although Faydhan may be capable of bettering his debut win. The obvious big doubt, however, is stamina.

dont see iva training on

wont stay anyway

no chance for me

I agree about Ivawood, I think he has a good chance.  Hannon Snr had a great record in the race and that looked like it had passed on to Hannon Jr with his 1st and 4th last year (at 40/1 and 50/1)  He has to be respected.

The only thing that put me off him was his Dosage 'Brilliant' score of zero, as no winners in the last eleven has had a 'Brilliant' score that low (not sure beyond that)

2 - Night Of Thunder
2
6
5
2
5
13 - Henrythenavigator
10 - Cockney Rebel
4
6
9 - Haafhd

I am pretty keen on Ol' Man River.

He won (maybe a substandard) group 2 Berresford Stakes without really coming off the bit; he has real pace and class and is about the best bred horse in training.

He is bred to get at least 10 furlongs but he really does have some speed and I reckon he will outclass the others at HQ.

I hope I am right as I have had a small investment and managed to get 40/1 for the Guineas Derby double. A nice dream anyway.

think a mile could be sharp enough for him

would be really worried about him at epsom on derby day. looked look he was about to boil over at the start the last day

Listen, you would't believe what he is doing at home.

looks like mister moore will be on board gleneagles ,joey struggling with his weight this year

Fat little git.

I agree that Ivawood's form is much closer to Guineas class than the form of Gleneagles. He's actually my top rated, marginally ahead of Faydhan, although Faydhan may be capable of bettering his debut win. The obvious big doubt, however, is stamina.

It is a problem but there are reasons for thinking he might get a mile. This would be a it irksome as I was lazy and laid off my Guineas bet having read someone saying he had no chance of getting a mile.

He is by Zebedee who was a fast 2yo but was bred to get a mile himself being out of a mare who won over 10 furlongs.

Iva's dam - Keenes  Royale - stayed 12 furlongs as a 3yo and is a half sister to Berkshire.

Timeform say that Ivawood will probably stay 7 furlongs and "isn't sure to stay a mile".

Generally horses who are bred to stay, do stay, and Ivawood is certainly bred to get a mile.

Anyone ruling him out because he cannot possibly stay may be making a big mistake.

Cryoftruth, I agree and I'm certainly not ruling him out. In recent years I also had stamina doubts about Night of Thunder and Canford Cliffs, also from the Hannon yard, but both horses proved they got the mile (although in CC's case I still think they only really got him to stay after the Guineas). I've not had a bet on the race yet but in general I'd rather take a punt at reasonable odds on a fast horse like him lasting out the mile than back Gleneagles at short odds, a horse who after six starts still hasn't, imo, run anywhere near fast enough to make him competitive in an average Guineas.

I like hannons "2nd string" Estidhkaar impressed with the way he stretched out @ Donny beating War front comfortably giving him 3lb and Aktabantay previous to that in SUperlative by nearly 5 lengths.
Both War Front and Aktabantay where beaten under 2 lengths in the Jean Luc lagadare "won" by Gleneagles.
His last outing was on very soft ground in Dewhurst where he dissapointed but was subsequently found to have a stress frature.Had 4-6 weeks box rest .
@ 33s on here would be far more interested than taking a rank 7/2 on Gleneagles a woefull shocking price.

Ivawood could well be pulling Hughes`arms off over a mile. To be fair the 2000G comes along far too early in the season for most. Ivawood may well get a mile but it won`t be straight forward and will have more chance in time.

Gleneagles will be a far more straight forward ride. He was held up as a 2 year old, so who knows he may even be better than his 2 year old form. Surely they will make plenty of use of him as a 3 year old.

I a get to lose money taking a view on such things but

Gleneagles looks remarkably short at around 3/1. He does look a bit exposed and is after 6 runs surely unlikely to improve on his rating that much.

Timeform have home rated on 114 and he won't be placed in the Guineas unless they are quite wrong or its a terrible Guineas.

Oh and figgis.... Nice to connect.

Hope all is well.

What do yo fancy for the Derby?

Hi, COT, it's a race I prefer to wait on, it's nearly 30 years since I backed a Derby winner at this stage . I wasn't massively impressed by what I saw last year, although there were a few lightly raced types that could make the grade. I think maybe something could come from nowhere like when Pour Moi won his trial. Do you have a fancy?

Only about 5 so far. So many stock in a single stable wrecking ante post