St Nicholas Abbey

Hi Soldier

Young Joseph did ride quite confidently and he made some ground up in the straight.

However the result is about what you would expect on ratings, with Danedream and the second maybe having a bit more to come when they get to Paris in the Autumn.

St Nicholas Abbey looks a bit sort of real pace and needs a bit further. Now Fame and Glory has gone over the hill, st Nick would make an excellent Cup horse for next year.

Off the bend if he'd tracked the eventual winner and Nathaniel closer up cryoftruth there was only one winner.

I won't criticise his jockey or the tactics but having him out the back for that long leaves him with some kind of monumental task.

By an absolute mile he was the best horse in that race.

This is where you lose points SOF

No one in their right mind thinks SNA was the best by an absolute mile. He was,though, given a poorly judged ride (again). Why dont you want to criticise the jockey? He'll pick up £10k in earnings for that effort!

using hand timing imho he was too far back.

I made it 126-20 from the seven to the line and 59.87 to the three, they then kicked around the three and did around 24-05 to the one and a final furlong of 13-28 when he made ground on them. Dont know if he would have won but a ride like the Breeders Cup turf where he was a lot closer would have seen him in better light

Totally agree zilzal with your comment there ...... "but a ride like the Breeders Cup turf where he was a lot closer would have seen him in better light". I guess that was the point I was trying to make.

sintonian whatever I post on here you jump in with critical comments and to be honest I really don't give a f*ck about anything you have to say. Take a look back at the vast majority of your own posts and comments on this Forum and they are absolute sh!te, based on guesswork and some half a*sed opinion about horse racing. Why don't you do everyone on here a favour and just head off to chit chat.

The form looks absolutely rock solid to me with the best two horses in the race almost dead heating and the third best in third. Remember Nathanial and Danedream won the two European middle distance championships last season. St Nic's form is still outstanding with a Derby winner and a Melbourne Cup winner a couple of lengths behind him. This could prove to be a classic renewal - the sort of race that appears on DVDs and such.

Where the hell did that come from sof?

I have not been on the forum as long as you, but sint strikes me as one of the most straightforward posters on here. Don't always agree with his opinions, nor does he with mine, but the forum is surely about expressing opinions?

The last thread isaw you post on was the two of you agreeing about Imperial Monarch.

rofl sof meltdown

Wow - that is SO out of order SOF. I can only assume you had been drinking when you posted that. Sint is one of the best posters on here.

Also can't believe you are that one-eyed to think SNA was "by an absolute mile" the best horse in the race. Form beforehand did not suggest that and that was not how the race panned out either. Nathaniel has beaten him twice now fair and square. Take those emerald spectacles off mate!

Looking at the race again it is obvious that this was not just young Joseph's plan but a team one. Robin Hood was supposed to take them along at a fast enough pace to stretch those who were likely to race up with it so they would be coming back to SNA in the last furlong or so. With RH missing the break this plan did not work out and it was always going to be difficult to catch quality horses from so far back.

FWIW I don't think there is much between the front three and you might well see a different result in October especially if SNA gets very lucky and it is run on faster ground. I am on Nathaniel at nice prices and am plenty happy enough with that.

Sof, I merely asked why you dont wish to criticise the jockey when practically everyone else thinks it was a poorly judged ride?? He picked up £10k in earnings for it.

No bother.

Same here sintonian, no bother at all and let’s not have it ruin our wonderful relationship on here.

For the record I would never be critical of any jockey on a Forum like this. They very often ride to instructions and they have to get it right with split second timing. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn’t. The young lad won’t look back on it as the greatest ride of his career, but even the very best get it slightly wrong now and again.

My comment on the horse was an OPINION, which is what this Forum used to be all about. If you look at the Antepost now it’s a shell of what it used to be, with very few threads and most of them posted by a small group of regulars. I wonder why that is?

If posters come on here with a view and if they receive comments such as “This is where you lose points” it might put them off posting again. I wonder what these points are – are they Betfair points, are they Antepost Forum points, or are they sintonian credibility points which are required to post on this Forum?? Who knows.

I’ll carry on dipping into the Antepost from time to time with a view and an opinion. I really don’t give a sh!t what you say in response.

St Nicholas Abbey was, in my opinion, the best horse in the race yesterday and it’s a shame that things didn’t go his way. Both the horse and his jockey will have brighter days ahead.

Morning Soldier.

I do agree with you about yesterday's race that Joseph could have rode a better race and St Nich would  most likely have been closer with a better ride. Your comments are appreciated by many on here and your passion for racing shines through. It is a shame that there are very few threads on antepost now. Used to be my favourite place on the forum and hopefully it can rise once again in the future.

Take care mate.

stealth I hope all is well.

I agree with your comments there about the Antepost Forum. It used to be a vibrant and active place where people shared their views and opinions, whatever those opinions may be. Sadly all of that has died away now and the volume of threads has diminished to the point where sintonian and a few of his ar$e lickers are the main posters. Occasionally sintonian’s twin brain cells manage to locate each other and he comes out with something of value, but those days are few and far between. He’s driven people away from here.

All the best to you too stealth and take care.

Occasionally sintonian’s twin brain cells manage to locate each other and he comes out with something of value, but those days are few and far between. He’s driven people away from here.



................................,-~*`¯lllllll`*~,............................................. .....
...........................,-~*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll¯`*-,..........................................
......................,-~*llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll*-,......................................
..................,-*llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.\... ..................................
................;*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll,-~*~-,llllllllllllllllllll\....................................
................\lllllllllllllllllllllllllll/...........\;;;;llllllllllll,-`~-,................................
.................\lllllllllllllllllllll,-*.............`~-~-,...(.(¯`*,`,...............................
...................\llllllllllll,-~*........................)_-\..*`*;..)..............................
.....................\,-*`¯,*`)............,-~*`~................../...............................
.....................|/.../.../~,......-~*,-~*`;.................../.\..............................
.................../.../..../..../..,-,..*~,.`*~*..................*...\.......................... ...
...................|.../.../..../.*`...\................................)....)¯`~,........... .........
...................|./..../..../........).........)`*~-,............../.....|..)...`~-,..............
.................././.../....,*`-,.....`-,....*`....,---......\...../...../..|..........¯```*~-,,,,
.................(............)`*~-,.....`*`.,-~*.,-*.......|.../..../..../...............\..........
..................*-,.......`*-,...`~,..``.,,,-*.............|.,*...,*....|.................\.........
......................*,.........`-,....)-,..................,-*`...,-*.....(`-,..............\........
........................f`-,........`-,/...*-,___,,-~*.....,-*......|....`-,...............\.......

My comments about you losing points was/is relating to your bias. Anyone who has been reading and posting on here a while knows you have,lets say, a deep passion for all things ballydoyle. As a betting person, like the entire forum, continuous bias is deeply annoying. We can all handle the occasional bit of pocket talk, no problem. It's even funny and sometimes enjoyable to read. But the bias displayed on a regular basis by yourself is whats annoying. You say I have twin brain cells (thanks btw) but im not the one who is biased. So this is what I mean about losing points.

As for the forum in general, I think you'll find it went downhill when Betfair themselves decided to phuck it up for everybody. Most of the good guys from the past are on T-witter now and BST/TT's place.

The assault on Sintonian is unwarranted; he's always seemed pretty level-headed to me. This forum used to be a lot livelier, with the likes of Deep & Plat regular posters. I don't post half as regularly as I used to, just haven't got the time, certainly nothing to do with being frightened off by Sint.

FWIW, Ryan Moore gave Sea Moon a far worse ride (imo).

It's a but much slagging off a poster when all you post on here is how great a particular stable's horses are then gloating if one of them wins.

There's a very interesting piece by Sam Walker in the RP and on their news feed (under World Class) on the form of this King George and possibilities for the Arc. Phil Smith meanwhile rated Danedream 122 and Nathaniel 124 on Saturday (which would be below a typical Arc winning performance).

Yes that article does make a lot of sense. I could not have Camelot at 3s so the Japanese horse could be deemed value.

Just think Nathaniel is continually under ratedand will step forward again. Whether that is good enough is obviously open to question. With the performances of Meandre and Great Heavens beginning to have my doubts if Nathaniel will turn up and instead head to Ascot..hope not though.

A_T I think you'll find that I've never been on here gloating about any horse winning.

By the way you missed the "TW" off the front of your Forum name.

Maybe your posts in the past have been insightful and positive SOF but I judge on what I see and read. Your last post confirms my initial impression that you are a bit of a to55er

PMSL roobuck, I'm mortally wounded

Oh dear. The forum used to be quite a civilised place, people disagreed but a sense of decorum prevailed; alas this appears on the wain. The days of kindred spirits and 'forum charges' seems over, and the world is a poorer place for it.

Indeed Mystic, so let’s close the thread at this point and just let it die away down the page.

I started the thread in good faith and with the intention of expressing that with a more positive ride St Nicholas Abbey could have won the race. I thought it would be a good topic to discuss. However as always with any comment I make on here, that halfwit sintonian jumps on it and we end up on a different track.

Anyhow let’s just let it go.

sof you should leave off posting full-stop you really are full of cr4p

Yeh you too T_W

Try and get this back on track....

If St Nic is seen to best effect on tight turning left handers than the Cox Plate should be on his radar.

Worth a couple of million pounds and he could have a throw at the stumps in the Cup for almost double that a couple of weeks later.

i agree with OP,to come from that far back in a decent G1 on ascot's round course,with its short straight, you need

(1) a bit of luck that horses dont come back into your lap
(2) have about 10lb in hand of your rivals

only my opinion,but not many come from that far back at ascot,hopefully Joe will learn from it(or team orders will differ in future)

SNA was closer to the winner at the 2F mark as he was at the line - not good enough

Totally agree gents.

At one point I thought they might have a look at the Gold Cup at Ascot for him, but that's probably stretching him to be honest.

So why not let him take his chance in Australia on a track that will play to his strengths and on ground that he'll love. He's definitely got the quality to win it.

Probably a tough one to call for them given that a return to the USA was always likely to be his end of season target.

sorry roobuck just watched it again and cant agree with that,also he is five behind the RU at the two pole.One last point as the leaders swing off the bend they quicken for the run for home while SNA is still coming around the bend.
Not saying i am right or you are wrong just good healthy discussion.

OK possibly stretching it but he came there easily enough after the leaders, as you say, were at it from a good way out. They continued to find and SNA did not do enough I don't see it as any more complicated as that. Look at SNA in the Arc when ridden closer to the pace, got beaten further

Fair comment about the Arc,but take the winner out that day they all finished in a heap.
Btw i am not saying SNA would have def won,but my preference (at ascot on round course) is for a horse to be ridden slightly closer to the action than SNA was on saturday.

Saturday was as good as SNA is. He probably ran a very evenly paced race. The Group 1s he's won have not been the most strongly contested and when tested at the very highest level in the Arc and 2 KGs he's been found to be not quite good enough.

For me, whether SNA would have won or not (and I'm far from certain he would have) doesn't excuse it being a very poorly judged ride. I backed SNA at Epsom, where he was also held up but at no stage of the race did I doubt his chances. However, at Ascot after only a couple a couple of furlongs I thought wtf is the jockey doing and I would have gladly traded my bet (as I'm sure would loads of his backers), except for the fact that at that stage I would've had to lay at far bigger odds. If Danedream had been ridden from the same position could even her biggest fans honestly say they'd be confident she would have won? I doubt it.

Having seen the race a few times through, I remain of the opinion both that St Nicholas Abbey was not given a very good ride.

I accept that soldier does not like to slag off jockeys on the forum; I have no such problem as I am sure they take it all with a pinch of salt.

I am not convinced that St Nicholas was "easily the best horse" though. although last off the final bend he actually had plenty of time to make his way through and just basically lacked a really top class turn of foot. Whilst he started his run from some way back, generally relaxing a horse will save energy, especially in a race run at a decent pace on ground with plenty of give in it. if he had been settled in 4th or 5th, instead of last, who is really to say he would have been able to find enough to beat the first two?

I have memories of St Nick winning over 1 mile 5 at Chester and the further he went the better he was. I also recall him being lucky to win the Coronation Cup against Midday, who was ridiculously ridden by Tom Q. I think St Nick is a very good horse, maybe touching 130 at his best, but he probably needs 14 furlongs to make further significant progress. I personally would back him to reverse with Nathaniel in the Arc, but only if the price was good enough and the going like last year. Trouble with that though is that on fast going, Danedream is better than St Nick on last year's Arc form.

regards the ante post forum, I would agree that slagging eachother off is much better left to other forums. We had years of disagreeing about the merits of horses on here without any name calling or abuse. lest try and leave it out eh?

^^ I concur with all the above, i would just add the way i interpreted the closing stages, a combo of Reliable Man fading together with little assistance from Le(night)maire accentuated SNAs final flourish.  The fact is he was right on RMs tail turning in and didn't get past him till very late on.