Barrie Draper

Although he has been unlucky with injuries

To me he's a vastly overrated trainer

He better than John Mullins though

He seems ok at winking one off opens but not comps

wow

Think he's genius two put eske in three steps get on double two night

cheers barrie

Me thinks PS disagrees with me

His kennel was Ravaged by injury. Sure he would have won plenty of silverware had that not been the case

He has won plenty of silverware

Just not many English/Irish Derbies or st Legers

Unlucky English Derby with Eden Star/Ballymac Eske and had other contenders sidelined or even dead! Never tried for Irish? Don't think had that many stayers of Leger quality. Maybe Eske if he hadn't gone wrong, yet again

surely it makes a lot of difference how many owners you've got and how much dough they are prepared to spend. big % has to be starting with high quality raw materials, just my opinion

Think they've all had wealthy owners in their time. Geoff DeMulder, Ginger McGee, Charlie Lister. Same in football. Money buys success

won scotish derby / 2 laurels/  2 racingpost juviniles/golden sprint/ threesteps/
2 wimbledon puppy derbies/romford puppy cup/olyimpic/puppy clasic/in the last 3 years
so i dont think he will be losing any sleep do you

scotish derby/2 juviniles/2 laurels/2 wim puppy derbies/romford puppy cup/golden sprint/oylimpic/puppy classic in the last 3 years  dont think he as a lot to prove

Hes been around for years,the bookies used to be scared to death when the money came for his back in the arnie dennis days,never ran many older dogs always seemed to be pups or under 3,but lots won when they should

Hes been around for years,the bookies used to be scared to death when the money came for his back in the arnie dennis days,never ran many older dogs always seemed to be pups or under 3,but lots won when they should

wish betfair had a delete,feel a fool when you do a double clickker

Barrie and Trevor are not the type to pay, or get their owners to pay, stupid money for dogs who are only likely to make minor open / category 3 class.

They've had a couple of superstars over the last few years and by definition they don't come along very often. The kennel also have a policy of moving their run-of-the-mill open racers on at the age of 3 so that occasionally leaves them short on numbers.

Even so they've still had 55 open race winners this year, which is the 10th highest in the country so rumours of Barrie's demise may be somewhat premature.

think they are very good trainers personally

I tend to agree pat but bookie made some very salient points I thought re the drapers during last year's derby

he might just be fed up of picking up dog$hit

Havent seen bookie for a while,hope youre well if you lookin in bookie.

What points did he make wonders?

yes, I haven't either pat now you mention it
sometimes see him on horse racing forum but I haven't for quite a while...he better be around when the northern jumps get underway to bounce a few ideas off him otherwise toys, prams, etc

just that he felt they didn't work backwards from the derby with their dogs ie they looked tired when they got there, especially in the later rounds

Interesting point wonders,now you say that i was talking to kev other day about a dog and what his plans were and he said "well the final is XX/XX so i work back from there and see what fits..."

ah yes but that is sir kev though

im sure he would like to win as much as the drapers have mate!

I remember when Warhawk came on scene as a pup winning all before him and Barry said live on SKY I have a better one just arrived (before dog had ran a race - Eske). I thought they did a great job with landing the Romford Sprint with barracuda. Could not see how Barracuda could win the Final from draw with pace all around him but he got out to perfection.  Obviously Eske was injured during the Derby and everyone was saying he was sh yte, but he won all 4 rounds (the only dog to do so) and did fastest time of Derby to date before going out in semi final. I dont think he can be faulted for that.  I personally was not sure about the campaigning of Eden Star in that Derby....but given Barrie has likely forgotten more than I know about dogs I'm not gonna criticize.

They own some dogs themselves and re-the injuries, typical Barracuda was set to win the Scurry when breaking down after flying home in his semi

That bookie chap knows his onions

Agree with him totally can't train a dog for a six round comp and his dogs peak far too early in the comp

That why he's won some two and three round comps over the years, but he has been training for a long time now and his strike rate ain't very good

other than the Oaks and the Yarm Derby (4 rounds) the only other > 3 rounds UK comp. is the Derby?

Yer and how many of the he won

Look at this year's Irish Derby winner. Flying early rounds like Eske was but his injury stood up. Not unsual for a dog to be running at the top of his game for 6 races, if that's how talented he is when fit

I think anyone who runs an injured dog is out of order

Barry cant use what they get away with in Ireland

Irish, what did you think of Judicial Ruling that did a flying flying time in 2012 Eng Derby early rounds, and kept on running and in papers from about quarters they said bad shoulder injury cant turn left at first bend, but carried on and got to Final....and nobody journalists no-one in public eye questioned the fact he was running a badly injured dog. Unbelievable. After final run once a week later, and once 6 months later, both times did nothing. Ruined.

Makes me laugh when people who may or not know dogs head from tail
Slags off people who have live and breath dogs all there working life
Plenty of dog walkers out there to slag off team draper not one of them

don't matter who it is ..... you shouldn't run injured dogs ..... feel free to try and justify it ... the fact is .... it's abuse of the animal .... out of order

I don't know coz im not a trainer but how do you determine if a dog is injured or not? Irish Derby winner was supposed to be carrying an injury and Kereight King and Ballymac Vic have also been risked then in the past then

In the case of Pay Freeze, trials were fast and seemed to come off sound but after rest and hopefully recovery, until you string a couple of races together, you don't know for certain

Eske must have been a bit of a cripple but came back to win 3 Steps. Now tell me youre supporting animal rights protesters!

"how do you know if a dog is injured or not".....  so naive at times Woody

... because good trainers know their dogs , most of them can tell just looking at them , if not the kennel hand should know and report it. 

If you had ever kept greyhounds or horses and saw them everyday you get to know them inside out, they know instinctively if there is something wrong.

I'd say about 90% of a trainers time with a dog is spent trying to keep it free from injury and getting it fit for its next race.

The Australian vet's "bible" maintains that a dog will pick up some sort of injury, on average, every 3 trials or races. If I remember rightly it goes on to say that given 7 days between those races, over 90% of those injuries will have cleared up by the next time they run.

That percentage can presumably be increased by immediate detection and treatment. I suspect that is what sorts out the really top trainers (using the best medic available of course) and the dog-handlers.

I would tend to agree with Irish in that you can usually tell within 5 minutes of getting a dog out in the morning whether something is wrong, and strangely enough, whether they are feeling on top of the world.

Not unlike Mrs Wales, in fact.

There tons of dogs running
With niggles
And most trainers miss it
There a few running tomorrow at Romford !
To say most trainers on the ball is bollox Irish

Very interesting Wales but sure Pay Freeze was fine 5 minutes after Elaine got him out Tuesday morning

ei ei, its starting to get going this 1

Sep 25, 2014 -- 9:34AM, FATTIEWHITEYSLOVEADRINK wrote:

There tons of dogs running With niggles And most trainers miss it There a few running tomorrow at Romford !To say most trainers on the ball is bollox Irish

where did I say "most trainers are on the ball" Fattie ? if you are gonna wage war get your facts straight first.


What you should realise is that I know most trainers ain't on the ball .
Now ask yourself why ?
Shortage of dogs ? demands of a bags contract ? owner greed ? trainer greed ? desperation ? lack of funds ?


The trainers have all been up in arms and not got anywhere have they ..... now they are going down the welfare route .... there could be trouble ahead (cue the music) !

After his first round victory, market indications were good for Pay Freeze in his semi but like I said, now seems apparent he cant stand up to the racing

its taken you a while woody but at last you've come round to my way of thinking, do try and keep up old chap

Woody

I'm obviously not suggesting that every injury becomes obvious within 5 minutes - some will not be evident until thoroughly examined by the trainer / medic, or unfortunately until they next race.

The top trainers are the ones that minimise the chance of the latter.

BTW I would consider Elaine Parker to be pretty close to the top of her profession.

as dogs become older they do get niggles which perhaps means they cannot run once a week.they are treated by the trainer with magnetopulse machines.most trainers use the experts some finding injuries by touch others using computer programmes.they advise the trainers on the treatment how long they have to be rested or what needs to be done.running a dog when injured achieves nothing it is never going to win and will make the injury worse.these chiropractors cover the whole of the uk going from kennel to kennel.it is amazing to watch them work on the dogs.

The fact is beebs some of them are still running injured .....

Once you accept that FACT  you have to ask why .........  and that is the current plight of the trainers !

i have never been involved with a trainer who runs injured dogs.i have however advised trainers of possible injuries to their charges.i think some are past their sell by date believe it or not some trainers do not watch their dogs run.

I'm sure that goes on , I was gonna get into it over here as you know Beebs but having been to work in kennels for over a year, I wouldn't go near it , got horses now instead at least they don't sh1t everywhere !

Us who take a keen view on the
Dogs for punting reasons
Do spot things ! maybe the trainer
Doesn't like he ain't going to spend hours on vids now are they ?watch a race 5-6 times
but than I think owner should use there eyes too


with pay I ain't got clue whats wrong with it
Could be wrist !! trail great, race great than next race bang !
6 weeks later trail well, race well than bang ! 2 months later same again again !
Endless pain to the owner

pay freeze hasn't been sound in ALL his races since the spring imo

just because he's won doesn't mean he's totally sound...take the run at notts for example, I am convinced that he was a bit wobbly on the bends around there (though can't be certain due to the delightful camera angles sky treat us to)

he totally bottles the bend when he is around dogs, on his own not so much
sad to see