Carlton House setback.

Connections remain ''hopeful''.

I am hopefull he wont even place!!!

sintonian
31 May 11 14:57
Connections remain ''hopeful''.

Yeah - but Eric is still hopeful Frankel may still run

Got to be bad news so close to the race

I think all the market principals look beatable in one form or another and wouldn't be at all surprised if we get the first major shock (over 20/1) winner since Snow Knight(50/1) in 1974

When I reserached that I was amazed that of all the winners in the last 36 years only one, High Rise @20/1 in 1998, had been bigger than 14/1.

Stoute is very patient, and isn't the type to take a risk. I don't think he will run. That's if there's even anything wrong with him.

The queen is 85, can't have too many more chances of winning the Derby, he'll surely run if he has 3 good legs.

Nothing wrong with the horse, just getting the excuses in early if it gets beat?.

Trainer Sir Michael Stoute is monitoring Carlton House's condition and said on Wednesday morning: "We're doing our best to get him there."

Some people talk some right ole nonsense.

Carlton House has just been laid on here at 4, while Pour Moi continues to shorten.

You learn over the years sintonian not to trust a word that comes out of a trainers mouth, the cry wolf syndrome.

Always have your sceptical hat on!.

Silver, there is healthy cynicism, and then there is unhealthy cynicism.

The horse has had a setback, that is a certainty.

But we don't know for sure whether my cynicism is unhealthy or not?, you can choose to believe the trainer or not?, I didn't see any x rays did you?, we can only take their word for it.

Watch this space sintonian, after the Derby is run there will be a plethora of excuses bandied about for many of the vanquished, but before the race they were all jumping out of their skin, Carlton House apart of course.

Racing propaganda, lessen number one always find an excuse even if one doesn't exist!.

Unhealthy cycnicism is not believing a trainer whilst eating a fry up.

The drift continues: CH has just been matched at 4.4!

That might be the folk who are laying off to cash in on the decent prices they got. A decision will be made on Friday. Either way i've had enough of talking about horses who might not even run. One minute it's O'Brien, the next it's short and stoute. I'm bored of the flats already.

Your cynicism is baseless though.

What does the likes of John Warren an Sir Michael Stoute have to gain from inventing something like this ??

If the horse is beaten narrowly they can always say if he didn't have that unfortunate setback he'd have surely have won?, and if the horse is beaten out of sight, they'll probably say in hindsight we probably shouldn't have run him.

As I said earlier on this thread get your excuses in early, I might be completely wrong but years of following this sport has thought me to be extra vigilant, thats why I always have my sceptic hat on!.

OK but that just makes them sound like bottlers. People who cannot handle the pressure. But we know that is not true. They are at the top of the sport for a reason.

gl.

If the horse is beaten narrowly they can always say if he didn't have that unfortunate setback he'd have surely have won?

what would they gain from that?

Its all to do with softening the blow as regards possible lucrative stud fees, while losing obviously decreases value but having a ready made excuse might just stabilise the ship.

Look as I said I might be completely wrong, but I just have this feeling that the horse will raring to go come Derby day?.

IIRC Workforce 'will come on for the run massively' too...

Still fairly decent amounts looking to back him at around 7/2-4/1 - I'd have thought if he were a genuine big doubt he'd have drifted much more.

apparently he worked and galloped this morning ..

Her Majesty's racing manager, John Warren, said: "We've got the next few days to see if it (the ankle strain) is cooling itself down - that's going to be key.

"The good thing is the horse is sound and he's moving well.

"He's on trotting exercise but, of course, Sir Michael Stoute would love to be getting some good cantering into him at this point.

"Luckily, we've got the most experienced trainer in the country and the best rider (Ryan Moore) in the country.

"We've got a chance (of running). It's not without a possibility that he'll stand in the line-up.

"He won't run unless the trainer is completely content that he's sound.

"By Friday we'll know more."

Carlton House worked over six furlongs on Sunday, and also had a routine canter on Monday, after which the problem was discovered.

Stoute's colt underwent X-rays on Tuesday morning, but no serious damage was revealed.

Warren added on talkSPORT: "There is no medication allowed into a horse going into a race.

"All that can be done is to ice him, wrap him, and hose him, and just get the blood circulating into that joint to speed the process up.

"It's wait and see for the next 48 hours."

I doubt that he worked, galloped this morning.

I can see NR looming.

if he could run they would know by now

Derby news on ATR in 2 minutes

Pour Moi is currently the new favourite, with Carlton House out to 5.4.  I'd be surprised if CH made it to the race now - the messages are becoming less and less optimistic.

When I posted just now, the Back odds were 5.1 Pour Moi and 5.4 Carlton House, but I see that CH has quickly reverted to 4.9 - was there any encouraging news on ATR?

The stable staff must know and the news is seeping through the cracks to the Exchanges. If it goes any bigger than say 6/1 i think the game is up

Not like we've not seen horses go to 999/1 only to run and win. I suspect it runs and this is one big smokescreen in case it don't win.

no money in the place market either

Nah can't see him running now. If he had a chance to run they would wait until Saturday. There's no way the NRNB brigade would be 2s either. I think they all know the score already.

There's no way the NRNB brigade would be 2s either. I think they all know the score already.

absolutely right, tells the whole story imo

Epsom is a good place to ruin a horse. Yes there is only one Epsom Derby but the Queen will want to be cautious.

say he misses epsom, there are still plenty of G1s for him to prove he is a champion... in the end it never did dancing brave's stud career any harm

*stud valuation, I mean

..career was fine mrdadger.

I can see this horse training on as a 4/5 year old. The Queen has not had a good en for an age. Connections will want a bunch of G1 victories.

if the horse was running why would they be putting out all these warnings.

Has the Queen got a Betfair account?  Is she laying Carlton House?

Apparently worked this morning and seemed ok - won't know for sure until evening stables.

Price on here had shortened to under 3/1 when betting suspended for the final declarations.

mad english.
why would ya back something into 3/1 with a risk of not running. Let alone how many horses that have won major Group1 races from a setback that week, and only being able to canter only a few days ago.

Weatherbys racing news

Carlton House declared for Derby

Carlton House has been declared for the Investec Derby at Epsom on Saturday.

The Queen's colt has been the long-time favourite for the premier Classic, but doubts over his participation arose after he developed swelling in his near-fore leg.

Sir Michael Stoute's Dante Stakes winner suffered the setback during a work-out on Monday. However, he remains in contention for the mile-and-a-half Flat highlight after cantering on Thursday morning.

Top price 9/4 with PPower and B0ylesports

no wonder there are so many bookies shops in the uk
madness

He's always been in a position to canter. It doesn't mean he will run on Saturday. I still have doubts.

same here graeme, although I believe he couldn't even canter yesterday

*or didn't

I find that baffling tbh Graeme. You dont believe the horse has/had a minor injury or setback but still doubt his participation.

Where did i say he doesn't have any kind of injury ?

Knew it was a total smokescreen. Pressure off now. Probably gone off 2.2 or so on here and hot fav w/o this smokescreen.

mad price.\
\
english. bookies fill up big time

Probably be found to be slightly lame in the morning? wouldn't surprise me?

Had every chance  - just didn't stay as well as the winner. I expect they will drop him back to 10f now - given his owner the new Champions Stake at Ascot will surely be the main target.

why silver ?

Horse had every chance, if anything Ryan Moore panicked and kicked too soon. Ran a smashing race though.