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17 Dec 15 22:59
Date Joined: 09 May 14
| Topic/replies: 12,591 | Blogger: TheFear's blog
So tiresome. I put up a fair request of £200 @ 2 on a quiet market and withing seconds some idiot (bot) is asking for £14 @ 1.99.  Did anyone ever consider tricking these wnkrs into getting matched on bets they definitely wouldn't want?
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Report Darlo Bantam December 17, 2015 11:02 PM GMT
Occasionally, but if I've got a much bigger amount wanting to be matched, like you have there, I don't care about the queue jumping bots. Your money will attract someone who wants to lay £200, whether it's at 2.00 or one tick lower.
Report YOMOMMA December 18, 2015 9:52 AM GMT
There are loads of betfair bots. You didn't get it on the classic website. One of the reasons the site has died.
Report Westender December 18, 2015 12:28 PM GMT
12 sec delay on football but zero sec delay for Bots above
Report Drive_Blind December 19, 2015 12:19 PM GMT
"fair request" - you obviously think there is some intrinsic value in your bet otherwise you wouldn't make it.  The exchange is a marketplace, what gives you the right to get matched at poor value ahead of the bots?  As Darlo, said if the markets opinion dictate that the price moves in your direction you will get matched.  There are some badly coded leapfrog bots that eventually offer a good value bet where the astute among us take what's on offer, you could identify when these situations occur and take advantage?.  There are also some very sophisticated leapfrog bots that know the limit at which to stop jumping.  Market efficiency is brilliant :)
Report Barton Bank December 19, 2015 9:50 PM GMT
You could put dummy bets in the queue for horses that can't possibly win overnight and then take their 2 quids and fivers if you can be bothered.
Report TheFear December 20, 2015 11:50 PM GMT
drive blind how did my fair request get turned into poor value for the layer? I used the phrase fair request after consideration (because I expected a comment like yours). The same price was available hours later, hence why I used the term fair request.

Thank you barton, I can definitely  be bothered I will do it one night to amuse myself.
Report Coachbuster December 21, 2015 11:49 AM GMT
Report Drive_Blind December 23, 2015 8:15 AM GMT
TheFear - my point is that you must deemed it a value bet otherwise you wouldn't have made it.  The bot writer had obviously coded the bot to also recognise the offer was a value bet and jumped in front of it.  Big deal, as I said before it is a marketplace, thats what happens, backers and layers will eventually agree on the real price.  To then call people who write bots idiots and wnkrs, is a bit rich imo.  The bot has just as much right to get matched as you.
Report Westender December 23, 2015 9:01 AM GMT
Bit like scummy FOBTs, people lose the will after a while, give up then spend their money elsewhere.

BOTs v BOTs is what this place is mainly now that most of the people betting have long gone.

There is a gap in the market now for a dedicated Betting Exchange which is Bot free.

People have choices - most have gone.

Betting Exchange full of BOTs is simply awaiting the day when only 1 BOT is left.

People don't need Betfair to live but BOTs badly need people to bet - they are effectively pointing a gun at their own heads.

Welcome to Paddy Power 2016.
Report MOGAMBO December 23, 2015 1:29 PM GMT
...70%  ..of  betfair  profit  comes  from  BOT,s....go  figure...
Report siwaadupa December 23, 2015 1:36 PM GMT
Agree Mogambo.
Report siwaadupa December 23, 2015 1:42 PM GMT
You won't trick them The Fear, the bots are set to "certain price". If you go for example to 1.80, you won't see them, as ther are jumping in queue to get all of the bets better than 1.8 in my example. The bots are directed against traders IMO.
Report Templeton Peck December 23, 2015 6:44 PM GMT
You can trick some bots.  There's one bot I can make remove their money from the market with one simple trick.  Another will go way above the 'correct' price.  Just a case of spending some time to test their reactions.
Report Templeton Peck December 23, 2015 6:44 PM GMT
You can trick some bots.  There's one bot I can make remove their money from the market with one simple trick.  Another will go way above the 'correct' price.  Just a case of spending some time to test their reactions.
Report Drive_Blind December 23, 2015 8:02 PM GMT
It was inevitable that the exchange would eventually have a large number of automated bots competing for action.  In any market, people will do whatever is possible to gain an edge, whether it is supermarkets importing cheap milk from abroad, the chinese dumping steel on european markets, bookies offering enhanced odds or bots on the betfair exchange.  I'm not making any assertions on the morality of these practices, but it is reality, human nature.  When it comes to money, humans are generally an unsavoury bunch.

The utopia of a bot free exchange in reality is never going to happen.  Screen scraping bots appeared before the API was introduced, and they will reappear on any bot free exchange.

The only reason casual punters don't bet here any more is because if you go to you are immediately directed to the sportsbook, plus there has been virtually no advertising of the exchange for the last five years.  The casual/mug punter just wants to bet without having to exert any effort, and the bookies and betfair sportsbook do that very well.  The exchange is hidden away and complicated for the average punter.

The vast majority of trades made in the forex markets are done by bots, it hasn't stopped the explosion of forex trading by retail clients over the last couple of years.

Any casual punter arriving here who wants to bet 20 quid, will be getting better odds because of the leapfrog bots, quite often markets on here are trading under 110% the night before the race.  Have a look at some of the price crashes in early market trading on certain horses when the leapfrog bots have got there price wildly wrong.
Report TheFear December 26, 2015 5:57 PM GMT
Be interesting if one day the premium charge reflected the value of people putting up bets compared to courtsiders and this type of bot. What has this bot brought to the table apart from trying to take the first £14 of my £100? Answers on a postcard.

drive blind you make some valid points but i stand by wnkrs, because IMO they are similar to someone pushing past to grab the last item on the supermarket shelf,,,
Report Darlo Bantam December 26, 2015 9:54 PM GMT
What has this bot brought to the table apart from trying to take the first £14 of my £100? Answers on a postcard.

He's offering a better price to the layer than you are.
Report siwaadupa December 26, 2015 11:28 PM GMT
If the user hadnt put higher price, the bot would offer lower price before user had put his price - it would stayed at lowest price possible, it annoys users- discourage to put leave bets on markets because always stupid bot of 10 pound will offer higher price by one tick.
Report GoBallistic May 22, 2016 1:12 PM BST
I've been encountering one particular leapfrog bot quite a lot recently...

Maybe there is a £5 back waiting at 12

I put up a £10 lay at 8. In comes the lay at 8.2
I put up a £10 lay at 9. In comes the lay at 9.2
We've all seen it

For giggles
I put up a £10 lay at 12. Taking the £5 back and leaving £5 lay at 12
In comes the lay at 12.5  Laugh

Someone actually went to the trouble of programming that
Report racingguru May 24, 2016 1:16 AM BST
I used to play about on bf in the early hours just to mess with the bot that controlled the prices at Betbright when they first started - made a fair bit off them till they closed me down. They changed their program a few months later and are now worst everything overnight.
Report romper stomper May 25, 2016 5:35 AM BST
Bots given a glimpse of human machinations about 5 years ago on this platform.
Overnight a 5 runner race with one runner having a wide of the mark scratching deduction was massaged into negative % territory all night by persons with information that it was to be scratched in the morning.
        Unsupervised bots were induced to bet at what appeared to be 1% profit all night ....over and over....
        Excited bot owners awoke to find their clever ones had made a lot of money.
        The moment of reckoning occurred at scratching time.
        1% green became 20% massive red.....more than the bots had in their accounts....they had in effect all been operating on an unauthorized credit facility.
        Huge problem for bot owners and management.....unreported but maybe 250 K.
        I suspect bots are more closely supervised by both owners and management since this debacle.
Report DStyle May 25, 2016 10:23 AM BST
of course a bot is merely performing mistakes a human told it to perform.

a similar but manual mistake was made on a first goal scorer market with loads of chumps from money saving expert forums doing their dough.

(this is always worth a re-read)
Report longbridge May 25, 2016 10:56 AM BST
@Dstyle - the MSE 1st goal scorer one is a car crash in slow motion to read.  In that case it was possible because at the time BF calculated exposure wrongly for 1st goalscorer markets.

@romper - I hadn't noticed that BF had got Racing exposure wrong in the same way - I'm guessing that's been fixed since?
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