Irish Saint for the schweppes

Good shout, he was impressive today.

Just had a look, runs off10-7 with the weights as they are at the mo and there's a fair bit of 12's about, even better!

Yes with the trainers rep saying that they would now look at this race you could see him going off really quite short on the day.

Will surely be the stable 2nd string if Irving runs so don't think he'll be all that short on the day. As impressive as he was today it looked a poor race and he wouldn't be my idea of the Betfair winner.

Irving seems terribly short to me on what he has done. Of course novices can win this handicap, but he certainly looks to me to have  an awful lot to prove. Of course being a novice he probably has a lot to come but he is priced up as if he is proven to be well handicapped rather than a possible.

Irish Saint is certainly a stone at least well in for this and I can certainly see why the magic swine want to avoid laying him.

Irish Saint has to run after yesterday and think it will be favourite on day now

He definitely carries a 5lbs penalty for yesterday.

I agree he was impressive, though, and would go there with a great chance. The drop back in trip wouldn't worry me - it was only a steady pace at Ascot which makes his turn of foot to go clear on the bend all the more creditable.

He wouldn't interest me one bit tbh, he was impressive yesterday but it was over further it was a small field, they went understandably steady and he was up front best placed the whole way, he had plenty of time yesterday to sort his jumping out, a lot of the field were beat a long long way from home, he just kept going while others failed to act in the race.

The time before was a race that would be most similar to what he'll face next time and in that it was a big field over 2 miles where they went quicker and with horses around him his jumping was poor, with a penalty from yesterday to carry in a race that will be nothing like yesterdays and more like a race we've already seen him fail miserably in...he's up against it IMO.

First"Schweppes" I remember was early 80's.BOOTLACES trained by David Barrons.Can't remember if NICHOLS was his jockey then or not.

we disagree Duffy sadly about part of what you say. It was very different from what he'll get in the Schweppes itself when he won. However it was really fast slick economical jumping that really impressed me so much - a really big plus for me was his jumping. He apparently gets the "steadier" of a 5lb penalty for his wide margin exercise canter - he would certainly have won with a stone more.

However I see that all the 14's and 12's has now disappeared and that 8's is the general price available; he is disputing favouritism now. so its time to lay off soon for the bet to nothing merchants.

I do remember With The Law of Easterby's winning it.

I also got stuffed with a fantastic ante post bet at 33's on Vicario di Bray. after I had stuck £8 in him he then ran in a champion hurdle trial at Haydock and beat Celtic Shot easily - must have run a rating of 160 and ended up running off about 130 and carrying no weight in the Schweppes. Still got flaming beat. He started 4/7. I recall he frightened off all the opposition because everyone thought he was a handicap certainty so the race was a farce with no real pace - didn't suit him at all. still makes me sick thinking about it!

Well i remember that one Cryoftruth, i also placed one of my largest bets of that time £100 to win at 25/1 before the said trial and just watched his price tumble could`nt believe he beat Celtic shot so easily! Me and a couple of mates travelled down to watch the race and stopped in lambourn Red Dog i think,met Fred Winters head lad gave us a horse to follow won 5 or 6 in a row , but that grey horse the following day did me right in! still as fresh in my mind as the day it ran.Thanks for the recall !!

I remember it also and backed him too.

I see the 8/1 is drying up now with the bookies and he is joint favourite. If the race goes ahead it looks like it will be a bog which will suit Irish Saint.

It is certainly not clear if joint favourite Irving would like heavy although he does go well on soft.

Border recover and Duffy - you must be as old as me to remember that Vicario race. Have you noticed how easy it is to remember old horse race names and less easy to remember the name of the nag you just backed.

I remember backing the first winner of the race when it was run at AINTREE
it was named ROSYTH and won it again at NEWBURY, backed it then as well, year after backed LE VERMONTOIS,
both winners trained by RYAN PRICE, would not back HILL HOUSE as I believed he would be warned off, he was!!!

Bazaar you are clearly very old indeed if you remember the Ryan Price coups. Hill House did seem to be a bit much even for the twits known as stewards. His form leading up to the race was a bit iffy - he had been pulled up a few times. Then I think he simply trotted up in the Schweppes, heavily backed of course.

Regards Irish Saint he has been now cut to less than 7/1 on here now.

I too remember the Vicario Di Bray race and remember not having a bet as was obvious that he would win and wasn't betting odds on. 25 years ago.  WOW

Why call it the schweppes? they refused to sponsor it so why give them credit?

Fair  point Jane. I still cal the Whitbread the Whitbread as well. In 30 years time I bet you will still be calling the  the Hennessy the Hennessy, even though by then it's known as the

extra strong lager 6 for 50p at Tesco's stayers handicap

It's just a habit. I remember when they called the Nunthorpe the William Hills Sprint Championship. It was still be the Nunthorpe whatever they call it for me.

Out of interest what is the Massey Ferguson called these days?

Cryoftruth, Massey Ferguson is now called the December gold cup - Still over 2.5f

Whatever you do don't overlook Nichols other runner FAR WEST 25/1 ew is a cracking ew bet, will be shorter come Sat and Irving is a doubtful runner

CRY, 76 just last week, backed horses since age of 15, all of my workmates were gamblers and
I got the idea it might be easy to make money at, never regretted it but other regrets in my life
too painful to relate, horses mostly kind to me.
The GRAND NATIONAL used to be the only big handicap where penalties were employed, weights only went up if highest weighted horse was taken out,
in 1965 the bottom weight carried was 10st 13 lbs and the top weight was about 11st 11, but not sure about the top weight, Arkle caused two handicaps to be made one if Arkle ran and the other if he didn't, I think the difference was 15lbs to Mill House, none of
them took up the engagement, so weights were raised.

Should have read penalties were NOT employed for winning races after publication of weights, now
the race formerly known as the Whitbread Gold Cup has similar rules, no penalties after weights published.